Starting with Geneforge

[Triumph]

If you want to learn the highest level spells without touching a canister, you will need to get yourself "modified" (the Awakened, Barzhites, and Takers all offer this service) before you'll be able to learn those spells. This does NOT count as canister usage and doesn't modify your stats like canisters do, but it does require you to submit to the self-tweaking going on up in the mountains before you can learn spells you otherwise couldn't obtain. I'll leave it to you find the details.

[Dear Potato]

All right, thanks, both of you!

 

I guess I'll have to decide then. Not sure what I'm going to do, though! Every sect looks a bit fishy to me.

[Randomizer]

They are all fishy. Geneforge is all about moral dilemmas.

[Kelandon]

My favorite GF2 game was the one in which I turned against all the sects, raining righteous Shaper fury on all the miscreants. It was fun. I recommend it.

[Student of Trinity]

That actually is a distinct ending, by the way. It's just a bit hidden. Well on in the middle of the game you can meet a lone Shaper who outlines what a true Shaper ought to do. If you do what he describes, you'll get a different ending. I think.

[Dear Potato]

I've really thought about not joining any sect at all... but I don't want to renounce to the higher magic spells for this.

 

Not sure if it's possible, but I thought that maybe I can join a sect and then betray it. And then... well, avenge Shanti's death sending all this weird colony to oblivion

[Triumph]

Oh, you can join any sect and then leave. Killing the leaders is a good way to convey to all that you've quit.

[Sudanna]

One of my favorite ways to play G2 is to join and then murder every sect.

[Dear Potato]

Good God, you guys are a terrible influence for me

 

My beloved agent Selena has decided to infiltrate and betray every sect in this treachorous colony. Takers and Barzites have fallen to my lies already [evil laugh here].

 

Seriously now: I have lied and betrayed both sects because I really see them as the worst of the lot here. But I really don't know what to do with Awakened and Servants. Both have their points, things that I really understand and support; on the other hand, they have obvious "moral" flaws. I must admit it's fun to play as an outraged agent, very upset about losing her mentor, and bringing vengeance to these people, though

[wackypanda]

If you don't want to infiltrate or destroy them you don't actually have to do anything with those two sects. They probably won't get a happy ending, but in Geneforge 2 sects won't get their happy ending unless you pledge allegiance to them and mean it.

[Triumph]

IIRC, no one actually cares about the Awakened, so ignoring them is fine, but if you want to make the Shapers back home happy, you need to do something about that incompetent traitor Zakary, too.

[Student of Trinity]

The Awakened were a big deal in G1 and G2 when they first came out. In G1 they really seemed to be the Good Guys. Then in G2 they still seemed pretty reasonable, until you thought about what Tuldaric was really doing, and (if you joined them) what their big plan really involved. A lot of people still really liked them, but I always thought that G2 already showed that the Awakened were really a dead end.

[Sudanna]

A dead end? They were more Malcolm X than MLK in 2, but I don't think they were any less robust as an ideology.

[Student of Trinity]

All they had was Tuldaric, who was clearly going to get eaten by a demon before too long, and a pretty lame plan to grow a couple of dozen Drakons. Neither asset seemed very scalable, in contrast to the plans of Barzahl and the Takers. Both Tuldaric and the 'Barrier of the WInds' were also pretty sad departures from the supposed Awakened ideals. What they showed was that the Awakened had to either dump their original 'serviles are doin' it for themselves' thing in favor of modifying themselves recklessly and enslaving giant new creations, or else get squished under somebody else's wheels and become a mere footnote in history.

[Randomizer]

The Awakened decided that equality is easier to enforce when they could match or exceed the Shapers. It still wasn't a workable plan to start an arms race when they were in last place and couldn't catch up.

[wackypanda]

Are Taker-type and Barzite-type drakons capable of flight? If they aren't, the Awakened plan becomes more feasible, as the Barrier of the Winds drakons can fly and their emphasis is on defense. They might have needed to scale up if the PC hadn't intervened, but they wouldn't be lagging all that badly.

 

Also, the Takers and Barzites don't really have happy endings (for you at least), now that I think about it.

[Sudanna]

I don't think Drakons are ever referred to as flying, and since specific emphasis is placed on the Barrier of the Winds Drakons being flying ones, the implication is that that would be a big deal.

 

We have to ask why normal Drakons and Drayks even have wings now, but you could probably handwave it away with heat regulation or somesuch. They are cold-blooded.

[Dear Potato]

I think I'm gonna avoid your conversation until I reach geneforge 2 end!

