A6 - Stealing?

[Ovenall]

Hey all. I'm new here. Just paid for the game last night.

 

I have a few questions. Does anyone here steals stuff in game? Is it worth it? How much do you have to steal before people get mad?

 

Thanks.

[Lilith]

How many times you can get caught depends on the area. In most areas, you can be caught stealing 5 times before the area goes hostile. If you're not seen, that theft doesn't count against you, but there are some items that can't be stolen without being seen. A few areas don't let you get away with anything at all.

 

In general, I steal as much as possible in the first few towns when money is tight. After that, I only steal things that I actually have a use for.

[Randomizer]

Synergy's Item List has most of the thefts allowed per zone listed.

 

But do save before you embark on your life of crime. The reaction to stealing doesn't occur until you move your party. Some places go hostile and you have to kill them while the Castle and other army occupied places use an autonode to end your game.

[Demseinwetter]

But stealing is probably one of the best things early in the game, you can get weapons with a damage spread you wouldn't see for a long time or a robe that can stay with your magician for most of the game.

 

Plus you'll make money by selling the items, which you can invest in Training.

[Ovenall]

Interesting. Is there any way to steal without getting caught? I found a small building with no one in it. There's a container with some stuff inside. No one's around. Does that count as stealing?

 

Thanks for the replies all.

[Lilith]

If nobody can see you while you're stealing, then it doesn't count against you. You can tell if you got caught or not because a little message will appear on the inventory screen when you pick up the item.

[waterplant]

In other posts people have discussed realism in the game. Stealing is one area for me where this applies. Do I want my party to steal from my allies, those that have helped me or those I am trying to help? Just blasting through every area helping myself to everything kind of kills the gameplay a bit. There is plenty of cool gear and coins in the game.

[Fael]

I'm with waterplant.

 

I steal things that directly translate to experience points -- Knowledge Brews, Wisdom Crystals, and Mandrake Root (used later on to craft Knowledge Brews). I never steal anything else.

[Rionep Ecnirp Etlevs]

I steal from allies with the ambitious idea that I am truly the nation's greatest hope against the enemies of Avernum. Thus, items and wealth are best spent for my benefit.

[Ovenall]

Some funny replies.

 

I get the rationale of not wanting to steal from friends and allies. But there's always the other side of the coin, which is vendors charging top dollar for equipment to a team of heroes who are going to save the world. Why are the vendors insisting on a price I can't pay? Are they just waiting for the next set of heroes to stop by with more money?

 

RPGs have these little quirks.

[The Mystic]

Regarding in-game theft: If nobody sees you, it's not really stealing. I've stolen untold millions in goods and cash in the Avernum series, from friend and foe alike.

[Fael]

Originally Posted By: Ovenall

But there's always the other side of the coin, which is vendors charging top dollar for equipment to a team of heroes who are going to save the world. Why are the vendors insisting on a price I can't pay? Are they just waiting for the next set of heroes to stop by with more money?

If you haven't seen it,, Jeff has a post on his blog (http://jeff-vogel.blogspot.com/2009/12/why-people-on-your-side-are-always.html) arguing fairly convincingly that, of all the silly, unrealistic things people complain about in his games, this one actually is realistic.

[Ovenall]

Maybe. I at least give him credit for acknowledging it. And it doesn't actually bother me, I just thought of it because of the topic at hand.

 

I know it's just a game. It's never going to be realistic, nor should it be. Why couldn't I just kill the first few vendors and simply take all of their stuff, for instance? Because it's just a game.

[Chidar_K_]

A general rule of thumb: if it's not bolted to the floor, steal it. Even if you can gain only 1 coin from selling it, steal it. Use all your free steal in areas. Investigate first what you want to use your free steals on though.

 

This is the way of the power gamer.

[waterplant]

Originally Posted By: Chidar_K_

A general rule of thumb: if it's not bolted to the floor, steal it. Even if you can gain only 1 coin from selling it, steal it. Use all your free steal in areas. Investigate first what you want to use your free steals on though.

