G5 wishlist.

[A less presumptuous name.]

How about some better graphics?

[The Crimson Coyote]

Quote:

Originally written by Taliesin:
What I meant was that the old guardian is pretty simple compared to the newer guardian and the warrior.

I like the Warrior avatar, but the Guardian avatar seems to just piss me off... I don't know what it is, it just looks annoying...

[wxxqut]

Spiderweab games aren't about graphicks and they are not its better side so its not likely to happen.

 

I would like a compromise betwen warrior and guardian look.

[The Crimson Coyote]

The Guardian Looks like a man wearing a blue tunic, and his helmet looks a little retard.

 

The Warrior looks more as if he is wearing armor and not a oversized tunic from his Grandmother on the other side of Terrestria, and although he is wearing the same style of helmet, it is done up better, the Guardian looks like he is wearing a a ladies leather thong over his head.

[Dikiyoba]

The graphic change Dikiyoba would most like to see (though it's not a big deal at all) is unique PC graphics that aren't also NPC graphics. To Dikiyoba, lifecrafters and mages having the same graphic is a bit odd.

[The Crimson Coyote]

geneforges graphics are ok... Just do something a little better for the guardians I say...

[Xelgion]

Ladies Thong, huh? Honestly i think the guardians are cool and looked better.

 

Now what would really be cool but isn't going to happen is that if the PC from the previous game came back as the final boss (with random stats and a class) you would see them throughout the game taunting you and at the end you would battle them as a highly warped canister freak. (i am implying that the rebel ending will happen because at that point everyone is at equal power) That is if you were shaper now if you were rebel you would get to take on the counsel of shapers with one or 2 creations or friendly generals (if you didn't shape). And then at the end, one possible ending is for you and the other PCs from the other games all to chain-link a shaping spell and make the Ultimate creation and dominate all of Illaya, Morras, Burwood, Etc etc........ The final battle would be held on sucia island over the first and most powerful geneforge.

 

And personally i want a spell that shapes a orink in people

[The Crimson Coyote]

Quote:

Originally written by SlaughteringSevile:
Ladies Thong, huh? Honestly i think the guardians are cool and looked better.

Yes... a Ladies thong...
They do look better than from the first games, but They do need a better graphic!
ah... nvm...

...

Im sure at least some of you want to see this idea I just came up with:

Half way though the game, the Wanderer (Shaper/Lifecrafter) gets put into a really bad situation... if he has used enough of the canisters and gets defeated in a particular special encounter He is saved by a few rebel scouts after being seriously wounded (thinking having his/her legs and one arm completely ripped off and eaten) and is taken to a Rebel fort.
once there a Rebel Canister maker reforges our hero from a human into a Drakon. truly improved!

Now I am going to Try and write a fanfic of this scene and make it a random post here! And While I am at it, I am going to draw a few hundred concepts for this new breed of warrior! Even though its likely never even been though up, let alone, ever be implemented!

[wxxqut]

He could be turned to dracon withot having his legs(or arm) eaten.But its not so good, why would anyone want to be powerfull giant-lizard when he could be powerfull glowing human. Its better to glow then to become a giant arogant lizard.He could instead make himself stronger to resist desiases, to stop felling cold or heat(it would be cool if you can't get fire or ice damage)or even stop death!To live for centuries!

 

Or if he gets his legs(or arm) eaten he could use a special canister or pod to grow it again.Or he could shape his legs again improving them, he could make them run very fast or if his arm gets eaten gives them super strenght or making them imposible to get eaten again or something like that.

 

It would make much more sense then having himself completley altered.He could alter himself completley anytime without having his legs(or arm)eaten.

 

Those two ideas are good but when combined they result in not so good mix.They could be used in G5 seperatly.

[Taliesin]

I think using Shaping on people should be legal under very specific circumstances, like making people immune to diseases or growing back limbs as mentioned above. Hey, the knowledge exists whether the Shapers like it or not, and it's a shame to waste power that could be used wisely. I do admire the Shapers' self-control in this area, but it's like trying to destroy nuclear weapon technology: If you make them totally illegal under all circumstances, only your enemies will have them. And they will use them, too.

 

Edit: Fixed wording mistake.

[Dikiyoba]

Healing people is already permissible. Repairing someone is a lot different than creating or altering someone.

 

Dikiyoba.

