Does anyone play d&d?

[MandatorySuicide]

Recently played some d&d with some friends but we are all total amateurs and as you can imagine some of the rules are a little confusing... we are playing out of the 3.0-3.5 books and Im wondering if anyone is knowledgeable enough to answer some questions...

[Dantius]

Originally Posted By: MandatorySuicide

Recently played some d&d with some friends but we are all total amateurs and as you can imagine some of the rules are a little confusing... we are playing out of the 3.0-3.5 books and Im wondering if anyone is knowledgeable enough to answer some questions...

Yes, lots of people on these boards (20+ by now probably) play a modified version called AIMhack that can be played across the Internet on an Instant Messenger client. There's probably like three or four threads in the first page of General, it shouldn't be that hard to find some exampled.

Regarding the rules, there's about four or five complete copies of the 3.5 SRD online, and even a legal on on the Wizards website. I'd recommend checking there first.

[MandatorySuicide]

Well, I've read the information in the books, some stuff is still confusing... For instance, when leveling up an animal companion, they get 2 HD added and they gain bonuses based on that, but im not sure how I add HP to them, is it just a D8 + the animals con mod?

 

Also, the initial information for a wolf, states the hit dice are 2d8+4 (13hp). I assumed 13 was the starting hp, the 2 refers to the number of HD the wolf doesnt get health points of 2 d8's lol, I dont think anyway. What does the +4 refer to? It isnt the animals con mod because the wolf starts with 15 con so it has a constitution modifier of +2.

 

 

sooooo who has some info for me?

 

I read this http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/rg/20070206a and it was fairly helpful, still confused on the HD as it relates to HP.

[Dintiradan]

I played D&D 3.0 for several years. I've never played 3.5, but I know about some of the rule changes made.

 

First off -- does everyone at your table have access to a Player's Handbook? You can get away with some players not owning one, but everyone should try to read it. At a minimum, each player should know what bonuses they get from their race, what abilities their class and feats give them, the effects of the spells they might be able to cast, and how to do basic rolls like skill checks or attacks. When first starting out, don't bother reading about stuff that doesn't involve your character -- Fighters don't have to know how spells work, for instance. Ideally everyone should know how the combat rules work, but there should be at least one person (usually the DM) who has studied the entire chapter and can help other players 'translate' their actions into game terms.

 

The DM should own all three core rulebooks (Player's Handbook, Dungeon Master's Guide, Monster Manual). I've never DMed, so I can't say what sections the DM should focus on. Still, part of the DM's job is being a referee, so he or she should know the rules pretty well.

 

Remember, there's nothing wrong with a DM running a premade adventure -- it's a lot of work to make an adventure or a campaign if it's your first time playing and you don't know what works and doesn't. There might even be a sample adventure in the DMG, I dunno. You'll be able to buy published adventures and campaigns at any good gaming store (make sure it's for the version of the game you're playing). Ask for help; maybe the clerk there knows a good one for a first-time DM. You can also download them from the Internet.

 

Check out Wizards of the Coast's 3.5 archive (the main D&D page is now devoted to 4th Edition). In particular, check out Vicious Venues (premade dungeons), Steal This Hook (plot ideas), and Map-A-Week (pretty maps you can make a story around).

 

Finally, a tip: when no one around the table knows the rule for something, it might be better for the DM to come up with a rule and check back later than spend a lot of time during the session reading the rule books. This won't work with every group: my group would rather spend five minutes looking at the rules than risk playing the game 'wrong'.

 

Anyway, I'll stop rambling and let you ask your questions.

 

EDIT: Seems you've found the WotC site already. Anyway, 'fraid I can't help you with the Animal Companion problem -- seems things have changed between 3.0 and 3.5 (there's no mention of bonus HD in 3.0, for example). At any rate, I've never played a Druid, so I'm not too sure how they worked in 3.0 either.

[Alorael at Large]

Most monster entries give health in hit dice and HP. A wolf, as an animal, has d8 hit dice. Hit dice largely function as levels, but instead of a class, the extra hit dice increase the power by type (animal, or aberration, or outsider, or whatever).

 

So that wolf is basically a level two animal. It has two d8 hit dice. Its Con mod is +2, which means +2 health per hit die, or +4 total for those two dice. Thus, 2d8+4. To save the DM calculation time, the entries then give the average health of the monster. The average of 2d8 is 9, and 9+4 is 13.

 

For an animal companion, each bonus hit die is d8 + Con mod, as usual.

