The Lurker

Well, I sure wasn't expecting the Forgotten One to be this easy. His Essence Lances spell wasn't really effective against my Gazer, and the nightmare burrowers were very easy to charm. My Gazer's Kill spells never missed and did a lot of damage. All in all, I found the Old Golem to be much tougher. I think the Shaper Trueweave will become my main suit of armor. Just for the challenge, I managed to save the rebels in Fort Raevinn (well, I'm not 100% sure I saved every single rebel since one or two battle creations managed to sneak in, but I certainly saved most of them, at the very least). I did most of the work on my own, using lots of Charm and Mass Madness spells. I used Essence Pods, re-blessed myself and saved between waves. I even ran away and made a Rot to help me at one point (it didn't survive very long, but it did help me a little). I beat every single enemy in the Poryphra Ruins. It was surprisingly easy (although I had to leave and re-enter the area a lot). I used my Gazer, and Charm spells, against the Wingbolts and Kyshakks in the ruins. I mostly used Charm spells to destroy the 10 War Tralls guarding the main camp. Then I did hit-and-run attacks on the camp with a Gazer until Alwan's warriors were destroyed. Then I sneaked into the western building and killed the Guardian there. Alwan didn't even interfere. Then I sneaked into the eastern building and kept attacking Miranda until she fled. Oh, and I charmed her creations, of course. Hellton was very easy - I just charmed him, then Alwan killed him for me. I managed to get Shaper Grim's attention without Alwan noticing me, so I just lured Grim into the tiny room in the western building, and well, he didn't last long. Alwan himself wasn't too tough - I used Spine Shield, kept hitting him in melee, charmed the first Wingbolt he made, and he fled shortly after. I fully explored Drosstro's lab. The Experimental Rot was easy, because once again, I was using a Gazer and Rots are very weak against magical attacks. The Unstable Firebolts were tougher - they were very resistant against my Charm spells, but I eventually managed to charm one. Two of the Firebolts the began attacking each other, and I dealt with the third one in melee. By the time I killed it, the second Firebolt was dead, and I easily finished off the first one. In case you are wondering, no, I haven't attacked Khima-Uss and the Grayghost Gates yet. Maybe later, if I'm feeling psychotic. My next major fight will probably be against Incantor Diamus, Agent Hesione, and Shaper... Um, what's his name already... Tungsten, I believe. I wonder how the fight in the Windswept Farms will turn out - as a Lifecrafter, I found this battle to be one of the hardest battles in the game. Who knows, maybe it'll be easier as a Servile.

GF5 sounds like it might be the most interesting Geneforge game faction-wise. I'll make sure to try 'em all. Litalia joining the Trakovites makes sense - she didn't really like the Shapers nor the Drakons, and although she thought the Trakovites were mad, she also seemed to think they were wise in their own ways. That Sage sounds like a complete nutcase.

Ah, thanks for the warning. Soulflayer has yet to use a spore baton. Anyway, I've destroyed pretty much everything that can be destroyed in the Western Morass. It was somewhat difficult, and I had to increase my Intelligence as well as use hit-and-run tactics. But Charm spells worked very well, and I was able to get the vial of blood poison. Scourge Vossizon is dead, although I'll admit I did enlist Teliamerus's help. Mass Madness seems to work very well against her worms. I defeated Salassar without using Leadership. Once he started making more creations, I cast Mass Madness and he died very quickly. Ice Spray helped a bit, too - Drakons and Drayks seem to be very weak against cold. For some reason, I thought a Pure Crystal Shard was required to make the Shapemaster Boosts. My memory needed refreshing, I forgot that you could make them right after Quessa-Uss, and so I did. And I beat the Old Golem without using any Essence Pods. I used an Essence-armored Gazer (I felt like trying a new creation) as well as my Oozing Blade and my spine shield (and, of course, the usual protection and mass energize spells). The Gazer took care of the first few forms, then I finished off the Crumbling Golem myself. Spine Shield really does work wonderfully here.

