alhoon

Blood poison in GF3 I got from killing a weirdo Artilla.

Well, Shaping a Drakon is by far forbidden. Perhaps a few Shapers can do it but what you say seem to be the vastly more common occurrence then. Meaning that the great majority of (or perhaps all) Shapers cannot shape Drakon parts and the "creating parts" thing is only possible for specific creations like golems and batons after decades of research. But are you sure? I don't recall that but it's not that I have memorized the recipe books... Well, someone tried to put a better brain in an ornk and in 2 full playthroughs of GF5 I have not managed to find that ornk after it left!

Another thing that supports that Shapers can and do Shape parts of creatures: Living tools, Batons, machinery and Golems all have living stuff and mechanical stuff. In GF3 the lore says that the living components of a Golem are Shaped first, left in a vat for months to grow under careful watch and them bound to the inorganic material. In various other parts it mentions how Batons are a creature that is merged later with iron and stone to make a baton. All in all, I think that based on the above we can surmise that Shapers through trial and error and lots of work could make directly Glaahk eyes and the like but since creating a Glaahk is easier and faster they opt to go for that route usually. I would also dare to assume that since Drakons are such a pain to be Shaped, Shapers probably Shape Drakon scales (or things with similar properties for wands and rings) directly without creating a Drakon first but that's just what I think would make sense.

OK, I think I found a solution to the items not giving strength to creations problem. I'll mod the items that give strength bonus to creations, so that they would give directly levels on damage and attack. EDIT: I made the mod. Here is the link if anyone is interested Aside of changing strength bonuses to creations (that doesn't work) to extra damage dice and to hit increases this mod makes Alwan slightly better by giving him +2 Action Points and after the first blade upgrade, a slight increase in damage. To install: Simply unzip the folder inside the Geneforge 3 Folder and allow the program to overwrite the 2 files required. Since there are only 4 possible stats an item can affect, items (like Shapers boon) that give bonuses to all stats give bonuses to attack, to damage, to dexterity and intelligence but not in endurance. To compensate for the lack of those endurance points, these items give increased dexterity bonuses to make creations be hit a little less (so be more durable). I.e. Shaper's Boon now gives +1 level to hit, +1 dice of damage, +2 dex and +1 intelligence.

Actually, a hole to the heart would be easier to heal I would think with direct application of magic. It's like closing the wound fast and efficiently. Alwan was half-dead for some time and paralyzed. He had to have a Fyora pull him and he was sustaining himself with healing IIRC.

You both keep saying "Early Shaping" but that's what the Shapers are still doing by the time of GF5. They just have more formulas for what works. If by design or accident they make something useful, they evaluate it and then send it to the Foundry for further evaluation. I think I've read in more than one games that their method of research is still "bombard it with magic to see if it changes beneficially and keep track of the changes" or "make small alterations and see what happens". Take the Kyshaaks for example. The load-screen texts tell us they are unstable and prone to blow up. I guess those blow-up Roamers and Kyshaaks are half-done. For Kyshaaks especially I think the Shapers would improve them in future generations. Kyshaaks are like generation 2 while Clawbacks and Alphas are several iterations further down the road. Even in the detail-light geneforge games half the labs or castles I go to, mention that the Shapers use those blast doors and open areas around cores etc to isolate problems when those experiments go bad. In GF3 there is a merchant in a city that tells you "Very few researchers die in their sleep" alluding that most die by accidents.

Tested it. It works.

I would say that closing a hole in the heart in an instant, made by a tool specifically engineered to kill you if it is retrieved is not the same problem as attaching an arm. Still, what you mentioned, the Shapers healing heart-holes without much ethical problems adds to the Alwan's life support machine to make me think that they would allow partial-shaping to help a maimed person. I think that Battle Beta legs would be very controversial, but perhaps a human\servile leg would be acceptable. PS. A non-shaper made the salve. We can't know if a good Shaper could cure the disease. In GF2, the Awakened are fighting off a disease I think with spores and magic.

