Jump to content

What new creations you want to see in the remake series?


Recommended Posts

So personally I'd like to at least a split line creations for both rebel and loyalist, because in the original some part of them doesn't quite make sense like you are a loyalist, but you have a figgin drakon walking alongside you, but my biggest wish is seeing a totally new school of shaping cause 3 school shaping can be a bit limited, which is something I felt strongly about in the original; I hope Jeff might consider that.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't know if specifically shaper vs. loyalist creation lines makes sense with the side-switching nature of the story, but regarding Drakons, in the Exile/Avernum series, sometimes people would react to you differently if you were traveling with a Nephilim or Slithzerikai. It was subtle and mostly inconsequential, but it would have been cool if it had more of an impact. Imagine six lizardmen just strolling into Lorelei claiming they're going to save the world! I could see potential for that concept being explored more deeply in Geneforge.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I would agree with Shaper vs Loyalist creation lines and I am completely fine with the 3 schools of Shaping and I consider it enough variation.

I would agree that loyalists are more limited but that is because they choose to be more limited. Still as they have many more years in this, indeed they should have access to "better" variants. 

They player should be able to get everything, but be able to get say 4 out of 15 creation categories from Shapers only and 2 out of 15 creation categories from Rebels only. 
Also, I frankly think that we need more than a simple variant per creation category. I.e. I want more variants than Cryora / Fyora. 

The new game's customization possibilities are a good step towards that, but I think some of these options should be "locked" until you learn them. I.e. you could get the overload thing for Fyoras from Shapers and the haste from Rebels or something. 

For the 3rd variant, it could be something as simple as "Fyora-variant with basic level 6 and a different set of abilities (like the roamer's berserk or pyroroamer's blow up)." 

 

But all these aside, if some of the abilities you can use are locked till someone teaches you, and each sect teaches you different abilities, I would be glad. 

It doesn't have to be just "Rebels" and "Shapers", mind you. It could be things like "In areas 1 to 15, the Shapers \ rebels rely on their creations doing much of the buffing, so that's the area where you get the blessing abilities for the magic creations (as well as items that give intelligence to creations). However, in areas 16-30, the Shapers/Rebels rely more on battle creations coming close and personal to the enemy so that's where you would go to get things like hardiness, leap, etc. (as well as items that give endurance and strength to creations)" 

Edited by alhoon
Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, alhoon said:

The new game's customization possibilities are a good step towards that, but I think some of these options should be "locked" until you learn them. I.e. you could get the overload thing for Fyoras from Shapers and the haste from Rebels or something.

 

Oooh, I like that idea.

 

******

 

One thing to bear in mind for everyone compiling wishlists, Jeff is just one person.  Every new creation needs to work on all four difficulty levels without throwing the game balance completely off/have to work as part of your creation army with other creations.  The more complex it gets, the longer it's going to take to write/test everything.  For someone who's business model has been to put out a game every 12-18 months, even with a (presumed) solid Kickstarter backing, I can't see him putting 'that' much effort into really changing the already designed system.  Tweaks sure, but a completely new shaping class is probably beyond what he'd want to do (and fwiw, I have zero idea what his thoughts are on this matter...so this post may age really badly...).

 

******

 

That said, how about a hydra.  You could have multiple types of attacks from the different heads (fire, cold, acid, etc).  Perhaps not as powerful as a dedicated fire breather (for example), but combined they could be similar damage levels.  As it goes up in levels you would add an additional head per damage type (1st level, one each of fire, cold, acid.  2nd level, 2 each. Etc)

 

 

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, ultra112 said:

I assume this creature would be a fire primary, magic secondary and battle last right?

 

No, each head would be at the same 'level' as each of the others. If a regular fire fyora could do a maximum of say 20 points of damage with their fire attack, then each of the hydra's heads could have the potential of say, 40% of that damage (8 points).  So if all the heads hit, you could do 24 damage...theoretically.  However each head would also have to roll the proverbial dice to see if it hit, so at least while the to hit % was lower/early game, you probably are looking at 16 max damage instead.  The power comes later on when you're adding 3 (or 6) more heads as then the potential damage (compared to the same fyora - who for sake of simplicity is still at the same damage level as is each of our hydra's heads...) would be 48 (or 72) points.

