The Reverend

I've made more progress on my Torment playthrough with Anama rules (see the first post in this topic for the rules I came up with). They also need to generally adhere to behaving as good Anamites (Anamians?). This came up when deciding what to do with Drath's Spellbook (see below).

 

This will probably be my penultimate update, since all that is left is the three final quests (and I've done all the prep work/pre-quests/finding items for all three). The reason the level jumped so much between the last update and this one is that I saved all my wisdom crystals/mandrake for right before the final quests, since their experience grants don't scale down with level (or at least not nearly as much as other sources). So, I got my characters to almost level 32 after finishing the non-final quest portions of the game, and then used all my crystals, bumping them all up to level 35.

 

Level 35 Update - Ready for the final quests

 

Since the last update, Brutus et al have continued to travel the Underworld, spreading the word of the Anama and saving the people of Avernum from the evils of magic. After a quick detour to get rid of the annoying Lord Chuckles, they took out nasty Pyrog and his giant helpers. Upon studying his spell book they discovered it was predominantly priestly rituals, so they handed it to their friends in the Freehold, and were rewarded with some excellent training discounts. They next went after Drath so that they could retrieve the last piece of Demonslayer, and use it to take out the Adze-Haakai in the Tower Magi (once again, those mages getting themselves into trouble that they need priests to save them from). They made quick work of Drath (he's not so bad if you are level 29 when you take him on).

 

They retrieved the final piece of Demonslayer from Drath, but were not sure what to do with his spellbook. They didn't dare to read it, since they could feel that it was full of the worst kind of magic. They also didn't want to tempt their friends (Avernum and the Freehold) with such evil magic, and they clearly didn't want their sworn Empire enemies to have access to it. However, the rewards offered for it were quite tempting (and would be quite useful to their quests). Ultimately they decided to play a little trickery on the Empire (after what they did to their brethren on the surface, they had no moral qualms about this). They gave Thantria the book, and she placed it in her room and retrieved an excellent set of armor as their reward. After accepting the reward, they attempted to enter her room to destroy the book before she could send it up. Thantria objected strenuously and attacked them, so they took her out, looted her room, and destroyed Drath's book (stabbing it repeatedly with Demonslayer was quite effective at exorcising the demons that inhabited its pages). They had realized that they would likely have to take out Thantria eventually anyways as part of their secondary mission to rid Avernum of Empire influence (they felt this was necessary in order to allow the Anama to truly flourish in Avernum).

 

After taking out Pyrog, Drath, and Thantria, our heroes rid the Tower of the Adze-Haakai, and then wandered around a bit more cleaning up the rest of their quest list (except for a couple things they disagreed with, like driving away Kyass). At this point they were all close to level 32. They then used their accumulated wisdom crystals and herbs to bump themselves up to level 35 (as mentioned earlier).

 

If you'll recall from our last update, Brutus and Cecilia were interested in staying in Avernum, starting a family (the heroes of my future Anama playthrough of the forthcoming A:CS remake have to come from somewhere!), and helping the fledging Underworld Anama movement get off the ground. Thus their primary interest is in getting rid of Grah-Hoth. Fred and Mini, on the other hand, want to return to the surface to assist the surface Anama in their struggles against the Empire. So they are interested in finding the exit and in assassinating Hawthorne. They have all agreed to help each other, and Brutus and Cecilia have agreed to do the exit quest first in exchange for Fred and Mini marrying them on the surface (they want to get married as soon as they can so that they can at least have that in case they don't survive Grah-Hoth or Hawthorne).

 

Party builds

 

Since the last update, I've concentrated on survivability. In particular, with the Torment penalty to resistance, I've convinced myself that endurance is more important than on lower levels (since your damage resistance maxes out at 60% instead of 90%). So, as you'll see below, all of the characters (and especially Brutus) have had nice bumps to their endurance. I was made more confident in doing this (and thus not putting many of these last points in attack stats) by noting RaustBlackDragon's success on Torment with an even lower investment in primary attack stats than what I already had for all of my characters.

