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Actually, that's not a bad idea at all. Come up with a list, input any relevant binary factors, and look for an equation of best fit. Hmm...

In which case, I suppose it is an issue for *i after all. Or maybe Thurilith. Anyone want to shed light on this?

Here's a question I don't recall being discussed before. Hey, Alorael (I assume *i isn't going to bother with this topic) -- when do you first remember seeing "oldbie" used here?

It's less true now than it used to be, but typically the members who have been around the longest all have custom titles instead of postcount-based titles anyway.

Oldbie is as oldbie does. A scary thought, considering the historical record...

Serious question re *i's post: Okay, so there isn't a distressing level of radiation there now. But there was, however briefly, a pretty seriously distressing level of radiation there. Presumably that would have had an immediate impact (if not an immediately visible impact) on animal life there when the event took place. And okay, that was 25 years ago -- but wouldn't it make sense for population and maybe even population diversity to still look different 25 years after such an event?

Well, if we want to get real technical about it, its the ruins of a Fort that is now mysteriously called Haledon. It isn't Fort Haledon.

I have to say, this wins my award for "least newsworthy science story in a long time." Originally Posted By: The Mystic Actually, I'm kind of surprised that anything is living in the area at all. The region will probably be setting off Geiger counters for generations, and the blast site for even longer. When the meltdown occured, Geiger counters in Sweden went off for some time.

Nope. It's still here: http://home.sanbrunocable.com/~tommywatts03/scripting.html'>http://home.sanbrunocable.com/~tommywatts03/scripting.html at Kelandon's Pink and Pretty Page!! http://home.sanbrunocable.com/~tommywatts03/

CIRCUS, CIRCUS, WONDERBRED CENSUS IMMENSUS IN DANT'S MANSE

Alorile.

Even within A4-A6, it's been slightly different in each game as Jeff has adjusted both the steepness of the experience formula, as well as how much experience is actually available. However, the relevant point in all cases is that LEVEL UPS DO NOTHING EXCEPT GRANT YOU THOSE 5 SKILL POINTS and small amounts of HP and SP. Skill points become relatively LESS useful at higher levels, since the skills you care about cost more... on the other hand, for the same reason, the bonus skills you get from races and traits become relatively MORE useful because they would cost more and more to acquire naturally. Divinely Touched would be worthwhile even if it cost you 8 levels for that alone, and it doesn't. When a Divinely Touched Elite Warrior Slith finishes around 5 levels lower, as has been typical for the second trilogy, it's a total no-brainer. What do I want more: 25 skill points, maybe 40 HP and 30 SP... or on the order of 300 skill points worth of bonus skills?

RETRIOACTIVITY IS IN THE AIR FOR UBB

Only vaguely apropos: "Surely every human being ought to attain to the dignity of the unit. Surely it is worth while to be one, and to feel that the census of the universe would be incomplete without counting you. Surely there is grandeur in knowing that in the realm of thought you are without a chain; that you have the right to explore all heights and all depths; that there are no walls or fences, or prohibited places, or sacred corners in all the vast expanse of thought; that your intellect owes no allegiance to any being, human or divine; that you hold all in fee, and upon no condition, and by no tenure, whatsoever; that in the world of mind you are relieved from all personal dictation, and from the ignorant tyranny of majorities. Surely it is worth something to feel that there are no priests, no popes, no parties, no governments, no kings, no gods, to whom your intellect can be compelled to pay a reluctant homage. Surely it is a joy to know that all the cruel ingenuity of bigotry can devise no prison, no dungeon, no cell in which for one instant to confine a thought; that ideas cannot be dislocated by racks, nor crushed in iron boots, nor burned with fire. Surely it is sublime to think that the brain is a castle, and that within its curious bastions and winding halls the soul, in spite of all worlds and all beings, is the supreme sovereign of itself." - Robert Ingersoll

And maybe this explains why "oldbie" was such a persistent concept, beyond the asinine way some of them wanted to treat newer members. Drakey, Alec, and TM have now been essentially gone for 4-5 years. Most of our current members don't really know who they are -- might have heard their names but have certainly never seen them post. And yet, they put SO MUCH time and energy into this place when they were here, that they still outshoot anyone currently present on that count, even you and Thuryl who have been here the whole time, but made less noise about it. It was the intensity of their presence that bound the term and made it stable, more than the "old" part.

It's not in this very thread. It is in about twenty others, though.

Let me guess: the Frahham incident?