 

I've finally decided to go against everyone and stay loyal to shapers -although, I won't touch awakened people-. I would have made this decision much earlier If I hadn't been confused about the loyalist camp location. I thought it was through the mountains, and not near the base of it. In any case... I'm looking for the other drayks in taker territory. I suppose I'm near the end.

 

By the way, i wonder if I would be able to beat that imprisoned demon that escaped to Ellrath's tomb. Last time I tried to fight with him, it basically mopped the floor with my agent. Even without guards!

[Randomizer]

Student of Trinity mentioned good results with a wand of terror. So maybe a terror spell.

[Triumph]

If you really want to be loyal to the Shapers, you'll punish Zakary. He broke the rules and helped create the entire mess. Just FYI (speaking in terms of getting the best non-aligned ending).

[Dear Potato]

If you really want to be loyal to the Shapers, you'll punish Zakary. He broke the rules and helped create the entire mess. Just FYI (speaking in terms of getting the best non-aligned ending).

 

Yes, thank you I somewhat guessed this by speakig with the loyalist camp leader, and his "Be observant of shaper's laws" preach I killed Zakary. Right now, I'm having some trouble looking for Eass, the last Drayk from Taker alliance -he or she is the last Drayk in my black list; by killing it I suppose I would reach the end...

 

At any rate, I liked this installment as much as the first one. Better gameplay balance, better spells, but less interesting plot (despite being truly interesting, specially the beggining; is just that G1 had the surprise effect for me!)

[Student of Trinity]

I don't think Drakons are ever referred to as flying, and since specific emphasis is placed on the Barrier of the Winds Drakons being flying ones, the implication is that that would be a big deal.

 

We have to ask why normal Drakons and Drayks even have wings now, but you could probably handwave it away with heat regulation or somesuch. They are cold-blooded.

 

I seem to remember that when I played the Awakened ending in G2, I got to see a big conga line of Drakons march out of the hidden Barrier of the Winds zone. If I'm not just getting my Geneforge endings mixed up, they looked just like all the other Drakons, but of course you have to add a bit of imagination to Jeff's limited graphics. Maybe only they could fly, and maybe that was important. For what it's worth, though, I always imagined that all the winged or floating Geneforge creatures could fly at least a bit if they wanted, but that like Tiggers, "they just don't like it, somehow".

[wackypanda]

Yes, thank you I somewhat guessed this by speakig with the loyalist camp leader, and his "Be observant of shaper's laws" preach I killed Zakary. Right now, I'm having some trouble looking for Eass, the last Drayk from Taker alliance -he or she is the last Drayk in my black list; by killing it I suppose I would reach the end...

 

You should find him soon enough. As one of the blacklisted, he should be in a crucial place, like maybe... near the Taker's magnum opus.

[Dear Potato]

You should find him soon enough. As one of the blacklisted, he should be in a crucial place, like maybe... near the Taker's magnum opus.

 

Thanks! I'm scouting all taker territory, but no look to this point. I found a "brain" creation (those creatures that are able to speak and run shaper buildings by themselves) who told me Eass created him, and stated that he didn't know where Eass is, but at the same time, the text displaying that info told me that he was clearly lying (with 13 points of leadership, I wonder if with even more I could ask him directly...)

 

At any rate, I'll keep looking. I'm a patient player

[Dear Potato]

Finally! I've killed the Taker triad and destroyed the Geneforge. I returned to the council and got a pretty good ending -I really liked the ending, I felt my effort took account into the epilogue, mentioning difficult decisions

 

But... there are two things that annoyed me: after the time and effort put to the destruction of the taker triad -probably the harder part in my playthorugh- and the geneforge, not a single mention is done in the epilogue; is that normal? Or maybe I did something wrong?

 

Also, I guess that thing with the sealed door in the taker complex, mentioned in the ending, has something to do with next sequels, doesn't it? I mean... did I left something interesting behind by not being able to cross that door? (if you don't mind, avoid spoilers, please )

 

Thanks! I really liked Geneforge 2, probably as much as Avadon.

[Lilith]

If you'd finished the game without destroying the Geneforge, the ending would have been very different, and not for the better.

[wackypanda]

The ending is normal, and the Shapers appreciate your efforts. If you don't think so, try not killing the triad and see what happens.

 

The door is a sequel hook.

[Dear Potato]

If you'd finished the game without destroying the Geneforge, the ending would have been very different, and not for the better.

 

Yes, I should have guessed so After the disastrous experience with Geneforge I ending, I tried to be much more cautious with canisters, goo pools, and apparently good natured serviles!

