Inner Keep problems

[Beatrix]

I have been repeatedly trying to get to the northwest private chambers of Lord Rahul and Lady Anjali -- but the guards there attack me. From reading the posts here, it sounds like everybody just gets the Guardian Claymore with no problems.

 

I have Leadership of 11 and even tried boosting it to 12 to talk to Rahul again. When I ask for supplies, he still says something like "I ain't fetchin' 'em for ya" and implies if I use ingenuity I can find what I need. Uh.... okay. But my ingenuity is tapped out.

 

Did anyone else have this problem? If not, what did you do to get the items in the northwest chambers? I'm curious whether I need to fulfill the quest to talk to Greiner first?

[Zeviz]

You aren't supposed to get these items until much, much later.

 

If you don't mind a little cheating, you supposedly can enter combat mode, haste yourself and rush into the room, closing the door behind you before the guards notice. (Apparently, only 1 of the guards raises alram, the rest just ignore you. So you have to time it so that that particular guard can't see you sneaking in.)

[Dolphin]

Try using creations to block the patrolling guards from going back there, and move in combat mode so the remaining guard doesn't see you. I do it in two trips, one to get the Drayk canister (E), and a second to get the Claymore (W)

[Contra]

You have to sneak up and get the claymore. First wait untill the blue guard has ran off into the other room (Only one guard matters, the one patrolling the main hallway leading to the enterance of their personal room), then enter, get the stuff from there, open the second room, kill the two Ur-Ghlaak, and get the other stuff. Run out andrepeat, but this time wait for the guard to be right otuside their bedroom before sneaking off to enter the other room.

[Walter]

There is only one gaurd who triggers going hostile if he sees you and he patrols back and forth between the two directions pausing briefly at both ends. You just wait for him to walk by then go the direction he came from, and close the door behind you so he doesn't see you when he comes back.

[Beatrix]

These are all great ideas! When I got freed up last night, I gave 'em a whirl. Failed, but it was fun to create 7 fyoras and strew them about. heh heh

 

I've noticed I have trouble being sneaky. I have a flair for getting caught. It took my agent a couple of tries to get the necessary stuff from Lankan's place to fulfill other quests. When I played the Guardian, I never could get any of it.

 

Wouldn't it be nice to cast "invisible" to last a short while for those of us challenged in the ways of infiltration? :-)~

[Beatrix]

Wanted to add something -- maybe a little off topic to this thread -- but I found the guardian so difficult to play in G3 that I stopped that game and started with the agent. In the past -- G1 and G2 -- I've most enjoyed shaper and agent, but I didn't think the guardian was as tough to play.

 

I still have the guardian game saved for replay when I'm feeling bold.

 

Oh, I'm just playing on normal.

[Drakefyre]

That's funny - I found that the Guardian was easier to play than the Shaper or Agent.

[Beatrix]

It may be that I'm simply not playing the Guardian correctly. So many rogues shoot bolts from a distance that I find I rely heavily on missile weapons -- not a match for many of the enemies. Greta was getting more bad guys than I was by far.

 

Also, huge difference between the guardian and agent at Krya's refuge. Guardian couldn't last through second round of ghosts; agent toughed it out.

 

HOWEVER.... I know of one mistake -- BIG -- that I made. Yesterday, I went into the guardian game (in progress still) and noticed how poorly I handled stats. I didn't boost up intelligence for Greta, Alwan or the two creations beyond the intial two points. No wonder each and every one of them fell under the specters' spells, turned on me and actually were the ones who killed me!

 

I guess I should have been asking advice on how to play the guardian. I've always wanted to play him.

[Drakefyre]

Personally, I've never focused on missile weapons. I like to pump up melee, quick action, and parry. I'll also create a fyora to help Greta from a distance while the Guardian and Alwan close in to do melee combat. If you find that you're getting too damaged in the first round of combat by missile weapons, improving your parry skill or endurance should help.