 

—Alorael, who has apparently played enough D&D. He's now moved on to newer and more esoteric systems that are less amenable to mortal understanding.

[Enraged Slith]

I've tried D&D before, but it's become less fun with each excursion. It requires a certain mindset to take the whole role-playing experience seriously.

 

My advice would be to make your sessions work for you, rather than the other way around. Just have fun with it.

[MandatorySuicide]

well, let me say that we have the books, some of the sections of the book are still confusing, and I want to clarify, when my wolf levels up, he gains +2 HD, so when I go to add more HP to him, do I literally roll 4 d8's +2 con mod to each?

 

current hp = 13

 

new hp = 13+4d8+8

 

clarify clarify: Roll 4 separate D8 dice add their totals plus con mods to each....

 

lol just want to make sure im not trying to add ridiculously more hp then I should

 

we are new to the game, we understand a good chunk of the rules to actually play the game. Just trying to play exactly like you are supposed to, we arent in it for the role-playing, we arent [censored] larping LOL. We play it purely for the game, a little brain exercise while playing the basis for many video games we already play. So we try to have our DM make as little falsified rules as he has to, its highly understood that the DM has to make certain decisions that arent going to be explained in the book, you never know what a player will try.

 

I just want to be statistically accurate, I want my animal companion to be fair and I want to use him properly.

 

 

also another question, training your companion tricks takes time, weeks in fact. From a DM stand point how would you guys handle the passage of time like that in a game? Would the druid need to roll to teach them the tricks and then after so many weeks pass the dog gets it? Or do you have to take 4 weeks out of your journey to do it and the time passage is instant its purely for the games sake?

 

If the time thing is purely up to the DM, and the time actually has to pass, may just have the tricks taught to the companion at the end of the evenings worth of playing and claim the time passes when we meet again to play... seems reasonable enough, either way give me your opinions.

[Student of Trinity]

I think that 13 is just stating the average of 2d8 +4; it doesn't mean you get to add it to the die rolls. From what you say and what that web page you linked says, it sounds like a normal wolf has 2d8+4 health, for which an average roll would be 13, but you might get luckier or less lucky. Then, whenever your own level reaches a multiple of three, your pet wolf gets to add 2d8 more to its health, plus 2 for its CON bonus.

[Alorael at Large]

SoT is right. The number given in HP is the average of the hit dice and Con modifier. For an individual animal, you can roll it (or take the average, or use a set amount per hit die, depending on house rules) and add Con mod per hit die. So until level 3, your wolf has 2d8 + 4. At level 3, it has 4d8 + 8. At level six, it has 6d8 + 12. Each time you hit a multiple of three, you add another 2d8 + Con mod, and you roll only those two dice to add to the current health total.

 

Companion animals get free tricks that require no training at all. If you want to teach additional tricks, you follow the rules exactly as written:

 

Quote:

For tasks with specific time frames noted above, you must spend half this time (at the rate of 3 hours per day per animal being handled) working toward completion of the task before you attempt the Handle Animal check. If the check fails, your attempt to teach, rear, or train the animal fails and you need not complete the teaching, rearing, or training time. If the check succeeds, you must invest the remainder of the time to complete the teaching, rearing, or training. If the time is interrupted or the task is not followed through to completion, the attempt to teach, rear, or train the animal automatically fails.

 

Training takes a week, and you can train animals during your journey as long as you have at least 3 hours of spare time per day.

 

—Alorael, who thinks it helps to really read through all the rules. In particular, if you can't find a rule in one section, check the index. The training rules are under "Handle Animal" in the skill section.

[MandatorySuicide]

k, i understand all that i get that the 13 was the average etc. but are the added HD purely for reference to increases in the companions statistics based on the MM tables, or do I roll 4 d8 + con mod to each to add to my wolfs hp?

 

 

Originally Posted By: Battle Without Vigor

Each time you hit a multiple of three, you add another 2d8 + Con mod, and you roll only those two dice to add to the current health total.

 

So then I am right, i only roll 2d8+4 to add to his total hp, and the added HD are purely for the other increases based on the tables in the MM, correct?

[Alorael at Large]

Your wolf's HP is determined by his hit dice and Con mod. At all times it's Xd8 + X*(Con mod). At any given point, he'll have some health that you've determined by rolling. When you hit a level that gives the wolf bonus HD, you add more health by rolling those hit dice (they're called hit dice because they're the dice you roll to add hit points!) and the Con mod that goes with those hit dice.

 

So no, they're not just in reference to the tables. The come with extra health, too. Each bonus hit die is a bonus d8 + Con mod.

