Character/Party Generation Guide?

[DrPraetorious2]

Basic question -

In A2:CS, do Humans get more traits than in A1:EftP, or do Demihumans get *less*?

I'm sure I'll notice pretty quickly, but if L30 humans get 23 traits and Demihumans get 16, then Demihumans are playable if slightly inferior (well, Slith anyway).

If Humans get 16 and Demihumans get 8, then Demihumans are screwed.

 

So, does any of the advice from this FAQ not apply:

http://www.gamefaqs.com/pc/641828-avernum-escape-from-the-pit/faqs/64127 ??

 

Two relevant threads cover some topics:

http://spiderwebforums.ipbhost.com/index.php?/topic/21072-tool-use-and-cave-lore/

http://spiderwebforums.ipbhost.com/index.php?/topic/21028-a2cs-first-look-at-balance-updates/

 

- Dual-wielding is now less dominant, and Shields are now better, so that's nice; but is it decisive? I'm thinking it isn't.

- Polearms are likewise better, and maybe worth saving the skillpoints vs. Dual-wielding (especially on a Warrior/Priest, for example). So such a character might be able to get by as a Slith?

- I vaguely recall (and spoilers seem to confirm) that in Exile 2 there were social advantages to having at least 1 Slith in the party. Do these still apply and how much are they worth?

- Are missile weapons (and thus perhaps Nephil?) better now?

- In A1:EftP, Cave Lore was worth buying (with money): http://spiderwebforums.ipbhost.com/index.php?/topic/18667-value-of-cave-lore/ - are there substantially fewer caches now?

[Lilith]

Humans get a total of 24 (the bonus traits are at levels 2, 6, 10 and so on, so they end up with a total of 8 bonus traits at level 30), while nephilim and slithzerikai end up with 16.

 

Dual-wielding still ends up ahead of other melee options, but it takes longer. I ended up switching my sword user from sword-and-shield to dual-wielding early in Chapter 4, and she's now outdamaging my polearm user, but not by a huge margin (and she occasionally has accuracy problems against bosses).

 

Polearm users have fewer useful traits compared to dual-wielders and spellcasters, so a polearm-wielding slith won't be at a massive disadvantage, although they may have to pass up a potentially useful trait here and there. It may not be mechanically optimal but having a slith in your party does unlock some neat dialogue options in various places, although nearly all of them are just for flavour. There's one place where you can get cheap priest spells for having a slith in your party; most of those spells, but not all, can be acquired for comparable prices elsewhere. Likewise, a pure archer won't suffer too much for being a nephil.

 

Missile weapons have been given a bit of a boost but are still generally inferior damage-wise to other options. While being able to attack at range can be useful, spellcasters can do that too.

 

There are still plenty of caches, but the quality of the items in them seems to have been downgraded somewhat.

[ex post slarto]

Humans get more than in A:EFTP.

 

Much of the general advice in that guide still applies, especially about tactics, but there have been some nuanced shifts -- more having to do with timing of exploration and availability of certain stuff than with changes in mechanics, really.

 

Dual-wielding is less dominant, but polearms have only been slightly buffed. They compare OK against swords now, but eventually do a bit worse (because Flaming Sword) even for single-wielding sword users. Both attacks still pale compared to magic. Sliths aren't unplayably bad, but they are still suboptimal compared to humans. 8 traits is a lot.

 

Missile weapons received a slight buff, but they are still weaker than other attack types. Not unplayably bad, but visibly suboptimal.

