Burgeoning Battle Gamma The Real Dragon King Posted November 16, 2004 Share Posted November 16, 2004 I know I will be yelled at, told that I am *dumb*, but... Is there anyone working on the Windows port of the 3D BOA Editor? If so, what is the current status? i.e., are you looking over the source code, checking your tools to compile this monster, anything?? Thanks for reading my dumb rant --- James Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrulous Glaahk EDWARD, HAMMER OF THE SCOTS Posted November 16, 2004 Share Posted November 16, 2004 It'd probably be easier to make the Windows version 3D than to port the Mac 3D editor, actually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyshakk Koan Mortimer Posted November 16, 2004 Share Posted November 16, 2004 I know I said I was planning to take a look at it, but eh, life had other plans, apologies to anyone who got their hopes up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnificent Ornk Kelandon Posted November 16, 2004 Share Posted November 16, 2004 Arenax said he'd look into it, but I'm pretty sure he makes no promises, and I think it's also second on his priority list, behind a scripting helper. I don't know of any other efforts going on at the moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyshakk Koan Arenax Posted November 16, 2004 Share Posted November 16, 2004 I am looking into it. However, I DEFINITELY make no promises. It'd be easier for me to write an editor from scratch, given JV's godawful code. It doesn't even compile on the version of CodeWarrior I managed to...uhh...procure. So if I do it, I've got a laundry list of more important things first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgeoning Battle Gamma The Real Dragon King Posted November 17, 2004 Author Share Posted November 17, 2004 Thanks for replies --- I now go over and sit on the window still and wait for some new games just around the corner....... James Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyshakk Koan Arenax Posted November 17, 2004 Share Posted November 17, 2004 I doubt I'm going to even look at it for a few months at the least. I don't see a personal need for it, and I write tools that I will actually use. I can design just fine in 2D; a 3D editor is unnecessary for me. AvScript and AvDialogue are more important tools than a 3D editor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyshakk Koan KernelKnowledge12 Posted November 17, 2004 Share Posted November 17, 2004 Why not just get the maker of the Mac 3D Editor to port his own/Jeff's code using a free cross-platform class library? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyshakk Koan Mortimer Posted November 17, 2004 Share Posted November 17, 2004 Possibly because I don't believe he has a PC available to test it on. Arenax's current projects sound far more interesting to me as well, I haven't had much problem with the 2D editor, a 3D one is just a nice want rather then a need. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyshakk Koan Arenax Posted November 17, 2004 Share Posted November 17, 2004 Quote: Originally written by KernelKnowledge12:Why not just get the maker of the Mac 3D Editor to port his own/Jeff's code using a free cross-platform class library? Because Jeff's code, to be very frank, sucks. I've looked at the Mac 3D code, and I find it wholly unportable. Graphics are handled entirely differently and the mechanism for putting them on the screen is weird on a Mac. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyshakk Koan KernelKnowledge12 Posted November 18, 2004 Share Posted November 18, 2004 Quote: Originally written by Mortimer:Possibly because I don't believe he has a PC available to test it on. Hence the term, cross-platform library. If he uses one and it works on a Mac, it should work on any platform the library supports. He'd just have to get it to a PC to build the executable, which shouldn't be too hard considering the amount of programmers in this community. Quote: Originally written by Mortimer:Arenax's current projects sound far more interesting to me as well, I haven't had much problem with the 2D editor, a 3D one is just a nice want rather then a need. A need would be an editor (3D or not) with plugin capabilities for the various smaller programs people are working on. Quote: Originally written by Arenax:Because Jeff's code, to be very frank, sucks. Graphics are handled entirely differently and the mechanism for putting them on the screen is weird on a Mac. Of course it sucks. It's complicated and entirely too messy, but getting the gist of it isn't too hard, if you look at the right parts. Ignore the Mac graphic's code; it shouldn't matter. Look at how the program itself loads, and then the format of the scenario files. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnificent Ornk Kelandon Posted November 18, 2004 Share Posted November 18, 2004 That would require re-writing the editor from scratch, wouldn't it? That's a slightly larger issue than adding a new capability or two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyshakk Koan KernelKnowledge12 Posted November 18, 2004 Share Posted November 18, 2004 It would be rather difficult. Fortunately there are several libraries that would make it easier (wxWidgets, Boost, WideStudio, the famous STL and its many add-ons). Also much of file handling/scripting code can be copied and tweaked to favor a more object oriented approach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrulous Glaahk EDWARD, HAMMER OF THE SCOTS Posted November 18, 2004 Share Posted November 18, 2004 Well, the most important part would be to extract the scenario-saving parts of the editor and turn it into a good library. Then, you could write an editor for any platform with any language and any toolkit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyshakk Koan KernelKnowledge12 Posted November 18, 2004 Share Posted November 18, 2004 The scenario-saving parts are extremely simple. Only the several simple classes (located I believe in global.h) in Jeff's code need to be copied and screwed with. There is a scripting engine ( technically an engine) that loads the editor's global data (from the corescendata.txt files) that should not be copied. A quick lexer and parser should be created using the Script Checking program's grammar files, with FLEX++ and Bison++. The Bison++ input file should be tweaked to actually edit a ScenData object. The graphical interface should use OpenGL, if it's meant to be fast. (An easier alternative, however, would be just to use a toolkit's graphical classes.) Using OpenGL would allow for shaders and therefore more flexible tinting code, but would take much longer to implement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Well-Actually War Trall Khoth Posted November 18, 2004 Share Posted November 18, 2004 Actually, I think the parts of the editor dealing with the file format are the nastiest and most arcane parts, with the possible exception of the script parsing. There is some weird magic for dealing with endian-ness that I don't want to touch with a bargepole, for a start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyshakk Koan KernelKnowledge12 Posted November 18, 2004 Share Posted November 18, 2004 Quote: Originally written by Khothie:Actually, I think the parts of the editor dealing with the file format are the nastiest and most arcane parts, with the possible exception of the script parsing. The saving and loading functions (for scenario files) are very simple, and its pretty easy to see how the files are stored: Scenario Info Struct (Can't remember the real name) Outdoor Sections Towns (the size of each town differs based on the stored town size) The editor's scripting functions are total and utter crap, but a more extensive one isn't neccessarily needed. Quote: Originally written by Khothie:There is some weird magic for dealing with endian-ness that I don't want to touch with a bargepole, for a start. I think you're talking about the flipShort function. All it does is switch the two bytes contained in the given short. The following function would probably be better, if somewhat slower: template< class _Ty > _Ty& flipData( _Ty& d) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrulous Glaahk Dastal Posted November 18, 2004 Share Posted November 18, 2004 KernelKnowledge, if it's such an easy process, and you have already figured it out, you should have no problem quickly converting the Mac 3D BoA editor to Windows. On the other hand, if you have trouble putting your money where your mouth is, then maybe you should accept what others say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Well-Actually War Trall Khoth Posted November 18, 2004 Share Posted November 18, 2004 I am aware of the basic order of how things are stored. But remember that "scenario info struct" is not a simple thing. It depends on things like how the data is padded, whether chars are signed, how things have been endianised and so on. I would love to see an actual file format specification. Please make one, I would genuinely find it useful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyshakk Koan KernelKnowledge12 Posted November 18, 2004 Share Posted November 18, 2004 Quote: Originally written by Dastal:KernelKnowledge, if it's such an easy process, and you have already figured it out, you should have no problem quickly converting the Mac 3D BoA editor to Windows. I never said it was easy. I screwed around with the original editor for a month over the summer and started working on a 3D editor using MFC/DirectX. (Before I started thinking cross-platform.) After a little I got an idea for a project that could potentially make me some money, so I dumped the editor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyshakk Koan Arenax Posted November 22, 2004 Share Posted November 22, 2004 Quote: Originally written by KernelKnowledge12: Quote: Originally written by Dastal:KernelKnowledge, if it's such an easy process, and you have already figured it out, you should have no problem quickly converting the Mac 3D BoA editor to Windows. I never said it was easy. I screwed around with the original editor for a month over the summer and started working on a 3D editor using MFC/DirectX. (Before I started thinking cross-platform.) After a little I got an idea for a project that could potentially make me some money, so I dumped the editor. You said it was "simple." "Simple" and "easy" are interchangeable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrulous Glaahk EDWARD, HAMMER OF THE SCOTS Posted November 22, 2004 Share Posted November 22, 2004 Not at all. It's simple to run for 5 miles up a mountain -- you point yourself and start pushing your legs. It's not easy at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyshakk Koan Arenax Posted November 22, 2004 Share Posted November 22, 2004 I know, Djur. Sarcasm doesn't really transfer as well as I'd like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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