Not Another GF2-I Review/Endgame Rant

[Hyperion703]

EDIT: I almost forgot... MAJOR SPOILERS AHEAD. Read only if you like being repeatedly and unapologetically spoiled.

 

Yep, another one of those posts. Critical. Subjective. Anecdotal. Unsurprisingly abundant following every major release. Thanks for clicking on it anyway. 

 

So, I’ll just jump right into it with the ‘glows.’ Here is what I am enjoying so far about GF2-I after 1.5 playthroughs. For context, the first was an unaligned solo agent; currently as a fire-focused factionally-fluctuating shaper (rolled high on my alliteration check). Both on normal. My observations below might heavily reflect those aspects of the game.

 

Glows:

 

• Overall, it seems like class power balance is good. Each class has gear which is clearly meant for them, though not exclusively. It seems like my current shaper got through parts easier than my solo agent. However, the opposite is equally true. I imagine it’s likely also true for guardians. This adds to the replayability; it’s like having three games in one, and even more with my next point...
• Related to the last item, I love the viable option to play as a ‘pacifist’ infiltrator/convincing smooth talker. The hint book (which I recommend) covers both play styles equally, so its inclusion was not an afterthought. I know this is an option in most (all?) SW games. But it is so cool and unique that it is worth restating.
• The plot is intriguing, mysterious, and often unpredictable. Political tension abounds. I know this is a given for SW games, but noteworthy nonetheless. In other text-heavy games, I find myself skipping the text to get to the action. Here, I enjoyed taking the time to read each line and then imagining it playing out, a nod to the storyline depth and writing of these games.
• Compared to many other titles (SW and otherwise), there seems to be more faction-specific side quests available. Again, these increase replayability because, depending on a player’s choices, they won’t get the option to do some of them. They will want to come back repeatedly to explore those options not available in prior playthroughs. Honestly, I’d like to see more of these (or even the inclusion of class-specific quests), but I understand they might not be the best bang-for-buck in regards to time spent developing a game.
• I love that we can change the names of our creations. Currently, I have four drakons named “Dorothy,” “Blanche,” “Rose,” and “Sophia.” Thank you for being a friend...

 

That said, there are some things I would do differently. I’m solely a player (and a fairly casual one at that), so I fully admit that some of these ideas might be unrealistic or too resource-intensive for a small indie dev team to include. Still, others might be doable in future updates or mods.

 

Grows:

 

• Sometime during my agent playthrough, I began feeling that the Mental Magic curses were fairly underwhelming. As Blessing Magic’s dark counterpart, Mental Magic can be viewed primarily as debuffs. Dominate was situational - It won some fights on its own but it was useless against much of the endgame monsters and bosses. Daze had some usefulness in the Drypeaks area. Otherwise, I found little use in MM. Both Daze and Wrack lasted one or two turns before it wore off regardless of my MM skill level. And Madness was acquired too close to endgame to really be pivotal. It felt unnecessary; spending one turn’s actions so I could roll the debuff dice each turn did not seem particularly worthwhile if the fight only lasted a couple turns. And is there really a need for Delirium? Does it do something I don’t know about? Or is it just another Daze that connects more? Seems redundant. Maybe a spell that applies Lifesteal or Shock might be better in that spot.
• Many of my agent’s most sensitive areas were often enflamed, and she could never find a suitable treatment. No, no, get your head out of the gutter... I mean she kept getting burned up by the DoT status after some inconsiderate drakon connected a Purge. No cure for burning love? Really? Essence Shield was crucial here, as I never found another way to avoid the life loss. Maybe the Healing skills suite could include a solution when someone tries to turn you into a walking campfire.
• The missed opportunity to include a robust system for item crafting is truly perplexing. All these unusable Fine Mined Crystals and gemstones. All these unused Enchanted Anvils. It’s so clear and obvious that I’m half wondering if this element of the game was originally intended, but left out for time or budgetary reasons. I know the anvils have some (limited) use in the handful of artifacts and the ultra-rare exclusive ingredients they require. But it could be so much more. How cool would it be to improve weapons and gear, maybe in tiers, to get even more epic badassery? This would add a ton to customization and replayability, too.
• Haste does not stack with Quick Action. Sadness. Even though some enemies get three actions per turn, your flexes will rarely be as hard. I *think* I recall haste stacking with Spell Mastery, like once or twice. Not sure. For the essence cost, Quicklash should stack with either or both of them, though I don’t think that’s the case currently. Otherwise, Quicklash is six essence worth of pointless if you have high enough Haste or QA. I’m sure this can be explained. Anyone?
• The upgraded versions of most (all?) creations just aren’t worth the essence cost. This is already explored thoroughly here, so I won’t delve into that.
• Lastly, it’s kind of rough that there are so many duplicated “unique” magic items. It’s always a bummer to go through hell (sometimes literally), straight up rock a bunch of grimy fools, and claw your mangled ass to a treasure chest... only to open it and find the same loot you already have. The min/maxer in me says “boo!”, while the completionist in me says “yay!” At least I’ll be able to get all the stuff if there are multiple ways to get them.

