Tenderfoot Thahd SuperCMonkey Posted January 20, 2019 Share Posted January 20, 2019 So I'm playing through the series again, and I just beat G3. I'm looking to go for the Trakovite ending this G4 playthrough. I've done it before, so I know the specific thing necessary to get this ending. My question has to do with the two branches of the ending. I've looked at the G4 Ending Chart, and I know that you can either be exiled or executed in the Trakovite ending. I know that whether one or the other happens depends on your reputation. My thing is, the last time I went Trakovite, I thought I was pretty pro-rebel. I straddled the fence action-wise, sure, but my opinions were pretty one-sided. Despite that, I still got the execution ending. Does anyone know how far rebel you have to be to get the exiled ending? Do you have to do everything the rebels want, or can you help the Shapers a bit? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrulous Glaahk Vinlie Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 I have 3 characters in my Geneforge 4 game. One Pro rebel, one pro Shaper, and one neutral. I tested all three of them in the Trakovite ending and it was apparent you only get exiled if you are heavily pro rebel. My pro rebel character had all the rewards you could receive from the mage in Derenton Freehold, so you could use the mage rewards as a reference for how pro rebel you are being. I suppose if you aren't eligible to receive the last couple of rewards, you'll get the execution ending, but I can do further testing if needed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenderfoot Thahd SuperCMonkey Posted January 21, 2019 Author Share Posted January 21, 2019 (edited) Thanks for the reply! 😀 I guess it isn't really that surprising that you'd have to be heavily pro-rebel for the exiled ending. The main reason I was wondering is because I really like the availability of the Shaper trainers. At the very least, I like having access to all of Shaper Duncan's creations, which I believe requires you to repair Moseh. I was hoping that I could at least repair Moseh, but it sounds like even that isn't really an option. Edited January 21, 2019 by SuperCMonkey Correcting Grammar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Slawbug Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 Be careful about drawing conclusions here! There are two things that might be likely to affect that part of the ending. One of them is your "reputation", the number that lots of actions (and a few conversation choices) alter. The other is specifically how you resolve the major quests at the end of each chapter. The rewards from Manohla in Derenton Freehold depend SOLELY on the reputation number. I would be careful about assuming that that is what affects the ending rather than how you resolved the major quests. It's certainly possible, I just don't think it's a given. Both of these things could be tested by using shift-D to edit SDFs right before the ending, if you wanted to. Re repairing Moseh... I believe that buying creations from Duncan simply requires a slightly pro-shaper reputation and does not depend on Moseh specifically. You may wish to consult this: https://minmax.ermarian.net/g4/g4q.html Vinlie and SuperCMonkey 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrulous Glaahk Vinlie Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 Regarding Moseh, I think it's so obnoxious that if you're a rebel he'll always drain 2 attributes from you before fighting him with no way of getting them back. What I do now is play the Shaper side until Alwan gives me the quest to repair Moseh, just so I get to keep my attributes the way I want. Of course I kill Moseh and the Barrier Zone Guardians because they're ez af. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Randomizer Posted January 21, 2019 Share Posted January 21, 2019 If you bring the servile from the Rebel base with you, then you only lose one attribute. Still sucks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenderfoot Thahd SuperCMonkey Posted January 21, 2019 Author Share Posted January 21, 2019 I'll probably just pretend to help the Shapers until I get that quest from Alwan. I figure it would make sense for my character to want to stick close to the rebels if he was a Trakovite sympathizer. It may limit me a bit, especially since I don't plan on using many canisters, but it's not much different than my recent G3 playthrough where I was a Shaper sympathetic toward creations. Didn't use any canisters and had limited training available because of my opinions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Well-Actually War Trall alhoon Posted January 22, 2019 Share Posted January 22, 2019 11 hours ago, Vinlie said: Regarding Moseh, I think it's so obnoxious that if you're a rebel he'll always drain 2 attributes from you before fighting him with no way of getting them back. What I do now is play the Shaper side until Alwan gives me the quest to repair Moseh, just so I get to keep my attributes the way I want. Of course I kill Moseh and the Barrier Zone Guardians because they're ez af. Moseh was probably the most difficult boss in the series for me. As for the Trakovite ending, I think it may also be affected by which NPCs survived and some quests, not solely rep. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenderfoot Thahd SuperCMonkey Posted January 22, 2019 Author Share Posted January 22, 2019 I'm at Cairn Gates, and the only pro-Shaper thing I've done so far is help Shaila escape, which I only did because I sympathized with her. The only other pro-Shaper thing I'm thinking of doing is getting the Heart of the Kiln for Mouawad (I think that's his name), because I want the Skein of Wisdom. If I report Moseh's death to Alwan, will that count as doing the Shaper task and let me use the Shaper path to Burwood? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Lilith Posted January 22, 2019 Share Posted January 22, 2019 8 hours ago, SuperCMonkey said: I'm at Cairn Gates, and the only pro-Shaper thing I've done so far is help Shaila escape, which I only did because I sympathized with her. The only other pro-Shaper thing I'm thinking of doing is getting the Heart of the Kiln for Mouawad (I think that's his name), because I want the Skein of Wisdom. If I report Moseh's death to Alwan, will that count as doing the Shaper task and let me use the Shaper path to Burwood? Yes. As long as you at least got the quest to repair Moseh from Alwan, even if you didn't complete it the way he wanted, you won't be locked out of dealing with the Shapers yet. (If he didn't give you the quest at all, which is possible if your reputation is heavily pro-rebel, then the Shapers are going to be hostile for the rest of the game.