 

—Alorael, who really thinks it's easiest to just look at hit dice as levels in the wolf class. Every time your druid gains a level, he gets d8 + Con mod to add to health and some class benefits. Those levels are druid hit dice, basically. The wolf is the same, except for some reason it gains levels two at a time.

[Erebus the Black]

A very good site with easily maneuverable charts and simpler to understand definitions for game terms (it has complete lists of feats, prestige, items etc... ready for download with shorthand for stats and effects) is crystal keep : http://www.crystalkeep.com/d20/index.php.

 

P.S.

you should generally stick to either 3ed. or 3.5ed, not both, as they have contradictions due to the system overhauls from the movement from one to the other.

If you really like a rule or a class in the one you are not using you should confer with the DM on how to translate it to the other.

 

About the time issue, some people choose to completely ignore this and magically receive all tricks, spells and feats at the end of the adventure without all the silly hassle of finding a trainer (especially useful if you are in the middle of nowhere)

[MandatorySuicide]

thanks for the info battle without vigor

 

im going to check out that link bender, also there are just a few things that are clarified a little better in 3.5 like the details on the companion. So that would be why I take information from both.

 

Myself and a friend have be taking turns being DM, writing out portions of our own campaigns, we both want to play more than we want to dm so we've been trying to share the responsibility. So we are all trying to play as appropriately as possible based on the core rules. That being said we are both amateur DM's, so there is no consulting with my DM for what he thinks, we try to come to a consensus on how the game should be played before hand.

 

At least statistically once the DM is in control its his game, we are just trying to be accurate.

 

Once again we are all amateurs at this with nothing but the books and the internet to help us understand the books exactly. Lol as far as Im concerned the help I get from the internet is my DM consultation.

 

the wizards site has been fairly helpful with correcting the little mistakes we've made, sometimes its just hard interpreting the rules.... Most of us who are playing together are recovering mtg players...

 

Which means we are all complete rule nazis. If we feel like something isnt right with how we are doing it we'd rather not the DM just make it up and we play how it is, lol as i've said we arent role players of the fruitier variety, we are in it for the game in its purest form, so we want to be as statistically accurate as possible.

 

example of our amateur status, I only just realized yesterday we screwed up doing our skill points, we thought you started with 4+int modx4 (which you can start with) AND you started with your choice of the ranks in the listed starting package, i read about properly setting up your character sheet on the wizards site yesterday, that it is either the starting points or the choice from the package. However the PHB doesnt tell you Either/Or, it just lists it and tells you to choose lol.

 

We are slowly gathering all the proper rules, I should only have to come to you guys for the subtle interpretations.

 

Anyway enough of my blathering. Thanks everyone for the current info, as well as the info im sure to ask for in the future.

[Dikiyoba]

Originally Posted By: MandatorySuicide

lol as i've said we arent role players of the fruitier variety, we are in it for the game in its purest form, so we want to be as statistically accurate as possible.

Still living up to your name, Dikiyoba sees.

[nikki.]

Originally Posted By: Dikiyoba

Still living up to your name, Dikiyoba sees.

"Rage!"?

[MandatorySuicide]

derail someone elses thread, you guys can add #'s to your post totals elsewhere

[Enraged Slith]

Originally Posted By: Nikki.

Originally Posted By: Dikiyoba

Still living up to your name, Dikiyoba sees.

"Rage!"?

[Erebus the Black]

In order to delay derailment,

What expansion books do you use/have (such as unearthed arcana, any of the completes (complete ...), any of the races (races of ...), Players handbook 2 etc...)?

 

P.S.

I don't know why they removed the base classes index from the keep, but if you want I can send you a copy I saved while it was still up (There are a lot more base classes than are described in the handbook such as the archives which allows you to learn and cast priest spells like a wizard or the favored soul which casts priest spells like a sorcerer).

[Dikiyoba]

Originally Posted By: Nikki

"Rage!"?

Snarkiness, really.

Dikiyoba.

[Alorael at Large]

Originally Posted By: MandatorySuicide

there are just a few things that are clarified a little better in 3.5 like the details on the companion. So that would be why I take information from both.

Except it doesn't work like that. The companion rules might be clearer in 3.5, but they're also completely different from how they work in 3.0. You can't mix and match without paying careful attention to what changed and how, especially since a fair number of the chances were either balance fixes or changes that balance with other changes.

Quote:

At least statistically once the DM is in control its his game, we are just trying to be accurate.