 

The ending is normal, and the Shapers appreciate your efforts. If you don't think so, try not killing the triad and see what happens.

 

The door is a sequel hook.

 

Thanks! So then, I probably took one of the best endings when it comes to loyalism. When i think of it, It's... pretty impressive the amount of variations in the endings.

[Dikiyoba]

We have to ask why normal Drakons and Drayks even have wings now, but you could probably handwave it away with heat regulation or somesuch. They are cold-blooded.

This is old, but one of the loading screen creation charts says that drayk wings are vestigial, which means drayks definitely can't fly, and since drakons are basically bigger drayks, they aren't going to fly either. (Presumably, drayks have some now extinct flying creation in their ancestry, or the first drayks were a lot smaller and could fly.)

 

Dikiyoba.

[Student of Trinity]

Doesn't the 'barrier of the winds' Awakened endgame of G2 suggest that those drakons, at least, will be able to fly? Or am I just reading too much into 'of the winds'? I always pictured them as flying, anyway. But other than that, I don't think there's anything in any of the games that even mentions flying in connection with drakons or drayks.

 

Wingbolts evidently fly, but for some reason they never go very high. That's kind of hard to explain. Their wings look too small in relation to their length to be generating much of a ground effect. There is that one episode in G4 where an attack by vlish over water is mentioned, though not seen. Vlish clearly float. Why can't they float higher?

[Triumph]

Yes, the Barrier of Winds drakons the Awakened try to create in G2 are explicitly described as being capable of flight. E.g. the statement "This is what the Awakened are counting on to protect them from Shaper invasion: an army of flying drakons, which will protect the narrow passes leading up to their cities."

 

This sets them apart from from "normal" drakons encountered elsewhere in the series.

[Arclight]

That actually is a distinct ending, by the way. It's just a bit hidden. Well on in the middle of the game you can meet a lone Shaper who outlines what a true Shaper ought to do. If you do what he describes, you'll get a different ending. I think.

Please elaborate, this is intriguing. Lone Shaper, what a shaper ought to do? hmm?

[Lilith]

 

Please elaborate, this is intriguing. Lone Shaper, what a shaper ought to do? hmm?

 

 

Instead of allying with anybody, just kill every faction leader before leaving the area.

 

[Arclight]

 

Instead of allying with anybody, just kill every faction leader before leaving the area.

 

I figured, thats what you did for the canon entry for the first geneforge. (Although it didn't matter if you left Sects alone or not.)

[Dear Potato]

Hello again!

 

Since this month I had some free time, I started to play Geneforge 3. After some weeks, I've finally completed it, and I must say it was somewhat of a mixed experience. In general, I liked it, specially some of the new ideas and concepts -Greta and Alwan were completely unexpected and very well received; it adds flavour to the plot Other things, though, left me wondering if this chapter is well considered among the long-term Spiderweb fans. The idea of the islands is great, but at the end it made feel encapsulated, even frustrated (the necessity of travelling through docks to change islands... understandable, but tiring). Also, the magic anvil and the recipes were welcome, but due to my character build, I was unable to access some of the greater equipment (well, my idiocy also played a role ).

 

The plot was, as always, a great piece of work I was fearing another iteration of Genforge 1 and 2, and the rebel-loyalist set took my by surprise. It makes more sense, and I believe it presents some major and better developed moral dilemmas than previous entries. At the point of reaching Gull island, though, everything seemed a bit disjointed. Not sure if it was because I played a loyalist, but the final showdown was a bit disappointing. Also, I was expecting Greta joining the rebels and showing for a climatic confrontation. But, anyway, I really liked the plot and how it ends; it is the first Geneforge game that impels me to play the sequel without an interval. I'm really intrigued about how the idea of the rebellion unfolds!

 

I played as an Agent, specialized in battle magic. I found the game challenging but very playable -certainly, less challeging than G1 and G2-. I reached level 34, with Battle magic 14, Spellcraft 11, Mental magic 6 and Blessing magic 5. Also, I pumped points to Intelligence (11), Endurance (8), Leadership (12); at the end, frustrated for not being able to open very intriguing doors , I spent some points in Mechanics (7). Oh, and all this numbers are without equipment buffs.

 

I must say I felt that this entry let me use Leadership not as often or with the same satisfaction than the other two games. Probably it's just a perception, but I remember fondly how I was able to avoid or misguide some terrible foes in the previous games; in Geneforge 3, being Leadership a must in every experience level for me, I never felt it was as decisive as before. I know that mechanics is always important, but I like to stick to magic when the chance is given. Not that I blame the game, though It was a bit clumsy by my part not to foresee that I wouldn't be able to open many things just with the combo Mental+Spellcraft+item buffs.

