mikeprichard

It's in the SW Barracks in Monitor Base C (the Corruption). BTW, you can do a "find" search in Randomizer's "Synergizer's Item List" for this type of info, unless you really don't want to risk seeing any spoiler-y info in your peripheral vision.

I resurrected this thread to edit my list above with the slime and roach plague numbers (thanks qella!), and also noticed this issue - but just remember, "unfriendly" towns like Colchis aren't affected by the plague, so they're intentionally not mentioned in the list.

Thanks - I do (have the time) and I did (email Jeff), so I guess we'll find out whether he considered any of our suggestions when Avadon 3 comes out in a few years. Take it easy, all!

Good point; maybe that's what Jeff was going for then. Based on their descriptions, it would seem more logical for at least some of these skills to use STR, but at least there is a "method." Anyway, I get the impression Jeff doesn't have the time/inclination to read through the forums. So do any of the veterans think it would be appropriate for me to email him directly about this thread to draw his attention to things some fans might like to see in the next installment? Or is this whole exercise just academic?

Right - I meant to include Earthshatter with Earthquake, and those other physical/melee-type-damage Blademaster/Shadowwalker skills also use DEX when it would make more sense for them to key off STR - or at least not only DEX. I also forgot about the strange ranged weapon modifier for Icy Lance. So does anyone know what's up with these - i.e. were any of these stat mechanics intentional on Jeff's part, and if so, why?

Cool, thanks Lilith. Going back to the shaman DEX-vs.-INT thing - was Jeff ever planning to "fix" Call the Storm's and Earthquake's use of DEX (i.e. make them use INT instead) after Avadon 1, and just forgot to change this for Avadon 2? Or was this intentional, and if so, why? Just wondering whether any previous beta testers have some inside info.

Ha, no argument there.

Exactly. The whole thing seems pretty tacked-on, as you don't have much time to actually interact/develop a relationship with the scout in-game. I appreciate that Jeff is trying something new, and he obviously doesn't have a AAA budget to throw around, but the way the "romance" was implemented, I don't think it adds anything to the game.

That makes more sense then - so I guess ignoring END is really only viable on Casual or Normal. BTW, for a playthrough on Hard/Torment as a melee-focused character (I'm thinking Tinkermage), what would be a recommended STR-vs.-END stat point distribution by Level 30?

About emphasizing END vs. the "class" stat for each character (STR for melee characters, DEX for ranged, or INT for (most) magic): on Normal difficulty, I found diverting points from the class stat to END made a much weaker build overall. The character could take a little more damage, but since he/she would do a lot less damage and hit less often, he/she ended up getting into longer fights and taking more punishment in the long run anyway. So though I haven't played on harder difficulties myself, I'd think this problem would be even worse on Hard or Torment - i.e. increasing END by a few points only gives another (say) 30-40 hit points, while the cold/acid/poison resistance doesn't seem significant (or in the case of cold resist, doesn't seem to actually work as intended according to the tooltip); on the other hand, being able to hit and do damage (with more STR/DEX/INT) would be essential. So is there really any reason from a power-gaming perspective to nerf a character's class stat in favor of a few more END? I just don't see it.

Thanks for the info - that's what I figured. I'll still definitely buy Avadon 3, but I guess it's back to Avernum for the non-linear goodness.

True - I'm sure many players will reach the level cap a little later than I did. I guess I'm just disappointed in its apparent use as another way to "force" a static level of challenge on the entire game (with the exception of a couple token "challenge" fights). Upping the difficulty level doesn't fix this problem - it just makes every combat harder by a static degree. Although I still like Avadon overall, what I really enjoyed about the older Exiles/Avernums was the well-implemented non-linearity, which allowed some players to explore and develop more, and as a result, see their characters grow in power relative to earlier challenges. As it is, Avadon aims for mass appeal with the static challenge level. The result is "balanced" difficulty throughout any one playthrough, but in my mind, this eliminates the fun of character growth that's central to so many truly great classic RPGs.

I posted about this elsewhere, but who else would like the level cap to be raised/removed? Although I did complete all the available side quests up to that point, I hit the cap during the Hunting M****** main quest - about 2/3 of the way through the game. Apparently there was talk of raising the cap after Avadon 1, but for some reason it didn't happen. Discuss.

(Mild spoiler) After a certain point in the game, when you enter the basement for the third time, you'll find a surprise, with a pretty good reward. (If you want to be totally spoiled, check out Synergizer's Item List.) Otherwise, the only apparent reasons to own the house are the bragging rights.

