Garrulous Glaahk AethirWeb Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 Blades of Avernum II, so ikinda think the current engine is kinda crappy as it uses the first trilogy's engine and it was really difficult for me to use cause it seem to be all drag mouse, did you know I actually lost track of time trying to open a door and found o wasted an hour of my life? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyshakk Koan Karoka Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 FACT: It's actually 63 words. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnificent Ornk Student of Trinity Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 The problem is that games today have become more technically demanding. Jeff himself has kept up, kind of, inasmuch as he stays only a few years behind the mainstream. But he has been tinkering with his game engines for years, now. A system that can make games like his, without the user needing to have his experience in tinkering, would be really, really hard to build. Jeff has been through this before, and Spiderweb barely survived. Blades of Exile was quite successful, in large part because the simple 2D graphics and stuff could be done fairly simply. So the technical mess was mild, and customers could happily get into the fun stuff of game design. Blades of Avernum was already something of a nightmare. It took Jeff a lot of time to make, I understand it's frustratingly buggy, and even apart from the bugs it's much harder for a user to just get into it and get going making their own games. There's a lot of boring stuff you have to fuss with. Presumably because of this, BoA sold quite poorly. Jeff swore, Never again. Geneforge and the new Averna are considerably more complex as game engines than old Avernum was. It would take a much bigger company than Spiderweb to pull of a user-friendly game designing tool that could produce games based on those engines. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Well-Actually War Trall Niemand Posted September 2, 2011 Share Posted September 2, 2011 Originally Posted By: AethirWeb Blades of Avernum II Jeff has sworn never to make it. Originally Posted By: AethirWeb so ikinda think the current engine is kinda crappy as it uses the first trilogy's engine Some of us like the older engine! It does, however, have it's (noticeable) failings. Originally Posted By: AethirWeb it was really difficult for me to use cause it seem to be all drag mouse, did you know I actually lost track of time trying to open a door and found o wasted an hour of my life? I have no idea what you mean by something 'being drag mouse', but that engine does have a much more keyboard-oriented user interface (which is one of the things I like best about it). As for doors being a problem, now that you point it out I do see that there's nothing inherently obvious about it, and when I first played A2 it took me a similar length of time to figure out how to hit enemies in combat (when I finally read the manual the information turned out to be clearly stated). Doors, oddly, I figured out without noticing I'd done so. EDIT: Originally Posted By: Student of Trinity Blades of Avernum was already something of a nightmare. It took Jeff a lot of time to make, I understand it's frustratingly buggy, and even apart from the bugs it's much harder for a user to just get into it and get going making their own games. There's a lot of boring stuff you have to fuss with. Presumably because of this, BoA sold quite poorly. Jeff swore, Never again. I would argue that it's not actually very buggy. The main source of frustration is the the game engine hints tantalizingly at how, with just a small amount of extension, it could do so much more. Jeff simply couldn't sink anymore time into it than he already had, I suspect, so it ended up with some possible features being left just out of reach. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Easygoing Eyebeast Dintiradan Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 Originally Posted By: Niemand The main source of frustration is the the game engine hints tantalizingly at how, with just a small amount of extension, it could do so much more. Jeff simply couldn't sink anymore time into it than he already had, I suspect, so it ended up with some possible features being left just out of reach. This. The system is too complicated for non-technical users, and is not sophisticated enough technical users. I can empathize with Jeff though; eventually, you have to ship, and it's not clear that BoA would have had a greater following if it had been improved. I'm hoping he'll open BoA once he rereleases the first Avernum trilogy, the way he opened BoE once the second trilogy came out. He may not want to waste any more time on it, but he does seem to want his games always playable on the latest machines, and opening the source would be the easiest way of doing that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Lilith Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 Originally Posted By: Niemand I would argue that it's not actually very buggy. The main source of frustration is the the game engine hints tantalizingly at how, with just a small amount of extension, it could do so much more. Jeff simply couldn't sink anymore time into it than he already had, I suspect, so it ended up with some possible features being left just out of reach. Also, Blades of Exile was quite buggy too, probably more so than BoA was, so that can't have been the main sticking point for BoA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Easygoing Eyebeast Enraged Slith Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 It's not all that tough to figure out the scenario editor if you put a few hours into it. I just wish he'd open BoA while we still have talented programmers willing to work on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrulous Glaahk AethirWeb Posted September 3, 2011 Author Share Posted September 3, 2011 Aww...The Movement in the Avernum engine is horribly difficult, I keep ramming into walls and jump off cliffs by accident. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Understated Ur-Drakon Callie Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 That might be a problem if you're using a mouse, but I never had any movement problems while using the keypad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Understated Ur-Drakon Sudanna Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 Isn't there a prompt when you try and jump off of a cliff? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Easygoing Eyebeast Dintiradan Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 Yes, the early Avernum games are meant to be played with the keypad. If you're used to the mouse from the later games, using the keypad might be awkward for the first five minutes. But trust me, once you go pad, you never go... bad? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rotghroth Rhapsody Duck in a Top Hat Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 I agree, Blades of Avernum II would be great, but think of all the extra work it would be for designers to make good scenarios with the new engine. For instance, the new creature graphics sheets all contain frame upon frame of painstaking 3D animations that would be near impossible for designers to recreate in custom graphics. Custom graphics would be slow to make and would never fit in with the quality of the default graphics. What we really need is BoA to go open-source so we can finally fix all of the game's bugs and other flaws. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Easygoing Eyebeast Jerakeen Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 Quote: Isn't there a prompt when you try and jump off of a cliff? Yes. Unless you are in the habit of blindly clicking on "Yes" without reading the question, accidentally jumping off a cliff would be very hard to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrulous Glaahk AethirWeb Posted September 4, 2011 Author Share Posted September 4, 2011 Odd, when I used a keyboard it didn't respond. Same as some flash games on the Internet, iq this connected as a problem?? Or is it coincidence Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Easygoing Eyebeast Dintiradan Posted September 4, 2011 Share Posted September 4, 2011 Does BoA not recognize any keypress (click i and see if your inventory appears on the bottom left; click a and see if the automap appears on the bottom left)? If it's just a problem with the keypad, check to see if the NumLock light on your keyboard turned on. If it isn't, press the NumLock key. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unflappable Drayk ĐªгŦĦ Єяŋϊε Posted September 4, 2011 Share Posted September 4, 2011 Originally Posted By: AethirWeb Aww...The Movement in the Avernum engine is horribly difficult, I keep ramming into walls and jump off cliffs by accident. there are doctors for that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ineffable Wingbolt Tirien Posted September 5, 2011 Share Posted September 5, 2011 But ramming into walls his how you find seeecrets! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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