Thuryl : I've been mostly neglecting Endurance since the beginning - usually I can either heal myself faster than I take damage, or I can distract my enemies with creations, or I can wreak havoc with my mental spells. So, right now, my Intelligence is indeed higher than my Endurance. I'm still pretty tough... With a few buffs, I can literally walk through pylons and minefields. Ackrovan : I'm doing fine. Being skilled in both melee and battle magic is no problem at all. Missile weapons... They were useful if the first two chapters, but I've been somewhat neglecting them in the Fens and Burwood. My Dexterity's still pretty high thanks to various bonuses, so we'll see if they can be useful again.

The creations weren't friendly, they were neutral. These townspeople get mad waayyy too easily. Thanks for the tip about the Shaper Trueweave - I've got a few breastplates in mind right now, but this robe is indeed pretty nice. I've just tried attacking the Shaper Camp. I charmed and killed a few enemies and ran. It appears than the respawning creations are very resistant (though not immune) to Charm spells. Not good. I may have to make a few creations to distract them when I eventually decide to explore it for real. I've destroyed the Cultist Safehouse with almost nothing but mental spells. Wow. I did just as well as a Lifecrafter for this area, if not even better. Impressive. Oh, and I *so* can't wait to fight Incantor Diamus.

Well, Chapter 3 was a joke, and now it's over. On to Burwood Province. Before I killed Monarch, I bought two Create Kyshakk points from Shaper Dannell. It was expensive, but hey, there's at least one area in GF4 where you can get infinite money, so that's okay. The Wingbolts guarding the road were surprisingly easy, I picked them off one at a time and didn't even have to use mind control. A few Ice Sprays spells took care of them. Agent Yngrid was very easy, and I got her Infiltrator Charm. That Shaper guarding Valeya Road was much trickier - I had to dispatch every hostile creation nearby before fighting him. Then I fought him in melee, dazing his worms when necssary. The Brutal Wight was tough, so I made a Kyshakk to help me. The poor ghost literally killed itself on our Spine Shields. Guardian Kantor wasn't much of a problem since I destroyed his rear guard before fighting him. However, this made the townspeople mad at me for some reason, and I forgot to buy the Demon's Bile before fighting Kantor. Ah well. I charmed the creations guarding the path to the Maddened Trall, and they completely destroyed each other. It was very fun. The Maddened Trall was difficult. I fought him in melee, since his missile attacks are quite dangerous. I wanted to charm the Kyshakks, but I didn't even have to - because he was cornered, he was unable to make the two Kyshakks. He did make the two Battle Alphas, however. Guardian Dameron summoned two War Tralls while I was fighting him. I managed to charm one of them, making the fight much easier. And I have the Frozen Blade. Neat. I think I'll stick to the Oozing Blade most of the time though, I'm really fond of it. Shaper Horis summoned a very powerful Burning Kyshakk while I was fighting her. I successfully charmed it, and she died in no time. Then I finished off the Burning Kyshakk in melee. The Uberoozebeast took a while to die, but it wasn't too difficult. I killed it from a distance, since it does quite a bit of damage in melee. And I love the Ornkskin Gauntlets. I managed to defeat both the Imprisoned Soul and the Soultaken Twins without using any Essence Pods. They were no match for me and my Kyshakk. I can kill the Old Golem, but once again, I'll wait until I'm a bit stronger. Wouldn't want to waste too many items, after all. I gave two Puresteel Rings to Orois Blaze, but chose not to pay him for the (expensive) canisters. I just unlocked the three remaining doors intead. I've got 8 Spellcraft right now due to various enhancements and items. I still haven't spent a single skill point on Spellcraft. Delicious Vlish was right - charm spells are great, but it takes a very powerful spellcaster to charm the most powerful creations, apparently. I'm *still* using the Thahd Skin Tunic, but physical damage is starting to hurt. I may have to replace it with something that provides better protection. And in case anyone wants to know, I'm using the Girdle of Genius from Southforge Citadel. Powerful mental spells can be pretty costly. Ackrovan - I plan to make the Gloves of Savagery and Shapemaster Boots at some point. Maybe the Cloak of Shadows, too.