[Taliesin]

Oops. I meant altering people to be immune to diseases. And I doubt that growing back limbs would fall under the category of "legal" Shaping.

[The Crimson Coyote]

I am now wondering... what extent dose the Healing go to In the GF universe?

 

...

 

Well... Thinking about the Reshaping limbs thing, I would...

-Shape a baton like creation into my arms. (+2 Baton attacks/Missle weapon skills)

-Shape my legs to be more like an animal's back legs, so I can run particularly fast. (+3-5 action points in Combat)

-Shape a set of Bat like wings with a light weight carapace over them to prevent damage to them... (+45% armoring, Different choices on some Special Encounters)

-Shape a Tail with a Mace and a Baton like end on it. (+1 melee attack, +1 Baton attack)

 

You have to admit such a lifecrafter would look cool!

[Dikiyoba]

Originally by Taliesin:

 

Quote:

Oops. I meant altering people to be immune to diseases. And I doubt that growing back limbs would fall under the category of "legal" Shaping.

Let's see... the first zone of G2 gives us:

 

Quote:

This is an operating room, where wounded humans and serviles are brought to be cured. A trained Shaper can use magic and raw essence to alter a damaged person or even rebuild damaged body parts.

To me, "rebuild damaged body parts" sounds like limb replacement is an option. I don't know how easy it would be to do, what it would look like, or how functional the resulting limb would be, but it sounds like it's possible.

 

But I do agree that disease immunity is probably currently illegal, since the Shapers technique is still essentially random. However, it's worth noting that the Takers in G2 were able to develop a cure for a servile disease by doing some sort of work on the disease itself. And in G4, the Shapers were able to read the Unbound specifications without much trouble. So who knows what the future will bring?

 

Dikiyoba.

[Taliesin]

Quote:

Originally written by Dikiyoba:
Let's see... the first zone of G2 gives us:

Quote:

This is an operating room, where wounded humans and serviles are brought to be cured. A trained Shaper can use magic and raw essence to alter a damaged person or even rebuild damaged body parts.

To me, "rebuild damaged body parts" sounds like limb replacement is an option. I don't know how easy it would be to do, what it would look like, or how functional the resulting limb would be, but it sounds like it's possible.

Dikiyoba.

I stand corrected. That makes me feel a bit better about that part of Shaper law. Although I still think they would do well to keep some of that DNA research from Sucia. However, that knowledge is very easy to abuse, so I don't know. It's all part of the dilemma that makes the Geneforge world so interesting.

[wxxqut]

But if everyone had that power and somebody abuses it rest of them could defeat him, afterall they will use the same powers.

 

And human shaping would be very cool.I wonder will rebellion use it in G5.Hope so!

[The Crimson Coyote]

Ok... This is what 'I' Had in mind for a Modified human.

 

Do you guys like?

[wxxqut]

It looks way too crepy.

 

I would like super limbs but not to look like a...a...a monster.

[The Crimson Coyote]

He looks Creepy! HE IS A LIFE CRAFTER AND YOU WILL TREAT HIM WITH RESPECT!

 

lol

 

You should see THE Character from the story I am making: Colicdus.

[Sudanna]

It is blond. It must die.

[Taliesin]

I like the wrist-as-thorn-baton idea, but overall it looks like an unholy combination of Star Wars and Diablo bad guys. Which is freaky but kind of cool.

 

Quote:

Originally by Nalyd:

It is blond. It must die.

Excuse me? *raises (blond) eyebrow*

[Sudanna]

Nalyd has an irrational hatred of blond hair. At least, the almost-white bleached look in that picture.

[Taliesin]

Okay, good. I'm not that blond. Haha.

[The Ratt]

That thing reminds me of a digimon. Does anyone else think that? (Wiki digimon if you forgot what they look like)

[The Crimson Coyote]

Dose it mater that its blond?

Im trying to go for a way out look... I mean The guy has been altered!

 

Maybe I should have gone with red and blue streaks of hedgehog hair/spikes?

[wxxqut]

You could put spines around his body so nobody can touch him without hurting themselfs.

[The Crimson Coyote]

... Cooool

[Student of Trinity]

Igor made a good point in the G4 survey thread: we never really see much of the good that shaping can do.