 

Brother Brutus

 

Strength: 35 (+ 6 from traits and items)

Dexterity: 11

Intelligence: 10

Endurance: 20 (+ 7 from traits)

 

Melee: 12

Hardiness: 12 (+ 1 from items)

Parry: 12

Blademaster: 8

Quick Action: 2 (+ 3 from items)

Dual Wielding: 1

Lethal Blow: 2

Bows: 2

Thrown Missiles: 2

Gymnastics: 2 (+ 4 from items)

 

Priest Spells: 8

Spellcraft: 10

Resistance: 12

Arcane Lore: 2

First Aid: 1 (+ 2 from items)

Cave Lore: 4

 

HP: 372

Energy: 255

 

Armor: 82

Magic: 79

Fire: 83

Cold: 79

Poison: 88

Acid: 90

Mental: 70

Curse: 36

 

Traits: Improve Strength x 3, Improve Endurance x 5, Mighty Blows, Parry Mastery x 2, Ambidextrous, Good Health, Robust Health, Perfect Health, Negotiator

 

Brutus is the party's main tank, with lots of points in hardiness and resistance and high hit points. He's also added quite a bit of endurance since the last update. This has been a party-wide trend, as mentioned earlier, but Brutus as the main tank has taken it even further - all 5 of his stat point increases since the last update, plus his two traits, have gone into endurance. He's become virtually invincible. He remains a decent healer, and now that he has his mental resistance up a bit higher he can often play the role of mind unshackler as well (typically Cecilia is the only one susceptible to mental attacks on a regular basis). As before, he often plays that role of the healer due to having weaker attacks, but he has improved his armaments (seeking rapier and venomous blade) and blademaster skill a bit so his dual-wielding attack is not as weak as it used to be.

 

Sister Cecilia

 

Strength: 36 (+ 7 from traits and items)

Dexterity: 11

Intelligence: 10

Endurance: 19

 

Melee: 17

Hardiness: 12

Parry: 12

Blademaster: 12 (+ 8 from items)

Quick Action: 5

Dual Wielding: 5

Lethal Blow: 5

Gymnastics: 2

 

Priest Spells: 5

Spell Craft: 1

Resistance: 3 (+ 1 from items)

Arcane Lore: 1

Cave Lore: 2

Luck: 0 (+ 3 from items)

 

HP: 327

Energy: 255

 

Armor: 84

Magic: 76

Fire: 74

Cold: 70

Poison: 69

Acid: 85

Mental: 50

Curse: 15

 

Traits: Improve Strength x 5, Mighty Blows x 3, Parry Mastery x 2, Ambidextrous, Good Health, Robust Health, Perfect Health, Negotiator, Sage Lore

 

Cecilia has become even more deadly now that she's wielding the spectral falchion (+8 blademaster!) and the flaming sword (or Demonslayer when facing demons). The high damage output of her swords, combined with an adrenaline rush in the first round, can take out many tough enemies.

 

Father Fred

 

Strength: 11 (- 3 from items)

Dexterity: 11 (- 1 from items)

Intelligence: 35 (+ 5 from traits)

Endurance: 19 (+ 3 from vampiric knife)

 

Melee: 6

Hardiness: 8

Parry: 5

Quick Action: 5 (+2 from items)

Lethal Blow: 5

Pole: 2

Bows: 2 (+ 3 from items)

Thrown: 2

 

Priest Spells: 17

Spellcraft: 12 (+ 4 from items)

Resistance: 12

Tool Use: 4 (+ 1 from traits)

Arcane Lore: 2

Magical Efficiency: 4 (+ 1 from items)

Cave Lore: 3

First Aid: 0 (+ 1 from items)

 

HP: 345

Energy: 405

 

Armor: 74

Magic: 74

Fire: 72

Cold: 72

Poison: 79

Acid: 86

Mental: 90

Curse: 53

 

Traits: Improved Intelligence x 5, Elemental Focus x 5, Good Health, Robust Health, Perfect Health, Nimble Fingers, Negotiator, Sage Lore

 

Mother Mini

Strength: 11 (- 1 from items)

Dexterity: 11

Intelligence: 35 (+ 7 from items and traits)

Endurance: 19

 

Melee: 5 (+ 3 from items)

Hardiness: 7

Parry: 6

Quick Action: 5

Lethal Blow: 5 (+ 2 from items)

Pole: 0 (+ 4 from items)

Bows: 2

Thrown: 1

 

Priest Spells: 17

Spellcraft:12

Resistance: 12

Tool Use: 4 (+ 1 from traits)

Arcane Lore: 3

Magical Efficiency: 5 (+ 1 from items)

Cave Lore: 2

 

HP: 327

Energy: 415

 

Armor: 70

Magic: 72

Fire: 75

Cold: 74

Poison: 75

Acid: 84

Mental: 90

Curse: 43

 

Traits: Improved Intelligence x 5, Elemental Focus x 5, Good Health, Robust Health, Perfect Health, Nimble Fingers, Negotiator, Sage Lore

 

Fred and Mini both now have two AP boosting items and access to Adrenaline Rush, allowing them to cast Divine Fire and/or Retribution twice every round, and four times when not fatigued (or three if they have to move to get into position). With their Quick Action Points, they often go before all or most of their enemies, allowing them to significantly reduce mobs before they ever get to attack (I always play with the setting where action order is determined individually rather than for the party as a whole).

