Meeshka

Quote: Originally written by Xenodave: There could be a Chieftain or a breeder creature. Did you mean "and" instead of "or"? I hope that in A5 we won't see so detailed "reason" of the growth of creature populaton. Only if it is slime, breeding by dividing the slime from the pot (or whatever there was in A3). And am I the only one who thinks that beer is repulsing terror and any mind control from outside of one's mind?

Quote: Originally written by Randomizer: Just start with a minor disaster that traps a remote village from the rest of Avernum. Your party was "volunteered" to find a new route back to the main cave system. You have a base and can explore through different levels. Give lots of false routes and side trips that take you away from the desired route. Cliche, isn't it? For about 99% the beginning of Avernum 2, but that might work. I think I got it right, A5 is already being plotted. So I'm not sure we should make proposals for "the start", "the end" and "the place". So details may be those, which count right now. I'd like beer in Avernum to posess some antimagic traits, like anti-terror and anti-mindcontrol -------------------- HHGtG: Avernum: Making deals with undead don't mention anything concrened to Ephesos . They hate him. They really do. Don't know why.

Quote: Originally written by Vicheron: If a cataclysm is prevented, bad things will still happen. A lot of people will want to leave Avernum. Valorim will have trouble absorbing the new arrivals. There could be accidents with the portal. There'll also be speculations and theories about unnatural causes of the the cataclysm. Lots of people are going to think that the Vahnatai were behind it. The Anama may take advantage of the situation by telling people that such events are caused by ramapant use of magic. Both Avernum and the Empire may be forced to spend massive amounts of resources to solve the problem, limiting their ability to respond against other threats, such as bandits, chitrach investations, those random undead attacks that pop up out of nowhere, etc. Plus the solution to the problem may not even be permanent. Well, I don't want to understate the amount of grief we all have after a cataclism breakes through on Earth. But here we are discussing an interesting plot for an epic game and its continuation. May be it is time to have some rest from overevil disasters. But writing history we always concentrate on global events: wars, revolutions, falls and rises of imperia, etc. In a hundred years a cataclism like tsunami in Thailand won't count as a good plot for a movie or a book known worldwide. Please, don't think I'm too cyniñ about it. I hate when people die, fight or somehow else show their foolishness. ------------------------------ HHGtG: Ermarian - mostly harmless. Beware of adventurers. They steal, calling it a good deed for the sake of ... whatever they are questing for.

Quote: Originally written by SpFiota: .. and the box becomes to heavy to carry. Does it? I can't remember stumbling across such a disaster. Am I wrong or do I just misunderstand what SpFiota meant?

Quote: Originally written by Vicheron: Quote: Originally written by Meeshka: Quote: Originally written by Vicheron: [qb]... No uber bad guys are involved, your major enemies are nature and time. And what is the point? I mean in the end everyone in a team, who survived wil understand they are the best friends ever met and return and live happily ever after? What for was that mess with quakes? Or was it just the "trailer" that you wrote? Why does there have to be an intelligence behind every catastrophe? How can you possibly say that there's no point to preventing natural disasters? Yes there is. As I wrote above, and seems you've missed it. A small one can be prevented by evacuation (or magically stopping a quake). Planetary cataclism on Ermarian is harder to prevent, I think. Still some pages earlier I seemed to make a proposal for a plot which will prevent a war/or any other "unnatural" disaster. Concretely prevent. A party will have to undertake some number of quests: diplomacy, assasination, stealing,... oh, whatever, that's adventuring. And the cataclism won't breakthrough. Quote: Sometimes the most frightening disasters are the naturally occurring ones. Plus you think that just because they prevent a catastrophic series of quakes, if that does happen, that everything will go back to normal? Agreed. It won't. But back to Avernum. This time all the Avernites should leave Avernum for some sanctuary? Quote: If a series of earthquakes hits the town you live in and then a while later the government tells you that they just prevented a cataclysmic quake that could have destroyed your entire town and every town within a hundred mile radius, are you going to feel safe living there? Again, agreed. The only difference of natural and unnatural then is that you can give a 100% guarantee of ending the latter and no guarantee for the former? What will your team be up to then? Quote: Another thing is that just because it's naturally occurring does not mean there isn't something unnatural making it worse and there are always those unscrupulous enough to take advantage of such situations. There are. Marauders. But again, only if it is a local catastrophe.