I would respectfully disagree. The Shapers are using magic combined with a good understanding in biology. Modern medicine is nowhere close to creating Serviles or battle betas but the Shapers can do it within moments and the creation is usually loyal on the moment of creation, bound by the Shaper's will (except Drayks and other barred creations). That's not something that modern medicine can replicate. As such I would say the Shapers are far more advanced in "medicine" even if they have worse understanding of the human body and its complexity. You say that modern medicine cannot deal with dementia or Parkinson's and it is true. But modern medicine also cannot bring back someone from death's door from sword wounds to full health, without permanent problems, within moments. Shapers are also said to have created diseases, even magical diseases by accident or for bio-attacks using their magic, without understanding how bacteria and viruses etc work. And they can cure normal stuff with a wave of the hand (cure affliction and the like). For some weird magical diseases like the one in GF3 that may be resistant to their cure affliction spells, they create magic potions (or it was just a healing remedy that works?). However, you have a point on "when they need a Glaahk eye, they shape the Glaahk and take out its eye". So I would agree they would not be able to create a human arm... easily. And yet... Shaftoe had Shaped 4 brains of himself to assist him, and had them outside his body. Even if he used just a tiny part of himself to create those minds, they were connected to him symbiotically. As such, Shapers do have the knowledge to create "adaptable parts" at least. What I mean is that a Shaper probably could shape a Glaahk and then attach the Glaahk's eye on himself. Or similar to Shaftoe, create a bunch of eyes symbiotically connected to him even from a distance passing him information like biological security cameras. Shaftoe, a Guardian, managed to do it within a short time after all. As such, I think that shapers could create eyes and limbs if they wanted. But what Shaftoe did was illegal and tolerated because Alwan loves controversial stuff and Shaftoe more or less expected to face trouble for turning himself to a monster. (I think in GF3 they shaped a Glaahk because it takes a few seconds \ minutes to Shape a Glaahk if you know how while learning to Shape a Glaahk's eye by itself with the correct properties would take research and time) So the question about limbs would become: Since some Shapers at least can Shape limbs (not necessarily humanoid), would attaching such limbs be illegal? I am 100% sure that changing your legs with powerful Battle Beta's legs would be illegal. But Shaping a human\Servile arm for a Guardian that missed it? Controversial certainly, perhaps illegal.

I really doubt they can afford 100K$. Ehh... perhaps a good programmer from a less expensive country? I think that some software developers are finding talent in Asia to do that stuff. I once saw an ad from an indie game company asking people to do a bit of freelancing for them for 300$ per month or something, for ~50-100 hours per month. I think they got a lot of people to show interest. I don't know if those applying actually had the qualifications but the company later said they were very pleased by the interest shown.

Well, if I knew the answer I wouldn't be asking...

So, I was thinking. If a Shaper was losing his eyesight due to age, cataract etc. If he "Shaped the cataract away" is it considered self-shaping to give himself better vision? Or healing? How about a Guardian that has lost an eye and shapes a new one in its place? If a Shaper was growing senile (brain cells dying etc) and had his age "healed" from the rigors of old age, is it considered "Cheating"? How about someone that has lost a limb and a Shaper shaping a new one in a vat and attaching it? I think it would go by case and that it would be controversial personally. While healing cataract with Shaping would probably be OK, I think a few purists would consider it a bit far fetched as a means to stave off the effects of old age. I can recall in the series Shapers that didn't see very well or were starting to become senile. Alwan was using Shaping to keep his failing body alive but Alwan was always skirting the line (working extensively with Geneforged \ Self-shaped individuals, using Spawners and other creations that can Shape etc). Moseh, Elizah and Shaftoe were illegally Shaped and they knew they would face consequences for their transformations even if the Shapers were overlooking that at the time.

I really don't think Spider Games make enough money to expand and hire extra help just for the remake of games. The price you see should take into account that steam takes a bite, taxes take a bite etc. If Spiderweb games makes 2$ per game I will be surprised. A part timer for software assistance would get probably ~10-15$ per hour or 10K$-15K$ per year. The resale of the games should give the developer some money and cover those fees. I.e. if they hire a part-timer, I believe they would need to sell 5000-10000 more copies at full price to cover his or her salary.