[Fyora Toast With Roamer Butter]

A trick which helps with combat mode is to put some of your stuff on the ground so you have no weight penalties then haste your main character so you can get past the doors quicker.

[Beatrix]

I have put a lot of points into endurance and I do have a fyora (since the beginning). Maybe I should think about pumping up the parry and quick action and forget this missile guardian thing.

[Beatrix]

Oh, btw.... I did go back and finally get the Claymore! Yippie! I'm thrilled... didn't get the drayk canister, unfortunately... but I'll try next time.

[Marlenny]

Hi Holly, Welcome to SW Boards.

Hope you have fun and are here to stay. But sweety: Could you try to edit your messages instead of double posting? We would all appreciate it. thanks

[mok]

Quote:

Originally written by Marlenny:
Hi Holly, Welcome to SW Boards.
Hope you have fun and are here to stay. But sweety: Could you try to edit your messages instead of double posting? We would all appreciate it. thanks

First of all, if you look at the numbers, Holly has been here about 2000 members longer than you have. Secondly, why does everyone get their underthings in a bunch if someone posts twice in a row? Especially if, as in this case, the 2 posts are 2 different thoughts, answering 2 different parts of the thread?

Would you yell at me if I click on "Add Reply" here, and then go back and add my $0.02 to the discussion at large, and share my thoughts on the best way to take Rahul's gear? The 2 posts would be completely unrelated and, imho, deserve some separation.

[nikki.]

Quote:

Originally written by mok:
First of all, if you look at the numbers, Holly has been here about 2000 members longer than you have.

It's all about post counts. If YOU would care to look, Holly has significantly fewer posts than Marlenny. Thus, Holly is the newer of the members, since she has posted less.

Secondly, double-posting is generally a bad thing in all fora. I, for example, have managed to address two different things in this one post. It isn't hard. And, if you would care to look, "intentional double posting" is in violation of the CoC, whether or not it addresses two different things.

If you want to seperate two different things, use paragraphs, or, if you must a row of dashes. Don't double post. And don't criticise others for asking, rather politely in my opinion, that newer members don't do it.

[Dolphin]

If you are quoting two different people it is okay to double post, but not a good thing to make a habit of.

 

Holly should have used the edit button, as her posts were said to the group rather than specific people (and were somewhat related).

 

It's okay to ask people politely to use the edit button instead of double posting, or to use legible spelling and grammar; if you do so in game boards it would be nice if you also contributed to the discussion or helped answer the person's question.

[Beatrix]

Look, I just came here to have fun. If anything I did offended anyone, it wasn't intentional. I think that's obvious.

 

I tried using the edit button the other day and it didn't work for some reason. Eh, well.

 

This forum is not particularly well attended for a game that just came out on Windows not too long ago. Maybe the folks here jumping on people for innocent flubs isn't the best way to keep people here. Not everyone has great grammar or spelling or, like me, find the mechanics of posting to be easy.

 

I've seen several people scolded here by just regular posters for silly infractions and it creates and unfriendly environment in a place that should be fun.

 

I think there reaches a point where people should just let people be unless they're being rude or offensive. And let the forum moderators do their job.

 

Oh, and I'm not sweetie or honey or baby or anything like that. You can call me Holly.

[Contra]

I think you are overreacting. Most people just like the inform others that it is considered good form to edit ones post instead of posting again.

This is usually informed by a phrase like "Please Edit your post instead of doubleposting."

I can't se any harm in that.

[Dolphin]

Asking people to use better spelling/grammar is so we are able to understand and answer their questions better. Some members on this forum are not native English speakers and may have trouble reading abbreviated English; it is not the intention to upset anyone.

 

I have not noticed you to regularly double posting (which is why I didn't comment about you doing so), but "intentional double posting" is a minor infraction in the CoC. I don't think we have scolded for doing these things.

[nikki.]

Quote:

Originally written by Holly:
This forum is not particularly well attended for a game that just came out on Windows not too long ago.