 

So far the Geneforge series has made the Trakovite cause look appealing, because we've seen lots of shaping disasters. If G5 is going to end the series, then it will probably have to feature the Trakovite option prominently, since that would make for a real conclusion. But it would definitely raise the stakes of the game if we also saw shaping doing some unambiguous good — and not just in undoing damage done by shaping. Some idyllic place that had been howling desert before the landscape was shaped. Some gravely injured or handicapped people, perhaps so from birth, restored to health by shaping. Maybe even some intelligent creations that are neither slaves nor monsters. Something that makes shaping more than just a bad genie that should obviously be put back in the bottle if only that were possible.

[The Crimson Coyote]

I think thats a good idea

[Sudanna]

Definitely. Nalyd would go into a monologue spouting the benefits of Shaping here, but nobody cares.

[La paix]

Quote:

Originally written by Student of Trinity:
Igor made a good point in the G4 survey thread: we never really see much of the good that shaping can do.

So far the Geneforge series has made the Trakovite cause look appealing, because we've seen lots of shaping disasters. If G5 is going to end the series, then it will probably have to feature the Trakovite option prominently, since that would make for a real conclusion. But it would definitely raise the stakes of the game if we also saw shaping doing some unambiguous good — and not just in undoing damage done by shaping. Some idyllic place that had been howling desert before the landscape was shaped. Some gravely injured or handicapped people, perhaps so from birth, restored to health by shaping. Maybe even some intelligent creations that are neither slaves nor monsters. Something that makes shaping more than just a bad genie that should obviously be put back in the bottle if only that were possible.

That's a very good point. It has always felt kind of evil whenever I play through joining the Shapers. I always end up joining the Rebels/Takers/Awakened first because it's a bit hard to get over the fact that Shapers are so impliedly evil. However, it may be partly true. What if all the Shapers really are corrupt? What if the real government of the Shapers is fully consumed in self-interest? Perhaps there should be a new sect, Shapers, but fighting for the goodwill of everyone. If you know what I mean. It would just sort of give a more realistic feeling to the game. Or even just small collectives of runaway Shapers who run a Shaping healing business, or something like that.

[Taliesin]

Quote:

With great power comes great responsibility. - Uncle Ben, from Spiderman

You have to admit the Shapers understand this principle well, whether their complaining subjects do or not.

[A less presumptuous name.]

I've heard a few other people mention this. How about a prequel. You are around before (or as) the first geneforge is created. You help Pioneer shaping. You invent the drayks. All sorts of possibilities.Maybe you could even start out as a full shaper and just get better!

[Taliesin]

I'd like to see some real Shaper civilization. Not just little forts and stuff. Sure, Dhonal's Keep was neat, but I want to see the real thing.

 

Prepare to be crushed beneath the essence-infused-iron fist of the Shapers!

[Lilith]

Quote:

Originally written by Taliesin:

Quote:

With great power comes great responsibility. - Uncle Ben, from Spiderman

You have to admit the Shapers understand this principle well, whether their complaining subjects do or not.

Do they? Whenever something goes wrong, their standard procedure seems to be to lock it up, forget about it and hope it doesn't get out.

[Sudanna]

No, the standard procedure is to destroy it and everything associated with it. The standard procedure for the Rebels is to lock it up and forget about it.

[wxxqut]

And what should be the standard procedure?Try to calm down an army of giant monsters that could wipe out whole island or province?I don't think so.

 

Think of it, Taliesin is right, Shapers do understeand that with great power comes great responsibility.It is best to destroy it before it destroyes everything else or if its too strong lock it up and stop anything entering(or leaving)that place.

 

Edit-And I agree that they could use some of the experiments, not destroy them like geneforge and drayks.But they have their own ways.

[Dikiyoba]

The fact that the Shapers created and let loose a horde of giant monsters* in the first place makes them greatly responsible, not of great responsibility.

 

*Just in case anyone wants to argue that only the rebels do that, Dikiyoba would like to point out that the Shapers created the drayks (then made them angry by killing them off). And the disease that Torsten had in G3. And the poisoned workshop in G1. And the rogues that chased off the farmers near Dillame.

[Student of Trinity]

Sometime before G4, I had a discussion with Waylander, I believe, about Shaper competence. I argued that Shaper society, and the Shaper Council at its peak, were stumbling through the minefield of history, irresponsibly continuing to build secured labs and develop new techniques, when their vaunted discipline and control were actually and manifestly inadequate to prevent disaster after disaster after disaster. I also held it against the Shapers that so many of their apparently top people kept going rogue.

