Delicious Vlish

Yeah, pretty much.

Yeah, that's my point exacly.I bet for most people, they don't even know that an Agent is around until it is to late. To late of course meaning suddenly bursting in to flame or melting in to a puddle of goo from a blob of acid.

G3 was interesting when you meet that Agent. She had disguised her self. Yet another aspect of Agenthood. You could meet one and never know...

The Agent is the proverbial boogeyman of the Geneforge world. Er, boogeywoman.

I'd really like to see a game where you are actually in Shaper society, rather than isolated on an island or in some backwater outpost.

Agents simply aren't as visible, and obviously not as prone to fall from grace. I seriously doubt they want to be noticed.

 

I do believe that G3 is meant to be played from the Agent's perspective though... The character in the storyboard picture is now an Agent.

Greta was an initiate, and not a full shaper. She wasn't even an apprentice really. Expulsion was probably the standard way out. She was unfit for duty. Weeded out. A lot of shapers start out feeling sympathy for creations, this is evident, even Shanti speaks about it, but it is conditioned out in time. And from a realistic stand point, probably the reason why Agents travel alone so much... Shapers and Guardians, being able to create life and having creations, might have feelings for what they create, emotions for their creations, their creatures. Some Shapers, and I speak as a Shaper, one of the three classes, some Shapers probably never fully shake these feelings. Hoge has that old Alpha that he has kept around forever and upgraded. Fyoras are said to be kept as pets and sentries. An Agent is probably heavily conditioned to not get an emotional attatchment to anything, which is probably why they don't shape so well. They are there to take life, not create it, or heal it. Hence, Greta's failure was that she had emotions, which is probably a liability for potential Agents. Emotions could be used against them... Like, say, provoking anger or total outrage in a Shaper by attacking his beloved pet Fyora... Said emotional outburst would be a weakness, something to exploit. A lone solitary Agent would have no such weakness, and, if as theorised, was a conditioned mass murderer, would be perfect for upholding her role as judge, jury, and executioner with no messy emotions or personal sentiments getting in the way. The Shaper society would have themselves the perfect police force and judicial system... No messy public trials, very little corruption, and lots of results to be rid of criminals. The fact they feel the need to hide in some dank hole says an awful lot.

Upon taking those tests, like in the testing grounds, I believe it is from that point on that death starts being the penalty for utter failure, unless of course, there is a fate worse than death handy, like being marooned on a swampy smelly island.

And something to think about... How many fallen Agents do you see in the Geneforge games? Lots of fallen Guardians, like whatsisname, Barzal, and many fallen Shapers, but how many fallen Agents do you see running around

And that is where the delicious roleplaying factor comes in. A hardcore loyalist will kill all those who cross shaper law, while a sympathetic loyalist will look past minor infractions. (Like when you have to report the servile being contacted by hostiles) The game gives you options to do both.

There is a few points where this breaks down. Like Grenier or however you spell his name... It's not hard to see that under shaper law, he should be terminated for his failure and allowing himself loss of control, and Rahul lets him off because of friendship. For many Shapers though, failure means death. You learn that in the school if you speak with the control mind, that death is the shaper way, and a small price to pay for being able to control and create life. Failure is met with termination, probably in the form of an Agent coming for you in the night. The Shapers are a results oriented society... Not uncommon in total totalitarian rule.

Lord Rahul approves of you dealing with the rebels harshly... Diwaniya is spineless and weak, the end credits even say so, he is punished for not slaying the rebels outright and left on that island simply because there is no worse place to put him. His failure to deal with the rebels by extermination is shameful.

Any contrary opinion is to be met with death... No ands, ifs, or buts. Shapers are pretty much totalitarian. Only the priviledged few can speak out, but even they face eventual termination, like Khyryk, who knows that one day the Shaper Council is going to come knocking on his door and is well prepared for it, or Sharon, hiding in her somewhat well defended grove. She even says that when the time comes that she hopes she is not dealt with to harshly for her conflicting opinions. Shanti even hints at this, more so when you play an Agent in G2, what your role is and how honourable it is to be the Agent. In game texts it describes how Agents are the assassins, murderers, executioners of those who would dare oppose the shapers or dare rise up against their rule or break their laws. Pretty much any violation of the law for non shapers seems to result in death, at least from what I gather. For a shaper, punishment comes in beaurocratic form, like whatsisname being banished to that island for the rest of his miserable life.

In fact, the very fear of Agents coming for them in the night is what keeps people in line. Words to this nature are said someplace in the series I believe.

This is true from a role playing point of view. A loyalist shaper would exterminate them for expressing contrary opinion. The same way that any real loyalist would destroy Lankan at first meeting, for being contaminated by evil and rebelling.

"You dare question a shaper?! You must die now!"

Best sort of character to play a hardline role is the Agent... Because you know they enjoy their job.

As far as advanced shaping goes... I want to shape war bred serviles to do my bidding. And have them armed with batons and blades.