Originally Posted By: Slarty Why the Shock Trooper in G4 would ever rate above the Servile is beyond me. G5 is a different story, but in G4 the Shock Trooper really was an inferior class. Do remember that this was *before* I started this replay. I no longer rate the Shock Trooper above the servile. Anyway, I kind of liked the Shock Trooper - okay, maybe she wasn't teh greatest character evar, but being able to fight alongside your creations was IMO pretty fun.

Making special spells and abilities is pretty simple (although it *can* get tedious, it isn't nearly as complicated as, say, BoR) and nowhere near as buggy as it was in BoE (remember that San-Racku's special spells could turn allies against you due to an engine bug?). Now, making *good* special spells, that's another story. My current project (scheduled for mid or late 2009, 'cuz I'm slow) has enemies with special abilities, and will have at least two special spells for the player. ...And despite this, it's currently being balanced for parties that have just finished A Small Rebellion.

Thuryl : The Unstable Firebolts were pretty much the only charged creations I found to be somewhat interesting. Heavy fire damage, AP boost. Fun to make, but only occasionally. Charged Vlish aren't that good. Charged Thahds... I believe I used them on one playthrough. Shock Tralls... What's the point of Charged War Tralls? War Tralls are mostly meat shields, and even then you're usually better off with Rots. So, yeah. Charged creations were an interesting idea, but they should have been more useful.

Originally Posted By: Thuryl Presumably Jeff decided it was a good idea to get rid of charged creations because everybody hated them. When playing a Shock Trooper in GF4, I found some of the charged/unstable creations to be somewhat useful. At times. Rarely . The problem with charged creations is that they just aren't much help in battles that you can't win in a few rounds.

Well, maybe, sorta, yeah . And since some powerful creations don't really require many points in Shaping, I will probably really kick butt when I get the Shapemaster Boots. If I can successfully charm the Titan's creations at the end of the game, the Servile just might end up becoming my second-favorite class (I'm still a big Lifecrafter fan right now). EDIT : I believe part of why I found the Servile to be weak last time may have been because I wasn't nearly as careful with item management as I am now. Right now I've got 6 Spellcraft, and I've yet to spend a skill point in that category. I've just put a single point in Healing Craft, since my healing was really getting weak. Just so you know, before this replay, this was how I rated characters : 1) Lifecrafter, by far. Even newbie players shouldn't have much trouble playing this class, and there's a fairly big margin of error with how you spend your skill points. 2) Infiltrator. I focus heavily on battle magic, mental magic, and melee, and usually ignore missiles. 3) Shock Trooper. 4) Servile. Yeah, I know, I had underestimated this class. 5) Warrior. I think most people will agree that the Warrior isn't all that great.

Eh, balancing super-high-level scenarios shouldn't actually be much harder than balancing "normal" scenarios. It'd be somewhat different, but as Ackrovan said you could just rely on giving the party more powerul items and giving the monsters special abilities. Exodus shouldn't be used as an example, since there are too few high-level scenarios right now.

The Maddened Rotwhatever, the Oozing Sentinel, Nakel, Eliza, and Shaftoe are no more. And I made the Legs of the Tyrant. The first two were a joke. Channelers you know. I single-handedly defeated Nakel, since I didn't want the fight to be *too* easy. Eliza was surprisingly easy after sabotaging her power spirals. Having a Drayk for this battle proved to be quite helpful. Shaftoe required two Essence Pods to take down (hey, Dominate is a costly spell - gotta keep that golem charmed), but he wasn't too hard - I even killed him before he could use his aura attack. I fought him in melee, since his missile attacks are so powerful. I can destroy both the Imprisoned Soul and the Soultaken Twins right now, but I think I'll wait until I can afford to use fewer Essence Pods.

