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I think that each race having a unique god could be more interesting for the game genesis

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I think Jeff does well in designing scenarios. Given the large scope of his work he manages to give players the flexibility to play the game in different paths. the advantage of small scenarios as developed by the editor and independents is the ability to force players to follow a preconceived route and thereby reveal a story (ala Canopy). This is disatisfying from my standpoint in that the only real control as a player I have is how to fight the battle and whether or not I win. I can plan to win the battle but not the war. On the other side, Jeff's large scenarios do become generic, especially as you level up. Race attributes and character skills become relatively less important with time/experience. So, I would like to see:

 

1) a better plot/story line (perhaps several depending on choices you make during the game)

 

2) character attributes that become more individualized and not less as your character develops. Thus, choosing a slith/nephil/human for the long term becomes important (especially if you play singleton).

 

3) perhaps the side quests/missions would not all be playable depending on the choices you make. I.e. you choose to side with the empire, the rebels do not give you a mission, because of that you cannot get a special item/skilltraining/spell advancement. Then, there are real consequences to choosing sides.

 

4) there could also be time elements to some of the missions/side quests (ala ZKR), again forcing you to choose, with consequences)

 

5) perhas some elements of non-criticl play could be added, like designing and building a mansion, governing a farm, opening your own store/training center. This could fill in time between quests and allow the character to "develop"

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The land inherited by the Avernites would be an interesting setting. It would be kind of cool to travel to the other continents, but Valorim was the only known continent to have monsters still roam the land. Some Avernites stay below, and some do not. Perhaps the story could branch there.

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Fatman: 1) is what we all want. 2) seems possible if he steals more from the GF engine than I'd like him to, but otherwise... I don't know how he'd do this in a way that wouldn't annoy me. 3) seems very likely, given what he's done lately. 4) was already done in E3/A3, so it's probably coming back -- unless he does something annoying borrowing from the GF engine and eliminates the concept of time. 5) also sounds much like E3/A3. — But not much like GF, which makes me wonder. I'd like to see this sort of thing too.

 

Tohubohu: the land inherited by the Avernites is awfully small... it's maybe 10-20% of Valorim, if that.

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FYI, Jeff has stated that A4 will borrow many aspects from the Geneforge engine.

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I'd like these features:

 

1. Keep the dang thing turn-based! Do you know how hard it is to find quality turn-based RPGs any more?

 

2. Someone already said it, but it deserves to be said again: house building and item crafting. I so want my own house (with storage area) and my own custom-built mithril rapier.

 

3. Being able to go from the surface back to lower Exile would be nice... Extremely time consuming to code, but nice. (I know, not going to happen... But I can dream, can't I?)

 

4. Definite race differences... Aside from graphics, I can't tell if my slith has a bonus with spears or just really high dexterity.

 

5. The A1/A2 weapons damage model. In A3, damage started to get entirely too high, even without assassination (or I just trained my skills abnormally high).

 

6. Again, been said before, but deserves to be said again: single-shot area spells. Who remembers fireball from Exile? I used that spell clear through the end of E2; the multi-targeting spells just don't cut it like fireball (and others) did. With a single-shot area-attack spell, there's strategy involved (getting opponents to clump together while avoiding clumping your party).

 

That's all I can think of right now for A4; as for the multi-player idea someone mentioned, heh. I emailed Jeff way back before E3 came out (a loooong time ago...), and he said that it's been mentioned and considered, but it's just not the direction he's going (or it wasn't then). Besides, programming a single-player game is vastly different from coding a multi-player internet game.

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Quote:
Originally written by Rent-an-Ihrno:
i think it would be interesting if npcs reacted to the looks of your characters. for example, a townguard would let you in if you have a beautiful, half-naked woman with you. you get my meaning.
WHA?!?!
*shoots Rent-an-Ihrno with a Shotgun*

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Quote:
Originally written by PantherShadow:
I think it sounds like a good idea
Yick!!your disgusting!!!!

Quote:
Originally written by PantherShadow:
The interaction, not shooting Rent-an-Ihrno that is.
^Best laugh of the day! laughlaughlaugh

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If I remember this correctly, Jeff mentioned that the idea for A4 has been on his mind for quite a while, actually since the days of E1.

 

If that's so, then maybe this game will be Avernum centric, no surface (I love the surface, but not as much as those guys in the caves, and there's so much more that can be done. New cave systems. Political situations between the three main races (four if he puts the Vahnatai in the mix)

 

Well. It's done. The milk is spilt. Enough people who know have mentioned already in this thread that the A4 engine will borrow from GF. That's that. Hope he borrows good things, and not the bad.

