Avadon Is Out On Steam!

[Danny the Fool]

I liked the caves because the setting was unique. Once it was aboveground it started looking more and more like any other fantasy RPG.

[captain_video]

It's back in the Steam top 20 (barely) as I post this. There is an argument over whether Steam's Top Sellers list is unit-based or revenue-based, with different Steam employees giving different answers. If it's revenue based, than Avadon has sold 6x more units in the last 24 hours than have either Civilization V or the pre-order for Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3. Perhaps someone is planning a Caribbean vacation soon...

[Uberwiggett]

I can't see it being revenue, it'd make much more sense to be unit based. It's a popularity contest after all

[captain_video]

There is now an Avadon forum within the Steam game forums area, for those who have either bought it on Steam or use Steam regularly for other things.

[Epyx]

True enough...we have to remember this game has been out for a while, while games like Dungeons of Dredmor and Cthulu Saves the Day were initial platform releases so likely the reason they moved more units.

 

I just hope Jeff takes that into account. I have no doubt that a future Steam release that is an initial first day release will do much, much better.

[Vent]

Originally Posted By: captain_video

It's back in the Steam top 20 (barely) as I post this...

I'm curious, how you get the steam top selling list with more than top 20?

I was looking at indies top selling on Steam and Avadon is top 5. Not so bad even if for sure it means low numbers anyway, it's still means it sells because that list is quite often updated.

I quote it is right above Aztara, a strange but very nice light RPG with a current big sale.

EDIT: And in top selling RPG it is above Skyrim and Borderlands, woo woo, I know a guy who will soon buy some holiday villa in some nice sunny island.

[Vent]

Originally Posted By: Danny the Fool

I liked the caves because the setting was unique. Once it was aboveground it started looking more and more like any other fantasy RPG.

Myself it's since long I'm dreaming someone buy the license or some rights to make full 3D high graphic RPG with such huge cave environment, weird alien vegetation and bestiary, and ton of strange looking light effect.

[stumblefoot]

I played the Avadon demo for a few minutes and then bought the game on Steam. This is my first Spiderweb game and it won't be my last. I've been looking for an rpg like this and I hope it does real well in sales. I'll definitely take a look at their other games.

[Juan Carlo]

I bought it on steam. Count me as another who had never heard of spiderweb at all before seeing Avadon advertised on Steam.

 

I love RPG games, but my biggest complaint is that the writing in most tends to be pretty awful. So since basically every review of Avadon talked about how great the writing was and how the choices in the game tend to be morally complex and very "grey" (rather than the sort of black and white take on moral complexity that you usually get from your typical Bioware style RPG), I thought I'd give it a try based on that. Plus, 8.99 is cheap enough that even if I hate the game I really won't feel burned.

 

I'll try to return to this forum and post my thoughts on what I think of the game (as a total newbie/outsider to the spiderweb universe) after I played it a bit more.

 

I'm hoping it lives up to the hype expressed in some of the reviews I've read of the game (most of which were positively glowing).

[Earth]

Originally Posted By: stumblefoot

I played the Avadon demo for a few minutes and then bought the game on Steam. This is my first Spiderweb game and it won't be my last. I've been looking for an rpg like this and I hope it does real well in sales. I'll definitely take a look at their other games.

if you don't mind old graphics then you could start from Avernum 1 and continue onwards to Avernum 6 or start at Geneforge 1 and continut to Geneforge 5.

[Vent]

Originally Posted By: Juan Carlo

...
I love RPG games, but my biggest complaint is that the writing in most tends to be pretty awful. So since basically every review of Avadon talked about how great the writing was

In my opinion the writing is quite stronger than, for example, in the Eschalon Book series, but in no way you can expect something at level of what can do teams like Bioware or Bethesda at their best moments.

Originally Posted By: Juan Carlo

...and how the choices in the game tend to be morally complex and very "grey" (rather than the sort of black and white take on moral complexity that you usually get from your typical Bioware style RPG), I thought I'd give it a try based on that.