 

Well, and that's it. I think I can't consider myself a novice Geneforge player anymore Not sure if I will be moving to Geneforge 4 right away, but I certainly have the urge to see how the plot continues. Also, I've seen classes change names, and that even two new are added, and this makes me feel even more eager! As always, though, the absence of music retains me. When playing Geneforge 3, I was unable to stop thinking that music should be at least a must in important confrontations. Or maybe keep the ambience sounds and throw some little, nice tracks here and there in certain moments or battles (more or less like the Tomb Raider series).

 

Anyway... I'm looking forward to complete the next two games. I'm starting to feel a lot of respect for Vogel and his work.

[Alorael at Large]

Geneforge 3 is usually considered the weakest of the series, although I think that's in large part due to the strength of G1, G4, and G5. The boats and islands system gets a lot of hate for being annoying, frustrating, and time-consuming. The plot is considered either a rehash of G2 or a weak prelude to G4.

 

Fortunately, G4 is better, and don't worry, Greta and Alwan remain important players in the story of the rebellion. You haven't seen the last of them!

 

—Alorael, who first got into Geneforge by playing G4. It has a special place in his heart next to the vlish horde.

[Dear Potato]

Geneforge 3 is usually considered the weakest of the series, although I think that's in large part due to the strength of G1, G4, and G5. The boats and islands system gets a lot of hate for being annoying, frustrating, and time-consuming. The plot is considered either a rehash of G2 or a weak prelude to G4.

 

Fortunately, G4 is better, and don't worry, Greta and Alwan remain important players in the story of the rebellion. You haven't seen the last of them!

 

—Alorael, who first got into Geneforge by playing G4. It has a special place in his heart next to the vlish horde.

 

I guessed G3 was not the best example of the series... I'm not a long-term Spiderweb fan and I was curious about the general consensus. I guess some people won't agree, but thanks for your answer; I find your definition quite accurate

 

I've started G4 right away -in fact, I've been playing for days now; I want to squeeze the last days of my hollydays-. I'm... impressed. Now I understand what you were talking about. It was refreshing to see a change in the resolution, along with the graphics and presentation. Also, the new classes are very intriguing; I spent half an hour trying to decide what character I would be using...at the end, I sticked with the infiltrator (I was very tempted by the Servile, for obvious reasons; never expected that Geneforge games would offer this possibility!). Seeing Greta and Alwan was a surprise, too. For now, the plot is very interesting.

 

Oh, and the "new" AP system that allows to attack with 1 point is also fresh air. And I thank the gods for the inventory limitless weight! At last my mechanic-dumb agent can carry tons of these little freaking tools

 

For the record, or if anyone ever needs help.... I'm playing an Infiltrator at level 20; I'll list her numbers, but only the ones I spent points to:

 

Strenght-3

Intelligence-9

Endurance-6

Battle magic-9

Mental magic-3

Blessing magic-3

Spellcraft-5

Leadership-10

Mechanics-4

 

Right now, I'm about to complete Illya province without too much trouble.

[Dear Potato]

Woah, what a ride!

 

I've played Geneforge 4 till the end in two weeks or so... I really liked it! So far, with Geneforge 2, the best entries in this universe. For me, at least!

 

I liked the changes in the battle system and the new creation types. Also, I really appreciatte the chance to gain the most powerful spells without relying on canisters. Good to have Aura of Flames without shaping oneself. I think I have only one complaint: after the surprise of having Greta and Alwan as companions for all the campaign in Geneforge 3, I expected something similar (maybe I missed something, but I was only able to recruti an Artila at the beginning and a female soldier at the Shaper camp on Burwood province;both abandoned me after a while, though).

 

Anyway, just one more game to complete the saga

 

I'll post my final stats and equipment, along with some comments, in case some novice player could find it useful. I played as an Infiltrator that betrays the rebels and becomes a double agent for the Shapers; though, with the war events, she ends being close to Trakovite thoughts:

 

Click to enlarge

 

 

I focused the first levels on Spellcraft, Battle Magic, Intelligence and Endurance. At the beginning, I also put points into Leadership until I reached 10; when I arrived at Fens of Aziraph or so, I spent one more point and start to rely on Leadership equip buffs for nasty dialogues.

 

After that, when I reached Burwood, I spent points on Strenght and Mechanics, since it was something I never did in past games and always regretted later.

 

The final points where distributed among Bless and Mental magic, since I found the final spells of those schools very, very useful for tight battles.