 

There would probably have to be some quantity limits on how many you could have so that you don't wind up with a Shaper strolling along with six hydras, each with nine heads, getting 54 attacks per turn... that might unbalance things just a tad...

 

And now, after rereading your question while proofreading my answer...

 

Do you mean to make a hydra you would have to have one level in fire shaping, two in magic, & three in battle to build the next level?  No, that wasn't my thoughts.  It might be interesting though that if you do want to make this powerful creature, you have to have a level/point in 'each' of the respective disciplines before you can shape it (& then a 2nd point in each to raise it to the 6 headed version)

Link to post
Share on other sites

I love hydras. Exile 2 has a hydra nest which is one of the highlights of the game. I feel bitter that in Avernum 2: Crystal Souls, it's just hellhounds instead. Hydras are better.

 

Picture this: The player finds a place where they can shape a Servant Mind. If you do, the Servant Mind acts as a library of every piece of text, NPC stats, and item stats the player has ever encountered in the game, as well as various gameplay statistics (enemies defeated, mines disarmed, mines detonated, etc.) and some amusing conversation.

Edited by The Almighty Doer of Stuff
typo
Link to post
Share on other sites
27 minutes ago, The Almighty Doer of Stuff said:

I love hydras. Exile 2 has a hydra nest which is one of the highlights of the game. I feel bitter than in Avernum 2: Crystal Souls, it's just hellhounds instead. Hydras are better.

 

Picture this: The player finds a place where they can shape a Servant Mind. If you do, the Servant Mind acts as a library of every piece of text, NPC stats, and item stats the player has ever encountered in the game, as well as various gameplay statistics (enemies defeated, mines disarmed, mines detonated, etc.) and some amusing conversation.

Well, you could do that already with a mod. It is very easy to do but time consuming. 
Also, since the limits of how long a file can be before the game crashes, you couldn't include a discussion about everything. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't know how the mechanics of a Hydra would play out, but I'd love if that was the "new" creation for a future GF remake. Whether or not that meant a KS stretch goal.

 

Maybe higher levels could increase the # of heads/attacks?! And to distinguish it from the highly magical Cockatrice, it would be hardier (inherent resistances) and deal more straightforward dmg. Maybe even have an upgraded version like Fyoras < Cryoas 🙂

Link to post
Share on other sites

I mean yeah the hydra would be a great addition, but what I meant about the fire shaping primary is due to the cockatrice, because I thought this creature would be similar to the cockatrice; a special class creation but would require fire shaping instead of magic.

 

Although I do think of what a special class battle creation might be though, perhaps a wendigo would fit in.

Link to post
Share on other sites

How about a creation that can heal and cure? Sometimes it seems like I spend more time healing than fighting. (can you tell I'm playing torment for the first time?) I have a tendency to play guardians and agents solo, because it seems like such a waste for them to spend so much of their AP healing, while their weaker buddies do the fighting. Maybe make it an available skill on one of the magic creations. Or maybe make a special creation to go with the ornk and the cockatrice. Then there could be a whole story line to go with it. Or maybe I just need to get better at combat?

Link to post
Share on other sites

A creation that can heal is  an interesting idea. 
However, just an observation: "it seems like such a waste for them to spend so much of their AP healing, while their weaker buddies do the fighting"  That's because you play an agent/guardian. :) My Shaper is the weaker of my team. I cannot compare in power to any of my creations. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, alhoon said:

That's because you play an agent/guardian. My Shaper is the weaker of my team.

Right. When I play as Shaper, spending time healing is not a problem. That's my job. It's also the hardest role for me to play, because I like to get involved in the fighting also.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm sure I'll appreciate whatever enhancements Jeff makes. But, the original GF2 had Rothgrowths, Draykons and Eyebeasts. Looking forward to dreading the sight of all three of them again.

