Well-Actually War Trall Actaeon Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 The almighty Netflix, in its glorious wisdom, recently saw fit to release Blade Runner and Terminator both for streaming. I jumped at the chance to review such 80's sci-fi classics, wholly ignoring the obvious cry for help by the humans now enslaved by their own servers. As I suppose was the original intent of the films (or at least Blade Runner), it got me thinking. Whatever happened to the fear of AI runamock? The last time I actually saw it portrayed in film, it was used flippantly in "Futurama" alongside ostrich mounted knights and chariot drawn giraffes. Has our subsequent research in the area convinced us that rebel machines are unrealistic? Has the direction of technology taken such an obvious turn that androids and their ilk no longer seem like a necessary product? Or have we simply turned our attention to a new set of fears? I'm bad at narrowing things down, so I'm open to any sort of response. Perhaps I'm just plain wrong, and that fear is still very much alive. Perhaps each generation invents its out fears, and androids we just a phase like puffy vests and synth-pop. Perhaps there's an angle I haven't seen yet. Have at it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Randomizer Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 There are still the classics: 2001: A Space Odyssey, almost any Star Trek series, Will Smith's version of Isaac Asimov's I, Robot, the Stargate series with the Replicators, the Terminator movies (there's a new one coming), and The Big Bang Theory depending upon whether you think Sheldon Cooper is human, alien, or a robot. There are fewer decent movies based upon AIs taking over, and I behind on reading new authors to see if they are still churning out that theme. It's mostly due to fear of the new and unknown. The 1950s had the threat of the nuclear bomb, the 1970s with the rise of computers in mainstream life had the rise of AIs, now it nanotechnology. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Easygoing Eyebeast Goldengirl Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Originally Posted By: Randomizer The 1950s had the threat of the nuclear bomb, the 1970s with the rise of computers in mainstream life had the rise of AIs, now it nanotechnology. Nanotechnology? What are you using to substantiate that claim? I've only heard a very few times that nanotechnology might cause any sort of threat, and that was years ago. If anything, I'd posit that the fear now is disease - that terrible film Pandemic, fears over Avian Flu, SARS, and other diseases in popular culture, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Easygoing Eyebeast Dintiradan Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 You still get AIs as the antagonists, but nowadays you see 'em portrayed in a more sympathetic light. The Cylons in the new BSG series, the Geth in the Mass Effect series, and other examples already posted. Hmmm, now that I think about it, books that portray fully sapient AIs in a good light have been around for a while, but when was the first Hollywood movie that portrayed AIs or robots in a good light made? (I was about to add "synthetic humanoids" to that list, but then remembered Frankenstein.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Randomizer Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 There are two versions of the nanotechnology threat. The more common and likely is a new source of disease as the particles can be toxic. The comparison is that it could cause problems like asbestos. The other is still far off, the rise of the nanite, a self replicating robot with intelligence that could be the start of run amuck AIs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Well-Actually War Trall Actaeon Posted January 23, 2012 Author Share Posted January 23, 2012 There's also a fair amount of fear associated with genetic engineering. And nukes haven't exactly gone away... (Also: http://questionablecontent.net/view.php?comic=2071) (Also also: I am afraid I cannot separate fear of Nanotechnology from "Prey", which makes it marginally harder to take seriously.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Alorael at Large Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Originally Posted By: Dintiradan You still get AIs as the antagonists, but nowadays you see 'em portrayed in a more sympathetic light. The Cylons in the new BSG series, the Geth in the Mass Effect series, and other examples already posted. And in both cases, they're major series antagonists. Not universally evil, but functionally so at the beginning and substantially so at the end. And, in both cases, factionalized. Maybe AI is so rebellious it's also autorebellious? —Alorael, who thinks mostly AI burnout has taken hold and everyone is so reliant on computers for everything that they've lost their alien menace. Sure, a supercomputer launching missiles is scary, but with everyone tapping away at keyboards all the time it's also clear just how far away that is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Easygoing Eyebeast Dintiradan Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 (My 'problem' is that I cannot take Prey marginally seriously. :-P ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Randomizer Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Originally Posted By: Fire Wakes —Alorael, who thinks mostly AI burnout has taken hold and everyone is so reliant on computers for everything that they've lost their alien menace. Resistance if futile. You will be assimilated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Easygoing Eyebeast Goldengirl Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Originally Posted By: Randomizer There are two versions of the nanotechnology threat. I am aware of the actual threats, especially the nanites. However, I was more questioning how it was that that fear had actually manifested itself in popular culture. I haven't seen any evidence that a fear of nanotechnology going awry has crossed over into the mainstream. Diseases, perhaps from genetic engineering as Actaeon mentioned, seem to be something that a lot of people are afraid of causing some sort of apocalyptic scenario. Public fear of avian flu, SARS, and all those other outbreaks, the popularity of the film Contagion (not Pandemic as I earlier said), and all of that seem to show people are afraid. I haven't really seen anything on that scale about nanotech. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Well-Actually War Trall The Ratt Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 I don't think we'll have to worry about AI's that become hostile (not including ones that started out hostile) unless we manage to perfect computers/robots that can alter their own programming and/or machine learning (not sure where the line is there). Otherwise, if you don't put it in the code, there's an almost impossible chance of that happening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Alorael at Large Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 One way or another, it has to be a bug. It can be a bug that makes the AI hostile, which would be bad, or a bug that leaves open the possibility of the self-modifying code becoming hostile, which would eventually be bad. —Alorael, who can't imagine creating strong AI without some capacity for self-modification. It's a pretty important part of thinking rather than just information accumulation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrulous Glaahk Yuna Corne Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 I am very disappointed that this isn't a thread about Robot Jones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Well-Actually War Trall Cairo Jim Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 What about Aran's army of spambots? Does that count? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Randomizer Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Originally Posted By: Cairo Jim What about Aran's army of spambots? Does that count? Only when they post. So the only one to worry about is Alorael. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ineffable Wingbolt Erebus the Black Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 On nanobots: we are still a long way away from nanobots, for one let alone making a media several molecules large to create a programmable memory, we can't even keep them going (i.e. a sustainable nano fusion power core). It is more sensible to talk about autonomous micro-bots at our present time as they have existed in nature for millions of years with a single program: survive. They are bacteria. On AI: has anyone seen the special about the US army robotics development and the dilemma about when is it OK for a robot to kill a biologic machine (i.e. anything from bacteria via plant and animal up to human) (robots make decisions faster than men, so having them await confirmation for each kill reduces their effectiveness, at least that's what the military top brass thinks) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnificent Ornk Student of Trinity Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 I think we've all realized that the most realistic scenario with computers running amok is that they try to sell us knock-off Viagra. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Well-Actually War Trall Rowen Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Originally Posted By: Student of Trinity I think we've all realized that the most realistic scenario with computers running amok is that they try to sell us knock-off Viagra. My greatest technology fear is the blue screen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnificent Ornk nikki. Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Originally Posted By: Rowen Originally Posted By: Student of Trinity I think we've all realized that the most realistic scenario with computers running amok is that they try to sell us knock-off Viagra. My greatest technology fear is the blue screen. Just set your desktop wallpaper to the blue screen and you'll eventually become so used to it, it'll have no power over you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Alorael at Large Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 I bet the AIs could make the trains run on time! Except they'd all slow down at times of high traffic, and periodically some would freeze until someone could be spared to repair them... Actually, I'm not sure it'd be different. —Alorael, who can imagine malevolent AIs making the trains run pretty much exactly as they do now as a show of evil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unflappable Drayk Ceiling Durkheim Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Quote: I bet the AIs could make the trains run on time! Well, that's better than Mussolini managed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Well-Actually War Trall Actaeon Posted January 24, 2012 Author Share Posted January 24, 2012 Continuing my recent tradition of citing webcomics: http://xkcd.com/282/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Easygoing Eyebeast Dantius Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Originally Posted By: Actaeon Continuing my recent tradition of citing webcomics: http://xkcd.com/282/ ... We are no longer friends. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Well-Actually War Trall Actaeon Posted January 24, 2012 Author Share Posted January 24, 2012 I have nothing to apologize for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Randomizer Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 If you can't the pun, stay out of the forum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnificent Ornk Dikiyoba Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Originally Posted By: Randomizer If you can't [take] the pun, stay out of the forum. Are you trying to compete with Harehunter for the rank of worst comedian? Because if you are, that certainly puts you in the running. Dikiyoba's greatest technological fear is that Dikiyoba will grow old and be completely unable to handle the newfangled technology of the future. Of course, Dikiyoba's biggest fear is that Dikiyoba won't live long enough to become old, so being befuddled by technology doesn't seem too bad in comparison. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Randomizer Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 As long as there are rocks you'll be fine with the new technology, You can use them as counters or throw them to settle arguments. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Well-Actually War Trall Harehunter Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Originally Posted By: Dikiyoba Originally Posted By: Randomizer If you can't [take] the pun, stay out of the forum. Are you trying to compete with Harehunter for the rank of worst comedian? Because if you are, that certainly puts you in the running. I resemble that remark. And thank you for the recognition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ineffable Wingbolt Erebus the Black Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Originally Posted By: Dikiyoba Originally Posted By: Randomizer If you can't [take] the pun, stay out of the forum. Are you trying to compete with Harehunter for the rank of worst comedian? Because if you are, that certainly puts you in the running. Dikiyoba's greatest technological fear is that Dikiyoba will grow old and be completely unable to handle the newfangled technology of the future. Of course, Dikiyoba's biggest fear is that Dikiyoba won't live long enough to become old, so being befuddled by technology doesn't seem too bad in comparison. The full onset of technophobia comes as age brings your eyesight to a level where no amount of prescription glasses can help you read small letterings without a headache or a lot of squinting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Well-Actually War Trall Actaeon Posted January 24, 2012 Author Share Posted January 24, 2012 One could make the argument that the advent of touch technology has actually reversed age-associated technophobia somewhat. Many people who previously had trouble with tiny buttons and complex interfaces have found that the new suite of devices are within their learning curve. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Well-Actually War Trall The Ratt Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Um, do you mean figuring out the devices on their own or figuring them out at all? Because my dad works at a library and he has had a lot of older folks coming with their new-fangled iPads and Kindles hoping someone could teach them how to use them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Alorael at Large Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 I've started getting emails from a 94-year-old relative. Sent from her iPad. It's the first computer she's ever owned, and now she's checking gardening forums and complaining about the quality of recipes on Epicurious. Anyone can manage. —Alorael, who is already a Luddite. He doesn't have an iPad himself, nor does he really want one. He doesn't Facebook, Twitter, or even reddit. And he plays Angband. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unflappable Drayk ĐªгŦĦ Єяŋϊε Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Originally Posted By: Smuggling ideas over the borders —Alorael, who is already a Luddite. He doesn't have an iPad himself, nor does he really want one. He doesn't Facebook, Twitter, or even reddit. And he plays Angband. and his avatar was created in paint. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Well-Actually War Trall Actaeon Posted January 24, 2012 Author Share Posted January 24, 2012 Originally Posted By: Smuggling ideas over the borders —Alorael, who is already a Luddite. He doesn't have an iPad himself, nor does he really want one. He doesn't Facebook, Twitter, or even reddit. And he plays Angband. To me, this could be a topic of its own. I'm a Wikipedia addict and am unhealthily attached to my laptop, but cannot get in line with modern tablets, ereaders, or the idea of web based computing that's rendered nonfunctional without an internet connection. (I also have been known to dip into roguelikes between Spiderweb releases, and own a typewriter and gramophone. Obviously, I'm not an ideal representative of my generation.) Edit: If he wanted to be really hipster about it, he'd have drawn it in Kidpix. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Well-Actually War Trall Harehunter Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 As our systems get more advanced, they get more complicated, requiring more resources on more computers, tying together more data from from more data stores, and requiring more oversight to keep the bloody things working. As Montgomery Scott would say, "The more they over tweak the plumbing, the easier it is to stove off the drain." On the other hand, we have one legacy server that runs a very simple, but robust database, and runs circles around our Oracle servers on less CPU, memory and disk. Often times, simpler is better. If it ain't baroque, don't fix it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnificent Ornk Dikiyoba Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Originally Posted By: Actaeon To me, this could be a topic of its own. Don't worry, topic drift will take care of that soon enough. And at the risk of sounding like a hipster, Dikiyoba thinks Kid Pix was awesome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ineffable Wingbolt Erebus the Black Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 @Diki: congrats on the new avatar, it reminds of a game I used to play (can't remember which though) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Alorael at Large Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Originally Posted By: Darth Ernie Originally Posted By: Smuggling ideas over the borders —Alorael, who is already a Luddite. He doesn't have an iPad himself, nor does he really want one. He doesn't Facebook, Twitter, or even reddit. And he plays Angband. and his avatar was created in paint. Wrong! If I were using a Paint-like program, it would've been done with AppleWorks, but I actually made my avatar with Adobe Illustrator. —Alorael, who is not averse to overpowered tools for minimal jobs. As far as he can remember, he's used Illustrator only for his avatar and his attempt at an Encyclopedia Ermariana logo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rotghroth Rhapsody waterplant Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Originally Posted By: Erasmus @Diki: congrats on the new avatar, it reminds of a game I used to play (can't remember which though) Very C64. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Easygoing Eyebeast The Mystic Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Originally Posted By: Born and Bed —Alorael, who is already a Luddite. He doesn't have an iPad himself, nor does he really want one. He doesn't Facebook, Twitter, or even reddit. And he plays Angband. I have no desire for an iPad either, and I have no real use for one, save as a large paperweight. I'd much rather have an iPaid, the device that pays you to use it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnificent Ornk nikki. Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Originally Posted By: The Mystic Originally Posted By: Born and Bed —Alorael, who is already a Luddite. He doesn't have an iPad himself, nor does he really want one. He doesn't Facebook, Twitter, or even reddit. And he plays Angband. I have no desire for an iPad either, and I have no real use for one, save as a large paperweight. They're actually really useful - I never really thought I'd use one, but being away from my computer (a 15" laptop which is aging and has very limitied battery life) a lot, due to, but not exclusively because of university, I find I use my iPad a lot. It's really easy to slip into a bag to take to school, or to my Mum's house when I head there to visit, and since I got the 3G model, I can also use it on the bus/train too. And, as well as all that, it's as easy to use as my iPhone, but it's far easier to write drafts of papers, keep a journal, or email from it than my phone, and it's far quicker to grab that and be online than waking my computer up from sleep. (And before I get branded as an apple fanboy, my computer uses Windows 7. I occasionally use OSX on an older computer, but only really for new SW releases.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Well-Actually War Trall Actaeon Posted January 30, 2012 Author Share Posted January 30, 2012 Can I avoid the apple fanboy tag if my COMPUTER is an apple but my other devices (phone, mainly) aren't? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Alorael at Large Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 You can avoid the fanboy label, or you should be able to, if you're rational in your product choices and don't gush at minimal prompting. I find smartphones handy because they don't require carrying another device and are useful in a pinch for notes or for email. I've yet to find myself in need of word processing or any serious browsing when unable to use a laptop and an internet connection, and I don't carry around a laptop as a matter of course. Everything's easier with an iPad, but not so much easier that I can justify another gadget. —Alorael, who probably counts as an Apple fanboy. He has come to terms with his designation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnificent Ornk nikki. Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Honestly, I think if I weren't at school for long stretches at a time, I'd rarely use my tablet - the five hours I have between lectures means I'm stuck around on campus (since it takes around an hour to get home, not accounting for public transport times). Those five hours go from messing about to being somewhat productive with my tablet. The fact that my school uses Blackboard, which syncs right up to the iPad is just a natty bonus, really. I mean, it is nice to use if I want to make a quick note of something, or buy something online (and I almost exclusively rely on iDevices for my email now), but I'd quite happily manage without the iPad if I didn't use it so much for school. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Easygoing Eyebeast The Mystic Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 Originally Posted By: fade out again They're actually really useful - I never really thought I'd use one, but being away from my computer (a 15" laptop which is aging and has very limitied battery life) a lot, due to, but not exclusively because of university, I find I use my iPad a lot. It's really easy to slip into a bag to take to school, or to my Mum's house when I head there to visit, and since I got the 3G model, I can also use it on the bus/train too. And, as well as all that, it's as easy to use as my iPhone, but it's far easier to write drafts of papers, keep a journal, or email from it than my phone, and it's far quicker to grab that and be online than waking my computer up from sleep. I never said an iPad wasn't useful; because it's essentially a mobile computer, I'm sure it's highly versatile. I just meant that, since I have a few other gadgets and whatnot at my disposal, I really don't need an iPad (and they also cost a bit more than I'm willing to pay). Originally Posted By: Actaeon Can I avoid the apple fanboy tag if my COMPUTER is an apple but my other devices (phone, mainly) aren't? You just did, simply by owning Apple and non-Apple products at the same time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnificent Ornk nikki. Posted January 31, 2012 Share Posted January 31, 2012 Originally Posted By: The Mystic I never said an iPad wasn't useful; because it's essentially a mobile computer, I'm sure it's highly versatile. I just meant that, since I have a few other gadgets and whatnot at my disposal, I really don't need an iPad (and they also cost a bit more than I'm willing to pay). Yeah, I think I was sort of generically answering both you and Alorael (and anybody else who cared to read) there. Sorry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Easygoing Eyebeast The Mystic Posted February 2, 2012 Share Posted February 2, 2012 Apology accepted, albeit unnecessary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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