Emperor Tullegolar

But they do say that almost nothing on Sucia Island survived. The only things that escaped were things that Zachary and Barzahl took with them to Drypeak. I doubt that they would have helped a mad shaper get of that island. If Monarch was Goettch, I can't imagine why Jeff would change his name and try to be secretive about it, other than the fact that Goettsch and Grosch sound so similar.

Quote: Originally written by Retlaw May: your underlings will band together an kill you eventually Won't happen. They are far too arrogant to work together to overthrown me. Besides, their loyalty has already been bought and paid for with power. Most will even seek to protect me to assure that the canisters continue to flow freely. Thus, through the chaos and individuality, I have created order and unity. There will be those that try to kill me. Being the leader of this overpowered faction, my personal defenses will be formitable, but should that fail to save my life, then, as I've said before, so be it. I hope the Emperor who takes my place is a worthey one. As for 'your type,' I do not see the non-shaped as a threat. Those that use canisters have such a loathing of you're insolent kind that any one of you that tries to stand against me will be long gone before they turn their attention towards me.

Retlaw, when you see the huge ego that canisters give you, you assume it will lead to chaos. Really, no one will be able to organize a resistance against my new order because they will be too busy trying to curry favor with me in order to gain more canisters. I don't care if they're hating me in their minds. The second they voice their disloyalty, a horde of my minions will be upon them, racing to be the first to bring me the traitor’s head, fully expecting a reward in the form of canisters for the deed. Thus, through their arrogance, I have guaranteed order. As I've said before, every canister someone takes only makes them more my servant, not the other way around. On the army of Shaper Monarchs theory, I'll meet you halfway on this one. Some are indeed made insane by canisters (Monarch, Shaila) but they are more often not (Litalia, Jared, Barzahl). The mistakes that happen from time to time will be easy to spot, as they generally make no attempts to hide themselves. Canister rewards to those who 'fix' these accidents... problem solved. Lord Safey: Yes, each individual Tullegolite would only see their own interests. Each one would have the ultimate goal of having my own position, and they will not rest until they have it. But it is this very fact that makes us strong. If each one of us concerns themselves only with power, we will be undefeatable. Since their ultimate goal will be to control my empire, they will do what is in it's best interest because it is in turn in their own best interest. It is this very ambition that unites us and keeps order. Edit: Garrison Quote: If each... individual wants the right to use more canisters... they do not have to submit to a movement like you describe. Oh, really? Then where exactly will they be getting the canister that they so crave?

Quote: Originally written by Lord Safey: You may be able to dilute the humanity out of you but never drive it from you. Sorry, but no. The Barzite ending in Geneforge 2 showed that it is indeed possible to rid yourself of that last "nagging" shred of humanity through canisters. Garrison: The "canister movement" in my vision would fight not only for the rights to use canisters, but also against creationocracy. When given independence, creations try to dominate those around them, and for that they must be put in their place. The movement would stay together out of necessity. Canisters may make you arrogant, but they don’t make you retarded. No one person would stand a chance against an army of canister enlightened people. The only way they will be able to gain more power is to grit their teeth, submit to me, and earn their canisters one by one, like everyone else. Sure, everyone would want to have their own little piece of the world, if not the whole things, but they would quickly learn the value of allies in such times of total war. Those of you that say it would never work overestimate, or possibly underestimate, the power of arrogance. If these people really seek what is best for themselves, they will work together, no matter how grudgingly so. Just look at the leaders of the rebellion. It is possible, no, it is inevitable. Exiled Necromancer: What?