I think the main reason for this is that GF3 isn't such a great game. People have been bored of it for a long time.

[arkadilo]

I for one don't think it a crime for the occasional double post. It should be looked at objectively and not so 'super-cop' oriented. I sincerely doubt Holly's intention was to increase her post count. Anyone that reads these forums on a regular basis can tell the difference between abuse or not. Sometimes I think the person pointing out is just boosting their own post count by doing it. In fact, most of the time it's not done by moderators as it should be. Let the mods determine if someone is abusing the CoC.

 

And just so you know, I am not the newbie as my id indicates. I had originally joined in 2001, and had amassed quite a post count (with only maybe 5 or 6 double posts). But for some reason my account got corrupted and lost my id and count. I was told I would have to start over.

[Drakefyre]

Quote:

Let the mods determine if someone is abusing the CoC.

Hooray.

I'm confused about the forums not being well attended part, though. Aren't all of the questions answered within a few hours?

[Kelandon]

That's not exactly what Holly meant, which seems to be that there aren't many people posting here. I disagree with that, also, but it's a different point.

 

I wonder if Aran's program could tell us what the posting rates are on this board for different time periods. It would be interesting to know if interest actually is dying down.

[Beatrix]

Yes, Drakefyre! The questions are answered within hours and most responders are extremely helpful. It makes all the difference between my getting stuck and frustrated with the game and actually being able to play it and have fun.

 

You are awesome. And Contra and others whose handles escape me at the moment are terrific.

 

I also think you moderators out there do a great job. I know this because I read a heck of a lot on these boards -- way more reading than posting -- to see if I can find the answers first. The mods are obviously picked for a reason. Tact, judgment... even kindness.

 

The anonymity the internet provides seems to spur people to do things they can't get away with IRL. One such thing is running around pointing out people's flaws and telling them how to behave.

 

I'm seeing a lot about post count being a big thing. Okay, I get it now. It gives folks that funny title after their handles, right? Whoa. Pretty big deal, eh?

 

Gee, I hope this post I'm writing right now promotes me. <snark>

[arkadilo]

For a lot of people, this is my opinion and everone knows what opinions are worth, higher post count earns higher respect. I was quite proud of my Adept status when I had it. I also had a 5 star rating at the time with a 3 digit member number. And will admit I was quite miffed at losing it.

 

But I've learned over the last few years in life that a title and nickle can only buy you a cup of coffee. It's the person that brings respect....

[Drakefyre]

Out of curiosity, do you know what your old member number was?

[Trina]

I've enjoyed this discussion about proper etiquette in the forum. On several occasions I've seen criticisms of poor grammar, excessive typos, and double postings, and I've winced to think how the original poster must feel about the response. On the other hand, folks have a legitimate concern about clear, efficient communication. And how can new people become full members of the community without occasional guidance from those who are more experienced?

 

Enforcing rules of communication isn't just about effectiveness, though; it's also about power and social class. For example, if I say "I ain't got no shoes," almost everyone will understand exactly what I mean, despite the bad grammar. So if clarity isn't the issue, why does that sentence bother some people? I'd say it's because we have a natural tendency to divide ourselves into groups for the purpose of considering ourselves superior to others. Have you ever wondered where the notion of correct grammar comes from? Generally, "correct" grammar is however rich people speak and write, regardless of the specific language or culture. And they control access to the upper class by insisting that outsiders adopt the same way of speaking and writing (among other things). On the Internet, no one can see how you're dressed, where you shop, or who you have lunch with--so language becomes even more prominent in deciding who's in and who's out.

 

I'd be willing to bet that Marlenny intended no insult by the use of the term "sweety" when addressing Holly--on the contrary, it was probably an attempt to be friendly and soften the impact of the request to avoid double postings. But my eyebrows certainly shot up when I saw the word, and I wasn’t a bit surprised when Holly fired off the reply that she's "not sweetie or honey or baby or anything like that." Consciously or not, Marlenny was asserting a position of superiority: if you're going to play with us, you're going to play by our rules. Relative newcomers (including me) got the message loud and clear.