 

Edit: I changed Brutus and Cecilia's equipment around right after this post (boots and cloaks), and also bought Cecilia 2 points of resistance. I've updated their stats and resistances to reflect this.

The remake is a lie.

The lie is a remake (of the truth)

Yes, he's said he plans to port the full first trilogy. The spiderweb front page states that they are "slowly gearing up to announcing" the Avernum 2 port (as well as Avadon 2), but I haven't heard official announcements of an expected timeline (although there has been plenty of speculation on the boards).

I think I'd rather be called "dense" than "sparse" ...

Where can i find the picks and shovels?

There are many of them scattered around the game. Look at dead ends in dungeons and sewers, and you'll often find them (where people were digging out more tunnels, I guess). For more specific locations, you can search for them in the items list linked from the strategy central topic.

I think it's a female assassin, though really that's an incredibly easy mistake to make.

The name doesn't exactly give it away.

 

Speaking of which, has it ever been established why so many Sliths have names starting with Sss? Does it signify something?

What format did you see it in?

—Alorael, whose preferences run more to beer, though. He's never had $30 bottles of beer, but he also rarely buys beer by the handle.

$30 is nothing:

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/05/sam-adams-utopias-beer_n_2076113.html

I'm only #17? Clearly I'm not procrastinating enough!!

It looks like it was fixed in version 1.0.3 for Mac and version 1.0.1 for Windows (according to the A6 support page).

And I'm also playing on hard, but that's the only thing that really gives me a hard time so there must be some battle tactic or way around this out there?

 

The difficulty of the boss (and mini-boss) fights are really the biggest things that differentiate hard from normal, and torment from hard. This is especially so in the early part of the game, where even on normal there is significant bump up in difficulty between the rest of the dungeon and the dungeon bosses and mini-bosses. I remember there being a couple difficult spell casting bosses in the Nephilim fortress. On Torment, I think I started that fort at level 8 or 9, but wasn't able to finish the bosses until level 10 or 11.

 

Or...if you're not afraid to take "Learned Noremac's Foolproof Strategy for the Cowardly and Dishonourable Adventurer"(Copyright pending), you can make a few early boss game fights easier by recognizing this: Bosses and their cronies do heal if you run away, but the dead ones don't respawn. Thus, go into a difficult fight not with the goal of WINNING, but with the goal of REDUCING the number of guys in the room, even if only by one. Conserve your items, target the cronies only, and keep at least one guy near the back row. Once at least 2 of your guys have died, leave one guy in the fight to give your last guy enough time to get away. Then, run back to town so everyone can sleep off their decapitations, then do it again. Eventually, you'll be left with just the boss itself, which will be far more manageable.

 

I like to call this "guerrilla tactics" rather than "cowardly and dishonorable". On Torment, it is extremely useful in the early going (definitely the first 10-12 levels, and still somewhat so later). Without things like this, there are very few boss fights you can handle in the early going without a lot of level-grinding. Often I play a variation on this where I attempt to lure some of the cronies out of the room, by standing where they can see me but the boss can't. This way you can kill the cronies, then heal/rebuff and head into the room with the boss to take them on with fewer buddies to help them.

Magical efficiency doesn't work for area effect spells.

Wasn't that a bug that got fixed in an update? Or am I misrememberating again?

I was wondering if there was a handy list of where all the scarabs in this game are.

 

I've bought out everything from the store, got a few here and there, and was wondering where I could get more.

 

I think I read somewhere that after getting the white necklace from Redbeard you could get the Scrab of the Void? I've been looking around but Ian't find it

The synergizer item list here has all (I think?) of the scarabs in it. You can find a link to it in the Strategy Central topic, or just click here.

Why isn't anyone suggesting Avadon? Is it like the step son or something?

Oops, I didn't realize that wasn't on his list - MDMC!! (Must Drink More Coffee)

 

Yes, by all means, play Avadon. After you're done with N or N:R.

just beat avernum : escape from the pit last night/this morning, all the endings + quests...i need a new fix :3

 

so far ive beaten: geneforge 1-5, avernum 1-6, exile 3

 

@_@

Try Nethergate!

 

(Or the remake Nethergate: Resurrection)

sure but for that player still needs to do visits to FG for herbs to replenish.