"One of them"? Why am I suddenly thinking of the Old Golem? Anyway, yes, ghosts are super-bad for a singleton. Much like Mystithus (I probably could have beaten him/it without abusing the engine, but it would likely have taken quite a few reloads and blessing crystals for the avoidance enhancement, and I was feeling lazy).

I'm very fond of the Shapemaster Boosts too, but they come very, very late in the game. Anyway, quick update - the Western Rise is the only Chapter 2 area I haven't fully explored. I've finished looting Moseh's Bunker. I think I'll keep the Gruesome Charm, since I gain more skill points than I lose. Cormac has been defeated, he was a total pushover. Mihzera and Mose have left the fens. I can't foresee any problems in Chapter 3 thanks to the Channelers. Killing the Forgotten One's merry band of ultra-powerful creatures is going to be painful. Don't you just hate enemies who slow you down? I think I'll take care of Shaftoe and Eliza at some point in Chapter 3, once I get stronger spells. Two interesting facts : although I fought Moseh, I told him I could repair him before he attacked, and he didn't drain me at all. After I killed Moseh, both Shaftoe and Eliza turned hostile, but not the Barrier Zone creations. Go figure.

Oh, I will, Ackrovan. I'm almost done with Chapter 2. I breezed through most of the areas, and when Daze didn't work often enough, (like against the Turabi Gate clawbugs), I just ran, went back to a friendly town, and finished off the remaining enemies. Neither the Parasitic Shade nor the Malformed Drayk were much of a challenge. I weakened both from a distance with both missiles and spells, then finished them off in melee. Moseh is now dead, he was ridiculously easy. Mind Alpha was somewhat troublesome, I'm glad the Plated Clawbugs don't attack if you're far enough away from the servant mind. I killed the Mind with Ice Spray spells, then dealt with the bugs in melee. Mystithus would have been extremely difficult had it not been for the fact that I abused the engine's flaws to prevent two of his images from appearing. For those who want to know, the weapons/spells I'm using right now are : 1) Oozing Blade (aka Munchkin Sword). 2) Venom, Acid, Submission thorns (I haven't used any submission thorns yet, but I have a feeling they're going to come in handy soon). 3) Firebolt, Burning Spray, Ice Spray, Lightning Aura, and to a lesser extent, Searer. I think I will keep my Thahd Skin Tunic until I make an artifact, like, say, the Legs of the Tyrant.

Hmm. It sounds like it hasn't always been that way. Interesting. How did Torment work in BoA? Did it increase Level too? It seemed to make the monsters' regeneration more efficient, as well as increase their hit rate and damage.

Randomizer : Wingbolts aside, the last half of the game is more about endurance battles than about killing your enemies as fast as possible. As long as my hit rate remains decent (and I can't foresee any problems with it any time soon), I'll be satisfied.

Well, I'll admit I kind of forgot most of the rest of the thread when I replied to your post. My mistake. And you're absolutely right - I think playing excellent, technically impressive scenarios is far more likely to teach you how to design well than playing buggy, unbalanced scenarios.

Whoops. I somehow managed to misread your post, Slarty. The reason why I'm using both battle magic and thrown missiles is this : variety. There is no submission bolt, and there is no lightning baton either. That said, it's not like I'm greatly increasing my battle magic skill or anything - right now I'm using the Ring of Eye's Purity, as I said before, and if necessary I will use a few other magic-boosting items. (And Vlish is right - disintegrating helpless enemies is fun).

Because Vlish said 1)I would need good sword skills and 2) he also said he likes missile weapons. Besides, fighting skills are cheap when you play as a servile. Missiles can be great, but they're just not as useful as melee in some fights (*cough*quickactionagainstwingbolts*cough*).

