Fledgling Fyora Tigerwave Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 Hi There, I just build Khalida as a level 25 sharpshooter. I thought it would be fun to maximize her critical-hit chance and so I did. Technically she has a critical-hit chance of 105% which, according to my logic, should mean that she always makes her critical hit. Somehow this is NOT the case. She has a lot of critical hits but definitely not all. Am I missing something here? I invested the full 8 points in the two skills bottem left and center. Plus all specializations in center. That makes archery 8 (=30%) and path of the blade 11 (=+25%=55). Besides that there is a chain (10%), boots and belt (both 5%), scarab (10%), greaves (10%), artifact (10%) which makes for 100% already. There is one other 5% item but it should not even be necessary. Why do these percentages not just add up (like for instance ability recharge items do)? Hope someone can help me out here cause I don't understand what's going on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Lilith Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 I believe critical hit rate caps out at 50%. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Aoslare Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 Huh. Really? That's too bad... Did that observation come from anywhere in particular, Lilith? (Not doubting it at all, just curious.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Lilith Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 From the most reliable source of all: I vaguely remember reading it somewhere. It'd make some sense, since we know that parry chance has a 50% cap -- I wouldn't bet my house on critical hits working the same way, but it does fit the observed data here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Aoslare Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 I know that parry cap existed in previous games, but do we know that it is a thing in Avadon? That's in the same general category of stuff that did receive a lot of minor changes after A6. Tigerwave, question for ya. About how often DO you get crits, if you've noticed? Is it closer to 50%, 75%, 95%...? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Randomizer Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 I remember from Avadon beta testing that Jeff changed item descriptions to keep Parry about 50%. I don't doubt that he put in other limits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Aoslare Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 What do you mean "changed item descriptions"? Do you mean he changed the stats on individual items to avoid people having total parry over 50%? Either way I can't dig up any posts that talk about a 50% cap on parry *or* on crits. Can we substantiate these at all? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Randomizer Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 Jeff looked at my blademaster build and change a blademaster only item so it was no longer path of the shield giving parry. I'd have to dig out the old beta, but it brought parry down from about 65% to 50%. I think you could get more parry, but only by using an item that gave inferior overall armor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fledgling Fyora Tigerwave Posted February 22, 2014 Author Share Posted February 22, 2014 I know that parry cap existed in previous games, but do we know that it is a thing in Avadon? That's in the same general category of stuff that did receive a lot of minor changes after A6. Tigerwave, question for ya. About how often DO you get crits, if you've noticed? Is it closer to 50%, 75%, 95%...? I've been testing this since I can't seem to find figures about this. I actually made two series of hundred and twice came at about 85 (like 87 and 86). That wasn't what I expected. If it is capped, which it indeed seems to be, then it would logically be something like 75%. At least that's what I would expect. Maybe it is capped at 75% for certain items/abilities and the artifact or the scarab are able to give that xtra 10 %. I would be nice if someone would be able to find these figures. It does make sense that certain things are capped, but I think it would also be nice if these figures where simply given in the game description or in the game itself. Would make it easier to distribute items amongst partymembers. With my melee blademaster I have been testing some other figures which are easier to test. Turns out there are some strange things going on there that I don't et either. First there is the '... less time to recharge abilities'. I got this one to 61%. Combined with +75% to blessings/curses and 'call of the frenzy' swings your party into a near-constant state of frenzy. I have not been able to detect a certain cap concerning these two abilities. The weird thing however is that there seems to be a big randomness factor involved here. Sometimes 'call of the frenzy' needs only 5 turns to recharge and sometimes it needs10. And sometimes it is somewhere in between with 7 or 8 turns. Besides that the actual numbers of turns in frenzy that I get also differ from time to time and from one partymember to the other. The other skills seem to be much more consistent except for stunning bash which quite often returns in the next turn! I have somewhat stopped trying to understand these since it works great in practive and is reliable enough. If however someone can enlighten it that would be very welcome. Thnx! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Aoslare Posted February 23, 2014 Share Posted February 23, 2014 I can help out with some of that. "X% less time to recharge" This is misleading. These items all function SEPARATELY. Each turn, each item has the listed % chance to reduce your recharge time by 1. (I think this is a separate chance for each spell/attack, but can't remember -- I haven't used that in a while.) That's why you'll sometimes get multiple reductions at once and other times, nothing. "+X% to blessings/cursings" This does 2 things. On curses, it increases your % chance of success. This is a simple, additive increase (just like for to-hit chance on weapon attacks). On blessings, it increases the duration of your blessings. Note that a lot of blessings have some random variation to begin with, and this is a multiplicative increase (i.e., at a total of 150%, your blessings will last 150% as long). I believe the bonuses are added together into one single bonus before they are applied. I'm also not sure if this rounds up or down. The 85% average is interesting. It's not impossible that the actual cap is slightly higher or lower and you just got somewhat higher or lower than average results from your tests. Besides the scenario you suggested, the other thing that seems plausible: That all abilities proc separately. This would reduce your results compared to adding them together. With adding two 50% abilities would give you 100% crits, with separate chances they'd give you 75% crits. If you don't mind, would you list out all the separate crit% boosters you have on (on items, etc.) plus what you have in the skill that boosts crits? Additionally, can you list what part of that skilled is (a) manually trained, ( from the level 5/15/25 bonuses, or © from items? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fledgling Fyora Tigerwave Posted February 24, 2014 Author Share Posted February 24, 2014 "X% less time to recharge" This is misleading. These items all function SEPARATELY. First of all thank you very much for clarifying these issues. It seems that I have chosen a build with a lot of randomness/variations. Which is not too bad since the unpredictability factor keeps the game surprising. I would however like to understand the game mechanics a bit more. What you're saying is that these items all work seperately. But then again there are two factors of importance which are decided at the moment that I use an ability (because the recharge time is fixed immediately): 1) Does the item reduce my recharge time 2) How much does the item reduce my recharge time And the question is what the percentage of the reducing item is actually pointing at. What I understand from your post is that only factor 1 is taken into account. And if this is a yes the time is reduced with 1 turn. What I have noticed however is that often the time is reduced with more than one turn. For instance with call of the frenzy I can reduce the recharge time to 4 or 5 turns (normally 15) while I have only 6 items on me that allow for reduction. So someway it is far more effective than it should be. Quote: Note that a lot of blessings have some random variation to begin with. How do you know this? And do you happen to know if there is some reasoning behind this? In my experience it is quite stable but there are indeed often if not always (pretty small) variations. A lot smaller at least than with the reduction time. Quote: If you don't mind, would you list out all the separate crit% boosters you have on That's not too much of a hassle :-) (And I also have a question about this by the way) First there is bow training with a 30% maximum (lvl 3-8) That adds up to path of the blade with 25% (8+3 = lvl7-11) 10% scorched greaves 10% tawon emblem 5% deepfang boots 5% scorched girdle 10% Heartseeker Scarab 10% Avadon Accuracy Totem So that's how I got to 105%. After testing this I have reduced it to 85% since this somehow seems to be the max. Another question: Do you think that the critical hit chance of the Valyrian Saber 10% would also work when I shoot arrows. The obvous answer would be no but I'm just not sure. I also added another 3% critical hit chance to this saber with a stone by the way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Randomizer Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Items that reduce fatigue each round have that percentage chance of that item working. So if you have 6 items, then each items is checked separately and for each one that works an additional fatigue round is removed. This means that every round you have the normal reduction and six chances of additional reductions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Aoslare Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Randomizer is right. The game does not actually care how many rounds it takes to recharge, what it tracks is "fatigue remaining before this skill can be used again." The total # of rounds it takes for your skill to recharge is the RESULT of all your chances to recharge; it is never calculated directly. Tigerwave, important question: are all 8 points of your bow training manually trained, or do any of those points come from items or from the level 5/15/25 column bonuses? For Path of the Blade, is it 8 points manually trained + 3 column points, or do you have any items contributing? The Valyrian Saber will affect your archery too, yes. With what you listed, it's 105% additively or 73% multiplicatively, neither of which is 85%. So I dunno. Now that you've removed 20% from items, do you notice any reduction in critical hits scored? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fledgling Fyora Tigerwave Posted February 25, 2014 Author Share Posted February 25, 2014 I think I get it when it comes to the fatique. Bow training is all manually. All three column bonusses are in the middle. I have no items on me altering path of the blade. It's nice that the saber influences the bow (and probably also damage from spells/scarabs etc.) even though it is kind of strange. I have not really tested the critical hits anymore but I might do this one more time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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