I think Avadon is well done on that point, including some good highlighting/reminding of past choices when later consequences happen. But it won't be at a level of a game like The Witcher 1, plus it seems that some players don't even quote that aspect of the game, perhaps not enough highlighted.

Originally Posted By: Juan Carlo

I'm hoping it lives up to the hype expressed in some of the reviews I've read of the game (most of which were positively glowing).

Crossing fingers, I hope too, from players/fans the opinions are more shared. But a part of disappointments was coming from expectations, so it's good to play it with a fresh mind, but I hope the hype reviews didn't build a too high expectation.

[Alorael at Large]

If you want moral decision trees, take a look at the Geneforge series. Avadon gives you choices, but Geneforge makes your choices drive huge parts of the story from fairly early in the game.

 

—Alorael, who will give Bioware much higher marks for dialogue. Spiderweb still uses text to describe just about everything, though, which often means that you get a more detailed picture of the world than Bioware gives, codex or no codex.

[Earth]

Al's post reminds me that I need to read codexes before I finish game.

[Alorael at Large]

Please just call me Alorael. If you start using the abbreviations for my daily displayed names no one will be able to figure out what you're talking about when the name changes. Like right now!

 

—Alorael, who actually would be very happy if there were a way to read codex entries while your party moves across the map. It will fill in a lot of dead time.

[Earth]

edited post.

[Beakie]

Hi,

 

As I stated before in the other Steam Thread I bought 2 copies of Avadon (PC and Ipad).

 

I too, would like to see the older games compiled into a set (maybe bundled with there HintBooks).

 

I Would like to catch up on the other series without it costing an Arm and a.... Wing (so to speak).

 

Beakie

[Slawbug]

http://www.spiderwebsoftware.com/mm5/mer...=collection_cds

 

I believe you can get registration codes for the mac/PC versions when you order, instead of waiting for the CD. However, note that while there is a discount of around 40% on the bundles compared to the individual games, don't expect Steam prices.

[Sterno]

Originally Posted By: HOUSE of S

http://www.spiderwebsoftware.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Store_Code=1&Category_Code=collection_cds

 

I believe you can get registration codes for the mac/PC versions when you order, instead of waiting for the CD. However, note that while there is a discount of around 40% on the bundles compared to the individual games, don't expect Steam prices.

 

If I remember right, Jeff ran a 50% off everything sale last October (about a week after I bought every game... doh!) So if anyone is thinking of buying a whole lot of games, might behoove you to wait a few months and see if there's a sale. 50% off a bundle is a pretty big savings. Then again, if you've got the money and want to support an indie dev, there's nothing wrong with full price either.

[nikki.]

Originally Posted By: Sterno

If I remember right, Jeff ran a 50% off everything sale last October (about a week after I bought every game... doh!) So if anyone is thinking of buying a whole lot of games, might behoove you to wait a few months and see if there's a sale. 50% off a bundle is a pretty big savings. Then again, if you've got the money and want to support an indie dev, there's nothing wrong with full price either.

Yeah, and the GeneForge one is great value at it's regular price - 5 full length games, with plenty of replay value, for slightly more than a single newly released AAA title.

[LazerBeast]

Just bought this game via Steam after reading about it on various websites.

 

Plunked 7 hours into it today.

 

Needless to say I am hooked and thankful.

[gunsakimbo]

Found Avadon through Steam as well (and had somehow never played a SpiderWeb game before). Really really fantastic game. Loving it sooo much. Thanks for creating it

[stumblefoot]

Originally Posted By: Earth Empires

Originally Posted By: stumblefoot

I played the Avadon demo for a few minutes and then bought the game on Steam. This is my first Spiderweb game and it won't be my last. I've been looking for an rpg like this and I hope it does real well in sales. I'll definitely take a look at their other games.