Allow Ur Drakkons the ability to shape Pyro-Creations, like Pyroroamers or PyroDryaks... Hahahah!

 

No worries about the creations staying around all that long, and there is a very real danger to you.

The other idea is to introduce a second attack somehow in creations. Sort of a rarer secondary attack that they have a small chance of using.

 

With a clawbug, you could, say, somehow allow for a multi target attack (Which the Guardian also needs) like a pincer swipe or a claw crush. To have those big pincers and never use them is such a shame.

Yeah. I agree. I can make an Alpha or a Beta with more hit points for fewer essence costs than a Rotter. I mean, you can have a creation with almost a thousand health (properly buffed of course) for just about half of what it costs to make a base Rotter. In one game, I had an Alpha named Timex just to keep me amused. Most of the time Timex couldn't hit the broadside of the barn. He had a hard time connecting with the high level endgame enemies on his own. (Buffing helped) When he did hit, he hit HARD though. He had a lot of strength. Mostly, he just stood there and acted as a punching bag. He never once came close to death, never caused me to panic worrying about if I needed to coddle him along till he got stronger, I created him, and when he leveled, I added to his stats when I could. He started off strong and finished out the game darn near indestructable. Other common names for my Alphabet Brutes are Numbskull, Dimwit, Moron, and Samsonite.

 

And, like you said, that's why I have been saying Vlish are overpowered all this time. You can jack them up and make them in to monsters... I mean real MONSTERS and you can do it for cheap.

It has been my experience that Alphabet Brutes hold up on the front lines better than rots... Maybe because I get them earlier and they level a good bit as I travel.

 

It is my experience mind you, that leads me to say this. Rots go down all to quickly to searing orbs and ice bolt attacks of the enemy. Aura of flames eats them up. I am not sure why, but the Alphabet Brutes seem to last longer on the front lines... Just feel tougher. Also, Alphabet Brutes are a lot cheaper to upgrade and customise. I can dump a lot of points in to endurance and not spend as much essence as I would doing it with a rot.

 

Don't get me wrong... Rots are nice and all. I just don't find them all that useful for a Loyalist. Especially with no canisters and jacked up physical stats. I have better ways to spend my limited essence and get better results.

Null Wands are stupidly overpowered because their ability to stun ramps up because of the missile skill and dex. The level of stun caused by a high missile skill level is obnoxious. The length of time spent stunned is amazing.

Glaahks are cheaper in cost and do a much better job of slowing and stunning. They also do more damage than rots. Glaahks are also highly resistant to magical damage of all kinds.

 

The rot's acid based attack can be resisted by far to many enemies... The Glaahk's attack is very hard to resist. All to often, there are spots where rots do an astouding 1 damage to something, like to other rots. They don't even do enough damage to counter regen in many cases. Which is a real pain in the tentacles.

Rots are practically useless for a Loyalist. I mean that in a very broad general sense. I mean, they are just not all that great. Many of your endgame enemies are rots, or other strong creations which tend to resist the rots' attacks. Rots are much better for a Rebel who will be fighting against "legal" creations in the endgame. Rots are also especially vunerable to magic attacks and reapers.

 

Battle creations have their issues, but they are not useless. Battle creations on torment are not about damage. They are your mobile armor division, a distraction, they are there to run interference, plug up a bottle neck to keep nasties on the other side away from your fragile artillery units, They are there to absorb damage, take blows, and occasionally tag an enemy to keep hostility and agression focused on the front lines where it belongs instead of your rear ranks where it doesn't. Battle Alphas and Betas are not bad creations at all. They have a lot of life and tend to take quite a beating. Thahd Shades do this job quite well too. It takes an awful lot to bring a Beta down. When I create mine, I add points to endurance. Do they do a lot of damage? Some times. Do they save me from taking a lot of damage? Heck yes! I know for sure when I plant a Beta in a doorway or similar point of bottleneck, I know that line of scrimage is going to be held. I know that my rear ranks wont have to waste precious action points repositioning themselves to safety, which means more shots fired, which means more damage done. I know I can plant a pair of Betas or Alphas in to a slightly wider bottleneck and hold the area. There are times when the Alphabet Maulers don't even attack because they are so stunned, but I don't need them to attack, I need them to hold the line.

 

And that's what they do best. I can cast Augmentation on a Beta and use an Armor potion and get darn near 1000 hit points. And nothing in the game can damage him faster than I can heal him.

Plated bugs can't hit the broad side of a barn. They have an exceptionally low to hit rate. Especially so in G3, they are worthless.

 

G3's Bug Baron cheated and got Glaahks.

 

Something else I thought of, but seriously doubt it could actually be implemented because of the game engine, is knockback for the Alphabet Mob. Something that big, when it clobbers you, is going to knock you around a good bit. Heck, one of those big guys could pick up a servile and kick them like a football right in to the next zone.

Battle Alphabets should be immune to stun. I mean, they are GIANTS for crying out loud. Heck, their mass alone should allow them to shrug off almost anything.