Quote: Originally written by Dikiyoba: Originally by Meeshka: Quote: Now I'm scared. What did you mean by "you" and "here"? It means that it doesn't matter how a person dies in Avernum. Alorael wasn't refering to you. Unless, of course, he sees you walking down the street one day. I am sorry for making Dikiyoba confused. Quesion about "me" and "here" was actually a nonserious one. And scared I was for Avernites. Too many ways to scare those who you loved after you die and come as undead.

On a second thought, quakes may be the signals to some planet catastrophe, so when you find that out your quest is to undertake all the steps to arrange the emigration to... well, theró are no spaceships yet, are there? So, we need to have a bad guy or an evil overlord, so that after studying the todo list of him we should find a weak spot and save the planet. Edit: typo. And did I say "we"? I meant "they", of course, the team of adventurers.

Quote: How you die doesn't matter here Now I'm scared. What did you mean by "you" and "here"? Edit: I hate undead, I really hate undead. But more than that I wanna be ba-a-ad. And necromancers I hate more than poor undead.

Quote: Originally written by Vicheron: ... No uber bad guys are involved, your major enemies are nature and time. And what is the point? I mean in the end everyone in a team, who survived wil understand they are the best friends ever met and return and live happily ever after? What for was that mess with quakes? Or was it just the "trailer" that you wrote?

Seems like necromancy is the default option, unless you are lucky to die in Avernum in peace, your relatives around. Die hard in torture or violence - you become a zombie (or a ghost). Die in grief and sorrow you become a ghost. Die from a hand of evil magician you become a zombie or a skeleton Die from a hand of a demon, and even that demon won't be sure about who you transform into.

Question on D&D was no doubts an absurd one. But the answer... Enough to say, I've put that question not expecting any answer. Thanks for replying, though. Next life I'd prefer to be a slith to have a mere opportunity to become a mighty avatar ina "afterlife", then to be a Vahnatai and become a Crystal for any achievements at the end. Still I know I'll be an oak tree. Too dumb, I guess.

Quote: Originally written by Accidental Malice: What exactly isn't explained in Jeff's universe that needs to be elucidated? Who makes them. Are Vampires "undead"? Why is it a bad idea to try to apply any issue of D&D to Avernum since there ARE Dungeons and Dragons present? That's what should be explained, I think.

At first I thought not only about the caves, but of the surface, as well. Still, at the northern side I expect to meet the eternally frozen caves. I think that Ice Lizard should originate from north to keep the proper fauna balance. Otherwise their existence is a bit of nonsense from the point of evolution. May be

Quote: Originally written by Accidental Malice: Undead generally come in three varieties: decaying, skeletal, and ghostly. Vampires are which one then? And here I can see the first type can transform into second, after it "decays" to the end? I've never heard of such thing in necromagic. And just for example, an elven vampire holds another name. I won't make a list, but the names of the "undead" of different races differ, I think, due to some racial traditions . May be not on Ermarian space, though. Still, the argument that we just can't make a concrete conclusion which race this or that undead came from is rather serious. I think that's what I wanted to hear. Still it makes fighting animated flesh (summoned ghost) a bit dull. I hate undead, they are all the same Edit: missed an interesting phrase. Yes, the games and the books describe undead as a rule. Avernum was, I think, the first game, where necromagic is not explained.

Quote: Originally written by Dikiyoba: Dikiyoba seems to recall there being mention of nephil and slith bodies ready to be turned into undead in the ruined nephil fort in Avernum 2, but it's been too long since Dikiyoba has played it as well.[/QB] Were there? Hmm, I have to play it again then. I can not recall anything of that sort mentioned. "ready to be turned into undead"? No sir, no spark of light in my memories, except the same things in TES3 series, but that's not from here. As for Vahnavoi, those were the creatures I think to be more ghosts (sorry, not the spirits of course). May be I am wrong. And it may seem that my sclerosis is playing tricks, but also I can't remember any necromancer met or even mentioned. Along with such type of magic. Were all the undead made by demons or cruel fate circumstances (the dark pit E1/A1)? May be I'm a bit too scrupulous with Avernum, comparing its magic stuff with some magic schools canons from other RPGs? As for giving a Repel Spirit vulnerability to any creature - why not give such to Slith Avatars?