 

if you don't mind old graphics then you could start from Avernum 1 and continue onwards to Avernum 6 or start at Geneforge 1 and continut to Geneforge 5.

 

I'm looking for games like Ultima or Wasteland and so I don't mind the old graphics. When I get done with Avadon I'll definitely look at those. Thanks.

[Earth]

Avernum 1 and Geeforge1 have much better graphics than Ultima 6 (last Ultima I have played) and on another plus is that modern comps run those games smoithly.

[Vent]

Have you notice there's no user recommendation for Avadon? It means it didn't attract much players having already played it. But also players that bought it didn't get any enthusiast enough to recommend before finish it or close.

[Grundy Claus]

Is it possible to sync the game's Steam achievements with Avadon if I bought it from the Spidweb store? I put the game on Steam already, but the achievements aren't there.

[A less presumptuous name.]

Didn't the achievements get added to the steam version? Unless you're talking about the game medals. Have you tried copying your save folder to the steam version? If that doesn't do it, there may not be a way.

[keira]

I would bet Steam has it set up so you can only get achievements at the time of awarding, to prevent friends from just passing the save file around to each other to bloat their achievement-o-meter or whatever. I certainly could be wrong, I don't use the fool program.

[Juan Carlo]

No.

 

You can easily pass saves around on steam and get the achievements (basically everyone was doing it during the summer sale achievement competition they had).

 

However, I'm pretty sure that steam achievements requires some added programing that the non-steam version of the game lacks (I'm not an expert, but I think it adds extra flags to the save game files to tell steam whether or not the achievements should be awarded). So I doubt that non-steam versions of save games will award you the achievements in the same way that steam version saves will.

 

I could be wrong, though, so you could just try it and see.

[Slawbug]

Are saved games even compatible? If they are, that strongly implies no such flags have been added and it is rather an extra check done in the application's code, maybe when games are loaded.

[A less presumptuous name.]

I believe that the saves are compatible. I remember people asking about it, and I think Jeff said to just move the save files over. Don't quote me on that, though.

[Celtic Minstrel]

Originally Posted By: Jesse Dylan

(how about a Spiderweb Classics Compilation on Steam?)

Much as I'd love that, I'm 99% sure it won't happen, primarily because they are old and gone and don't run on newer computers.

Originally Posted By: Sterno

If I remember right, Jeff ran a 50% off everything sale last October (about a week after I bought every game... doh!)

I think the October Sadness Sale is an annual occurrence; I know I've bought games in at least two years during one.

[Size_ JM]

Hey I know a lot of people do not like Steam, due to the client having to be installed. I found Avadon on D2d. D2D does not have a client and the same 9.99 price.

 

http://www.direct2drive.com/10858/product/Buy-Avadon:-The-Black-Fortress-Download

[captain_video]

$5 today only on Steam, brace yourself for some more new players.

[Juan Carlo]

Yeah, it's on daily deal today on steam (50% off).

 

So if anyone hasn't bought it yet on steam they should. Also tell your friends! (I convinced at least one friend of mine to pick it up).

 

I really did love this game so I'm hoping it will sell well enough on steam that the re-release of Avernum will also be released on steam.

[Tyranicus]

Originally Posted By: Juan Carlo

Yeah, it's on daily deal today on steam (50% off).

So if anyone hasn't bought it yet on steam they should. Also tell your friends! (I convinced at least one friend of mine to pick it up).

I really did love this game so I'm hoping it will sell well enough on steam that the re-release of Avernum will also be released on steam.

I would imagine that, going forward, new releases will be on Steam. I'm sure Jeff certainly wants to put them on Steam, and, now that he has one game up, it probably isn't as difficult to get new games approved.

[BlueDraconis]

I sure hope the new Avernum will be on Steam.

[Earth]

most likely will be and so will avadon 2, avernum 2.1 etc.

[Overwhelming]

Totaly worth the 3,49€ I paid for it today (after trying the demo and getting disapointed with the ipad oriented level design, I decided to wait for a sale).