 

Waylander, on the other hand, felt that the disasters we had seen were representative only of the frontier areas, where Shaper control was inevitably weak. G4 still hasn't quite clarified this issue. So it would be nice indeed if G5 could show us some of the Shaper empire's most civilized areas.

 

In that discussion with Waylander I also presented another possibility, which I think is also still open. That is that in the Geneforge world, shaping may be extremely hard to master, but all too easy to learn. So there may be Monarchs, or at least mini-Monarchs, cropping up all the time. The Shapers have no choice but to accept a lot of borderline unstable characters into their ranks, because otherwise all those Teks and Agathas and Hoges and Barzahls and Goettschs would just have been Monarchs anyway. Putting them into trefoil robes at least offers some chance of keeping the lid on them.

 

And the Shapers put the best face on things that they can, trumpeting their discipline and restraint as though saying often enough that all Shapers have those qualities might begin to make it so. What other choice do they have? Ever since shaping was discovered, they have had a tiger by the tail. They hang on because their hanging on is the only thing keeping the world from being devoured by Monarchs. Collectively they are nowhere near as competent or responsible as they pretend. But this pretence is part of the hanging on that they need to do, for everyone's sake. In this sense, what seem like Shaper incompetence, irresponsibility, and hypocrisy, may really be Shaper tragedy, even Shaper nobility.

 

I don't necessarily want G5 to settle this issue either, but it would be nice to see it somehow addressed.

[Lyric]

I would want the main character to be able to buy(build) his own shaper lab, this way you could create powerful a creation by using the shaping vats(for example you could create battle gammas, charged creation's that don't dye out, add an extra attack(stun, freeze) or improving a spell, so you wouldn't spend so much essence, but you would have to spend money.

It would also be nice to have duels between the main character and oder shapers or rebels(depending on which side you want to stick), in these duels you wouldn't kill the other shaper or rebel, you would just battle that person's creation, and the winner would granted extra knowledge in the shaping or magic arts.

[Lord Safey]

One thing you have to keep in mind is that the Shaper empire is very old. It at least a millennium old (I think more around 2). There so old that they don't remember how they begun. Any empire that is that old is bound to have elements of corruption. The fact that it has a little corruption as it does after all this time is impressive.

[Xaiya]

Uh Mythrael, I don't think there will be any huge changes.

[Celtic Minstrel]

Quote:

Originally written by Mythrael:
I would want the main character to be able to buy(build) his own shaper lab, this way you could create powerful a creation by using the shaping vats(for example you could create battle gammas, charged creation's that don't dye out, add an extra attack(stun, freeze) or improving a spell, so you wouldn't spend so much essence, but you would have to spend money.

Interesting idea. It would probably be much easier to allow you to buy it rather than build it, though. Anyway, I like this idea. The duals, maybe not.

I also suspect that what we post here isn't going to have a significant effect on what he finally decides on. Oh well...

Quote:

Originally written by LakiRa@:
Why not?I would love a faster way of travel somewhere behind red sections(if its previously discovered of course othervise it would be like cheating)

I just noticed this as I went through the thread. You do realize that you can warp instantly to any edge of any zone, provided that you're at the edge of the zone and there is a path of cleared zones between the current zone and the target zone?

[Lyric]

Quote:

Uh Mythrael, I don't think there will be any huge changes.

I know that there aren't going to be many changes, cause I've seen how the games mechanics are coded, but i believe that the shaper lab idea might be a feasible one if creations are treated as items(see how a weapon can gain stun, freeze, acid damage), so creatures could be upgraded with extra attacks or defensive abilities.

Edit: does anyone know when the next geneforge will be out?

[Randomizer]

Jeff will work on Geneforge 5 so the Mac version will be available some time in November 2008 and the Windows version in early 2009.

[Xaiya]

That is still a huge change.

[Txgangsta]

Iffy, it's just an anvil for creatures, instead of items. I think it wouldnt be that big of a change.

[Lord Safey]

that change sounds a lot easier said then done and Jeff isn't going to put a radical amount of work into something unless it radicaly increases the quality

[Zummi]

And we don't like those eye-candy graphics..

[Txgangsta]

Who cares about the graphics if the game itself is better?