Rent-an-Ihrno

Personally, I was a little disappointed by Battle Disciplines. I had anticipated things like a Chuck Norris-roundhouse kick kind of attack skill that would damage all adjacent enemies, etc. In Avernum 1-3, I sometimes played non-magic parties for fun, but in A5, that seems absolutely impossible. Don't know about A4. What do you think? Would that be overpowering?

I know this might be a little early, but seeing how fervid the discussion about changes made to Avernum in the second trilogy is at the moment, I thought I could open a thread in which we could sort things like that out. So, what would you like to see in Avernum's future? Note that this is not supposed to be a suggestion-thread directed at Jeff, but a more general one where we can discuss our imaginations for Avernum 6 (it's plot, engine enhancements and so on) as well as technical issues we might have with the re-writing of the older Avernums. And be nice to each other!

Quote: Originally written by Tyranicus: Solberg, he helped save Avernum from Grah-Hoth 3 times (once by helping with the actual deed, twice by dispensing necessary information). He also imparted important information that led to the defeat of Garzahd. Oh, come on. Not that I don't like Solberg, but giving someone information isn't really a legendary deed, is it? As well as for the avernite generals - though many of them may have been very competent, none could actually outsmart Limoncelli or, well, do anything without the PCs. Considering all the hints and comments NPCs give you on this subject, I even think mages had more responsibility in Avernum's strategic successes than generals or captains.

I completely agree with Kelandon. Plus, I mean sheesh, has one of you guys ever tried playing A4/5 on a laptop? It's horrible.

As for PCs, I pick the A2 party as my favs, followed by the A1 party. The others should go make schnitzel. How great it would be if you could play the various Avernums (without cheating), and then merge the parties into one game/whatever and let them fight each other... or something.

there are many heroes in avernum worth mentioning, especially people like erika and bon-ihrno. while it's quite easily said who contributed how much to the independance and safety of avernum, it's really hard to determine who was the "better soul", so to speak. i don't think erika is as egocentric as many think, and that she did everything she did for the sake of vengeance. and after all, in this context there are probably countless avernum citizens and soldiers who could fill the spot, but will never find their names written in any history book. so pick whomever you want - just don't you dare choose rentar-ihrno!! (for those who don't know: my nick is an everlasting insult to that insidious woman... spineless creature)

congratulations! i'm sure you will like a2 very much very soon (isn't it a great feeling to start a new party in a new game?). plus, mung demons and basilisks are far easier to handle in the later avernums. enjoy!

yeah, there definately are rougher places than highground in avernum. however, i actually don't see the controversy - when i make a new party, i always decide upon whether to be good or evil, aggressive or cautious, etc. i give my characters an identity, and then stick to it when i play. isn't it one of the fun aspects about games that you can choose to be evil? in real life, i wouldn't kill the drake, of course, and when i decide to play a "good" party, i don't. but wow i mean hell, if you actually can't make yourself breaking your moral values in the virtual, absolutely inexistant world of avernum, then i don't know... same thing with the geas. who cares about the anama or solberg? get gladwells rewards, and then kill him and loot his tower! yaay!

interesting, most people who say things like that played geneforge or avernum 4/5 previous to the older ones. i think it would just take you some time to get into a1-3. seriously, the simpler graphics are very pleasing to one who wants to focus on the plot and the atmosphere and everything. but then, what i meant saying i want the a3/boa engine back, was not that i prefer the graphics so much, but because i prefer the interface, the way you move etc. and theres another point. how in the world can you say moving/interacting is easier after a4?? i can barely stand walking in a5. actually, thats my main problem with the new trilogy as well as geneforge. doubtless, the insanely great fighting system of a5, the sound and many other new aspects would be a great improvement. but heck, i just love a1-3. oh, and i miss health bars!

sorry, i haven't checked on this thread for a while. i'm not sure about what level of intelligence you need for having an effective protection against dumbfounding, but i'll take a look at my savegames when i have a chance. maybe one of the know-it-all members around here knows the exact procentage of resistance intelligence brings. but besides, luck is more useful in this context, especially regarding the lower skill cost. i just think intelligence is a nice addition as you don't depend on your luck so much.

what i'd enjoy the most is playing avernum 1-6 with a uniform, avernum 3-based engine. that would be really, really great. not that a5 wasn't a big step forward from a4, and i bet a6 will be even better, but still, i miss the a3-engine. all the money i have for the one who makes a1-6 boa scenarios! with some exile-features, mabe... imagine being able to throwing some quickfire into hawthorne's throne room and then creating a barrier to protect yourself... the possibilities... im drooling what was this thread about again?