[Lilith]

Originally Posted By: Overwhelming

Totaly worth the 3,49€ I paid for it today (after trying the demo and getting disapointed with the ipad oriented level design, I decided to wait for a sale).

For what it's worth, the iPad port was an afterthought after the design work had already been done. If you don't like the map design, it's because you don't like the map design, not because of anything to do with the iPad.

[Slawbug]

I don't think Jeff would have changed level design just for the iPad version. But there had definitely been talk of "exploring" the possibility of iPad or iPhone ports long before Avadon was released. Admittedly, it didn't really sound like it was going to happen at the time, but I wouldn't call it an afterthought.

[Overwhelming]

Originally Posted By: Lilith

Originally Posted By: Overwhelming

Totaly worth the 3,49€ I paid for it today (after trying the demo and getting disapointed with the ipad oriented level design, I decided to wait for a sale).

For what it's worth, the iPad port was an afterthought after the design work had already been done. If you don't like the map design, it's because you don't like the map design, not because of anything to do with the iPad.

I disagree. The iPad version wasn't an afterthought and the map design shows it (like indoors being mega huge, everything more spaced out, probably because it was necessary to use touch instead of a more little and accurate mouse cursor).

Or it's all a coincidence.

[radiojonty]

OK so I downloaded this Steam thing in order to get a demo for another game too, but I'm not sure what Steam is.

 

I'm thinking it's, at 1.5mb, some kind of slimmed down GameSpy?

 

No?

 

Some sort of download manager?

 

Hmmm.

 

Why not just have the website with the downloadable trial demos already, instead of going through this having some software on your PC to get software middleman?

 

Am I being thick or what? :-D

[Alorael at Large]

For something like Spiderweb's games, where there's already a site set up to distribute the demos, going through Steam for demos adds nothing at all. For some games there are only demos through Steam, so you work with what you have to.

 

The real reason to use Steam isn't as a download manager, though. It's to keep a central library of games. You can re-download them anytime, anywhere you have Steam installed, and not worry about losing discs or a thousand different download logins. You can put your saves in the Steam cloud and access them in many places with some games.

 

—Alorael, who appreciates the convenience of Steam. He's just not sure it outweighs the convenience of backing up himself. Having to actually run Steam is a minor annoyance every time he wants to play a game.

[radiojonty]

Originally Posted By: Gaslighting by Moonlight

The real reason to use Steam...[is] to keep a central library of games. You can re-download them anytime, anywhere you have Steam installed, and not worry about losing discs or a thousand different download logins. You can put your saves in the Steam cloud and access them in many places with some games.

Ah, right, so you can only save saves - as it were - with Steam hosted games, and not use it for other game saves like Neverwinter Nights, say? (An old favourite)

[Alorael at Large]

Are you asking if Steam will store saves from games that aren't from Steam? The answer is no, but you can register some games you got from other places with Steam and still share saves. But Neverwinter Nights isn't available through Steam at all, and very few games actually use Steam Cloud.

 

—Alorael, who has pretty much reached the end of his Steam knowledge. You can probably get more from Steam FAQs.

[Tyranicus]

Yeah, Steam Cloud isn't nearly as useful as you might think it would be because most games don't support it. The big advantage of Steam is the centralized game repository. You can install Steam on any computer, login with your credentials, and download all the games you have purchased through Steam in the past.

[Ceregon]

Personally, I couldn't be happier seeing that Spiderweb Software games are finally on Steam. Pro or con it it's still major exposure.

 

I discovered Spiderweb games when Avernum 4 was made available to Big Fish games. I'm an "older player" who got my start in PC RPG gaming with the old gold box D&D games, such as Pool of Radiance, Curse of the Azure Bonds, ect. so when I fired up Avernum it was like reliving what got me hooked on PC RPG's in the first place.

 

So much so I came to this site and bought the Avernum 1-3 plus hintbook package. It was a hefty expense, although I'll be quick to add, absolutely worth every penny and then some.

