mikeprichard

Thanks, Ishad - so apparently there are variations in prices between different merchants even at "max" (5 points per character) Barter skill; I thought I remembered that from the last time I played a couple years ago as well. (EDIT: confirmed this from older threads.)

Earth Empires - great, thanks! Just to clarify a couple things:

A new party with two magic users already starts with about 30 total Rune Reading, so are you saying a level 1 party can already access all level 3 spells etc.? I must be missing something here. Also, is Vahnatai Lore checked completely separately from Rune Reading, or does it just add to the same Rune Reading pool?

And for Tool Use, the actual max total needed is more like 20-25, and you're saying 15 "base" plus points from items gets you there, yeah?

I'm planning a third playthrough of A3 after a break of several years, but since there aren't any shiny Strategy Central posts on the forums for the older remakes, and I can't find definitive info on some skills by searching around, I'd appreciate confirmed answers for the below. Cheers!

(Answers courtesy of Earth Empires, Ishad Nha, Nikki, and old threads such as http://spiderwebforu...ore#entry125341 and http://spiderwebforu...ge__hl__barter.)

Rune Reading

1) What is the maximum total value needed across the party to learn all spells and get all other benefits from this skill throughout the game?

ANSWER(?): ~30.

2) How does Vahnatai Lore interact with this skill (e.g. which/how many spells can only be learned by having Vahnatai Lore, and at which value)?

ANSWER: Vahnatai Lore points are checked separately from Rune Reading for certain spellbooks (such as Capture Soul and Simulacrum in Ghikra, Return Life in Lorelei, Divine Host in Moon, and Radiant Shield in the Defiled Crypt). In addition, they are always counted as Rune Reading points, and therefore assist in understanding all other spellbooks.

Nature Lore

1) What is the maximum total value needed across the party to get all caches in the game?

ANSWER(?): 23.

Tool Use and Unlock Doors

1) What is the maximum total value needed on one character to disarm all traps in the game?

ANSWER: 29. This is the value needed to disarm the traps in Sharimik's City Hall; the most difficult traps after that are two cabinets in the Golem Factory and one dresser in Erox (24), two other cabinets in the Golem Factory (22), and two chests in the Chasm of Screams (21). Other traps in the game only require around 20 or less. Note that the Rogue's Leather and Nimble Gloves each add 4 points to Tool Use skill when disarming traps, but fine/magic lockpicks don't add to Tool Use skill when disarming traps.

2) Is there any need for Tool Use once you have the Unlock Doors spell at level 3?

ANSWER: Yes. Tool Use is still needed to disarm traps.

3) Does Tool Use enhance the Unlock Doors spell if put on the same character?

ANSWER: No. This mechanic was only introduced in Avernum 4.

Barter

1) What is the maximum total value needed across the party to get the best possible item resale prices in the game?

ANSWER: 20. This will get you the "max" 45% item resale price rate at almost all merchants (with the exception of Winn in Blackcrag Fortress, who requires a total Barter value of 29 to reach the 45% rate); i.e., merchants will purchase the party's items for 45% of the items' base values. Note that unlike other items, the resale price for spellshards and spellbooks is capped at 36% of their value (900/2500 for spellshards, 450/1250 for spellbooks). Note also that actual shop prices are never affected by Barter.

2) Do different merchants still offer better/worse item resale prices at the maximum effective Barter value of 20?

ANSWER: No. At the maximum effective Barter value of 20, all merchants will buy the party's items at exactly 45% of their base values (with the exception of Winn, noted above).

Giving efreet their own graphic (instead of the ugly shambler graphic) would be great too, but I realize that'd be a lot more work than the chitrach graphic (assuming you'd just be recycling the existing chitrach graphic from previous games, whereas there are no recent unique efreet graphics to work with).

Correction: Garzahd drops a Blessed Armor Band.

One more - the "taunting" dialogue popups for the members of the Ten are a little mixed up in Angierach: I got the lich dialogue just outside the rakshasi door, and vice-versa (and this even though I'd already killed the rakshasi by the time I got to the lich door).