Quote: Originally written by Retlaw May: In the end, I think the strongest people in the Geneforge world are probably the older shapers without modification. By Geneforge 4, all such people are either dead or hiding in fortresses in fear of death, with one or two exceptions. The frailty of followers of the old ways has already been proven. Soon, the Shaper Council will go the way of Rahul, and the defeat of the weak will be complete. In real life it would be the same way. How could anyone hope to stand up against the canister augmented? No, they're not just going to kill each other off. Remember, they have far less patience with the unshaped than they do with each other. You fools who refused the glory of canisters will be long since dead or enslaved before the real fighting between gods begins. Where do you want to be when that happens, on the top, or on the bottom? On humanity: I hate that the word 'human' has become synonymous with empathy and compassion. There are so many people in the world today that are in power and still lack these characteristics. Adding canisters to the equation would mean little. On the flip side, human is also synonymous with mistake...

The key difference between Tullegolites and Barzites is that I support a meritocracy, whereas Barzahl, as Good Canisters pointed out, does not. He prefers to just give canister to any idiot passing by as long as they'll cause trouble for his enemies. Sloppy. Plus, it makes the power less coveted if you just give it away. Canisters must be earned through valor and loyalty. However, Barzahl was in a desperate situation, so looking back, I can forgive him.

No, the rebellion sucks because it's led by creations. See what happens when creations have rights? Making yourself an autocratic ruler is one thing, but they're not even any good at it! The Tullegolites would never have this problem. Creations must be put in their place. Technology must be allowed to progress free of the drakon perversions.

I have a feeling that the rebel ending in Geneforge 3 happened. That would mean that the Drakons have their very own super geneforge back on the Ashen Isles. You can't blame them for making the ones on the mainland weak. After all, they were ment for 'lesser' species. I hate drakons. I also miss the Geneforge 1 geneforge.

I don't think you need to worry about your immune system turning on you. After all, as long as the change effects the genes in every single cell in your body, what's left to reject it? The change becomes a part of you, changing you from within, and the immune system is only irritated by invasion from without. What would be interesting to see are the long term effects of self shaping. No one has lived long enough after having used these things to see whether or not they have deadly side effects. War veterans will be coming back to sue Ghaldring's ass off once they find out they've been diagnosed with cancer... everywhere. If only that Danette had left better notes behind. Stupid woman. Then again, shaping is pretty powerful, and I don’t see why a cure for cancer couldn’t be developed with shaper resources.

A very good question, Lord Safey. I suppose if you use the word humanity literally, you may be correct. After all, the only thing that makes us human as opposed to something else is our genes, and the canisters alter the genes directly. So I suppose it is accurate to say you are becomming less human with each one you use. If that is the case, I'm going to have to agree with Arachnid. Why be human when you can be something superior? In fact, I no longer consider the title 'human' worthey of someone with such power and clarity. Hmm, what should the new perfect species created by canisters and the geneforge be called?

This poll is misleading. Canisters don not take your humanity. They augment it, making you a better human than you could ever dream to be without them. In the Geneforge world I would use all I could get my hands on, simply as a matter of survival. The canisters, along with my unmatched ambition, would assure my domination of that world... at least for a little while. In the real world, I would probably only need to use a few to get what I really want, assuming not too many people already have access to them. Still, I would probably end up using as many as possible. Only then would I have the clarity of thought I need to be an enlightened ruler. Geneforge 4 revealed that the geneforge itself does not, in fact, perfect you, as you can still use canisters after having using it. A geneforge is more like the equivilant of using a few canisters plus getting the standard augmentation that allows use of shaping and powerful magic. However, the Barzite ending revealed that absolute perfection is possible through canisters. Thus, I don't really care how I acheive perfection, be it through canisters or geneforges. It makes no difference as long as I get it.

Quote: Originally written by opon mars: i will give you the name of the monster if you want to track it down in our hallucinogenic dreams. That has got to be one of the tripiest things I've ever heard on any message board. Nioca, could you please translate mars again, or at least give me some sort of paraphrase so I can respond? I can't shake the feeling that he is saying really interesing things under that veil of nonsense.