is it possible that you sympathize with the darkside loyalists, tullegolar? seriously, why does everybody have such a hard time doing immoral things in games? there's no "innocent" fraction left in avernum, anyway... actually, i kind of miss the feeling from avernum 1-3, where you knew you are on the right side... though the new atmosphere is more realistic, of course.

investing 1 point in priest skill is definately good for fighters, as that enables them to bless themselves and attract dumbfounding rays, but please - they can never accumulate enough skill points to be able to cast any spells worth using, so dont spend any more points in priest and (especially) mage skill. beside everything already said, intelligence is a good help against dumbfounding and the like. it requires a high level, but eventually you'll become resistant against most mind blows. edit: typo. oh, and i forgot to point out one thing - you'll never learn any spell worth using because soon after the beginning, divine restoration is the only usable healing spell, and has a far too high skill requirement for fighters, as well as divine fire and cloud of blades. at that point, the lower spells are all useless except for blessing.

There are definately just 2 bags of sugar in A2, as I recall. About when any of the supply quests are completed, I have no idea, however, as I have always ignored those. Also, I'm not sure about the tome from Garzahds tower, but to complete the "find Empire Portal" quest, you need to learn its location from the Empire Archives; finding it yourself won't do. -- Oops, I just noticed this is a revived thread. I hope posting this won't give me bad karma or something (after all, I spent like a minute to write all this).

Oh! I know that quest, but never bothered accepting it. I guess I don't like the idea of my own custom-made heroes should run petty courier routes. That explains everything, thanks!

During my last playthrough which I finished yesterday, I encountered a forest filled with gremlins and gorgons in eastern Karnold province. If you beat these, you get to some patches of so-called "savory herbs". They don't appear to be used in any potion, and I can't find anyone who wants them. What are they there for?

I agree with kkarski in every point. Though I still prefer the original version of Avernum, the new one has improved enough to have its own quality. I'm looking forward to getting the full version. If I was to add some criticism though, I'd like to say that one thing that bothers me about the environment is that walls etc. now consume a whole square, instead of squeezing between two squares. I think that really makes a big difference. Anyhow - A5 is great. Especially the battles are much more fun now! Good work, Jeff, and thanks! @Henrik: Tjena!

You can always use the "Reset hostile towns"-function in the character editor to revive any killed residents. If you don't want to that for some reason, well, he isn't really an important character, so who cares.

For all kinds of strong long-range units, I've found that blessing/hasting yourself before attacking makes the whole difference. Save as often as you can, and when you know you're standing a couple of steps before eyebeasts f.ex., haste yourself and take out the strongest ones at once. Fire is best vs. eyebeasts. Against the archers, you really should invest in hardiness. Defense only reduces your chance of being hit. You don't need to get back to the Vahnatai lands to gain experience, btw, there are plenty of good places for that in Avernum. Just don't be hasty.

I'm having the same difficulty with equipping stuff. For me, only one thing has worked against it: clicking harder, faster and shorter, lifting your thumb (or whatever finger you use to click with) before you do it. Just pressing a finger that is already lying on the mouse seems to more easily cause a click so slow the game considers it a double-click.

I wouldn't mind more character graphics at all, especially not such ones showing the reaction of attacked characters. I agree with Student of Trinity though, as I think that things you see the most should be the first to be improved, such as the ground you're walking on. Different kinds of rock would be nice.

Phew, I meant no offense. Geez. Is it a crime to enjoy having to figure things out?

Has there been any announcement concerning the fighting/thinking-balance in A5 so far? I would be so disappointed if A5 would drift even more to the hacking&slashing-direction. What happened to riddles, mysteries and the general necessity of having a brain?

Of everything I've read about A5 so far, I think I might be able to forgive Jeff the new graphics and buy it. Though I don't find a Bugslayer-kinda weapon necessary, I'm looking forward to not stumbling over chitrachs every five steps or so. The only thing I found worse than them were the demons in A1-2 (haven't really played A4), who seemed to really enjoy standing about a screen away from each other, so you had to keep starting and ending combat mode a thousand times, being shot at from everywhere by foes you couldn't see. That sucked. And yes, that was meant to suggest: please don't let them do it in A5.

phew. that was my first post in this forum for a long time, and ive already drawn the attention of the i-am-the-best-poster-brigade. i really dont want to get into flaming, so just read my post again - more carefully this time. im sure that would make you rethink your reply. however. ill keep out of the solberg-discussion, since i havent made up my own mind about that yet. but there is one thing that i would like to have in a5: structured quest lists. for example, there could be a section for unending quests ("xxx will pay you for any zzz you bring him"), or for major and minor quests... you know? or show them on a kind of 'quest map'. or what about 'progress indicators'. and stuff. nothing too fancy, just whats useful. you get the idea.