Emperor Tullegolar

The correct answer to this question is Geneforge 2. Geneforge is all about choices, and this one had the greatest amount. It had the best characters, namely Barzahl. It still used all the old Geneforge graphics (old shaper, old servile, old battle alpha) which I am quite fond of. The fact that Geneforge has the best story ever makes the linear gameplay of Geneforge 3 and 4 acceptable, but I will still take the non-linear style of Geneforge 2 any day. Did I mention it had Barzahl?

I don't think the Vahnatai could ever bring themselves to kill her. And I don't think she could ever bring herself to kill herself. No, she was killed by adventurers. It's really the only way to go these days. I'll miss her, at least.

Telling the giants to attack Muck doesn't really result in that much destruction. Every now and then, a giant or two will appear outside and attack the city when you're near it, but the guards can usually handle them. I've never seen them get as far as the alchemist. I have, however, seen that one nephil village completely destroyed by undead, which was hilarious.

Ah, but you can not do Shafrir's quest if you have the geas. He just won't give it to you. You would have to not get the geas until you've reached him, then go back and do all the other geas items, which, as was pointed out in another thread, can be buggy.

Quote: Originally written by Slarty: Is the issue that he needs the drake-skin first, or that he no longer cares about an item after you've passed through the land it comes from (i.e., the place where his geas would stop you from going forward)? I handed in the crystal soul shard after leaving the Vahnatai lands, so I would say the former is the issue. I had a curse and everything, which he was kind enough to remove. The real question is: is it not registering because he freed the drake (which would be lame) or because he got the geas after freeing the drake (which sounds more like a bug)?

Forfeit.

No.

Quote: Originally written by Spidweb: I meant it to be a clear choice Then how is Dorikas not a villain? Oh, well, the journey was great and I guess that is what Avernum is all about. I just wanted you to know there is a was huge vacuum (figuratively) left where a main villain should be now that Rentar is dead. Dorikas didn't fit the bill, and from what you're saying, it seems he wasn't really meant to. I can only hope that means you have something awesome in store for us later like you always do!

Quote: Originally written by Synergy: but keep dealing with loyal, determined underlings You see, I think that might be an overstatement. I think whole whole faction was underdeveloped. Even when I was talking to Tholmen at the entrance to their fortress, I just wasn't feeling the same moral struggle I feel in Geneforge games. They had done nothing to convince me that theirs was the way to go, and the whole journey thing just brought me closer to the Avernites, not farther. Quote: Originally written by Spidweb: 1. He is not a villain. That's probably why I disagree with this statement. In the Avernum games, there was always a clear protagonist and antagonist. The fact that Dorikas attacked Prazac made him a villain. Even though I personally am I fan of the Empire, Dorikas lacked the style and the development to be convincing. I apologize for being so critical, it isn't my usual style. Avernum 5 is a fantastic game on its own, it was just different from what I've come to expect.

Quote: Originally written by Spidweb: The game isn't about Dorikas. It's about the journey. This is fair, the journey was indeed the best part of the game. It's just that you set the bar pretty high with Rentar and Garzahd and even Hawthorne. The game itself was great, I'd just grown accustomed to memorable Avernum villains.

Lark (who is female) is back in New Harston, the first Avernite town you visit. To do Moref, you need to do Baquba as well as the Mongbat and the Pit Crawler. Each time you must turn the quest in to Lark back in New Harston.

Looks like he should have read that thread "Things to know on a first play through." That thread was actually quite helpful. Maybe it should be added to Strategy Central?

I disagree with SoT. I'm not saying that you absolutely must interact with the main villain, but his forces (the ones the game revolves around) should at least be present. He doesn't need to see you himself, but the fact that you don't even see many of his minions makes him seem weak and not so much of a threat. There were so few Darkside Loyalist encounters in the whole game it made the main plot seem so much less urgent. I also think the fact that he supposedly has limited resources and yet you have a short encounter with an infinite Loyalist army sort of spoils the whole secret faction image. I also agree with Locmaar, which is sad because I usually identify with the Empire. Perhaps the power struggle and lack of a definite Emperor had something to do with it. [Huge Incoming Spoiler] The fact that a Redmark ends up Emperor at the end of the game is novel, but also kind of a disappointment. Avernum wins again, eh? That's why Geneforge is better, it's darker, and with better characters and choices.

Taking the geas makes the game more interesting. It forces you to do bad things, yes, but bad things can be fun! In my opinion, your missing out if you don't take the geas. Plus, his rewards are substantial, that's always nice. You can kill him even if you don't have the geas, but those reward doors will stay locked unless you do his bidding.

She was cold but still your best hope in Avernum 2. I think the mystery plot in Avernum 3 made her a better villain than Garzahd. She tried to frame Erika, which was brilliant. The best part was that she was right under your nose the whole time. Dorikas and even Gharzad were just too distant to be well developed characters. Garzahd's appearance at Ornotha and the fact that his army was a constant threat throughout the game makes him superior to Dorikas, however. And damn it, I didn't ask for opinions on Rentar! We all know full well the popular opinion of her. What of Dorikas? Is he really any better?