Ok, wait. Here's ANOTHER take: this time, I've eliminated the "years present" factor as well, instead assuming that influence felt over time will be reflected in postcount and the boolean variables. Look at this one: Code: 3.84 Drakey 3.73 TM 3.05 Stareye 3.04 Alec 2.71 Arancaytar 2.71 Alorael 2.52 Slarty 2.37 Dikiyoba 2.33 Ephesos 2.31 Thurilith 2.29 ETSDe 2.22 Kelandon 2.07 Salmon 1.96 Dantdringissonika Slugfort 1.86 Randomizer 1.71 Zephyr Tempest 1.69 Tyranicus 1.66 Nikki 1.62 Zeviz 1.61 Marlenny 1.60 Shotts 1.59 Order Mage 1.58 Saunders 1.57 Nioca 1.57 Synergy 1.56 ADoS 1.56 Rosycat 1.52 Ben 1.51 SoT 1.50 Thralni 1.47 Delicious Vlish 1.43 Iffy 1.42 Lady J 1.41 Jewels 1.40 Djur 1.39 Creator Lael 1.39 Brett Bixler 1.39 Imban 1.36 Archmage Alex 1.35 Schrodinger 1.35 Celtic Minstrel 1.34 Mysterious Man 1.34 Ed Lemur 1.31 Lazarus 1.30 Nicothodes 1.29 Icshi 1.29 Infernal 1.28 Nemesis 1.27 Khoth 1.27 Zxquez 1.27 Scorpius 1.27 Sir David 1.27 Stillness 1.27 Fatman 1.27 Wise Man 1.24 Niemand 1.23 VCH 1.23 Excalibur 1.23 Morgan 1.23 Smoo 1.21 Lt. Sullust 1.18 BainIhrno 1.18 Dintiradan 1.18 Drew 1.18 Ackrovan 1.17 The Mystic 1.17 Radiant 1.16 Dolphin 1.16 Seletine 1.15 Enraged Slith 1.14 Stughalf 1.13 SMoE 1.13 Goldenking 1.11 Andraste 1.08 The Ratt 1.08 Arctic 1.08 Sarachim 1.07 Lenar 1.06 Safey 1.06 Frozen Feet Potentially even more interesting, but I think it would need tweaking, and especially expansion, of the booleans to really mean much.

Interesting way of looking at it. Okay, I'll bite. Here are the results of the same formula except with the "origin multiplier" totally removed -- which I guess we could call an estimation of oldbesity without a fixed reference point for what is "old": (The second column is the change from the old version of the list) Code: 27.12 - Alorael 24.37 - Stareye 24.25 - TM 23.02 - Drakey 20.79 1.04 Thurilith 18.25 - Alec 16.34 2.45 Ephesos 16.28 1.63 Arancaytar 15.65 0.78 Dantdringissonika Slugfort 13.77 - Zeviz 13.59 - Archmage Alex 13.30 2.00 Kelandon 13.25 1.32 Nikki 12.52 - ADoS 12.10 1.21 SoT 11.47 4.02 ETSDe 11.34 2.84 Slarty 10.41 - Imban 10.19 - Khoth 9.88 0.99 Jewels 9.50 - Saunders 9.47 3.32 Dikiyoba 9.36 - Mysterious Man 9.34 2.33 Salmon 9.29 3.25 Randomizer 9.19 - Enraged Slith 8.90 - Scorpius 8.83 0.44 Delicious Vlish 8.63 - Sarachim 8.57 0.43 Zephyr Tempest 8.40 - Djur 8.35 - Creator Lael 8.29 1.24 BainIhrno 7.89 1.18 Goldenking 7.86 2.75 Nioca 7.84 - Lt. Sullust 7.78 0.39 Andraste 7.44 1.86 Niemand 7.41 - VCH 6.76 1.69 Tyranicus 6.50 0.98 Nicothodes 6.44 0.32 Icshi 6.37 0.96 Frozen Feet 6.34 0.32 Sir David 6.14 1.53 Smoo 6.07 - Schrodinger 5.53 - Morgan 5.39 2.43 Celtic Minstrel 5.32 1.86 Safey 5.25 1.31 Lazarus 5.12 1.79 Nemesis 5.09 - Zxquez 4.99 2.25 Iffy 4.94 2.22 Excalibur 4.84 1.21 Marlenny 4.73 1.66 Dintiradan 4.70 1.17 Synergy 4.69 1.64 The Mystic 4.68 - Radiant 4.67 0.47 Rosycat 4.57 0.69 Ben 4.50 1.12 Thralni 4.43 0.22 Wise Man 4.33 1.95 The Ratt 4.32 - Arctic 4.29 1.50 Lenar 4.17 - Brett Bixler 4.14 0.62 Drew 4.14 1.86 Ackrovan 3.86 0.96 Infernal 3.80 0.95 Fatman 3.43 0.34 Stughalf 3.39 0.17 SMoE 3.19 - Shotts 3.19 0.16 Order Mage 2.85 0.14 Lady J 2.67 - Ed Lemur 2.54 0.89 Stillness 2.33 0.58 Dolphin 2.33 - Seletine Not much changes other than traditionally defined oldbies moving lower on the list. A few individual members have somewhat substantial jumps, but the list isn't all that different from the above list. Still, I would agree that this is a generally more interesting metric.

I believe my estimation for you was 3500 posts. Does that sound about right?

You were pretty much pure estimation, Tyro, since you've had at least 3 different accounts, most of which belonged to other people either before or after you used them...