 

Turn base all the way. Please. The only turn based RPG I've played in recent years, other than SW stuff that I enjoyed to a certain degree (some problems) was ToEE.

 

No region division, please. Please. It may help it look more. . . "organized" but that's, I think, in the end illusory. Open outdoors with dungeon/towns that you access through general outdoors area. Please.

 

No singleton oriented game, please. Let that be a choice one can make, not the norm. I'm fine in GF with going with cutesy critters, but that's GF (which doesn't even have GIFTS, so let's keep the two worlds as separate as possible, please)

 

Area spells. Not more spells as such, but more Useful spells. We could have 12653 Spells but if all we use are 12, then what's the use? Exageration aside, I miss the spell system of Exile, and that of Nethergate was nice (it had "schools" as well, which is not too shabby)

 

Multiple paths, multiple endings. That has been one of the things I've enjoyed the most out of the GF games. Granted that all Exile/Avernum games have had one ending (well, you had more if you continue with the different major quests, but no choice as such.) Multiple groups to join and help. This may all seem hellish, scripting wise, and if he goes that way it may make the game smaller, but heck if that means we sacrifice vastness (a la E3/A3) for well done storyline (a la Nethergate or E2/A2 or whichever you think has the best storyline) then let's do it. I think.

 

I'm okay with the three races. A few, not many, skills that are race oriented would not be bad, and it would make some sense (besides the initial bonuses you get)

 

More extra skills that you get as you play. I loved those, and I thought it made sense since a character can learn new things by living through the adventure.

 

Hmmm. Maybe if we go back to period before E3 we can have Erika around again. I'd like that. I'll miss her if we go after A3, and if so, then heck maybe it'd be nicer to see it a few generations later.

 

Well, I'll be weary with this GF engine thing until I see some screenshots and see how it looks, and of course until I play it. I like Geneforge a good deal, for what it is and in it's own cul-de-sac.

 

We shall see.

 

Cheers!

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there already is a boa-scenario that starts from when most avernites have settled valorim, but some stayed below, getting trouble with the sliths again. forgot the name. however, i dont think jeff would just steal that idea.

 

@panther: thanks laugh

 

@spawn: are you alright?

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Demonspawn is either a young, innocent boy, or a radically homosexual man.

 

EDIT: Now, not being able to pass a certain area unless you had pantsless women in your party would be interesting. Or pantsless men. Or an entire party without any instance of pants.

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imagine the possibilities! when fighting a dragon, for example, being pantless could disgust it so much it falls over and breaks its neck. or sitting in the forest wearing extremely colourful clothes attracts some kind of elves, blablabla.

 

what would naturally fit well to all that is a very, very old adventure-system - randomly given attributes of characters. of course not in an extend similar to those very, very old adventure games.

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Quote:
Originally written by Rent-an-Ihrno:
imagine the possibilities! when fighting a dragon, for example, being pantless could disgust it so much it falls over and breaks its neck. or sitting in the forest wearing extremely colourful clothes attracts some kind of elves, blablabla.

what would naturally fit well to all that is a very, very old adventure-system - randomly given attributes of characters. of course not in an extend similar to those very, very old adventure games.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

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Quote:
Originally written by Rent-an-Ihrno:
imagine the possibilities! when fighting a dragon, for example, being pantless could disgust it so much it falls over and breaks its neck. or sitting in the forest wearing extremely colourful clothes attracts some kind of elves, blablabla.
The Dragon wouldn't care!not as much nasty clothes to chew through/burn so he could care less. icon13.gif

I like the elf Idea though icon14.gif

@wiseman:YOU ARE AN IDIOT LALALALALALALA LA-LA-LA!!!!...YOU ARE AN IDIOT LALALALALALALA LA-LA-LA!!!!...YOU ARE AN IDIOT LALALALALALALA LA-LA-LA!!!!...YOU ARE AN IDIOT LALALALALALALA LA-LA-LA!!!!...YOU ARE AN IDIOT LALALALALALALA LA-LA-LA!!!!...YOU ARE AN IDIOT LALALALALALALA LA-LA-LA!!!!...

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I know this is crazy thinking, but maybe ONE FINGER ON EACH HAND! *shockhorror*

 

Also, I would like to be able to have two weapons at once...