And hopefully Jeff is breaking his own unwritten rule about not really reading the forums and is actually reviewing this thread. Guess we'll find out when the updated game versions are posted.

Correction to the notes under Egli - I've confirmed that you can get Rentar's phoenix egg even after getting the egg from Pyrog's lair; that's what I did, and I'm now showing "Phoenix Egg (2)" in my Special Items list.

Ah, I forgot the whole issue of "g"/"i" also referring to a specific item to be picked up, and therefore conflicting with the toggle, which is a good reason not to implement the toggle feature. I'll have to find another pretext for a Spiderweb lawsuit that will attract international media coverage.

It is annoying to have to constantly stretch your pinky finger over there, especially when you're (like me) hitting "g" every few seconds in a new area to check for items. I could see how some would say this is a nitpick, but there's no good reason not to have these buttons toggle that I can see. (Same deal with the map hotkey.)

Regardless, I'm preparing my lawsuit seeking damages from Spiderweb for two decades of unnecessary pinky finger stretching. From reading this thread, I may take it class-action.

Dahhhh, ya got me... been way too long since I've played either the "original" Exile/Avernum 2 or Nethergate. I'm an easy mark.

Another one - you can access the hidden button behind the painting in Fort Remote (with a dialogue popup indicating you found the button Fraitus told you about) even before talking to Fraitus.

Never mind then - thanks, Slarty!

Good to know - too late for me, but at least this has apparently already been reported.

So just another twisted Spiderweb mind game. Thanks, Randomizer.

Is there a key for the door in the west outer wall of Pyrn's tower (which leads to the body outside surrounded by the magic barriers)? If so, where is the thing?

The dialogue for the wandering Empire spies in the western Great Cave is blank (you only see "OK." in the dialogue popup window) - at least if you encounter them before encountering the Avernite patrol that mentions them elsewhere in the Great Cave (which is what happened in my playthrough).

I just confirmed that the capture list mechanics are completely random, such that a new monster could replace any existing monster in your prism list - including the most recent monster you previously captured. Sorta annoying.

Hmm, so I might need to capture each of these rare enemies several times (save/reload) before I finally get them not to overwrite a slot I don't want them to... irritating is right.

Right - I just want to test to make sure the list placement isn't totally random such that new monsters replace not the oldest monsters on the list, but more recent additions - which would screw up my plans to fill my remaining slots with only the 8 specific rare monsters I'm aiming for.

Confirmed that the way new captures are added to the list is buggy. I captured 8 cave widows first (to "fill" my list with junk monsters to start with - not sure why; I just did). Then I captured in this order: Fiery Demon (which replaced #8 on the list), Cryos Demon (which became #4), and Mung Demon (which became #2). The order they appeared in the list is weird, but not in itself a problem - but it WILL be a problem if the other very rare enemies I plan to capture in the remaining 5 slots (Haakai, Lich, Eyebeast, Demon Golem, and Efreet), instead of replacing the old cave widows, replace some of these 3 more recent monsters (or each other) that I plan to keep. I'll report back on what I find - still haven't had an opportunity/sufficient level to capture some of those last 5 beasties.

And they're locked to keep out those klepto "adventurers."

And the freedom to close doors... but I digress.

You probably don't have that some sort of freedom (like stealing) because your're Avernite soldier, not random adventurer like in A:EFTP.

You can still steal - as long as nobody's watching.

But yeah Lilith, forgot about the message. Ah well, guess that's the way Jeff wants to play it.

I actually think the opposite - *not* being able to attack friendly NPCs should be the bug, not the other way around. Not to sound anti-social or anything - just saying, freeform gameplay and all.

Thanks for the correction, Dikiyoba - sorry for spreading misinformation. Fixed my post.

And definitely agree with Sertorius that it'd be nice if the little automatic stat increase messages lasted longer, but Lilith's info is correct, so it's not difficult to figure out.