 

So remember: language is power; use it wisely.

 

(Hey, I've got an idea for G4: a new Language spell that enables you to talk your opponents to death. I think I'd be good at that....)

[arkadilo]

Sorry, I don't remember the number and can't even remember the id. I'm wanting to say it was 'Colt'. I called up Spidweb and they looked into it and said that for some reason, several id's were corrupted and could not be restored. This happened about 3 years ago now if I'm not mistaken.

 

And as for the communication part, I there should be certain etiquite upheld and enforced, absolutely. But the enforcement needs to be left to moderators who are on here all the time. One member should never correct another member unless you want to post it privately to them about the mistake. Posting for all to see would likely make the original poster feel embarassed and uncomfortable, no matter how nice it is put.

[Beatrix]

Thanks to all who have weighed in on the subject of ettiquette.

 

Arkadillo, I couldn't agree more with your feelings about corrections being a moderator's job and not members of the forum.

 

Trina, I couldn't have said it better myself. Thanks. If you wince and I wince just reading what is said to others, we can't be alone in this. Probably many people have fled this place because of this.

 

As to post count, I don't give a flip, folks. And I do think it's disingenuous (and a putdown) to welcome someone to the forum who joined it more than a year and a half ago. I have visited here off and on, reading more than talking. Why? I find out what I need to know by the "search" option. You can play the "you're a newbie" game with me all you like. I'm obviously not. I have a life with other things to do, so I don't hang out here. But I'm not going to be relegated to some lowly status by people into titles and post counts and what not. Stand back for a minute, folks, and look at this. Silly. Trivial. These are games. They're fun. This is a forum to talk about all this fun we're having playing these games. It's not a place to act out power struggles.

 

As Arkadillo said, it's the person, not the title or the perceived power that earns the respect.

 

Trina, are you a writer? You should be.

[Drakefyre]

As administrator of these forums, what I want most is an open environment where people can get help when they need it, talk about Spidweb games, talk to other people who enjoy the same games, and just have a good time. Since these are Spiderweb Software's official company message boards, it's in the interests of the administrators and moderators to keep people here and keep people happy, because happy people are likely to buy more games.

[Kelandon]

Holly: I fail to see how snarking at someone for an effort to improve your etiquette is any better than snarking at someone for bad etiquette.

 

I do recognize that many on these boards have been unpleasant at times, but you have to recognize when someone is being harsh and when someone is not. When someone says you are a damned idiot who should be shot, you are being insulted. When someone asks you politely to change something about your manner to be more in accordance with the CoC, you are not. Keep a sense of due proportion and be aware that you can't hear others' tone of voice.

 

Trina: Often people use AIM-speak when online, and it takes considerably longer to read and understand, "aye so i was lik3 havn tubl wit da genfore ni da kepe thin or whatevah," than it does to read and understand, "Hi all. I'm in Dhonal's Keep and am having trouble with the mountain pass." Correcting people's grammar has at least as much to do with easing written communication as it does with enforcing some sort of class structure.

 

To clarify the rules: Being nasty is wrong because it's wrong, not because you're not supposed to correct people's grammar. Politely correcting someone's etiquette or grammar is fine. I know Marlenny, and I'm pretty sure she was trying to be friendly, not condescending.

 

Double-posting is against the CoC, but it's probably the most minor infraction, so Holly, now that you know not to do it, don't get too worked up about having been corrected, but don't double-post unless you are responding to two entirely separate quotes (and are quoting them in your post) or unless you need to bump a several-day-old topic for a legitimate reason.

 

I'm pretty sure we're done here. The question in this topic has been answered, as far as I can tell, and other than trying to assign blame (never a productive activity), there's nothing else we can say about the rules. Therefore I shall lock this now.

 

If anyone needs clarification on anything, PM me.