 

And finally it has to be a hugehugehuge world! I love exploring in these games... maybe something with continents other than Valorim...? smile

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yeah man what a good idea !!!!!!!!!!!

it would sacrifice memory (more MB) for good music but it really would add the touch!!

ah and improvement in the sounds, in general

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Quote:
Originally written by Wise Man is quite the:
Guns and liquor.
We already have crossbows and gremlin wine.

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I would like to have some unique things about each species of character. Unique weapons, buildings, armor, clothes, weapons, statues, food for each type of character. Background stuff. Slith, Nephilim, and Human should be developed more. Put together a history for each character type -- 3-4 pages in the manual.

 

Kilts, yes we need kilts and tartans.

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'Cept for troglos, giants, and what-have-you... They relieve themselves whenever I draw my sword and charge laugh

 

I agree with Capt. Ackers on the ring thing... Two rings is much better. Of course, Jeff did give us bracelets... Anyway, I completely, 100% agree on two weapons. At the end of E2, my primary fighter was a force-and-a-half to be reckoned with all because of dual weilding. Maybe make it only available to characters with at least X strength, and/or impose an accuracy penalty on one weapon (since Avernum doesn't have the ambixtrous trait)?

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Quote:
Toasty Warm: "Kilts, yes we need kilts and tartan"
I was thinking about having kilts in Avernum context the other day. Although the other day I didn't even know about A4... it was more a BoA scenario idea... and similarly with having to wear pants for social occasions. My thoughts on kilts were basically no protection, or negative since they expose your legs, but you have to wear them for big parties or something like that.

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(a general want: even though it seems it will use a similar engine to that of the GF games, I hope it looks as far remove from GF and as close to the previous Averna games as possible. GF3 had bathrooms, though (or I thought they were bathrooms, maybe they were something else) so that can part of GF can be used. Heck, who knows, we may even have to play it singleton (no party choice) and all the critters will be of a general variety (I guess creations will be pushing it too far. Maybe we'll have three types: Goblin stuff, Giant stuff and Invisible stuff stuff.))

 

Kilts that can be worn over armor (underneath the armor, of course, nothing is worn)

 

Will this be the first Avernum without Erika? Can her ashes play a part in the storyline somehow? Maybe she can appear as a ghost. An Avernum game without Erika scarcely bears thinking about.

 

Well. . . this is a pipe dream, an perhaps not the worthiest worth dreaming of but. . . how about being able to fight with two weapons?

 

I said this before, excuse the redundancy: please, please, no regional division of the game. Please.

 

(oh and another redundant please: no more of the Big Bad Guy kind of plotline. A plot like 1 or 2 in as far as there were multiple major quests and though the Empire was the main bad guy in the 1st, there were other things the party was trying to accomplish. Similarly with A2 where we had to deal with the Empire and the Vahnatai.)

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If adventurers were naked under the armour, chain mail would kind of chafe underneath, don't you think? Yes, that would be men AND women alike.

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Yur right, sir. But. . . er. . . maybe they enjoy the pain since they feel they are somehow using that pain to punish themselves for their sins? Maybe they are all Irish monks who. . . Okay. I can't justify how that would be a good idea. Nope. Just can't. Can't even say that that somehow explains why the adventurers are better than anybody else. That was just one bad, bad idea. (who would it be worse for, men or women?)

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Honestly, if that's all you want, you can probably find yourself a half-decent hooker for as much as A4 would cost you. We've already got someone pissing up BoA with bad soft porn; no need for A4 to go the same way.

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The last thing Avernum needs is an even lower common denominator. Maybe Jeff had better stop using so much dialogue. It gets in the way.

 

—Alorael, who doesn't quite consider the Exile cheats very impressive. The E2 party advice is okay, maybe, but it's certainly not a party he'd ever choose to use. The E3 advice is both fairly obvious and fairly unhelpful. What makes dishes so critical?

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Maybe Avernum 4 can be set in the near future when the Empire has advanced to the industrial age, (factories, trains, telegraphs, typical 1890 technology) and the Vahnatai could be even more advanced, (1980 type technology).

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the empire in the imperial age. some continents struggle for freedom...

or: all peoples live in peace and harmony, until a group of nerds decide to take over the world, starting from a small town that likes the idea, and they call themselves the empire. will you fight them? or join them? (haha, damn geneforge.)

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The Empire's pretty big. Surely it'll feel the strain and fall apart.

 

Quote:
the empire in the imperial age.
Just to nitpick, the Empire is by definition in its Imperial age...

