Magical Efficiency doesn't work on arcane blow??

[EvilEye]

With 20 in magical efficiency arcane blow still takes 25 energy every time. Every other spell I cast doesn't use the full amount, but arcane blow is always 25 energy.

 

Is this a bug?

[Alorael at Large]

It's a bug if that's really the case. How many times have you tried it?

 

—Alorael, who has never heard of ME having that problem. Then again, from the (probably undeserved in A5) reputation of ME, there may just not be enough testing.

[EvilEye]

Oh, I dunno, about 50 or so.

[EvilEye]

Well it looks like Magical Efficiency is REALLY, REALLY bugged.

 

Seems some spells are not effected at all, and some are.

 

I edited my ME up to level 41, and spells like divine retribution cost no energy every time I cast it. On the other hand some spells always cost the full amount ( divine fire, icy rain, arcane blow ).

 

A level 41 MEF is possible, although probably a waste.

[Synergy]

Curiouser and curiouser.

 

It seems it might be intentional considering ME is not effective specifically on most the most damaging assault spells. But what about Fireblast? That is actually the most damaging spell in the game.

 

-S-

[EvilEye]

Fireblast is not the most damaging spell. Fireblast is about the same as Divine Fire ( 1-5 per level ).

 

Arcane blow is the most damaging ( 1-6 per level ).

 

All 3 of these spells do not work with magical efficiency according to my testing.

 

However lightning spray, divine retribution, bolt of fire, arcane shield, divine restoration and many others do. In fact, with 40 in magical efficiency, all of the above mentioned spells cost 0 energy to cast, every time ( or at least every time I tested ).

[Synergy]

Fireblast goes up to 8 levels. Divine Fire maxed at 6 levels, I think it was. I tested directly, using both spells on the same foes back to back. Fireblast was doing around 150 damage, while Divine Fire was doing 110-120 damage. Arcane Blow you only get up to level 3 or 4, but I rarely use it. It never seems to do as much as I expect it to when I do. It might have a higher multiplier, but I think with 8 levels of Fireblast vs.3 or 4 of Arcane Blow, Fireblast might still come out ahead, and certainly more efficient.

 

-S-

[EvilEye]

It works like this according to my understanding ( and testing ):

 

base damage for fireblast: 1-5 per point ( 3 average )

 

base damage for arcane blow: 1-6 per point ( 3.5 average )

 

total points = mage spells + spellcraft + magery + spell level

 

So lets say 15 mage spells + 15 spellcraft + 15 magery = 45 points

 

+ 8 for fireblast

 

lets say +3 for arcane blow

 

fireblast: ( 45 + 8 ) x 3 = 159 average damage

 

arcane blow: ( 45 + 3 ) x 3.5 = 168 average damage

 

And arcane blow will become more ahead the more points you have in mage spells / spellcraft / magery.

 

Also magic damage is not as resisted as fire damage.

 

*EDIT* if you are going to use a fire spell divine retribution DOES benefit from magical efficiency and hits everything on the screen. At a high level of MEF ( around 20 or so ) it becomes cheaper then fireblast, and if you have enough enemies or enemies that are spread out, it does more damage.

[ex post slarto]

evileye is correct about the damage. There are no caps.

 

I thought I used Arcane Blow on one or the other of my ME tests, and it worked just like any other spell. But I could be misremembering. An odd bug if that really is what happens.

[EvilEye]

Well perhaps someone could just test this so I can confirm its not just something weird about my computer...

 

Its not just arcane blow, divine fire, fireblast and icy rain are also not working with magical efficiency.

[ex post slarto]

Weird! I just tested and the same bug is present for me. It only seems to affect the area of effect damage spells.

[Rowen]

My tests (I just reloaded a saved file and fought through the Loyalist tower to test each spell) shows me that arcane blow does more damage the fire blast and that ME doesnt save any mp points when I cast it. Over all, my tests match up to what EvilEye said.

[Synergy]

It will also depend on the foe. While energy resistance is rarer, there are some things fire will damage more. It may have happened to be the case when I noticed Arcane Blow doesn't seem as punchy as it ought to be, and then again, I rarely thought to even use it at all. But I maintain that Fireblast works more powerfully than Divine Fire. Matt also makes that claim in his A5 FAQ.