This is the way of the power gamer.

I'm telling Levitt. You're going to the Abyss with all the other power gamers.

[Randomizer]

Originally Posted By: Ovenall

Why couldn't I just kill the first few vendors and simply take all of their stuff, for instance? Because it's just a game.

Some of the vendors are in sight of other NPCs so they will go hostile if you just kill the vendors. But Jeff gets tricky in that there are only a few items near each vendor so you don't get the inventory by killing the vendor.

[The Mystic]

Originally Posted By: Chidar_K_

A general rule of thumb: if it's not bolted to the floor, steal it.

Only the unbolted stuff? Amateur!

If you need the money, steal everything and sell it. If you don't need the money, steal everything anyway and set up a cache somewhere until you need money, and then sell it. If the item you want is in an NPC's line of sight, find a way to block the view, and then steal it. When it comes to in-game theft, no item is sacred.

The Mystic, pack rat extraordinaire, has spoken.

[Ovenall]

@ The Mystic-

 

Sounds like too much work for me. But I'm sure you can get really wealthy that way. I wish there was some kind of stealth mechanic in the game. I am really enjoying it so far, especially with help from this forum.

[ParsnipBake]

@Overnall

I hear that the Geneforge series has 'stealth' (See last post by Neossokrass) - http://www.ironycentral.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=196661#Post196661

 

Although I am going to confess, I have no idea what that is. Anyone care to shed the light??

[Dikiyoba]

Geneforge is real time when not in combat, so you can sneak around patrolling guards or follow characters to get access to treasure or complete quests.

 

Dikiyoba thinks it's kind of cool, but mostly it's annoying.

[ParsnipBake]

I'm curious why it's mostly annoying for you?

 

On the subject of stealing, I was surprised, it really adds a good dose of moral judgement to this game. I still struggle with my decisions every time. A good sign in my book. Some days I feel like being a real Samaritan, and other days I feel like...um...not

[La paix]

But the average Samaritan wasn't good (in the biblical situation to which you refer), so there's your problem.

 

There really are a lot of interesting moral quandaries in these games. They add a lot to the game experience. I've always thought half the fun (or more) was the writing and atmosphere. I used to steal everything everywhere, but in A6, I really made do without. As mentioned in a similar topic a while back, what's the point of stealing 6 coins from the local peasant? I decided I like being a true good guy better. Usually.

 

I remember some other moral dilemmas in these series. In A2, I think, you fight through a lair of chitrachs (or aranea, or maybe both) only to find evidence that they are sentient, intelligent beings. Obviously, Gladwell's missions are rather insidious, but I always kill him at the last mission. He had it coming. There is a slightly strange slith north of Formello you can leave or kill. You can help Melanchion as much as you like, though that might turn out unfavorably in the epilogue, depending on your tastes. In GF2, in the Clawbug Canyon, there is a protective mother clawbug that will not engage you unless provoked. You can kill it for some good treasure. This is all that comes to mind, but there are many more. The point is, you always have interesting choices, and for the sake of story and remembrance, I always like to make the more moral-minded choice. I think this adds an interesting edge of realism, but usually with little or no in-game consequence.

 

Unless I really want something I can safely steal or exhort.

[Øther]

Stealing has been very good to me in my game. Even if it is only worth a few coins, all of it adds up, so by now, a lot of my training has probably come from stolen goods. And with very few execptions (maybe I want to buy some herbs or crystals or something), I have bought nothing from vendors. And right now, my party can kill most of the stuff it comes across easily.

[ParsnipBake]

@Fractal - Yes, I stand corrected. 'real' should have read 'good' (as in the parable).

One aside question - Who/What is 'Alorael'?

[The Mystic]

Originally Posted By: Ovenall

@ The Mystic-

Sounds like too much work for me. But I'm sure you can get really wealthy that way.

True, it's a lot of work, but I've made many a god party that way.