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If this was Civilization, the Empire would crumble from excessive corruption. And then they would revolt to communism :rolleyes:

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A happy little list.

 

1. A larger world, jeff hasn't currently designated in exacts the time system. [Length of days and such relative to earth time] There could be more unexplored/undiscovered continents [You don't even know how large the world is unless you're an astronomer measuring the length of the days, seasons, and years, or you've sailed all the way around it.] he could also/instead of that open up the other continents he's already discussed.

 

2. More character customization, more distinct charactar portraits and spirits, gener differentiation for the other races. [sentient mammals have two larger breasts for a reason, and its not so straight males can look at them; they're there because intelligent offspring means fewer, larger offspring, with higher nutrative needs [The current pictures are either male, or undifferentiable]. As for the slith, females should just be larger.. as reptilian females generally are, evolution produced the need to protect a brood, and that would still show in the musculastructure and relative size even though males help now due to sentience]

 

3. More skills and schools of magic. Allow the party members to learn not only general weapons compotence, but at higher levels [perhaps using skill prereqs and special trainers] specific styles that alter the attack stats [letting your swordsman use a heavyhanded, finessless style, and your spearman and faster, more accurate style, or vice versa] specialize magic further, so that you have "subschools" within the priest and mage school [perhaps just group them togeather, or use prereqs and special trainers] for access to a larger variety of more specialized spells. More "survival" skills that allow the party to cull the land.

 

4. A more complex lockpicking/trap disarming system. A system that would bring up something similiar to a minigame for traps and locks if your skill is within a certain tollerance of the difficulty of your target, if your skill was excessively superiour or inferiour it might fail or succeed automatically as per normal.

 

5. Crafting skills of all levels, perhaps a specialized school of magic to place temporary enchantments on items as well, the ability to collect material and make most kinds of items, or possibly even alter the landscape/build structures.

 

6. Bore background/backstory/culture to the non human races. So far, "non humans" are treated pretty much as either really strange, superiour, or inferiour humans. Give them their own identities and structural flair, slith structures [once they learn how to build them and cement their own style] would be nothing like a humans, it would have as much in common with a nephil designed structure. [we saw this to a decent extent with the vahnatai, but it could of been better.]

 

7. More advanced scripted reactions and "character memories" to allow for more complex and absorbing NPC interaction.

 

8. More active communities. The extent to which any town or city was "active" in the past games was it being slowly destroyed by something, it would be nice to watch a town grow.

 

9. More Character Slots. Perhaps keep the Four PC slots, but have 2-4 extra slots for NPCs. Coupled with the more complex scripting and memory system this could allow Jeff to write more complex Quests. perhaps even make you feel like you're temporarily teaming up with another band of adventurers. [given it allows you to speak to these "party members" while they're with you.]

 

10. A Camp option. Instead of camping like normal it might be interesting for the party to actually pitch a temporary camp [done by using a map referenced by the kind of terrain their on.] It would add atmosphere, and possibly finding something interesting in the camp itself. [Retain a "quick camp" option for those which just want to regain HP, and not use the camp to prepare for something up ahead.]

 

11. More slots on the character's body. being able to wear more equipment is always interesting and gives your characters a bit of personality.

 

12. A "turn-time" based system. Turn-time, like geneforge used has alot of potential, though I will say while it was fun it could of been executed in a more intuitive and effective manner.

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Fighting styles. A return of bashing weapons (Clubs were cool - in Exile 3 with my party of 3 I would keep one around just for the hell of it). And of course, different physical damage types. If you can have different magic damage types for spells, it shouldn't be that hard to implement physical damage types, right? smirk

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there cannot be an imperial age when there is only one existing nation. (avernum doesnt count) the empire, when it has conquered all the continents, must be neo-imperialistic or fascistic.

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Quote:
Originally written by bogus standard candidate:
... Will this be the first Avernum without Erika? Can her ashes play a part in the storyline somehow? Maybe she can appear as a ghost. An Avernum game without Erika scarcely bears thinking about.
...
Maybe she'll come back as a shadow mage, a voice in the void or she managed timely to copy her knowledge into a crystal soul ...

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I agree with Ezrah, I'd like to see more survival skills too. Find Herbs was one of my favourite skills especially when I used alchemy.

 

I'd also like to see the return of some puzzles like in Exile 2. The test of mind in E2 was so much better than the test of patience in A2. Riddles etc are fun.

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