As a new player, I'd say that's a good idea. Once you get a feel for how the rules work, there might be some you want to modify. House-ruling is an ancient and honorable roleplaying tradition. Just be sure to consult with your players before changing the game on them and, if possible, let them retool their past decisions based on rules that you intend to change.

At any rate, that's all a ways down the road. For new players the core rules as written should hold for a while.

Quote:

Most of us who are playing together are recovering mtg players...

Quote:

we arent role players of the fruitier variety, we are in it for the game in its purest form, so we want to be as statistically accurate as possible.

Please lose the superior attitude. Just because you don't enjoy something doesn't mean it's wrong, and especially as beginning roleplayers I don't think you really have much basis for judgment.

Quote:

example of our amateur status, I only just realized yesterday we screwed up doing our skill points, we thought you started with 4+int modx4 (which you can start with) AND you started with your choice of the ranks in the listed starting package, i read about properly setting up your character sheet on the wizards site yesterday, that it is either the starting points or the choice from the package. However the PHB doesnt tell you Either/Or, it just lists it and tells you to choose lol.

Page 24 of the Player's Handbook tells you how packages work, and pages 23 and 62 are both fairly explicit in how many skill points you get. Again, before you do anything else I think you need to read the Player's Handbook slowly and carefully. It's all explained, but the information isn't always in one place.

In fact, I'd say the easiest order to read is Player's Handbook, DM's Guide (and you don't need to read all of it immediately), and Monster Manual.

—Alorael, who imagines the classes were removed because they're Wizards of the Coast's intellectual property.

[Dintiradan]

I understand where MandatorySuicide is coming from. Most of the people at my table are boardgamers first and foremost, and they view D&D as a complex combat simulator. It's a valid way to play, and I still have fun despite the smaller focus on roleplaying. I just wish my fellow party members would stop killing the things I want to talk to -- and I'm the Evil party member.

 

But there will be times, even if there is zero roleplaying, where the party gets into a situation that the rulebooks don't cover. Take something as simple as wading across a fast-flowing river. If a PC wants to avoid falling over, is it a STR check (the river is trying to 'bull rush' the PC) or a DEX check (the PC has to make a Balance check)? Does a Swim check work when all you're doing is wading? As a DM, you're going to have to pick something and stick with it. Again, this is an "open-ended gameplay" issue, not a "roleplaying" issue.

[MandatorySuicide]

Originally Posted By: Dintiradan

I understand where MandatorySuicide is coming from. Most of the people at my table are boardgamers first and foremost, and they view D&D as a complex combat simulator. It's a valid way to play, and I still have fun despite the smaller focus on roleplaying. I just wish my fellow party members would stop killing the things I want to talk to -- and I'm the Evil party member.

hahaha im in like the same exact situation its always our paladin whos pushing for the kill, lol then asking someone else to force us into battle

Originally Posted By: Battle Without Vigor

Quote:

we arent role players of the fruitier variety, we are in it for the game in its purest form, so we want to be as statistically accurate as possible.

Please lose the superior attitude. Just because you don't enjoy something doesn't mean it's wrong, and especially as beginning roleplayers I don't think you really have much basis for judgment.

Lol, well dude, as much as i appreciate your information you have to understand that what i said is MY opinion, and while you may not have enjoyed it, Im still going to express it =D

 

just like your opinion!

 

lol

 

also, what constitutes a beginning role player? someone whos playing d&d the first time? or someone who is acting out a part of a fantasy story line with other people?

 

if its the latter, then noone whos been through childhood is an amateur role player

 

that is all =D

[Aoslare]

tlol;dr

 

 

(just kidding. I don't believe in tl;dr, and I agree that you are entitled to your opinion, and entitled to express it. But you do come off as having a bit of an arrogant attitude. If you're okay with that, then hey, great.)

[Lilith]

Honestly, if what you want is an RPG that you can treat as a fun, well-balanced, easy-to-learn tactical wargame with clear and precise rules for most situations you're likely to run into, you should probably be playing 4th edition D&D, not 3rd. But since you've already got the 3rd edition books...

[Alorael at Large]

A beginning roleplayer is someone playing a tabletop roleplaying game for the first time. It's not too hard to figure out make-believe, but getting all the numbers and dice right, understanding how to play along with the party, not making the GM hate you (or the players hate you), keeping things moving and interesting (as player or as GM!)... that's all new.

 

—Alorael, who doesn't particularly care what you express. These are the Spiderweb forums, though. It's one thing for you to say that you find a certain game or certain style of game boring. It's another to call people who play it "fruity." The former is fine. On these forums, the latter is not. Please don't do it.