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrulous Glaahk Vinlie Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 If you give Monarch's papers to the Rebels that's when you'll be locked out of the Shapers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Slawbug Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 That's not true, although it can seem like it is. First, if you helped the Shapers in the Barrier Zone, they will help you leave the Fens even if you give Monarch's notes to the Rebels. Shaper and Rebel options also both become available at certain points in Burwood (after Quessa-Uss) and in Northforge Warrens (from Miranda) -- I believe no matter what. I don't think anything pre-empts these options; could be wrong about that, but giving Monarch's notes to the other team definitely doesn't if you handled the Barrier Zone in the opposite way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Randomizer Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 You only have troubles with one side that lock you out if you consistently help the other for the boss quest for each major area: Rebel Caravan, Moseh, Monarchs Paper, .... There are even warnings when you are reaching the point of no return before the quest that will cause you trouble. You can still advance to the next area, but once there you will face increasingly hostile reactions and maybe attacked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrulous Glaahk Vinlie Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 I actually adore how many different options can affect the overall story and the way people perceives you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Lilith Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 11 hours ago, Outside the Ox said: That's not true, although it can seem like it is. First, if you helped the Shapers in the Barrier Zone, they will help you leave the Fens even if you give Monarch's notes to the Rebels. Shaper and Rebel options also both become available at certain points in Burwood (after Quessa-Uss) and in Northforge Warrens (from Miranda) -- I believe no matter what. I don't think anything pre-empts these options; could be wrong about that, but giving Monarch's notes to the other team definitely doesn't if you handled the Barrier Zone in the opposite way. I went 100% pro-rebel on my first playthrough and didn't get any further Shaper options presented to me from chapter 3 onwards: all Shaper-controlled areas just attacked me on sight without giving me the chance to work for them. It's possible I missed something, I guess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Slawbug Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 Hmm, interesting. So it seems that there may be "points of no return" where you are locked out of the Shapers or Rebels, but that they only apply if you have been consistently (perhaps even 100%) siding with the other faction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Randomizer Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 2 hours ago, Outside the Ox said: Hmm, interesting. So it seems that there may be "points of no return" where you are locked out of the Shapers or Rebels, but that they only apply if you have been consistently (perhaps even 100%) siding with the other faction. It only happens regarding the major quest for each province. I did the same as Lilith on my first play through. On another play through where I was slightly helpful to Shapers, but got the Caravan through and killed Moseh, Miranda warned me that I had to turn in Monarch's Papers or the Shapers wouldn't help me anymore. If you alternate helping each side, then you can go further into the game without hitting the one side is hostile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Lilith Posted January 23, 2019 Share Posted January 23, 2019 I don't think it's actually possible to alienate the Rebels to the point where they won't work with you any more until the very end of the game. They're a lot more desperate than the Shapers are. (It is entirely possible to sabotage them enough that you're locked into a lousy ending if you side with them, though.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenderfoot Thahd SuperCMonkey Posted January 24, 2019 Author Share Posted January 24, 2019 So I may have been a wee bit enthusiastic with my pro-rebel stuff. Alwan didn't want to give me the Moseh quest, and I can't get training from Duncan. I'm hoping doing Mouawad's quest will push me over the limit I need for Duncan, otherwise I may have to rely on canisters, which I didn't want to do. I've only used three so far, and I think you can use 14 without getting a bad ending (although Trakovites don't have a distinction, I guess). This is more of a pain than I thought it would be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrulous Glaahk Vinlie Posted January 24, 2019 Share Posted January 24, 2019 You can also hunt down traitors in Dillame for more reputation Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Well-Actually War Trall alhoon Posted January 27, 2019 Share Posted January 27, 2019 Those include the Trakovites though 😛 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrulous Glaahk TheKian Posted January 29, 2019 Share Posted January 29, 2019 Nobody seems to have addressed the single most important component of the Trakovite ending. When you change the power settings (to get the ending), you can set it to a strong power flow or a weak power flow. A strong power flow will result in strong Unbound and destroyed machinery, while a weak power flow will result in low quality Unbound. The strong Unbound will (all other things being equal) cause you to be exiled, because they force a stalemate. Weak Unbound will result in the rebellion losing and you'll be executed. Aiding the Shapers when they attack Northforge will always result in your execution (I believe), and giving Alwan the Unbound specifications will result in the Unbound being destroyed regardless of which of the two options you chose and you'll be executed. Also, I just tested with the maximum pro-shaper reputation after a game that was pro-rebel with some amount of fence sitting with the cheat SDF 100 0 200. Being pro-Shaper does not cause you to be executed when you complete the Unbound. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Slawbug Posted January 29, 2019 Share Posted January 29, 2019 Actually, choosing a weak power flow doesn't result in a Trakovite ending at all. You have to pick a strong power flow to get the Trakovite stalemate ending. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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