I just meant saving the wisdom crystals that you find and make in your travels until later in the game, when you are a high enough level that only a few combats can give you noticeable experience. I don't bother doing extra stuff or trips around the world (what Slarty called the "Golden Girl Grind") to get herbs to replenish. I don't have that much patience.

 

The point at which I usually use them all is right before I attempt the first of the final quests (either grah-hoth or the final gauntlet - I always save Hawthorne for last). This allows me to get 2-3 extra levels before I attempt those final quests, at a time when it would be really hard to get those levels through other means. In my current playthrough (with no herb grinding), I'm up to almost 50 crystals (and I still have a couple more things to do before the final quests - namely Drath and the Tower Haakai). This is my no-mage playthrough, which means I've also missed some crystals that are behind barriers, so it could've been even more. (I've discovered that piercing crystals are scarcer than I thought, unless you are willing to completely buy out the stock of crystals and herbs at the Slith Village near the waterfalls in order to get them to replenish - but that is too expensive unless you are out of piercing crystals and have a barrier that you really NEED to get past.)

if you want to go beyond level 30 then you need to do alot "farming" aka killing random encounters (those few places they appear) and do Final Gauntlet few times per day for a couple months.

You can also save all of your wisdom crystals (found and made) until after you hit level 30 - unlike other types of experience, wisdom crystal experience doesn't scale down as you get to higher levels.

You can make upwards of $30,000, and through some special tax properties of stipends that I'm not versed in you get to keep more of it than from a salary, apparently. That's not something I'd try to support a household on, but it's still at least as good as a lot of entry-level technician jobs in the sciences and better than the hordes of unemployed college grads who still haven't managed to land anything decent.

 

—Alorael, who doesn't think anyone should abandon a lucrative job for the lure of big dollars in grad school. But in the absence of a job it'll look good on your resumé and you won't starve.

The larger stipends (30k range) are generally (not always) at Universities in high cost-of-living areas and/or in departments where there is strong competition from high-paying industry jobs. My point was not that the stipends are so low that you shouldn't go to grad school because you'll be destitute (although in some non-STEM fields that may be true). Clearly grad school is right for some people - it can improve your future job prospects, and you can study/research cool things. If I didn't believe that I wouldn't be in grad school now.

 

My point was merely that if someone is going to grad school just for the steady stipend paycheck, they might want to reconsider. If you can get into a graduate program that pays a stipend high enough to get by off of, you could probably get a job that pays as well or better. It's true that you may get a better job after going to graduate school, but if that's why you are going, then you're aren't going just for the steady paycheck. Better job prospects is a perfectly reasonably reason to go for a Masters in many fields (and even possibly a Doctorate in a few fields, although if you want to successfully complete a Doctorate, I recommend that a love of the field be another big factor in deciding to go).

—Alorael, who knows some people who picked grad school when the economy took its downturn because in the sciences it's a steady paycheck for a few years. Then you can drop out, take a Masters, and go get out of academia. It's less effective for the programs where you have to pay or can't do anything without a full doctorate.

Not a very good paycheck, though. I'm continuing to work one-day-a-week at my former full-time job, and the pay for that one day is more than my stipend as a grad student. I wouldn't suggest grad school if you're doing it just for the paycheck.

Option A: Work your entire life to send kids to college. Kids graduate, decide they want to go to grad school, and turn into this.

 

Option B: Retire early, tell your kids to become plumbers. Kids make almost as much money (on average) as their peers who went to college and graduated with non-technical degrees.

 

I'm buying my 3 1/2 year old a set of pipes and wrenches for the holidays this year.

I (mostly) meant that as a joke. I know his latest games have done well, but I don't think they've done quite well enough to fund an early retirement. But who knows ...

After level 30, you still gain the hit point and spell point bonuses every level, as well as the automatic stat increase (rotating between strength, dexterity, intelligence, and endurance). However, you only get the chosen stat increase and the skill point allocation every 5th level. Which, realistically, means that it will probably only happen at level 35 if at all, since most people finish the game with a levels somewhere in the 30s (unless they are playing singleton).

Maybe Jeff's going to retire to the Bahamas and live off the riches he made from Avadon and A:EFTP.

 

Or maybe we just have to patiently await the next update.

 

Personally I'm hoping for the latter .... Although Jeff does deserve a relaxing retirement after all the great games he's put out!

Excellent, another way to procastinate working on my dissertation.

I think you need to go and talk to Aydin, and he will tell you where in the black spire to put the royal seal. My recollection is that if he doesn't tell you where to put it, you won't even get the option to put it anywhere.