Years present * Origin multiplier * Postcount multiplier * Boolean multipliers Years present = 1 to 10 (as described above) Origin multiplier = 1.0 to 0.25 (as described above) Postcount multiplier = (Total postcount of all known accounts / 12500) + 1 (This translates to about an 8% increase per 1000 posts.) (Note that for a few cases where accounts changed hands or have been lost, I had to make estimates, notably MM, Saunders, Alec, Marlenny, and Tyranicus) Boolean multipliers = 1.5 for members who caused extensive controversy (à la TM) 1.2 for members who caused mild controversy at some point 1.4 for long-term admins 1.1 for users who were mods at any point 1.2 for users who were major scenario designers 1.5 for users who directly created community in an extensive way (à la Dikiyoba) 1.2 for users who directly created community in a less major way (à la Northern Isles, AIMHack, or Alex's cartoons) I don't have Excel open at the moment but I'm fairly sure those are the modifiers I settled on.

All right, because I'm procrastinating, I did up a more extensive formula and put a spreadsheet together. This formula begins with a base of 1, essentially. You would have a score of 1 if you joined in 2001, stayed for just one year, made no posts, and were not controversial, a major scenario designer, an admin or mod, or a community-building figure. Duration of stay is by far the biggest factor in the formula, followed by the other factors. Join date makes a bit more difference than the rest, but it does not mean everything (neither does duration of stay). Here are the results, call it what you will -- I make no claims to what this figures, but it figures something: Code: 27.12 Alorael 24.37 Stareye 24.25 TM 23.02 Drakey 19.75 Thurilith 18.25 Alec 14.87 Dantdringissonika Slugfort 14.65 Arancaytar 13.89 Ephesos 13.77 Zeviz 13.59 Archmage Alex 12.52 ADoS 11.92 Nikki 11.31 Kelandon 10.89 SoT 10.41 Imban 10.19 Khoth 9.50 Saunders 9.36 Mysterious Man 9.19 Enraged Slith 8.90 Scorpius 8.89 Jewels 8.63 Sarachim 8.51 Slarty 8.40 Djur 8.39 Delicious Vlish 8.35 Creator Lael 8.14 Zephyr Tempest 7.84 Lt. Sullust 7.46 ETSDe 7.41 VCH 7.39 Andraste 7.05 BainIhrno 7.00 Salmon 6.71 Goldenking 6.16 Dikiyoba 6.11 Icshi 6.07 Schrodinger 6.04 Randomizer 6.02 Sir David 5.58 Niemand 5.53 Morgan 5.53 Nicothodes 5.41 Frozen Feet 5.11 Nioca 5.09 Zxquez 5.07 Tyranicus 4.68 Radiant 4.60 Smoo 4.32 Arctic 4.21 Wise Man 4.21 Rosycat 4.17 Brett Bixler 3.94 Lazarus 3.89 Ben 3.63 Marlenny 3.52 Synergy 3.52 Drew 3.46 Safey 3.37 Thralni 3.33 Nemesis 3.22 SMoE 3.19 Shotts 3.09 Stughalf 3.08 Dintiradan 3.05 The Mystic 3.03 Order Mage 2.97 Celtic Minstrel 2.89 Infernal 2.85 Fatman 2.79 Lenar 2.75 Iffy 2.72 Excalibur 2.70 Lady J 2.67 Ed Lemur 2.38 The Ratt 2.33 Seletine 2.28 Ackrovan 1.75 Dolphin 1.65 Stillness

*shoooom* ...anyway, realistically, post count does not have a lot to do with oldbesity as it was traditionally conceived of. It might also be possible to include some kind of multiplier system: *1.5, say, for being a Very Controversial Figure, some bonus for being a long-term admin, etc. Or perhaps the postcount part should simply have its influence reduced: say cut it in half to ( (posts / 25,000) + 1) times everything else. 25000 chosen since that's where Postaroni, Pizzabella currently sits, I believe. EDIT: Whoops, bad math error!

Simple proposal: Total posts * total time * duration adjustment Where total time is in years; total time present, not span from earliest to latest time present; decimals OK And duration adjustment is a function of the year joined: 2001 = 1 2002 = 0.95 2003 = 0.90 2004 = 0.85 2005 = 0.75 2006 = 0.65 2007 = 0.55 2008 = 0.45 2009 = 0.35 2010 = 0.25 Approximate results for top ten posters as best I can figure, plus some from Niemand's list: Alorael: 183,220 Thurilith: 137,440 Drakefyre: 57,468 Stareye: 51,260 TM: 45,240 Kelandon: 43,319 Arancaytar: 42,854 Ephesos: 35,254 Nikki: 34,207 Slarty: 33,129 Randomizer: 27,979 Dikiyoba: 21,856 Salmon: 18,590 VCH: 17,592 Lt. Sullust: 15,468 Nioca: 12,594 Sarachim: 9,800 Drew: 7,769 Niemand: 7,133 Excalibur: 6,448 Celtic Minstrel: 6,208 Synergy: 5,227 This can best be viewed as a combination of oldbesity and influence on the way the boards have unfolded. I think this lines up decently with how we think about this stuff.