Just a thought for a detail in Avernum 5: - I want to see snow in the game and everything which accompanies it: nations, creatures, landscapes. Sorry if I missed too much, skipping A4, still I understand, that no action there took place in some northern areas. Thinking of a new area to discover may be it will be for good to remember some geographical traits of an human-inhabited planet? That's not a plot suggestion, still seems to be an interesting trait. N.B. Saying "snow" I don't mean "winter".

Quote: Seeing that there is no 'slith undead' slot BTW, why? Anybody ever seen and undead except a human one? I don't consider Vahnatai spirits and all sort of demons to be the 'undead' by definition. Does methabolism have to do something to make it impossible to raise a nephilim (read non-human) from the dead? Away from "no slot in a constructor" variant, what is the reason?

May be it is just because A3 is easier to beat than other two? Anyway, I prefer to count my team in Avernum as a family, so no change can be made during the quest! It's your team - lead them!

I think, I should vote for 6 characters in a gang. I always wondered how Duke Nukem manages with all those monsters. A bigger gang opportunities are... well... more realistic to me. May be RPG is not for me? Should I switch to RTS and guide armies?

Quote: Originally written by Erika Maroonmark: Quote: Originally written by Meeshka: It's a pity I don't have much time right now to think more over a point of a Demonslayer... Something you don't want sticking into you. *nods wisely* I think that is more point of someone demon-origin, instead of a Demonslayer.

Quote: Originally written by Ephesos: Um... the odds that somebody would be able to do that before a melee fighter comes in and smashes face are low. Very, very low. Didn't quite get that. Whom was that for? Somebody would be able to do what? Quote: Besides, said field would probably require quite a bit of magical talent. Thus, whoever created it would nullify his/her strongest talent, removing a lot of the motivation for perpetrating such a puzzling act. I thought I don't need to say that if such field is ever invented, definitely no mage will be interested in using it. I never said it would be a mage. I don't think Kurchatov with his hydrogen bomb was interested...

More it is a way to get acquainted with the best smith in Avernum and surface - Boutell. And in E2 if you dare fighting Garzahd in hand-to-hand, not only with arrows of light and Repel spirit, Demonslayer will come in handy. And if you write a story of Demonslayer, you can imagine it once belonged to Karzoth, who died in First Expedition, so if you feel like his scion, you have the right to inherit this artefact and be proud of it. It's a pity I don't have much time right now to think more over a point of a Demonslayer...

Quote: No more Erika. No more Rentar. No more Garzahd. Long live Avernum. Bye, Erika, wink. Let you come again in some BoA. Bye, Garzahd. May be demons will moarn of your death. Bye, Rentar. A good villain were you. A good villain is better then a bad friend. So we shall find another good enemy.

Quote: Originally written by *i: Quote: Trust me, if somebody wants, he can make an anti-magic aggregate to cover all Ermarian. Prove it. *pulling out his dear PM 9mm* No zelatory here, please. By the way, I forgot to say that that field had a tendency to spread throughout and on the whole planet. The only proof here can be is that I can name the novel and te story I mentioned, if anyone is interested. But since I highly doubt they are translated into English for most users here it is quite useless (sorry for tautology). Except I find enough time to translate them. Cross my heart, I swear! (always wondered if "swear" and "swears" have the same origin) Edit: some addition.

Quote: Originally written by Iron Eyes: —Alorael, who just noticed that nobody mentioned discovering Avernum by getting hurled through a portal after committing pety crimes. Sort of: -If you are followed by 4 faithful friends everywhere you are heading; -If your pockets can store four miniguns and there is more space -If seeing a corpse your first wish is to ransack it You are definitely overplayed Fallout. Can be transferred to Avernum series.