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G5 Ending(s) *spoilers*[G5]


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I did Astoria ending, then, for a complete reversal, I did Ghaldring, and I noticed that they were surprisingly... the same. I mean, there are some small differences (key being a bunch of dead nodye shapers), but in the end, the drakon empire falls, and Terrestia (spelling?) is split into rebels and shapers but there is peace and happiness following. Do all the endings end up with happiness and a split Terrestia?

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Happiness as in, Shapers and rebels both get along, there are quite a few survivors, shaping is lowered and controlled more, geneforge is drained, new people forget the old hatred of the war, drayks and drakons live peacefully.

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The Astoria, Ghaldring and Litalia endings are all pretty similar, although in Litalia's ending the Trakovites get their wish and shaping is eventually phased out for the most part. In Alwan's ending the rebels are effectively wiped out, while Taygen's ending involves the release of the Purity Agent and pretty much defines "gone horribly right".

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Originally Posted By: Xelgion
I did Astoria ending, then, for a complete reversal, I did Ghaldring, and I noticed that they were surprisingly... the same. I mean, there are some small differences (key being a bunch of dead nodye shapers), but in the end, the drakon empire falls, and Terrestia (spelling?) is split into rebels and shapers but there is peace and happiness following.


The big difference between the Ghaldring and Astoria endings is that the Rebels obtain far more land in the former. In Astoria's ending, the Shapers retain the western half of Terrestia (ergo. all the provinces that were held by the Shapers during Geneforge 5). In Ghaldring's ending, the Shapers only get to keep their coastal provinces.

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Do all the endings end up with happiness and a split Terrestia?


Yes for the Trakovite ending. The only difference is that Shaping is phased out.

Alwan's ending is a total but hard fought victory for the Shapers.

Taygen's ending amounts to complete annihilation of the rebels in a matter of weeks.
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Originally Posted By: Enalya
I've done both Ghaldring and Alwan's endings, yet in both, I don't find out who I am...is there an ending that allows me to get this knowledge?


The ending that does this is the one where you get so frustrated at Jeff's lack of closure that you go on the forums and are swayed by the persuasive arguments that
Click to reveal..
the G5 PC is actually also the G2 PC

which makes a lot of sense when you think about it. Another clever examples of fans connecting the dots is speculation that
Click to reveal..
the G3 PC actually becomes the mad Shaper Monarch in G4
, which would be pretty wickedly cool if Jeff would just admit it in the remakes.
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Click to reveal..
It mainly stems from text in the game scripts that doesn't appear in the game itself about how the PC was found wandering around in the ruins near Drypeak, where G2 took place. Obviously, this person was clearly powerful enough to interest Rawal enough to have him capture, subdue, and transport said person to the Whitespires.

Arguments against the PC being from G3 or G4 are much stronger- both Alwan and Greta removed ANY mention of the G3 PC from their journals, strongly indicating that said person was an embarrassment to both sides- so either a Trakovite or somebody who opted for the KILL EVERYTHING EVER solution, like Monarch. Plus, G3 canonically ended in favor of the rebels, so clearly said PC was pretty hopped-up on canisters like Monarch was, and in G5 IIRC Litalia states that she was to her knowledge the only person who managed to reverse the effects of the canisters, and she would DEFINITELY know if the G3 PC was able to do so. So the only remaining option is that the G3 PC went stir-crazy and became Monarch, since it fits all available evidence.

Now, Rawal is crazy and power-hungry, but he's not stupid. He knows damn well that even the combined resources of the most powerful Shaper and Rebel generals were only able to fight Monarch to a standstill, so he'd be incredibly foolish to try and recruit him, since there's no guarantee Rawal would be strong enough to contain him without relying on the control tool- and he'd have to know that Monarch was a intelligent enough researcher that's he be able to remove the tool at some point or other. In that light, he'd never put the PC in a position where he'd be far enough away long enough to remove it- aka he wouldn't leave the Whitespires. This also makes sense because Monarch's greatest strength would be creating hordes of creations to serve him- so he'd be more valuable as a last line of defense than as a far-reaching covert agent of Rawal.

Similar arguments also forbid the G5 PC being the G4 PC. Canonically, the G4 PC releases, or at least allows the release, of the Unbound, kills Miranda, and grievously wounds Alwan. This is the same Alwan, I'd remind you, that you personally meet later in the game. If you were the G4 PC, he'd recognize you, and either a) kill you, or B) imprison you and probably torture you. Rawal would again, probably know this, and he's not about to send you into the lions den to get a book if he knows that Alwan exposing you for who you are could cost Rawal his council seat and possibly life.

However, the G2 PC would be totally unknown, not hopped up on canister, and perfectly sane albeit very powerful. If you subtract their recollection of events from G2, they'd make an ideal field agent, having already proved their competence before, and by already being loyalist to the Shaper cause. Furthermore, anyone who could recognize them is either dead or in one of the two provinces that conveniently can't be accessed in the center of Shaper power. There are powerful IC reasons for Rawal to use you, no compelling counter-evidence, no legitimate alternatives, and some decently hefty circumstantial evidence to boot, making the fact that G2 PC = G5 PC pretty obvious.


QED.
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Click to reveal..
The problem I have with many of your arguments is that they assume that people have ready access to information on other people's identities. Terrestia has no telecommunications, and it's not as if Monarch's face was up on posters. Hardly anyone actually saw Shaper Monarch (the G4 PC, Litalia, and a few swamp villagers), so we have no reason to assume that Rawal has any idea what Monarch looks, sounds, or smells like (probably not very easy on the nostrils, all told). Your arguments only obtain if we assume Rawal knew the identity of his slave, and we know from his journals in G5 that he did not. Further, it seems entirely possible that the G4 PC defeated Monarch, then sent him off to harass the Shapers; this is, after all, an option the player can choose in G4, and a likely one given the G4 PC's canonical affiliation with the rebels. Monarch presumably then became further unhinged while in Shaper lands due to some combination of the shame of defeat, existing insanity, and further canister abuse.

I'll grant that the G4 PC is a less likely option, both because of issues of recognizability that you bring up, and because even Jeff's rather fly-by-night chronology strains and cries out at the timing that theory would necessitate.

Also, the fact that Rawal finds the G5 PC near Drypeak is much less telling when one considers that ~20 years have passed. Given that the Shapers destroyed most of the settlements in the area, the only reason the G2 PC would plausibly have remained around Drypeak is if s/he was in some form of stasis.


It amuses me that this entire discussion is taking place within spoiler tags.
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