Nim

I think there was some discussion years ago that the creations we shape are not the same as those you see grown in vats ? Might serve as an explanation, you can shape a drakon on the spot for combat but he is essentially just a body without much mind of his own ?

 

I like your dominance theory, Ghaldring has never been one to share power, creating too many contenders would be foolhardy in his position. Especially when you consider that the drakons try to improve every generation.

Moral discussions do tend to take a backseat during war though, especially if it is a total war. And yes, Jeff did choose this direction when he made the shapers a ridiculously powerful empire. There was never any other way but total war if a rebellion wanted to have even the slightest chance of success. How else could you beat a 2 continent empire with millions of subjects whose elite can not only use magic but also shape ?

@Nim: Ah, I see. And no, I don't think that justifies it entirely, I'm saying that at least would be an argument that could be made if you have that happen. As it is right now, Harmony Island shows the Rebellion is all about scorched earth, and isn't trying to show off why they're right and the Shapers are wrong.

The time for moral discussions, right and wrong was in G1&2. Once the war started all that ceased to be important. I don't like it but it's the direction Jeff chose for the series.

 

The only people they're hurting here is a community of normal people, and the serviles of the island. Nothing else is being accomplished, not even really doing anything to the Shapers, as Diwaniya doesn't seem the type to leave to help, he'd have just squatted on his island til the crisis is past. At least if you make the herbs something used in shaping, attacking the island has a strategic point.

Attacking it with spawners is dumb regardless of whether Harmony has any strategic value or not. As you said, everyone but Diwaniya gets hurt while he is the only threat to the rebellion. But if you kill him off then gameplay on Harmony goes poof.

@Nim: Like, totally dude. I actually have no idea how else to respond to that, as I'm not sure what it means.

Seriously ? You don't get how ridiculous you sound when you try to frame the shapers for the rebels murder of innocents ? Oh if the shapers only hadn't done this or that the rebels wouldn't have had to kill all those gatherers ? Really ?

... Boom, it is now the fault of the Shapers that the Herb gathers got attacked, as if they didn't need the herbs for their art, the rebels would have had no reason to bother them...

Just....wow.

It seems possible that GOG somehow ended up with not-quite-the-latest-version.

Nah, the Mac version from here lacks it too.

z39northm.txt (PC) contains

 

beginstate START_STATE;

// clear zone?

if ((zone_clear(ME) == FALSE) && (get_flag(37,16) > 0) && (get_flag(40,17) > 0) && (get_flag(38,2) > 0)) {

clear_zone(37);

clear_zone(38);

clear_zone(39);

clear_zone(40);

 

 

 

Perhaps we are experiencing a different slowdown then. Your fix did not help me back in the day. Or perhaps I just did it incorrectly.

Both possible. Afaik there are a variety of issues that ForceDirectDrawEmulation solves but that doesn't mean there can't be other stuff it doesn't help with. Can't say I've seen many of those if any at all.

Guys, stop saying this can't be fixed / isn't a problem when we have a sticky for exactly this.

Shameless self-quote from http://spiderwebforu...em/#entry232161

GF2 menu screens pops up instant now again when hitting ESC like back in the day

The purity agent doesn't kill human rebels or drakons. That's not wiping out the rebellion, that's just weakening it. At a monumental cost to the shaper empire.

Please don't use Sage Taygen as a pro-shaper example for anything. He is just utterly nuts and so is his "plan". Destroying the economic foundation of shaper society so that he can kill a few rebels is just

OH GOD WHY

Putting points there (apart from 2 INT) is just not worth it. Make a clean save, absorb that cryoa and make 2 or 3 cryoas with just 2 points in INT. You should immediately see a difference in combat.

 

No mech and leadership means you miss out on quite a bit, usually not advised to start without, not even as a shaper.

No "Repair Moseh" quest ? Haven't talked to Alwan yet ? You really really want this, just for the easier passage in the barrier zone alone. And lvl 10 at that point with no mech or leadership and only ONE cryoa ? Did you upgrade that cryoa ? Never ever put anything into creation stats apart from 2 points INT. Just go with numbers and better creations once available.

Nobody cares when you wipe out Derenton and Poryphra ( well as long as you have the mission to go on). Same with the camps in the fens and the rebel safehouse. Or the shaper camp in the first chapter. So just go nuts

Well, because nobody gave me a quest to kill.

Koerner does. Poryphra Ruins.

Wiping out Derenton Freehold isn't hard, just a loooong slog.

Kinda curious now. Could you post that text ? If it isn't too much trouble.

Correct me if I'm wrong but this

Minor Variations in the Beginning of All Endings:

- Zakary (did not meet

- Barzahl (did not meet

cannot actually be done ingame. Iirc if you don't go meet Zak the first door in the Secret Tunnel is closed. And I think you can't leave for the council unless you have met them both ?

Does the door to the Geneforge even open that way ?

I'm curious because I like what Trajkov does, but the takers still piss me off.

So you like innocent serviles dying in minefields and to spawned rogues

Cannon =/= Canon. And for obvious reasons the canon ending can't really be too good or decisive.

 

Learned Dayna is in Medab, not sure about anyone else.

Why would you feel bad for the Obeyers ? They can get a great ending

 

 

Does this mean that you don't have to do anything at all (other than talk to Greta before you leave the Fens) to retain the option to play for the Rebels when you get to Burwood?

Yes.

Edit: if you don't open the Rebel path into Aziraph (by talking to the dude at the safehouse), does THAT lock you out dealing with the rebels?

Nope. I didn't talk to anyone in the safehouse at all and as you can see from the screenshot above the rebels in the fens are friendly.

Also, note that giving the Unbound specs to Alwan is a really bad idea if you have any intention of going for a non-Shaper ending.

It's fun tho

I expect most people to stay somewhere in the middle at least in the beginning so this situation probably doesn't happen that often. Trying to follow Crowleys advice of being a good double agent and all.

 

And I'm pretty sure that the shaper side works as intended, if you don't help them enough they will cut you off. At least that's what I remember from that single time I played pro-rebel. You lose out on a lot if you try to play pure rebel compared to pure loyalist.

Just made a quick run for the fens, destroyed the caravan, restored Moseh and gave the papers to the shapers. Opinion solidly pro shaper, got all rewards from Agent Mouawad. Greta dialogue

 

 

 

I saw that too. But I seriously doubt that I could have been anywhere close on the opinion scale. I really screwed the rebels over every single opportunity. And yet they let me into Burwood.