[Ephesos]

Originally Posted By: Dintiradan

But there will be times, even if there is zero roleplaying, where the party gets into a situation that the rulebooks don't cover. Take something as simple as wading across a fast-flowing river. If a PC wants to avoid falling over, is it a STR check (the river is trying to 'bull rush' the PC) or a DEX check (the PC has to make a Balance check)? Does a Swim check work when all you're doing is wading? As a DM, you're going to have to pick something and stick with it. Again, this is an "open-ended gameplay" issue, not a "roleplaying" issue.

...random aside. Goblins switched its RSS feeds like two months ago, apparently, and my old feed failed at everything. I missed like ten comics. Much gratitude for the link, Dinti.

[Enraged Slith]

Originally Posted By: Ephesos

Originally Posted By: Dintiradan

But there will be times, even if there is zero roleplaying, where the party gets into a situation that the rulebooks don't cover. Take something as simple as wading across a fast-flowing river. If a PC wants to avoid falling over, is it a STR check (the river is trying to 'bull rush' the PC) or a DEX check (the PC has to make a Balance check)? Does a Swim check work when all you're doing is wading? As a DM, you're going to have to pick something and stick with it. Again, this is an "open-ended gameplay" issue, not a "roleplaying" issue.

...random aside. Goblins switched its RSS feeds like two months ago, apparently, and my old feed failed at everything. I missed like ten comics. Much gratitude for the link, Dinti.

Wow, me too. I've been busier with school than I thought.

[Erebus the Black]

If you want a real challenge try playing a paladin with a vow of peace.

"hi I'm a big cluncking paladin sworn to protect the virtues of goodness wherever I roam but I'm not allowed to hit anyone unless they are undead or from another plane"

[MandatorySuicide]

Originally Posted By: Lilith

Honestly, if what you want is an RPG that you can treat as a fun, well-balanced, easy-to-learn tactical wargame with clear and precise rules for most situations you're likely to run into, you should probably be playing 4th edition D&D, not 3rd. But since you've already got the 3rd edition books...

yea lol, one of our friends already had a few books, and none of us want to drop the money for more, especially not for new books, the local game store wants 35 bucks a pop.... found em online though, you can get the core books used and spend about 50 or 60 overall.....................

even still, though atleast one of my friends is going to get another PHB, sharing 1 is a little annoying

Originally Posted By: CRISIS on INFINITE SLARTIES

tlol;dr


(just kidding. I don't believe in tl;dr, and I agree that you are entitled to your opinion, and entitled to express it. But you do come off as having a bit of an arrogant attitude. If you're okay with that, then hey, great.)

lol at you guys who keep pretending to be offended by what i said, and then carrying on with the the thread like its all good, If you cared so little then why bother saying anything at all?

hmmm.... this i will have to ponder... wait wait, maybe it wasnt that i was speaking against live action role players, you guys arent upset because of the subtle reference to queers are you? lol probably not, either way if fruity means anything else besides homosexual than I stick by applying the term to larpers..... If we've already reached a national consensus that fruity specifically refers to homosexual. Then maybe, maybe i'll take it back. (in which case we arent role players of the frivolous variety)

*EDIT* Once again I'd like to thank everyone who actually helped me, whether or not we see eye to eye, your maturity at putting my 'supposed immaturity' behind you to give me information is greatly appreciated. =D

[Aoslare]

Originally Posted By: MandatorySuicide

wait wait, maybe it wasnt that i was speaking against live action role players, you guys arent upset because of the subtle reference to queers are you? lol probably not, either way if fruity means anything else besides homosexual than I stick by applying the term to larpers..... If we've already reached a national consensus that fruity specifically refers to homosexual. Then maybe, maybe i'll take it back. (in which case we arent role players of the frivolous variety)

*facepalm*

I don't think anyone was horribly upset by the original "fruity" comment, but the paragraph above is a bit much. Whatever you think the word means, it's clearly a derogatory comment about SOME type of person... and yeah, saying that you are laughing out loud while talking about hate language is definitely going to piss people off.

For comparison, the N-word would not magically become OK to use if I use it to describe CCG players instead of black people. Look at your paragraph above, replace "fruity" with the N-word, "queers" with "blacks", "homosexual" with "negro", and tell me if it still sounds reasonable. Targetted comments like that are not welcome here. Please consider this a warning.

Anyway, this thread is over. If you want to start a new one, please do so without the little side comments dumping on people.