 

Wow, I didn't see that thread on Cave Lore -- cool! It's possible that I am undervaluing the contents of the caches. Even in that analysis, though, you only gain a little bit, and it's at a cost of a large investment of money early on when it could instead go directly into valuable training or spells... also, there is 1 less free point in A2:CS and the training is a little more expensive. I actually already made a list of cache contents by CL requirement by grepping Randomizer's list; it may not be quite complete but assume it will have most things, so can give us a rough estimate if someone wants to tally the value of its contents:

 

1100 gold:

[CL 2 or less] - healing potion

[CL 2] - lightning scroll

 

2200 gold:

[CL 3] - fiery wand

[CL 3 or less] - razordisk (6)

[CL 3 or less] - energy potion

[CL 3 or less] - healing elixir (west of purple tree west of Coffin Caves)

[CL 3 or less] - graymold

 

3300 gold:

[CL 4] - battle crystal

 

4400 gold:

[CL 5 or less] - healing elixir

[CL 5 or less] gold necklace

[CL 5 or less] - powerlash scroll

[CL 5 or less] - fine steel

[CL 5] - return life scroll

[CL 5] - gold necklace

 

5500 gold:

[6 or less] - invulnerability potion

[CL 6 or less] - Momentum Gauntlets (5% armor, -5% to hit chance, encumbers mages, +1 Quick Action, +1 Lethal Blow)

[CL 6 or less] - acid shower scroll

[CL 6 or less] - lemonwood longbow

[CL 6 or less] - fine leather

[CL 6 or less] - energy elixir

[CL 6 or less] - speed elixir

[CL 6 or less] - wand of death

[CL 6 or less] - ensnaring wand

[CL 6 or less] - speed burst scroll

[CL 6 or less] - invulnerability potion

[CL 6] - speed elixir

[CL 6] - return life scroll

[CL 6] - Foil Helm (4% armor, -5% to hit chance, +20% mind effects res., --1 INT, +1 Luck)

[CL 6] - wisdom crystal

[CL 6] - energy elixir

[CL 6-7] - Rod of Succor

 

6600 gold:

[CL 7] - focusing crystal

[CL 7] - platinum ring

[CL 7] - speed elixir

[CL 7] - armor elixir

[CL 7] - fine razordisks (6)

 

7700 gold:

[CL 8] - fine steel waveblade

[CL 8-9] - rod of alacrity

[CL 8-10] - Blessed Breastplate

 

8800 gold:

[CL 9 or less] - crystalline wand

[CL 9 or less] Ten Blessings Band (4% armor, +1% to evade,+10% to blessings/curses you cause, +5% to healing)

[CL 9] - wisdom crystal

[CL 9] - corruption baton

 

9900 gold:

[CL 10] - rod of defense

 

11000 gold:

[CL 11] - First Expedition Ring (+2 Luck, +3 First Aid, +2 Cave Lore)

[CL 12] - Putrified Gauntlets (9% armor, -1 STR, -1 DEX, +50% acid res., +8% magical damage)

[Mechalibur]

Difficulty-wise, this game seems more manageable early on compared to EftP on torment, bit the late game fights can get quite difficult. It might make dual wielding worth the extra wait.

[DrPraetorious2]

In the previous game, you could offset armor penalty by wielding a longbow; this is no longer the case. Also shields and helmets are both better, so Swordmage becomes a going concern.

 

HOWEVER - does the +10% critical chance bonus for a longbow apply to melee or spells?

[Lilith]

HOWEVER - does the +10% critical chance bonus for a longbow apply to melee or spells?

 

Yes, both.

[Sudanna]

Do those bonuses apply whenever you have an item equipped, or just when it's selected as your default attack?

[Mechalibur]

You get the bonus as long as it's equipped.

[ex post slarto]

Note that there is a difference between "+X% to critical hit" abilities and attacks that say, under the attack, "critical damage (25%)" or the like. The latter only affect regular attacks with that weapon (i.e., not even battle disciplines); the former affects all attacks of any sort that you make.

[Juan Carlo]

Random question I can't find answered anywhere: Which skills count toward battle disciplines? Is it just polearms/melee/bows and thrown weapons? Or do the top tier warrior skills count too?

[Lilith]

Random question I can't find answered anywhere: Which skills count toward battle disciplines? Is it just polearms/melee/bows and thrown weapons?

 

Just those,