 

Bugs should have poison, and lots of it. Their discription even says they should have poison. They do not. Plated bugs should have massive armor values and resist almost anything thrown at them, at the cost of some loss to hit. My Bug Baron was bitterly bummed out by his bogus bugs. Also, being insects with very little brains and only impulse centers, they should be immune to charm and mental effects.

Hack away for a while and you will get a message saying you chopped off a bit. Then head back to the castle.

But they wont need cash to buy the spells... They can spend that thousand gold or whatever on something else, like another level of training.

 

Edit. Also, they wouldn't need to spend thousands on buying creations. They could just wait till they get the creation desired from a canister, which in the long run saves more money for training.

 

Lots of potential here.

In G3.

 

Well, any version for that matter, but I am basing my question on G3.

 

I have been thinking about that a lot. Tactically. Strategically. I have had canister crazy Agents, Shapers, and a Hunter Guardian... The Guardian turned out more like the Terminator at the end.

 

Agents get spells, stats, and skills, but the creation canisters don't do them much good. The canister buffed Agent shouldn't need to be discussed by now.

 

Shapers get creations and spells. Most of the stat canisters don't do them a lot of good. I mean, they don't do a whole lot for Shapers, because Shapers are not physical sorts. They sort of just play a passive game, unless of course you have a jacked up Bullseye Shaper. On canisters. (Shudder, have to try that) Skills are iffy... Shapers don't get much out of melee.

 

Guardians. Guardians have a lot to build. Leadership, mechanics, luck, physical stats, melee skills, some shaping skills, skill points get tight quickly.

 

I have been thinking about this a lot, the Guardian. You can buy two levels of magic at the keep, which is cheaper than a Guardian trying to train in any magic skills.

 

Canisters seem to do a lot for Guardians. Magic boosts and spell additions allow a lot of cash to be saved for training elsewhere... Like, if you buy two levels of blessing magic, and get the third level from a canister, that allows you to use speed. Buy two levels of mental magic, and you can get a few more from canisters and items, and a Guardian should be able to cast Strong Daze with out actually spending a single skill point in magic skills. For spellcraft, there are charms and various items. There are a lot of magic boosting items actually... Those gloves, the tribal fetish that increases blessing magic. And there are a bunch of charms of mental focus, you can even make one as I recall. The Agent's Cloak. I think with a little effort that you can get every magic skill to 4 with no effort from canisters and common items. 2 from a trainer, canisters, and the cloak. And then there are the gloves, which add to battle and mental, the tribal fetish which adds to blessing... So it is possible to jack up to five. Maybe more with some items.

 

The Guardian has a lot of untapped potential to become completely jacked, magic, shaping, and melee... A jack of all trades, but will he become the master of none?

 

I remember how powerful my canister using hunter was, and how I left so many aspects of his build go to waste. I ignored magic. I see now, with the right items, the Guardian could, at least in theory, become a halfway decent mage. With strong missile weapon support and a couple of the right creations, it should be enough.

 

I think the Guardian could potentially get more out of canisters than the other classes. Maybe not the most in terms out power... No, not that at all, but the most use. I need to make another rebuild of Deadeye.

Dolldrums are common... You either need a new baton, more skills, or a strong re-evaluation of what you need to be doing at that point.

You do very well on the averages. Some places there is a lot of dialog and text, and other places, not so much.

I find Jeff, with your conversations and where they happen, and I don't know if this was intentional or not, but I started noticing it in Exile III... That often there is a lot of combat. Especially areas of heavy combat, and in the middle of it all is some kind of cool down dialog that allows the jittery nerves and jangled emotions to cool down a bit. Either that, or just when you are growing weary of constant unending combat, somebody taunts you to get you fired up and make you pissed. A good example is Rentar and how she taunts you, and your feeling a bit worn down from the unending combat in her fortress. (Exile III)

In short, all of your dialog tends to happen right when the game really needs it. And it's not that dreadful Final Fantasy type dialog either... HAHAHA! I kill you now blah blah blah.

Dialog is probably the one reason I keep playing these games.

I love the suprise dialogs, like the one I sent the screen shot to you of during beta testing AVIV, about the lizard when you talk to it.

In all reality, the Awakened are just Takers with sweeter words and empty promises... With very strong Shaper tendencies to enslave other creatures. Thinking long and hard about it, they are the worst of both worlds. The Barrier of Winds employs slavery for their own benefit. They speak a great deal of peace and bartering, but are preparing an army to take what they need by force.

 

At least the Rebels are more open about what they want and don't try to hide their real agenda under a thin veil of pretty words.

Brings to mind the current conflict of Western Values vs Arab values and the Religion of Peace. Both sides are extremists, and boy howdy, how so.

I type in my sleep. Some times I doze off a bit and I keep typing. Sort of like how people doze off at the wheel of a car but keep driving. I probably had my hands on the keyboard, but who knows what I was doing.

I woke up after one such doze to find that I had typed the words "Evil monkey dentists root canal vasectomy."

I have no clue what that means.