LINDYLOU - as far as I can tell, all stairs/ladders/trapdoors that can actually be used are in fact permanently marked on the area map after they first come within view of your party; I remember there were one or two "dummy" (i.e. unusable) trapdoors that didn't, so maybe you're thinking of those? But I could be wrong and be forgetting something - it's a fairly big game.

Yeah, that's what I was implying.

These gameplay choices seem to have become more common in Jeff's more recent titles, tying back to the fact that his more recent games - especially Avadon - are much more consciously linear than the early Exiles/Avernums. Because of this, it seems he's put a lot of effort into making sure the player has a fairly even level of challenge throughout the entire game by essentially "forcing" you into only attempting certain challenges at certain seemingly arbitrary points in the game; although a lot of gamers appreciate this "balance", one negative aspect of this is the lack of a sense of freedom you describe.

Yeah, I'm not a big fan of the cap either... maybe Jeff will finally ditch it for Avadon 3.

Just wanted to reiterate that - at least on Normal - splitting attribute increases doesn't seem to be optimal. If you want a melee tinkermage party, you can't go wrong with two all-STR tinkermages (you and Alcander), and an all-INT shaman (or, from what others have said, maybe a sorcerer). You can safely ignore END/DEX for all characters completely outside the automatic increases; if you use the healing scarabs on your main character and focus on healing as well as spirit claw for your shaman, you'll have plenty of healing to balance your lower HP (due to lower END) for the tougher fights.

The difficulty you're having might have to do with using a DEX-heavy build, which is nowhere near as effective as in Avadon 1. I'm personally using a tinkermage as my main character (maxing STR exclusively at every level, with the middle skill tree maxed and the right tree as secondary), Alcander (using the same stat/skill distribution as my main character), and Dedrik (INT exclusively, with the middle tree again maxed and the group heal and poison mist skills pumped up). With this group and the two tinkermages on melee, I've been tearing through basically all enemies/bosses like a buzzsaw. This is on Normal difficulty, though; not sure what difficulty level you're using. That said, the Spiderweb veterans seem to generally agree that a properly built tinkermage is the only way to powergame.

By the way, is anybody working on/planning a character stats/skills editor? I'd like to simulate removing the level cap by adding a couple points to skills whenever I've earned enough XP to get to what would be level 31, 32, etc. I know a lot of people won't agree, but I think hitting the level cap only 2/3 of the way through the game is pretty lame.

I actually think the real underlying "problem" with Avadon character development is the fact that the gameplay is much more linear than Exile/Avernum, so your characters basically always correspond in strength to the available enemies throughout the game. This is clearly an intentional gameplay balance choice on Jeff's part, but IMHO, it kills the feeling of character growth that's essential to a fun RPG. For example, in Exile/Avernum - especially the earlier titles - you could choose to visit lots of places with enemies significantly stronger than your characters at any point in the game. Yes, most people wouldn't actually do so, but it was extremely satisfying to challenge yourself against enemies two or three - or even ten - levels higher than you; through good strategy and even a little luck, you might score a victory and some great loot - or if not, you could come back later and actually get a feel for how much stronger you've become. By contrast, in Avadon (and other linear RPGs), there's an even difficulty throughout most of the game - one or two token "challenge" fights excepted. Again, yes, this can be good - but not if you're forced into it. That's why more free-roaming/”open-world” games, like Spiderweb's earlier titles, have always been much more satisfying to me, while Avadon - though better than your average game - has just felt bland. (On a side note, I'm really, really looking forward to the remake of Avernum 3 down the road. With its dynamic and huge game world, it’s my favorite Spiderweb title.) Anyway, of course there’s no objective “right” or “wrong” in this whole debate on character development in linear vs. open-world RPGs – and I fully understand that just because a game is “open-world,” doesn’t mean the gameplay is necessarily done right – but it is what it is.

Lilith - darn, that's what I was afraid of... thanks for confirming though!

Anybody know of a way to do this? I'm in the middle of the "Hunting M******" quest (which I'm guessing is around 2/3 of the way through the game), and have already hit level 30. Granted, I've explored every available map and done every side quest so far, but I know I'm not the only thorough gamer out there, and hitting the cap so early kills a lot of the fun for me - I'd love to try out new/improved skills, etc.

Huh... in my Windows 7 game, even with melee selected as default, clicking on a snare/mine in combat simply gives the message "Disarm Mine: Too far away. Move next to it before trying to disarm it." Is there something you changed in the game settings to fix this? And good point about the inventory screen keyboard shortcut issue - but it would still make sense to me to have the toggle as an option (and it would especially make sense for other screens, like the journal and character sheet).