Well, as I said before, the canister workshop would be heavily guarded. As the heart of my empire, every Tullegolite would know the place's value and would guard it with their lives. There is also the fact that few would be willing to destroy a place that could give them so much power. On top of all that, I myself would always be nearby to protect it personally should it ever be threatened. You're right though, of course. Someone could infiltrate and destroy it, bringing down my empire. But given the world of Geneforge, that's the whole point, right? I'm just trying to present an alternative to the repressive ways of the Shapers and the chaos of the Drakons. Surely, though my side is not flawless, you can see it's superiority? We value strength in a world where you must be strong to survive, yet we maintain the important Shaper vision of a world where creations are kept in check, kept from forming bizarre armies and murdering innocent people. It is the best of both sides. What more could you ask for? But Tullegolar, I want a world where everyone lives in peace. Well, you can thank Ghaldring for making sure that such a world is now long gone. You have to fight now. Will you take a side that does not give you sufficient strength, or the side where racist drakons control your future? Or would you have the courage to be a Tullegolite?

There's just something about the satisfying click that levers make. Secret doors you need to run into just aren't as... clicky. Besides, if you really like the old secret doors, Geneforge 4 has some of those, too... sort of. The ones you need to walk up to in order to notice.

Just a minute, Nalyd. I can't help but think that opon mars is saying something profound here in all that mess. But you're right, of course, whatever it is I sense is lost to us forever. On cheating: I love cheating, it makes the game more fun for me. But I never use dbugkill. Where's the sport in that? On shaping vs magic: Shaping is more destructive than magic, I'll admit to that. But I would also say that shaping is exponentially more beneficial than magic. Magic is really only good for destruction, which, while I approve of it, it seems to be the only argument Trakovites have against shaping. I hate that the Trakovites can say shaping is bad when, though it can be destructive, much more good can come of it; then they say nothing at all about magic, which much destruction comes from and almost no good whatsoever. This philosophy has no logical grounds.

You guys all get the control rod, right? I never find myself overwhelmed when I use that thing. In fact, I find the various creations coming to my aid even get in the way, sometimes.

How dare you compare canisters to harmful drugs? They have no harmful effects whatsoever. Even if you consider the clarity of thought that the canisters give you as a negative, even then the positive effects are far more numerous. I can not approve of the children idea. Canisters must be earned. Never given freely.

Well then if it's that simple, what reason does anyone have at all not to use canisters?

Quote: Nioca: However, there are a couple of experiments I would like to see done, simply to sate my curiosity. There is a little bit of mad scientist in all of us, it seems. I don't fully understand how anyone (including Litalia) is able to 'adapt' to the changes in their bodies. If the canisters really effect your genes themselves, then anything that they do should be permanent. I don't understand how Litalia is able to control her new self, as that implies regressing her genes back to the way they were, somehow. You can't 'train' your genes, and you can't adapt without inside influence. Perhaps she used additional shaping methods? When all else fails, shape some more! Is there anything shaping can't fix?

Quote: Originally written by Thuryl: The drakons are really big on the whole better-living-through-chemistry deal, and they don't exactly seem to have moved past petty politics. Here's the problem. You've made the fatal error of comparing humans and creations. Creations, no matter how much shaping or evolution you apply, will never amount anything culturally significant.

Quote: Originally written by Alberich: (even if it's just telling me that I can hold up my hand and see that I stayed fully human) Why hinder yourself with the frailties of a human form? It is your birthright to be able to shape yourself! It is the next step in evolution. Those that die along the way die so that the strong may live, they die so that the species as a whole can grow and be stronger. To reject the canisters is to doom the whole world to mediocrity and endless sqabbles over the petty things like politics.

Thanks, Micawber. It was quite useless until now.

The shaper dying sound sets off a Pavlovian signal in my head that says "you lose." I hate it. I also jump a little and get that adrenaline rush whenever I hear it. Probably because, since I cheat, I die so rarely.

I just don't get it. I'm sitting here with the script from my Geneforge game (works) and the script I copied from the post (same damn thing) and I can't figure out for the life of me why one works and the other does not. What does 'bad header' mean? There are no discernible differences that I can find between the two.

The servile crunching sound? I enjoy that one as well.