For a Shaper I think speed GF5 is very good. I had 2 or so creation getting an extra attack each turn with a single casting. Mass energize is very powerful in GF3-4.

It affects everyone though; as a Shaper I found GF5 speed to my liking and was casting it often. It is certainly not garbage.

I personally prefer to go Fire\magic. The creations I like are (in no specific order): Cryora, drayk, drakon, clawbug, GF5 wartrall, Vlish, Wingbolt, Gazer. Keep in mind that even with a Shaper (on normal, I never do torment), I suboptimally don't dunk too many skill points in Shaping skills. I grab items and artifacts that boost Shaping skills and wear them when I shape something.

I didn't play on torment but my poor Shaper had like 50-60 hp.

Wingbolts in GF4... The first creation I ever had that went rogue on me. I didn't even know what happened at the time. The Wingbolt was getting a beating, sure. I saw the weird bubble, I didn't know what it meant and... my Shaper went down like a tower in the sand.

I thought the steam version was fixed...

From GF5 map, I would think GF2 area would be one or at most two open-air zones in GF5.

Well, I thought we have all agreed that GF gameplay doesn't really reflect the story. In GF5, the top soldiers of the starting areas are a drop in the water compared to the soldiers of Derra reaches. Same for the random bandits. Some things are done for game balance. If I may, the lore of Geneforge is rich and obscure. We never learn "fluff" stuff like how big Terrestia actually is and we have to surmise it from discussions here and there. How many people live on it, how many Shapers or how many Drakons etc. We don't learn about the previous rebellions as the Shapers keep them secret, whether "Lords" like Lord Rahul are common and not mentioned or he's just an one-of-a-kind exarch-kind because the Ashen Isles are so far from the mainland, and stuff like that.

I would be very surprised if he was. On the other hand, the Shapers know their biology. If he was from a good family of strong and loyal people etc, he could have been eating protein day and night from young age, with exercises etc to become as massive for him to serve as a soldier or guardian. From story perspective, she was quite formidable. Not close to a veteran or a serious shaper, but still head and shoulders above how you are after you use the Geneforge. She escaped confinement, managed to set up her base and made machines etc too. All in all, she became as troublesome as a bandit leader with a moderate gang. And that with a touch of a pool. Regardless, the Geneforge in GF4 had the purpose to short-circuit a few years of intense study. Land you at the level of a Shaper apprentice before the test to become prospective. It didn't seem to have the purpose to make you equal to a Shaper with 10 years of service and training under his or her belt. That would have been too reckless for the human side of the Rebellion (Drakons have a very different opinion about that though). Anyway, using the "tame" Geneforge of GF4, Some people die, some people turn mad and some make it. But we're talking about grabbing farmers here and turning them to Shaper apprentices. That was (I think) what Southforge GF was made for.

About the female Guardian etc, Rawal has no problem Shaping people directly without the Geneforge. The guys he sends to meet you here and there are Shaped but they can't Shape except that one Servile on the mountains. However the female Guardian trained on her own, passed the tests despite the illegal changes Rawal did to her and then kept on training and learning the normal way. We can't simply say "Ohh, Rawal's Geneforge made a full fledged Guardian!" The GF4 geneforge made Shaila to something great even if broken. The purpose of the GF4 geneforge was to create lifecrafters that would have a lower chance to go crazy and if they did, they would be containable. The GF in Geneforge 4 is weaker than Lankan's Canister to bring the discussion back in GF3.

I have made a mod that makes melee attacks stronger for everyone in the past for GF3-5. I need to fish it out from somewhere. Never really cared for melee combat personally, so I didn't use this mod aside of testing it. EDIT: Here it is

Damn, you're right... Alwan is like a leveled up Thahd. Not a Battle Alpha, a Thahd. At least Greta is like a powered-up Artila. Gameman, should we look forward to perfected batons in GF3? Or a Perfected batons \ Alwan mod?