 

Edit: I read somewhere that someone suggested weather events for this game. Pretty rad idea if you ask me. I'd take that one step further and say having weather events and day/night cycles would be the raddest. Some NPCs or areas only open during day, night, or during certain weather events. This would likely require a full overhaul of the entire game, so probably not something to hope for this game. Maybe future remake sequels?

 

That was long. If you’re still reading, props to you. Feel free to agree, disagree, ignore completely, whatever. If enough players agree with something that should (and can) be changed, I’ll email the dude and tell you what he says.

Edited April 28 by Hyperion703

[alhoon]

Your opinion is respected and I am not here to fight. I will just offer my perspective on couple of things. Your experience and what you like is for you, of course. 

 

  

37 minutes ago, Hyperion703 said:

How cool would it be to improve weapons and gear, maybe in tiers, to get even more epic badassery? This would add a ton to customization and replayability, too.

It is not hard to mod this. 

HOWEVER... you are a Shaper. With the exception of a few Guardians, that train for this, you cannot "improve" standard gear. You are not a servile or a blacksmith. You can magically augment some things but you can't enchant a steel sword to make it a purified blade. Your character doesn't know how to hollow out crystals to turn them to blast crystals. 

You could give them to the crystal-witch with the Solai, I guess, but what I am trying to say here is: 

Your character is not an item crafter. You cannot turn iron bars to swords or armor. You cannot turn "adaptable spores" to healing spores or speed spores. 

 

The enchanted items are useful for a specific function for your character, but the powers that have them have much more use out of them. 

 

44 minutes ago, Hyperion703 said:

Haste does not stack with Quick Action.

Oh. Are you sure? We had a discussion about that and I think they do have a chance to trigger, both of them. You only get the benefit once, I think but a hasted drayk with the power to haste will act twice more often, or so I was told.

I.e. you roll your 30% for haste (or how much it is) and your 30% for Quick action (or how much it is) and if one or both of them "Trigger" you get your action to cost as 6 action points. 

46 minutes ago, Hyperion703 said:

The upgraded versions of most (all?) creations just aren’t worth the essence cost.

The upgraded clawbugs are certainly worth it. Pyroroamers are useful, situationally. 

 

 

[Hyperion703]

2 minutes ago, alhoon said:

Your character is not an item crafter. You cannot turn iron bars to swords or armor.

Yes, I am aware of this. It would still be nice to turn these junk crystals and a blade over to someone... say, Ellisia... along with some coinage to put some rocket in the sockets. 'Know what I mean? It works for certain rings and slap gloves. Would it be a stretch to assume they could do the same for my stabby sword of death incarnate?

 

9 minutes ago, alhoon said:

Are you sure?

