Mutant Lizard

I think the highest number of PC/NPCs that can fight with you is in the quest for Lysstack the Beast (or some name like): your party plus an escaped soldier from Harking's Landing, a tamed mouse, and possibly up to two beasts/spirits summoned by your mages/priests. That's all in Avernum 5, I think. If your party is left with few magical points to launch spells or summon aid, wands may help something. Mirco.

When they cast 'rays' or 'bolts' wands are subjected to the defensive skills of the target PC, such as parry. If a PC is dextrous enough, he can swing/deflect the effect of the wand. When wands affect an area around them, the defensive skills of targets are ineffective, but not their specific defense against their effects, such as protection from fire against a wand of inferno (if I recall exactly the names). So charging all your party - that is all your PC not able to do great damage with their current weapons - with wands effective against a particular target may result in a rate of damage higher than that done by the target on you. (you may keep one well armored warrior and/or some NPCs to keep engaged it in the meantime. Mirco.

Actually, the archmage was another friend of Shanker reduced to crystal status back on surface. He was then teleported in Avernum using some defective equipment (like that in Highground) from the Empire-Avernite Company and materialized in a crop of spiritual herbs something north of New Harston. A cow happened to pass from there and ate both the crop and the crystal. Then they happily jolly-raided all Avernum in search of other tender crops of magical herbs: the cow feeding herself with juicy grass and the crystal with ready-to-use spiritual power, the crystal slashing everything interfering with lighting bolts and arcane blows. -- End of the first part of Exile(d) - Escape from the Cow -- Mirco.

(Earth Empires) Avernum will not last for long after the quest... The Empire will land in Avernum for good and take for itself the crystal commerce, not touching anything in appearance, but actually bashing Vahnatai and everything opposing it. Before saying "there is nothing I can do", somebody might try something (but finishing the game nevertheless... as I posted above). (Txgangsta) Vahnatai are difficult to find. Apart for the fact that they are strictly against the Empire and not incline to help adventurers (at least in Avernum 5), they sleep for centuries and you must be lucky to find someone awaken and willing to help you in the period of you quest. Mirco

Ahhh... thanks Erasmus for the rockhounds nature: I didn't realized that. I think that your plot is indeed a correct request to the game mechanics, but implies that it's coherent with the designers' vision of the game. As Rendomizer pointed out, there are four dungeons not related to the general game plot (I'm remembering three: Khora-Viss, The Soultaker's Pit and the Pit of Abominations... ), so every side-quest related to them is ineffective on the outcome of the game. But another thing would be a "quest by you own": something you pursue for your own shake or belief of the situation depicted in the game (like helping Dionicio instead of Vahnatai): this is always possible, but at your own risk in terms of gaming outcome. For example. I didn't like General Redmark: for me he is a person trying to take advantage from the confrontation Prozac-Dorikas and trying to exploit at best Prozac's murder, not a much better figure than Dorikas. If I had decided to kill both Dorikas and Redmark (and strangely Redmark vanished from Blackchasm Outpost from a point onward)... should the game have had an ending for this? Actually I think that in a game a challenging quest would be having your own vision of the situation and acting accordingly to it, but trying to successfully end the game nevertheless. Mirco.

Sorry... I posted my last message a bit in a hurry, thinking more of my gaming than of the Vahnatai. Pit of Abominations (I finished it) was there only to feed you with experience points (I talked a bit about them above) and to reward your party with some useful objects. Vahnatai fate is linked to crystals, even more than to land or food. I think that stopping miners and giving them some more time to awake their tribes is all you can do for them without getting in trouble with Avernites (obviously in the perspective of a game played as in my post above). Mirco.

Yes... a weakened people would be at merci of others invading their lands, even mages. I tried at least to figure a settlement among all the parties living in Avernum (humans, Vahnatai, Monsters). If such a settlement would have been possible, perhaps the fate of these beings, not only Monsters and Vahnatai, but also humans - remembering the acute food shortage - would have been different (note: I don't know Avernum 6). A problem lies in the fact that in the case of trying a settlement among parties you can't smash everything you encounter and pursue every quest, but nevertheless the experience system is based on points gained *defeating enemies* and *solving puzzles*. Mirco.

Summing up, I considered a pity that Prozac wasn't alive to see the new relations between Empire and Avernum. I decidedly prefer this fancy Empress to General Redmark. Mirco.

I'm trying to better my English (I hope it's understandable, verbs nevertheless). Apart for the fact that Avernum has many possible threads inside it (the wilderness, the Avernites/Empire, the monsters and you...), my way playing Avernum 5 was trying to figure what would be the best manner to manage Empire's interests, but remaining more in the path of Empress Prozac (the Avernites are to be respected), than in that of General Redmark (the Empire first). So, beginning with Azure Gallery, I tried to give some power to everybody but not to someone's unique advantage: - Helping Dionicio in consolidating Avernum, but not letting him to expand beyond the Azure Gallery; - Helping Muck against Highground and the Vahnatai killing the Giant Queen and not accepting the quest to kill the Mayor of Muck; - Helping Vahnatai in their awakening but slowing down their expansion (see above); - Helping monsters too, not weakening the Dragon Lands (for example, simply killing those who didn't pay for their possessions) and even respecting the Circle of Life. I even wondered if I should have been able to find a remedy for Empress Prozac illness. Perhaps in this way the game should have ended with some "Conference for the Settlement in Avernum", with the Empire as Chairman... Mirco.

"How may ways to play Avernum" was much a wonder and a question I posed to myself visiting this Forum and counting the different opinions about the same topics. I supposed the existence of alternate endings, apart from killing either Dorikas or Manfred Redmond, much regarding the final fate of the party that accomplished it. I chose to be dumb and loyal to the Empire, trying to drive events in such a way that (I thought) would have favored it in future. I think to have reached this goal so that... (really, I don't want to add a spoiler). Mirco.

I'm Mirco from Italy and I' have just finished my Avernum 5. I didn't sided with Darkside Loyalists. I thought it would make the game more difficult to conduct and now I read it would be so (sorry for may English). I kept reading the various dialogs during the game and I suspected that a geas would break me during a quest, if Gladwell chooses so. I remembered the killing attempt to General Redmond when he said that a geas killed his almost-murderer before he could question him. Still I think so. How may ways to play Avernum? Mirco.

I'm Mirco from Italy and I recently finished my Avernum 5 quest. I had no problem in fully backing Muck against Highground and the Vahnatai. I killed the Giant Queen and didn't mention to help the Vahnatai when speaking with the Crystal *I don't remember the name*. It was funny to exit the Vahnatai Lands nevertheless. Mirco.