So. After arguing with Delicious Vlish in the GF5 forum, I decided to try to make his "omnipotent" servile. He'll be very good at mental magic, and I want him to be a decent spellcaster when it comes to battle magic and blessing magic as well. He will also need to be good at swordfighting and throwing missiles. I will only put points in Healing Craft if absolutely necessary. I will not neglect Mechanics and Leadership, but I will try not to use them too much in the hardest battles (for example, I will try to fight Moseh without having the Alphas). I will also try not to put points in any Shaping stats. Instead, if I feel I need to make a decent creation, I will use boosting items like Delicious Vlish suggested. My character will be Soulflayer. I want him to be a treacherous backstabber. He doesn't have particularly strong moral beliefs and will fight purely for the pleasure of kicking butt. He does not like Trakovites. He will side with the Shapers at first, but betray them once he reaches Moseh. I will play on Torment. Soulflayer started with 6 in Mental Magic, so as to make Daze more powerful, and spent most of Chapter 1 putting points in Leadership, Mechanics, Melee, Missile, Parry, Quick Action, as well as one more point in every primary stat. My, isn't heavy armor painful. I will sure miss my high strength from the last time I played as a combat-heavy servile. I've become addicted to the Thahd Skin Tunic. I actually dealt with Master Thell, despite siding with Crowley. I wouldn't want to miss the powerful sword, after all. I didn't have any major problems completing Chapter 1, with the exception of a few optional fights. The shaper soldiers guarding Spirefield were very tough, and the battle required quite a few reloads. I had to make a Thahd to distract my enemies and I used Greenfang for a bit of extra power. Speaking of Greenfang, I actually think he can be decent with lots of Dexterity. The two Alphas in Chickweed Bridge were quite tough, but they could actually be dazed, which allowed be to heal between hits. The battle against Shaila's creations and the one that occurs when escorting Shaila were very easy. The Runewarded Thahds weren't actually all that bad after I hit them with Venom Thorns. I did need to use a few healing pods. The spinecores should never be a major problem as long as you take out their buds from afar before engaging them. The Shaper guarding the Cairn Gates was actually pretty powerful (I actually fought him *before* finishing the Dumping Pit), so I used an item to haste myself in order to make the fight easier. I'm currently playing Chapter 2 - right now, I've got 9 Mental Magic, so that's one less problem to worry about. I also bought those two Spellcraft points from Burkes. Expensive but worth it, in my opinion. Oh, and I love the Ring of Eye's Purity. I had no problems when I fought everything that stood between me and the Illya Safehouse. So far I've won three hard battles in Chapter 2 : 1) The one against the monsters in the Purity Workshop B. I had to lure the monsters into the healing pool room so I could beat them. 2) The one against Alwan's Wingbolts. I had to make two Thahds to distract the Wingbolts, and even then it wasn't easy. I think I got a bit lucky. 3) The one against Jadetree. Once again, I had to lure the enemies into the corner of the forest path so I could pick them off. I find that depending on how you make Jadetree get mad at you, she and her bandits may or may not give you a free turn before they attack.

Thanks again. And don't worry, if my servile's adventures get interesting enough, I'll make a thread in the GF4 forum instead.

Thanks for the advice - I've started the Mental Heavy servile replay. I'm almost done with Chapter 1 - I just have to finish the Dumping Pit. Do you use missile weapons? I think they're pretty helpful right now, since my thorns and javelins hit more often than my firebolts. I haven't had any real challenge so far, with the exception of those nasty shapers guarding Spirefield. And I hate these turrets. Then again, the player isn't really supposed to attack them before the caravan quest, so I guess I was asking for it.

The former, I think. Maybe a bit of both. Seriously, I don't know what's the deal with mazes. I would probably strongly dislike a scenario where every dungeon would be a maze, but a good maze now and then? Not so much. There are ways to make mazes more interesting than mere twisting halls.