 

I believe the character was well rounded for almost every encounter and quest, except for the heavy-mechanic ones. Specially at the beginning. On the other hand, this is the first Geneforge game that makes me sweat hard for victories. Some battles were very difficult,and not only the secondary/optional ones (those were little hells; The Titan and Litalia made me sweat blood)

 

Click to enlarge

 

Armor: Stability suit (but I used the Quicksilver Chitin for a long, long time before I found this one on Northforge citadel)

Belt: Girdle of Genius (for the most part, though, I used the lesser level belt that grants only 1 point of Intelligence)

Weapon: Spectral rapier (Almost always, but I combined it with the Flaming Sword in case I ran into physical weak enemies)

Ring: Ring of Eye's purity (very, very useful for magic oriented Infiltrators; you could get it from Miranda at Illya province by completing missions for the Sapers; lasted for me until the end)

Boots: Quicksilver sandals (before this, that I found very late in the game -inside the Cryo-Drayk camp just before the Northforge part- I relied on dexterity buffs as Stability boots)

Legs: Sapphire Legplates (Very useful, too, although a bit heavy; sometimes I was forced to change the Intelligence belt for the one that grants stength)

Hands: Lodestone gauntlets (very useful, too, but also late in the game; for the most part I used the Carnelian gloves)

Shield: Polychromous Shield (A great buff for resistances,a long with some crystals, that really helped me when enemies started to hit harder; I was unable to equip it with ease until I created the Talisman of might)

Necklace: Talisman of might (a lifesaver; really helped me to endure the big hitters in the later chapters, since I was able to equip better armor).

Cloak: Symbiotic cloak (very useful, helped me along with high armor levels in the last battles; but for the most part, I used the Infiltrator cloak)

 

 

Well, now I'm eager to play Geneforge 5

[Randomizer]

You could recruit others in different area, but you need a certain reputation and amoral nature to play off both sides to do it.

[Learned Noremac]

Since you've beaten the first two already, I guess this doesn't spoil anything, but the funniest thing I always find about the first 2 games is that if you aim to kill each and every single living character in the game and do nothing else, you are not only praised by the Shaper Council for your loyalty but you get pretty damn close to the canon ending for both games.

 

I know destroying or not destroying the Geneforge in #2 affects the ending fairly significantly, but in G1 you actually don't need to destroy the Geneforge for the loyalist ending, so long as no one capable of using it is alive by the end of the game. I've actually tried it--it's pretty much the exact same loyalist ending except the Geneforge's destruction isn't mentioned.

[Dear Potato]

Since you've beaten the first two already, I guess this doesn't spoil anything, but the funniest thing I always find about the first 2 games is that if you aim to kill each and every single living character in the game and do nothing else, you are not only praised by the Shaper Council for your loyalty but you get pretty damn close to the canon ending for both games.

 

I know destroying or not destroying the Geneforge in #2 affects the ending fairly significantly, but in G1 you actually don't need to destroy the Geneforge for the loyalist ending, so long as no one capable of using it is alive by the end of the game. I've actually tried it--it's pretty much the exact same loyalist ending except the Geneforge's destruction isn't mentioned.

 

Interesting... the canon endings never bothered me until Geneforge 4; since I did a loyalist playthrough I felt all my effort was in vain ^_^u

 

The canon endings for G1 and G2... If I've understood the dialogues during those months of gameplay, those basically are loyalist outcomes. I'm not sure if I'll be playing the Geneforge saga again after beating the last chapter, but I would definitely play them differently if that's the event Not sure if I would experiment killing everyone, though... there are tons of residents in both G1 and G2! I still have goosebumps with the true-loyalist playthough I did! I had to kill lots and lots of NPCs!

[Learned Noremac]

 

 

Interesting... the canon endings never bothered me until Geneforge 4; since I did a loyalist playthrough I felt all my effort was in vain ^_^u

 

The canon endings for G1 and G2... If I've understood the dialogues during those months of gameplay, those basically are loyalist outcomes. I'm not sure if I'll be playing the Geneforge saga again after beating the last chapter, but I would definitely play them differently if that's the event Not sure if I would experiment killing everyone, though... there are tons of residents in both G1 and G2! I still have goosebumps with the true-loyalist playthough I did! I had to kill lots and lots of NPCs!

 

Of course, you don't have to kill EVERYONE. The only people who the ending checks to see if they lived or died, if I remember right, is Trajkov, Goettsch, and the leaders of each of the servile factions. So as long as you kill Traj and Go, you don't need to destroy the Geneforge.

[Upon Mars.]

Confirmed.