A6 - Starting Over

[Californian]

So here I am starting over due to a hard disc crash that wiped out my game (I saved a good 95% of my stuff, but A6 was in the lost five percent. The good news is that I got a new hard disc of 1TB capacity and an updated OS for $200, instead of having to buy a whole new computer.) Fortunately I always buy Jeff's CDs, so I'm fine. Also, I'll be starting over with 1.0.3.

 

And there I was, approaching the endgame.

 

But this gives me a chance to do things better. So I have a few questions.

 

In creating a party, I know it's a matter of taste, but clearly I need a tank (human?) and a slith. I'm thinking I'll make my magic users nephils this time. Obviously I'll go with Elite Warrior, Pure Spirit and Natural Mage, but is it better to give a penalty trait, such as Brittle Bones, to get a 0% experience penalty, OR is it better to go with Divinely Touched for everyone and take the penalty?

 

Also, to Gladwell or not to Gladwell? I decided not to Gladwell the first time, but I'm wondering if I'm missing a lot of fun. I want to discover as many different endings to the game as possible (no spoilers, please!), and I intend to play the game several times in several ways. Do you masters think it's more fun to go Gladwell?

 

So, human tank or slith tank (or nephil)?

Divinely Touched or Brittle Bones?

Gladwell or not?

 

I know it's all down to opinion, but I trust the opinions of the masters on this forum!

 

Thanks! I won't be starting the game again for a few days yet, so I'll collect your comments!

[Jerakeen]

Slith tank, Divinely Touched. You will level up a bit slower at first, but it pretty much evens out as you go, since XP rewards are adjusted according to your level.

 

As for Gladwell, it's a matter of taste. I'm doing my first Gladwell play-through now, so I'll withhold comment for now, except to say that the rewards are nice but not game-changing.

[Randomizer]

You can always save near the end and go back to do Gladwell's quests real quickly to see the change. It means you don't have some nice items and spells earlier in the game, but it won't matter too much.

 

Ever since Avernum 4 it no longer pays to take disadvantage traits to get more experience. You just plateau sooner in getting less experience.

[Californian]

That's good advice! Thanks!

 

So then, two slith fighters and two nephil spellcasters. Stupid humans. No extra skills.

 

Yeah, I was holding off on Gladwell for the first play-through (so rudely interrupted) with the idea that I could always go back and do his quests at the end. I'll probably do the same thing this time. I like to stay pure, mostly.

 

Although I do intend to murder the Vahnatai. Just to see what happens. I can always save and reload.

 

Um, one other question I've never bothered to test out. Which do you guys think is better, enchanter robes or magus vests? Or is there an advantage at all? I've often wondered.

 

Thanks!

[Randomizer]

It depends upon what bonuses you need at the end. There was only one Magus vest and by that time you should have found better armor. Enchanter robes are found earlier in the game so use them when you get them.

[Californian]

Yeah, as I recall from my first (attempted) play-through, I sold the Magus Vest when I got it. Must have had something better by then.

 

It'll be a few days before I start again, but this advice gives me a much stronger party, and probably less frustration.

 

Although, I'm rather proud that I did so well before with a weaker party. There is a reason for taking those disadvantageous traits. Might try a game sometime with all my characters suffering from "frail" and "brittle bones" or "sluggish." That would be a challenge! I'd do it on "normal," however.

 

Any of you masters ever tried a deliberately weak party, or singleton, on torment?

[Student of Trinity]

I'm a notch or two in the 'casual' direction down from 'master', but I did try a Torment singleton. It had a few painfully difficult stretches, and a few stretches that really weren't too bad; then near the end it became really annoyingly hard. Perhaps I made some bad build choices, probably got too used to relying on charming, probably didn't have enough Parry or Endurance. Anyway, fortunately for my struggling singleton, at that point he discovered the amazing lost artifact that raised all his stats to 30. He had no trouble finishing the game after that.

[Failedassassin]

Oh yes, the magical artifact. I believe it is called "Ch'eets" or some other word in an ancient otherworldly tongue.

[Californian]

BTW, just what's the difference between Normal and Torment anyway? Are the baddies stronger, with their stats bumped up, or is the game made more difficult in some other way?

