Rotghroth Rhapsody Uberdhizon Posted December 10, 2008 Share Posted December 10, 2008 I can't kill any of the Servant Minds. Is there a diplomatic approach, like persuading them to give up life? Any tips on the fighting, if the answer to said question is no? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrulous Glaahk Blurb Posted December 10, 2008 Share Posted December 10, 2008 You must be with Litalia's group. The hint book says that you first speak with Alpha (the first Mind) who tells you the Synthesis Mind is erratic. Then go talk to the Synthesis Mind (in the far south of the level, kind of in the middle). With high leadership, you can get this Mind's help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Articulate Vlish Ohtar Posted December 10, 2008 Share Posted December 10, 2008 I didn't have to talk to alpha. I just talked it out of Synthesis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rotghroth Rhapsody Uberdhizon Posted December 10, 2008 Author Share Posted December 10, 2008 Yeah, me too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chittering Clawbug Danny the Fool Posted December 11, 2008 Share Posted December 11, 2008 Even then, the Synthesis Mind's creations may need some careful attention. Being with Litalia's group as well, I found it fairly hard to solve this while strictly following that group's beliefs. Then, when I gave in and talked to the Synthesis Mind so I would at least have its creations supporting me, I still managed to get all of its first wave killed by the first mind. Not sure what happened there, the second attempt that I found myself forced to start soon after that went through without any major pain. (Since I play without canisters this time around, I can't actually make any creations myself that are powerful enough for this part of the game. If you can, I imagine that's enough to turn those fights around completely.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenderfoot Thahd Fries with that Posted December 23, 2008 Share Posted December 23, 2008 I have a different problem with this area: I've killed everything, but now what do I do to complete the quest (received from the Trakovites)? According to the quest description, I'm supposed to talk to Alwan, but my conversation choices with him don't seem particularly helpful. If I go back to the person who gave me the quest, she just describes the quest as if I hadn't done it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgeoning Battle Gamma Vempele Posted December 23, 2008 Share Posted December 23, 2008 I want to talk to you about the Shaping arts. Have you had problems with Control Core B? So relying on your creations has not been helpful? What do you mean? // sets the flag Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenderfoot Thahd Fries with that Posted December 23, 2008 Share Posted December 23, 2008 Do I have to do the Gazaki-Uss quest before I finish this one? Maybe that's the issue, because while I can say "I want to talk to you about the Shaping arts", I can't have the rest of this conversation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Randomizer Posted December 23, 2008 Share Posted December 23, 2008 The Control Core B quest can only be done if you ask to join Alwan's faction and he only does it for pro-Shaper reputations after the Mission to Drakons quest in Gazaki-Uss. The Trakovite version can't be done until you do the other quests in their quest chain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenderfoot Thahd Fries with that Posted December 23, 2008 Share Posted December 23, 2008 I'm doing the Trakovite version, after doing the previous quests in their chain, and it wouldn't let me complete it until I completed Alwan's Gazaki-Uss quest. Now that I've finished that one, I was able to complete the Trakovite Core B quest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ineffable Wingbolt Dahak Posted December 31, 2008 Share Posted December 31, 2008 Originally Posted By: Randomizer The Control Core B quest can only be done if you ask to join Alwan's faction and he only does it for pro-Shaper reputations after the Mission to Drakons quest in Gazaki-Uss. The Trakovite version can't be done until you do the other quests in their quest chain. I believe this has changed. From what I see the quest after Control Core B is the first chance you get to swear to Alwan. All Alwan requires for Control Core B is a rep of 103 (adjusted by 50% of leadership) or better and completion of Journey To the Drakons. Can someone playing the Alwan path confirm? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgeoning Battle Gamma Vempele Posted December 31, 2008 Share Posted December 31, 2008 Originally Posted By: Dahak Originally Posted By: Randomizer The Control Core B quest can only be done if you ask to join Alwan's faction and he only does it for pro-Shaper reputations after the Mission to Drakons quest in Gazaki-Uss. The Trakovite version can't be done until you do the other quests in their quest chain. I believe this has changed. From what I see the quest after Control Core B is the first chance you get to swear to Alwan. All Alwan requires for Control Core B is a rep of 103 (adjusted by 50% of leadership) or better and completion of Journey To the Drakons. Can someone playing the Alwan path confirm? You're both saying the same thing (_ask_ to join != swear. It's the "I'm eager to blah blah blah" phase). And yes, you're right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyshakk Koan jlsgaladriel Posted December 31, 2008 Share Posted December 31, 2008 Yes, I'd gotten this wrong in the first version of the walkthrough. One *can* do the quest without swearing to Alwan; it is only required that one tell Alwan that one *wants* to join him. The dialogue is confusing the first time through, but it's exactly the same as with other factional quest sequences. (Litalia's quest in the repository is the same.