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, stilltim said:

I'm sure I'll appreciate whatever enhancements Jeff makes. But, the original GF2 had Rothgrowths, Draykons and Eyebeasts. Looking forward to dreading the sight of all three of them again.

I cannot wait to see those again. Though one nice thing about this remake was the ability to get top (3rd) tier creations well before the end of the game. I always struggled w/ the original games to get the top (4th?) tier creations...and then the game was essentially over. Or that's how I remember it these days. If so, I hope that will be addressed in the further remakes.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I wonder what kind of abilities G2 creations will have in the remake, like for example the rotgroth could have a passive that drenches foes with acid when they get hit like Firefang from the wooded valley.

 

Also I do wonder if the wingbolt may appear in G2 as a 4th tier for the loyalist?

Link to post
Share on other sites
20 hours ago, stilltim said:

I'm sure I'll appreciate whatever enhancements Jeff makes. But, the original GF2 had Rothgrowths, Draykons and Eyebeasts. Looking forward to dreading the sight of all three of them again.

To be fair, I finished GF2 without encountering a single Eyebeast. I have never seen one in game. Not once. I know they exist from Shaping.

 

That useless trivia shared... I hope Rots don't get leap attacks. They are supposed to be slow. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Jeff will probably make abilities tied to game difficulty and player's choices like this remake so only on torment will you face the full effect. That said, Jeff likes to reuse his favorite new changes in monster abilities which was why we kept seeing lightning aura and we will probably be seeing more leaping attacks.  :(

 

Leaping attack really counter our range attacks. No picking off the strays from the edge of a swarm.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Back to heal and cure...

I just realized that the cockatrices in Barrens Bunker heal and cure themselves every time they attack. Or at least they do on torment. Don't know about the other difficulty settings. Makes you rethink your approach to battling these critters. Acid is worthless cuz they cure almost immediately. Anyway. I'll figure something out. Back to the topic at hand, since the logic to do it is already there, it makes me hopeful that in future releases, some of that can make it into creations that we can make. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Persistence pays off. And a little luck. Enough of them finally got close enough to each other where I could deal more damage with airshock than what they were dealing. I'm pretty excited about it too. This is the first time I have played on torment, and I even did it before using the Geneforge. Good times.

Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, alhoon said:

To be fair, I finished GF2 without encountering a single Eyebeast. I have never seen one in game. Not once. I know they exist from Shaping.

 

That useless trivia shared... I hope Rots don't get leap attacks. They are supposed to be slow. 

But I thought Rots were fastest out of all the battle creations due to it's innate quick action and it's capability to close distance rather quickly

Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, ultra112 said:

But I thought Rots were fastest out of all the battle creations due to it's innate quick action and it's capability to close distance rather quickly

The quick action allows them to make more attacks, not move faster. I don't know  what you mean that it closes distance rather quickly. They have the same speed as all creations IIRC. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

To think, Akhari Blaze had so much control that he could keep 100 unbound under control. But other than right when they're made, Unbound are supposed to be uncontrollable. Fire-and-Forget weapons. That means that after you lose control of them, you should not be able to assume it again. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, alhoon said:

The quick action allows them to make more attacks, not move faster. I don't know  what you mean that it closes distance rather quickly. They have the same speed as all creations IIRC. 

 

I was saying that because the enemy rotgroths are able to get close to my party easily and attack them close range when previous ones need two round to get to my party.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah. I don't think Alhoon got it, though. Depending on the game, Rots are one of the only PC creation that just straightforwardly gets a couple extra action points every turn. I think clawbugs sometimes get that too. Which is a little strange, Rots are so stilted and shambly, I never imagined them as being all that fast, like clawbugs seem to be.

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Sudanna said:

like clawbugs seem to be

Clawbugs are the worst! When the earth destroys itself, and you think there is nothing left but the cockroaches, the clawbugs will come in and destroy them in minutes.

Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, The Almighty Doer of Stuff said:

In Exile, Ghasts and Quickghasts, powerful and very fast undead monsters, are depicted as bloated, blue corpses like you would pull out of a lake. I think Jeff might just like slow-looking undead that are actually fast, for some reason.

really? well that's pretty odd.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...