[Dikiyoba]

Originally Posted By: Californian

Are the baddies stronger, with their stats bumped up

This. They will hit harder, have a greater chance to hit you, have more HP, and evade more of your attacks.

Dikiyoba.

[Randomizer]

I tried a singleton on torment and had the same problems as SoT before reaching Formello. I restarted, but haven't had time to really play it.

 

The last time I used disadvantages was Nethergate: Resurrection which used the old BoA game engine. There it really boosts experience so you can negate most of the bad effects.

[Student of Trinity]

I got quite far in the game as a singleton with the only cheat being to have edited up my Lore and Tool Use stats from the very beginning. I just didn't want to play a challenge game about trying to dig holes and open locks. And the game was quite hard enough without having to invest skill points in these skills. I also avoided the more brutal forms of engine abuse, like ending combat in the middle of battle just to heal up.

 

Click to reveal..

I struggled along okay up to the quest from the Vahnatai to go and rub out the Rentar Ihrno cultists. I took time to clear the Occupied Lands almost completely, leaving only the invincible armies around Formello, the ever-spawning guards in Formello itself, and that one crazy invincible slith warrior dude in the far southeast. I got the slave camps, I got the Fungus Lord. I had also cleared out the whole above ground part of the Training Grounds, except for the clutch of lightning crawlers or whatever they were in the northeast. And I'd done some of the underground areas there, though the Salamander Queen was definitely too much. I also cleared the giant lands, and the alchemy lab full of exploding slimes and things, and entered Fort Monastery.

 

My memory may be fuzzy, but I'm pretty sure I had also done Fort Draco. I definitely remember having a terrible fight at Fort Monastery, but I don't clearly remember whether I achieved victory before I cheated all my stats up, or gave up after many failed saveloads and only succeeded later. There were that many saveloads, that the memory of victory has been blurred out by all the memories of failure. If I did succeed before I cheated, I definitely had to use a lot of invulnerability potions. Or it may be that it was in this phase that I started cheating with 'healmenow' and 'leetbuffz' before finally giving up completely.

 

The last Rentar cultist boss was really what did it for me, simply because there was such a long, tedious phase of fighting summons, before the boss would even become vulnerable. Then the boss had some random attack that did enormous damage, and would one-shot me after a few promising rounds of finally going toe-to-toe with him. And to try again with a different strategy was requiring starting over right from the beginning. I probably could have ended combat just to save after unlocking him, but at this point it just wasn't fun any more. But I was far enough along, and frustrated enough, that toasting everything left in the game with a god character actually was fun.

[Californian]

Well guys, just to get you up to date (I found I couldn't wait another few days to restart the game. I started.)

 

I think you're right about having two advantageous traits even with the experience penalty. Yeah, I got a bit frustrated with the slow leveling up at first, but now that I've reached levels 11 and 12 it's smoothing out nicely.

 

I'm down at the Great Portal now, ready for the action there. I'm having loads of fun with my semi-replay.

 

But this raises another question. I've often wondered why the characters level up at different rates. My spellcasters always go higher than my fighters, yet the whole party is supposedly getting XP at the same time. Why is that?

[Mod.]

Characters level up at different rates based on their race and chosen traits. Also, if I remember correctly, the character who kills the enemy gains a majority of the experience. I might just be making that last part up though.

[Randomizer]

Plus there is a slight random element in awarding experience even for quests. I saw that when I had to reload after doing a collection quest and one character just leveled up the first time and was a point shy the second time.

[waterplant]

And if a character is unconscious then obviously no xp is awarded to that PC for the rest of that battle. This causes disparity if one of the party is out of action when a boss goes down and the rest of the party gain a little extra.

[Student of Trinity]

For some reason now I'm picturing a party of four where the fourth character is lagging the rest by some 20 levels, having been unconscious for most of the game. Sort of a stoner character, who just kind of comes around occasionally to ask what's up, and whether there's any pizza left, before nodding off again.

[waterplant]

Or being continually knocked out by his own party for being too annoying - eating the entire skribbane stash does that too you...

[Student of Trinity]

Heh. That would do it, too.

 

My parties have all carried around huge piles of skribbane, but never used it.

 

Honest. We didn't inhale.