Rentar-Ihrno (may she rest in peace) is quite a controversial figure on these boards. However, the simple fact that so many of you hated her with all your heart shows what a great character she really was. Let me ask you this: did Dorikas invoke these feelings as well? Did he invoke any feelings at all? Don't get me wrong, I'm a fan of his ideology. Clearly, Avernum needs to be put in its place, but I don't think this man was the right candidate for the job. There was nothing to him. He had little face time with the PCs and even less backstory to develop him. Rentar was once your ally, you shared her pain when fighting against the Empire with her in Avernum 2 and then despised her for betraying you in Avernum 3. Hatred for her only grew when your nemesis returned in Avernum 4 and I for one was sad when that rivalry had to end. Dorikas was a thorn in your side in Avernum 4 but provided little more than a cliffhanger by the end of that game. All of Avernum 5 seemed to be about him and yet he wasn't in it at all. You ended up fighting an enemy without a face and that weakened the Darkside Loyalists as villains. By the time I was in chapter two, the thrill of the chase had worn off as he was clearly too far ahead of you to make you feel rushed. He seemed more concerned about you in the previous game than in this one, as his traps and assassins have become few and far between. While Rentar was capable of engulfing entire continents in chaos, Dorikas's reach barely extended beyond his little fortress in the middle of nowhere. Dorikas simply didn't have that nemesis trait that Rentar did. She was practically omnipresent in that you felt her blows against you wherever you went. This proved a hard act for Dorikas to follow. You would think that with the backing of the conservatives of the Empire, he would have been able to do a better job, but Lystaak the Beast ended up instilling more fear than he did. Sure he was supposed to be a more secretive person than the mad campaigning Rentar, but everyone knew about him and yet no one was really that concerned. Even General Redmark was so concerned with finding him first that not finding him at all was never considered a possibility. It was like Dorikas was doomed from the start to be cannon fodder. Doomed to be a plot device for advancing the story. Anyone else get these feelings or any feelings at all regarding Dorikas?

Quote: Lepus timidus: - A group who have beliefs equivalent to the Barzites. Finally, someone else who realizes that something is missing. I like your signature as well. Too bad Barzahl died before the Trakovites existed, though. Quote: TehSlaughteringSevile: Ok, but what type of sec do they follow, a kill-all, like the barzites, or something like that? Since when did the Barzites want to kill all? What separated Barzahl from Trajkov is that, as an outsider, Trajkov had to 'take' Shaper secrets, thus he was a Taker. Barzahl was already a Shaper, and thus it was his birthright to utilize Shaping to its full potential. Ghaldring has to return so he can finally be killed. I think the opening of Geneforge 5 should involve the Council being wiped out so that people we already know like Alwan end up being the real leaders of the Shapers instead of just pawns. Shaper Grimm seemed like a good candidate as well. Throw in Miranda and you got the triumvirate that Shapers tend to operate in right there.

Fulfilling those two obligations is not really as bad as it seems. You can complete all quests for Harkin's Landing before confronting the drake, kill her, and leave without coming into contact with any angry citizens. The same goes for the Anama scrolls. Complete all their quests, steal the scrolls, and use the portal to get out of there. There is no reason to come back to either of those places once you have moved on to the next chapter. Personally, I think it is great to just wipe out both towns for the loot, experience, and because they have it coming.

For the record, I can't even transfer registrations to new machines with the same operating system (my job requires me to get new hardware often). I'm thankful Jeff is so understanding with these things.

Thanks for the suggestions guys... not. Anyway, you can disreguard, it was just a problem with my new computer, which still sucks but at least your off the hook.

Quote: Originally written by Dryth'tor: the ultimately more interesting Avernum genre I object, your honor.

Quote: Originally written by Contra: Oh, by the way, I have to fall back, atleast a tiny bit, on my "Caninsters are damnation" standpoint. I just encountered Litalia in G4, and she seems to have been able to cure her mind to a rather vast degree (compared to G3), even with her extensive Canister use. Very interesting indeed. Litalia is just as insane, if not more so, than any other canister user. She is arrogant to the point of forgetting you are in the room with her. She probably doesn't attack you outright because she doesn't sense a threat. What's more interesting would be a canister user's reaction to another who is similarly enlightened. At one point, you meet up with someone who has used canisters (I forget who) and if you have used them as well the game says you have a mutual respect for each other's powers. This leads me to believe that there would be peace if everyone used canisters, rather than the absolute chaos people seem to fear so much.

Always appreciated, especially the first part. Thanks, Khoth.

Downloaded the demo of Avernum 5. I get the above message when I try to start it up and the sounds do not play. I have an intel mac. Really a downer since I just downloaded it so I could hear the intro music quickly before going to school.

Quote: Originally written by Actaeon: It's simply the first time I'd seen it in action, and I got a little excited. That's funny, you've never seen me argue with Stareye before?