Nope. Not even a little bit. I'm... kinda sorta maybe certain to a degree. Which is to say, not certain at all. It has just never happened to my knowledge in one of my huge quantities of 1.5 games. If it is possible, maybe just increase the likelihood? Maybe not require an act of god to achieve a three or four-action turn? I'm not talking about consistency here. Just once in a blue moon. A reasonable ask.

 

Also, I'll check the clawbugs out. The pyroroamers scare me. Not gonna tempt fate with that one.

 

Thanks for the reply.

[alhoon]

7 minutes ago, Hyperion703 said:

Yes, I am aware of this. It would still be nice to turn these junk crystals and a blade over to someone... say, Ellisia... along with some coinage to put some rocket in the sockets. 'Know what I mean? It works for certain rings and slap gloves. Would it be a stretch to assume they could do the same for my stabby sword of death incarnate?

 

Nope. Not even a little bit. I'm... kinda sorta maybe certain to a degree. Which is to say, not certain at all. It has just never happened to my knowledge in one of my huge quantities of 1.5 games. If it is possible, maybe just increase the likelihood? Maybe not require an act of god to achieve a three or four-action turn? I'm not talking about consistency here. Just once in a blue moon. A reasonable ask.

 

Also, I'll check the clawbugs out. The pyroroamers scare me. Not gonna tempt fate with that one.

 

Thanks for the reply.

 

 

Oh, you mean you would like more quests or opportunities to use the various item crafters around to make items for you. Well, in past games we could combine saltweed or how it is called with crystals and make gems etc but aside of airshock crystals that do stunning, the crystals are quite underwhelming. 

Quests to make more equipment or give more options for your equipment could work, I guess. And I doubt anyone playing a Guardian would argue that the ability to have someone make rods of battle would be a waste. 

But as far as the tons of gems you find... they do have a use: Money. Everyone here is saying how you roll in it from the mid-game forward. Meanwhile, I am starving for the huge amounts of cash I need to buy up the 2nd training of Drakons (costs like 10-12000) and Gazers (costs 12000).  5000+ extra to boost my spells or buy some more would also be welcome. 

 

Now the haste thing: 
I think I perhaps misled you. You do not get three actions. Or at least, I never had. I think quick action & haste give more chances for you to get two actions. 
I know that after I buy haste for my Drayks and Fyoras, if I haste them, they get 2 actions much more often than my hasted Drakons. Which leads me to believe that the info I got, that there is bigger chance to do your thing easier, stacks. 

[Hyperion703]

9 minutes ago, alhoon said:

You do not get three actions.

You do. But only really, really rarely with a certain stylish hand apparel. I just want Haste and Quick Action to be friends and work together to achieve a common goal: More actions per turn for me. Three or more. I need to get more action.

 

Good luck with your coin problem.

Edited April 28 by Hyperion703

[Archaeolagent]

3 hours ago, Hyperion703 said:

Both Daze and Wrack lasted one or two turns before it wore off regardless of my MM skill level.

 

Mental Magic only raises their durations by 8% (on average), which you're not going to notice when the base duration is a small number like 2 or 3.  Raising your skill level in that specific spell raises their durations by 25% (on average).

 

However, you complained right after this that fights only lasted a couple turns, so one or two turns of the effect should be plenty?

 

3 hours ago, Hyperion703 said:

It felt unnecessary; spending one turn’s actions so I could roll the debuff dice each turn did not seem particularly worthwhile if the fight only lasted a couple turns.

 

Some fights definitely last longer on higher difficulty, so this may be where not every spell is going to be relevant to every play experience.

 

3 hours ago, Hyperion703 said:

No cure for burning love? Really? Essence Shield was crucial here, as I never found another way to avoid the life loss. Maybe the Healing skills suite could include a solution when someone tries to turn you into a walking campfire.