 

But still, and here's where I join the Pro-steam side; I would never have discovered Jeff's incredible games if he hadn't of offered A4 to indy distribution sites. I'm sure he did it for the exposure to bring in new customers and fans, and I do believe I read that he had stated that doing so had saved his company.

 

Fast forward to the present. I love Steam because it does offer old school RPG's. Heck they even still offer the Shining Force series for PC. So I was pleasantly surprised to get Jeff's email that he was now offering Avadon on steam. And at that price I bought it with absolutely no hesitation. At that price my hand just automatically went to the BUY tab and *click*.

 

I do understand that an incredible amount of talent and hard work goes into Spiderweb games, and I fully understand that Jeff and crew need a good source of income to keep roofs over their heads and food on the table. But at the same time I haven't bought Avernum 5 or 6 yet and the reason is the price. I've always put it off for someday....someday...and will it ever come? Who knows.

 

The thing stopping me? As much as I acknowledge and truly believe in the principle that the staff of Spiderweb needs good profits to keep everyone employed and their families taken care of, it's still the price.

 

Believe me, even though I bought A 1-3, and happy I did, once my wife saw the credit card bill...well, that was a torment level no one should face. So litte to say, getting Avernum 5 and 6 after that has been on the back burner ever since.

 

But with getting Avadon for $10, no hesitation on my part and my wife actually encouraged it, knowing how much I loved the Avernum games I did buy.

 

So it's a two edged sword in my opinion. Just where is the price point for old-school RPGs that keeps both the creators and buyers happy? Moreso, where is the price point that earns a profit but also, like with Avernum 4 and Avadon convinces consumers to click the BUY button without even thinking twice about it. It's the "thinking twice" part that usually has customers pass by and keep skimming the lists of games available.

 

In any case, thanks for putting Avernum 4 up for $10 on the indy sites like Big Fish that introduced me to your incredible games, and for putting Avadon up on Steam for the same price, that in a total reversal actually had my wife encouraging me to hit the ol' BUY button on it.

 

Of course immdediately afterwards she bought a Sims 3 stuff pack for herself... Umm, I think I just got played...

[Juan Carlo]

The entire Geneforge series just appeared on steam for 15 dollars.

 

I just bought them.

 

I didn't think any of the older Spiderweb games would ever come to steam (Valve is pretty picky sometimes about rejecting low tech games), so this is awesome.

[Lilith]

Originally Posted By: Juan Carlo

I didn't think any of the older Spiderweb games would ever come to steam (Valve is pretty picky sometimes about rejecting low tech games), so this is awesome.

as a general rule once you get one game on Steam it's a lot easier to get others on, because you already have a business relationship with them

it's not so much that Valve is picky (there are plenty of awful games that have still made it onto Steam) as that Steam is honestly kind of understaffed and doesn't always respond to every random indie game developer in a timely fashion

[Juan Carlo]

Originally Posted By: Lilith

Originally Posted By: Juan Carlo

I didn't think any of the older Spiderweb games would ever come to steam (Valve is pretty picky sometimes about rejecting low tech games), so this is awesome.

as a general rule once you get one game on Steam it's a lot easier to get others on, because you already have a business relationship with them

Perhaps, but there are some pretty big exceptions.

Soldak Entertainment, for example, who sold "Depths of Peril" on steam (another indie RPG) had their second game "Din's Curse" rejected with no explanation (even though "Din's Curse" is really a more polished game than "Depths of Peril" on most every level--so it makes no sense).

I've heard of several other similar situations as well (Fort Zombie, Patholigic, and a few others).

Valve doesn't always make a whole lot of sense when it comes to accepting/rejecting games (especially considering some of the crap that they do sell). I often wonder if sales factor in at all (i.e. maybe "Depths of Peril" sold really poorly and that's why "Din's Curse" was rejected. Who knows? It's their policy to not give reasons for rejections so there's really no way of knowing).