 

-S-

[ex post slarto]

The formulas for spell damage are extremely clear. They are written in the instructions and can be confirmed by looking at the game data.

 

Divine Fire does 6 damage plus 1-5 per level of Divine Fire skill, Priest Spells, Spellcraft, and Magery.

 

Fireblast does 14 damage plus 1-5 per level of Fireblast skill, Mage Spells, Spellcraft, and Magery.

 

Arcane Blow does 30 damage plus 1-6 per level of Arcane Blow skill, Mage Spells, Spellcraft, and Magery.

 

Arcane Blow is definitely more powerful, though note that this was NOT the case in A4. Fireblast is slightly stronger than Divine Fire, but since the multiplier is the same, the damage difference will always be exactly 8 (before resistance is applied). If there is a greater difference, it's either due to putting more points in Mage Spells than Priest Spells, or is random variation.

[Sleeping Dragon]

Though I can't back this up with facts, I think I've noticed that more monsters seem resistant to arcane blow than to fireblast, primarily the tougher wizards and other spellcasters. So I often find myself using fireblast more often even after I discover arcane blow. Is there any truth in this?

[Evnissyen]

I myself was a little disappointed that the higher priest spells seemed to be compounding on the fire theme, and Divine Fire and Divine Retribution seemed to amount to very nearly the same thing except for spellpoint cost (I seem to remember ME not helping much there, actually) and a certain difference in damage, so that Divine Retribution ended up being too costly for its effectiveness, if I remember correctly... . Maybe there was just one too many of the massive-damage area fire spells. A top-level energy spell for my priest character would've been nice for fire-resistant creatures. Maybe a mid-level energy spell as well, to match with the mage's Lightning Spray.

 

[Lilith]

The difference between Divine Fire and Divine Retribution is that Divine Retribution hits everything on screen. It actually does less damage than Divine Fire, but it's great for taking out huge swarms.

 

I think the fact that priestly offensive magic is less versatile is a good game balance decision. If priest spells could deal out as much damage of as many different types as mage spells could, there'd be precious little reason not to join the Anama. (Well, okay, there'd still be Haste.)

 

I wouldn't mind if Arcane Blow were upgraded to a hit-all-on-screen spell too, though.

[Synergy]

I've always wished that priests were truly divided from mages in that they do not damage anything other than with Repel Spirit, which would seem like a priestly ability — abolishing the dead. Let mages wield the fire and ice. Priests should seem more....priestly. This would shift strategy in party build a bit, I'd imagine. Going back to the six person party, in which you'd have a truly dedicated thief/rogue and a dedicated archer who wielded some real punch, (but only by being a dedicated archer), might also be more gratifying for variation and role play.

 

-S-

[Evnissyen]

Ah, yes... now I remember... the extended area attribute.

 

As for priestly power... I think it would make for a boring character if the priest couldn't cast high-damage attack spells... although, if the priest were given some interesting new spells that were more like tricks and manipulation spells rather than blind destruction, while still causing great damage: that might make for a more interesting game. But I don't want a character who can only 'bless' and can't cause lots of damage.

 

I also don't think I'd want a six-person party system. Three is enough for me. Fighter, Mage, Priest. The problem I see with having very specialized characters, such as building one for thievery, another for blessing, another for bows (which really are too weak, I think), and then two or three damage makers... is that you end up with characters who often cannot really do anything substantive in a fight, so that you end up either having them employing weak attacks that cause very little or no damage, or else you have to keep hitting the space bar to every round to pass by them. And then they always drain the party of XP. That's why I prefer to streamline my parties into two or three powerful and versatile characters.

 

[ex post slarto]

Six really was too many... in Exile it was a holdover from the Gold Box games, in which the party regularly faced huge swarms. Without that aspect I think it just slows down a lot of different aspects of play.

[Swivelable]

Is there any way to know how many levels of a spell the caster has?

[Sleeping Dragon]

In the training window, look in the upper right corner for the button that says something like "see spells/skills".