Magnificent Ornk nikki. Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 So, I've just noticed something weird going off with spells. As I usually do whilst playing, I have just been buying the first level of all spells, and then waiting until I can find the spell book to upgrade to level 3 (sidenote: meh if that's suboptimal). However, when I've found the spellbooks, they only seem to be increasing my spells by one point (i.e., to level 2). Is this how they're supposed to work, because it seems kind of counter-intuitive. What's weirder is I can still buy the second level from stores, meaning that I've been and purchased Bolt of Fire level 3 from Miles in Formello, but I'm not getting rewarded with any awards for finding the third level of the spell (second sidenote: I don't care much for awards, but some people probably might). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rotghroth Rhapsody Vent Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 EDIT: oops sorry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Randomizer Posted December 22, 2011 Share Posted December 22, 2011 This version of Avernum doesn't bump you up 2 levels when you read a level 3 spell book. However you also don't need to have a level 1 of the spell before reading the spell book. To get the medals you need to have bought 2 levels and found the spell book. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ineffable Wingbolt Erebus the Black Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 Look at it this way, the first level is the basic spell, the second level from the trainer is an advanced form of the spell and the tome gives you lost tips or tricks that no one else can tell you about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnificent Ornk nikki. Posted December 23, 2011 Author Share Posted December 23, 2011 Originally Posted By: Erasmus Look at it this way, the first level is the basic spell, the second level from the trainer is an advanced form of the spell and the tome gives you lost tips or tricks that no one else can tell you about. Sure, except that I get level 1 (the basic spell) from a trainer. Then I get an advanced form from the book (level 2). Then, in your version of how to view it, I'm learning the lost tips and tricks that nobody else can tell me about from Miles in Formello. I suppose I'm just missing how it worked before, but it makes more sense to me that the spell book gives level 3 rather than just adding another level and allowing me to learn level 3 from a trainer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chittering Clawbug ProperPseudonym Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 Originally Posted By: living in my post-war apartment I suppose I'm just missing how it worked before, but it makes more sense to me that the spell book gives level 3 rather than just adding another level and allowing me to learn level 3 from a trainer. I believe that if you have read the tome, training with someone who will teach spells can get it up to lvl 3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rotghroth Rhapsody Kreador Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 Books ADD 1 level to the spell. You can purchase two additional levels from trainers. The order you do that doesn't matter. That's my understanding. Someone who knows better can correct me if I'm wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnificent Ornk nikki. Posted December 23, 2011 Author Share Posted December 23, 2011 Yeah no, we've covered that already in the thread. Books just add one level in AEFTP. In A1-3, however, they just straight gave you the third level of the spell which was where I was getting confused. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rotghroth Rhapsody Vent Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 Originally Posted By: Kreador Books ADD 1 level to the spell. You can purchase two additional levels from trainers. The order you do that doesn't matter. That's my understanding. Someone who knows better can correct me if I'm wrong. Yes as simple than that, don't search further, it's just that some people are trying to put realism where there isn't. Originally Posted By: living in my post-war apartment ... I suppose I'm just missing how it worked before, but it makes more sense to me that the spell book gives level 3 rather than just adding another level and allowing me to learn level 3 from a trainer. Except that in previous system the same book could also learned you level 1&2 spells or level 3. It was as incoherent than current system. With previous system you was taking care to use the book only for level 3? Your choice, you can do it too with the new system. For me the new system is better. Possibly a rude design would work too, books would work only for level 3 and the game would help keep track of books already discovered, for example maps user notes would work, or just a special list. And the game should have such list or user notes too for trainers. Particularly now that you can't switch to another application, something rather tedious for quoting in game information the game itself doesn't keep track. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Alorael at Large Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 The previous system was generally that the books with level 3 spells wouldn't do anything unless you already had level 1 or level 2. If you had either, you'd be bumped to level 3. You could reread them as often as you wanted, so characters who acquired the spell after you first read the book could get the 3rd level spell later. —Alorael, who liked that system purely because it made the level 3 book almost always immediately gratifying to the tune of a maximum level spell. Now you can easily find a book and have to go find a trainer and pick up the earlier levels for it to be really exciting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rotghroth Rhapsody Vent Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 Ok then it's more "realistic" but the crap is to make you wait find the book instead of learning the spell level 2, or overall lost money. Bad gameplay system, the newer is much better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ineffable Wingbolt Erebus the Black Posted December 23, 2011 Share Posted December 23, 2011 Originally Posted By: living in my post-war apartment Originally Posted By: Erasmus Look at it this way, the first level is the basic spell, the second level from the trainer is an advanced form of the spell and the tome gives you lost tips or tricks that no one else can tell you about. Sure, except that I get level 1 (the basic spell) from a trainer. Then I get an advanced form from the book (level 2). Then, in your version of how to view it, I'm learning the lost tips and tricks that nobody else can tell me about from Miles in Formello. I suppose I'm just missing how it worked before, but it makes more sense to me that the spell book gives level 3 rather than just adding another level and allowing me to learn level 3 from a trainer. In my view, only with both the tricks and the advanced training can you fulfill the full potential of the spell, each alone gives you a slightly better ability to cast. That's why to me this makes more sense (What would make even more sense, as I stated somewhere else, is if some trainers could give you a small extra for the 2nd lvl of the spell that you couldn't get from anyone else (like a tenth of a lvl), and maybe for nerfing purposes, you could chose only one (not including nor instead of the tome that gives you real secrets so it's worth is a full lvl)). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chittering Clawbug othersean Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 Speaking of level 3 spells, has anyone compiled a list of how they differ from their level 1 brethren? In the old Avernums (up to A3), they were often a huge step up; in the newer ones, extra spell levels are mostly useless, or at least not very significant. I gather that AEFTP falls somewhere in the middle, but I haven't found it documented. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Slarti Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 The game mostly does a good job telling you what the difference is, although not until you get the spells at higher levels. Healing, buffing, and summoning spells add extra buffs. Curing spells cure more effects. Damage spells either add a percentile bonus or a chance of a debuff or cleave. Debuffs add extra debuffs or extra chances to succeed. Cloaks and wards take effect at a higher power level -- presumably this makes their effect stronger. Dispel Barrier dispels all barriers instead of just some. I think that covers them all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Randomizer Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 I started a list, but the cost for raising spells kept me from completing it. I only have about half of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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