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ineffable Wingbolt Dahak Posted December 31, 2008 Share Posted December 31, 2008 Same = Confusing or that the first sworn quest is the repository? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyshakk Koan jlsgaladriel Posted December 31, 2008 Share Posted December 31, 2008 Quote: same = confusing well, yes, confusing in exactly the same way, in that one needs to *tell* litalia one is interested in joining, but one is not required to swear. Quote: same = the first sworn quest is the repository? no, rather the opposite, the same in that *neither* requires swearing. The walkthrough is right now: If you say you wish to join Alwan's faction, he will next assign you Q: Control Core B. (Note that you can finish this quest without joining Alwan's faction, and the control core contains unmelting ice.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ineffable Wingbolt Dahak Posted December 31, 2008 Share Posted December 31, 2008 Ah, I see where I was confused. You do not ask to join his faction. You ask to fight for the Shapers. From the Shapers it then breaks down to Alwan's faction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyshakk Koan jlsgaladriel Posted January 1, 2009 Share Posted January 1, 2009 Okay, I went back to the scripts, and with Alwan you're right. The Control Core B and Repository quests are exactly the same *phase* for Alwan and Litalia, respectively, in that you need to express interest in joining them, but are not actually required to swear. But the wording is indeed different: For Litalia, to get the repository quest, one needs to say, I am interested in becoming a Trakovite. For Alwan, it is indeed I would like to fight for the Shapers. So Litalia's wording is actually more confusing than Alwan's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenderfoot Thahd Gondolin Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 Hi, I've been lurking these forums for a while because I'm new to the Geneforge games. Right now I'm stuck in Control Core B, sent by Alwan. I have 16 Leadership (with items), but I have no dialogue option that doesn't lead to a fight against the Synthesis Mind. I milked the dialogue tree a couple of times, I talked to the Alpha Mind first, reloaded, talked to the Synthesis Mind first - no go. I ask every question I can and then the only option is to tell it that Alwan sent me to fix things, which makes the mind angry and it challenges me. I already fought it once, but without going through the dialogue. I just attacked it and killed it. The other minds became hostile and I had to kill them as well. The result was one botched quest and one angry Alwan. Advice is appreciated. I'd especially like to know why I can't get the diplomatic dialogue option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chittering Clawbug AaronC Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 Originally Posted By: Gondolin Hi, I've been lurking these forums for a while because I'm new to the Geneforge games. Right now I'm stuck in Control Core B, sent by Alwan. I have 16 Leadership (with items), but I have no dialogue option that doesn't lead to a fight against the Synthesis Mind. I milked the dialogue tree a couple of times, I talked to the Alpha Mind first, reloaded, talked to the Synthesis Mind first - no go. I ask every question I can and then the only option is to tell it that Alwan sent me to fix things, which makes the mind angry and it challenges me. I already fought it once, but without going through the dialogue. I just attacked it and killed it. The other minds became hostile and I had to kill them as well. The result was one botched quest and one angry Alwan. Advice is appreciated. I'd especially like to know why I can't get the diplomatic dialogue option. I did this recently. First thing I did was talk to all the servant minds. Then talk to Synthesis mind, do NOT fight him now. After you go through all his dialogue, go back and talk to the Alpha one (first one) and ask for help. His help will be his creations defending him. The hard part is keep alive the servant minds that the creations attack. The beta and gamma will die almost assuredly, but you have to defend the last one, alpha. He has some guys helping him, but there are rots and patchwerks that will wreck him. It took me a damn long time to do it right. The synthesis mind after taking some damage will give a prompt, and his HP is reduced to 200 and will be killed by damage from the other minds. Then defend the last mind, or leave as fast as you can before he dies if you can't handle the enemy, cause if they all die then you fail and Alwan isn't interested in you Ircher 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenderfoot Thahd Gondolin Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 Thanks for the advice. Could you, please, tell me whether the Synthesis Mind shapes an endless number of creatures to attack the other minds or if I can simply kill everything it throws at the minds and then handle the rogue at my leisure? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrulous Glaahk Blurb Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 I never lost any of the minds (and few of the minds' creations). Are you playing solo on or torment? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenderfoot Thahd Gondolin Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 Nope. I'm a pretty high level Shaper playing on Normal. Heck, it's my first time with the Geneforge games. I have a War Trall, two Plated Clawbugs and a Gazer. Still, I was interested in the diplomatic solution. I'd like to make use of that high Leadership. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrulous Glaahk Blurb Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 I think there is no solution to fighting the rogue Synthesis Mind. I had very high Leadership and still had to take him down. I think you might be better off to ditch the bugs and get some rotdhizons. Also, after talking to the the S-Mind, leave him in battle mode. Don't fight him yet. The waves of rogues start at the bottom (not top!) and go up. Buff and once over, go to the next. Once There are at least two waves, I think, so repeat the process. Once the rogues are gone, then go back to the nasty mind. He is weakened by now, so he is easier to kill. Ircher 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenderfoot Thahd Gondolin Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 The waves start at the bottom. The SM actually says somewhere that it would start with Gamma because it's the weakest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrulous Glaahk Blurb Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 Okay, I'm going on some bad memory here and will amend my post so as not to mislead. Also I incorrectly stated "intelligence" instead of "leadership." I'm on a quick work break so writing too fast. The bottom is even better ... not so far to walk. Try to go west of the minds to try to block the rogues. I think weak creations may be an issue. Honestly I strugged horribly with strategies and restarted the game a number of times before discovering that with a Shaper character, I had to pump Shaping and Intel almost to the exclusion of everything else and switch to powerful creations. Then it was ridiculous easy. I played only on normal at that point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenderfoot Thahd Gondolin Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 Pretty much so. Still, I was hanging on to the clawbugs because they're cheap and get the two attacks per turn. However, they do far too little damage against Kyshakks so I'll have to get some rotters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrulous Glaahk Blurb Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 Oh, you probably know this, but don't forget about enlisting the other minds' aide before the challenge, as mentioned above. After talking to the nasty one, tell him you'll get back with him, go get the other minds' help, then come back, tell the S-Mind you're ready, etc. I tried hanging onto the bugs, too. I get attached. If you get the green rotters, they have 12 AP, so they can get two attacks. (You can get a canister in the Western Passes after defeating the naughty Eye there that will enable the higher level rot. You will need regular rots to defeat the Eye. At least, I did.) Intelligence really needs to be high for Shapers, so that you can support a large and powerful army. Without that, the Shaper is too weak a character. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenderfoot Thahd Gondolin Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 I killed Synthesis Mind, with help from the other minds. The Gazer is a powerful hitter against the green rotters. The other minds took out half of SM's hit points before the battle started and my pack killed it in one turn. I got the canister in the Western Pass before fighting the SM. I didn't need rotters for the Gazer inside. He went down quite quickly, thanks to my own Gazer and the War Trall. The bugs kept his minions busy. Now I need a trainer to give me two levels in rotters so I can get the green ones. Still, the drain on my essence is huge. I have 19 points in Intelligence (items included) and I have 120 essence points to spare and my pack is now down to 3 creatures, plus my character who is reduced to casting the occasional spell. Thanks for your advice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrulous Glaahk Blurb Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 You can find a trainer in the place with all the kryshakks. It's called "Abandoned Farm" (abandoned something, anyway). He's in the house to the north. You have to get past the pylons (turn off a couple to get through). Just tell him what he wants to hear and he'll train you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenderfoot Thahd Gondolin Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 Hmm, I've already given a neutral answer. Any way to change his mind or reset this flag? Nevermind, I can read the list of trainers myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrulous Glaahk Blurb Posted March 12, 2009 Share Posted March 12, 2009 Do you have a recent save? I did the same as you and had to go back to the autosave and re-kill more of those beasts again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgeoning Battle Gamma Kiexcolo Posted March 13, 2009 Share Posted March 13, 2009 Shouldn't it be considered a bug if you challange and kill the Synthesis Mind before the rogues can kill the other control minds and everyone in the zone becomes hostile? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Randomizer Posted March 14, 2009 Share Posted March 14, 2009 Jeff didn't consider it a bug during testing. You just have to follow the dialog tree through to a challenge (Alwan faction) or the Synthesis Mind helping you (Trakovite faction). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgeoning Battle Gamma Kiexcolo Posted March 14, 2009 Share Posted March 14, 2009 Not just about following the dialogue tree but a sequence of events. 1. Talk to minds, talk to synthesis mind, talk to minds again to enlist help. 2. Throw challange. 3. Kill all rogue creations besides synthesis mind. (Or maybe until the point where it mentions the pylon is weakening 3 times and you get another dialogue when you approach synthesis mind) 4. Kill synthesis mind. If you do step 4 without step 3, the whole zone becomes hostile. Minds who were being attacked by the rogue creations suddenly go "Lets kill the guy who is helping us." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.