 

Why does there have to be a solution that involves curing it?  If every debuff is just something you remove by using ability X, that reduces the variety in the game.  It reduces the variety of strategies you might use in response to different enemies and what they throw at you.  Having debuffs that can't be cured and where you instead have to mitigate the effects is a great thing, IMO.

  

3 hours ago, Hyperion703 said:

The missed opportunity to include a robust system for item crafting is truly perplexing. All these unusable Fine Mined Crystals and gemstones. All these unused Enchanted Anvils. It’s so clear and obvious that I’m half wondering if this element of the game was originally intended, but left out for time or budgetary reasons.

 

No.  The gemstones are a major cash source, and the fine mined crystals do in fact have multiple crafting applications.  (They aren't exciting ones, but they exist.)

 

This is one of those RPG elements that some people really love and a lot of other people don't care about.  There's a long list of elements like that.  Not every game is going to have all of them, and the fewer people involved in a game's creation, the fewer are going to be there, because they take some time to create.

 

3 hours ago, Hyperion703 said:

Haste does not stack with Quick Action. Sadness. Even though some enemies get three actions per turn, your flexes will rarely be as hard. I *think* I recall haste stacking with Spell Mastery, like once or twice. Not sure.

 

This is incorrect.  But, there is a nuance that the tooltips don't explain, which is relevant here.

 

Haste and Quick Action (and other skills with that effect) do stack.  They increase the chance that you get the reduced AP consumption effect.

 

However, the "Hasted!" or "Quick Action!" effect that reduces your AP consumption can only trigger once per turn, no matter how many possible sources of it you have, or how many actions you take.

 

Also, the "Quick Action" skill itself doesn't trigger off spells.  Spellcraft does that.  (This bit is in the tooltips.)

 

The Gloves of Spell Mastery effect is unique (it's actually hardcoded) and seems to have no effect on Haste/QA whatsoever.  It can also apparently trigger multiple times per turn.

 

3 hours ago, Hyperion703 said:

Otherwise, Quicklash is six essence worth of pointless if you have high enough Haste or QA. I’m sure this can be explained.

 

Quicklash is overpriced in essence IMO, but it is not "pointless" just because you have some Haste/QA.  Quicklash guarantees you get a second cast.  Haste/Spellcraft cannot be raised high enough to actually guarantee that.  So if it's crucial, the spell can really make a difference.

 

 

3 hours ago, Hyperion703 said:

Lastly, it’s kind of rough that there are so many duplicated “unique” magic items

 

Actually, I feel like there are fewer duplications than we often see in games (especially compared to games with random magic item drops).  Per nlambert's index, I count 88 magic items that are completely unique, and 46 that are duplicated.  (This excludes listed items which are obviously generic, like Shaped Boots, but it does include items whose status as magical is ambiguous, like Swamp Boots.)

[Goldengirl]

In OG3 and onward, the PC is able to do a lot more crafting, making their own artifacts, wands, and crystals for personal use. Originally, the enchanted anvils were introduced in G3 to wider usage.

 

I’ll agree that they do seem tacked on here. There are still plenty of quests to make this or that artifact.

[l33tmaan]

I must admit it feels a little weird to get introduced to this cool enchanted anvil at the start of the game, only to go over half of my playthrough being completely unable to use it. By the time I finally upgraded my Helix Band, it was obsolete since I was fighting drakons in the snowy peaks.

[BenS]

re the efficacy of Mental Magic...there's a thread on Steam about the Agent class talking about how Slow & Wrack go down to 2 turns on bosses...and Jeff said he'd tweak that in 1.0.2, which will be out in the next few weeks. Possibly too late for my solo Agent game but you can't have everything.

 

re upgraded creations...while not optimal in many respects, they can have their places. My 1st game as a Shaper found me using Gazers & Rotdhizons quite effectively. Others will have similar stories I'm sure.

 

Anyway, I agree w/ all the OP's "glows" about this game, which I love, and am playing my 3rd game now.