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Explaining Geneforge's lack of popularity?


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Hey, I'm a new member of the forums (actually just signed up to be able to use the search function). I bought the original Geneforge 7 years ago, but never looked much at the sequels (I'm the type who doesn't like more of the same in games) but I came back for the conclusion and enjoyed Geneforge 5 immensely. However while surfing the net I found this article:

Reflections On Geneforge By Scorpia

I was rather surprised to read that apparently Geneforge is less popular then the other series? I personally find Geneforge by far the more interesting of the series, the combination of open-ended storyline with lots of possible endings, creation party-mechanics and a fun pseudo-science world with lots of bio-based tech is what got me to buy the game in the first place. Don't get me wrong though, what Scorpia says makes sense to me, but I wanted to know what the people of this forum thought about it, has Jeff ever said anything about why Avernum is apparently more popular? Are RPG fans really such boring people that they want the same old fantasy worlds (which, btw, to my knowledge have gone completely out of style afa the fantasy novel industry is concerned) latter rinse repeated?

 

Please share your thoughts,

Zoston

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Originally Posted By: Zoston
Don't get me wrong though, what Scorpia says makes sense to me, but I wanted to know what the people of this forum thought about it, has Jeff ever said anything about why Avernum is apparently more popular? Are RPG fans really such boring people that they want the same old fantasy worlds (which, btw, to my knowledge have gone completely out of style afa the fantasy novel industry is concerned) latter rinse repeated?


Jeff has said something about it, and your last sentence is pretty much what he's said, although he was very slightly more diplomatic about it. He originally wanted to make Geneforge pure sci-fi with no magic at all, but he didn't think that would sell.
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I love Geneforge far more than Avernum. However, Avernum is a remake of Exile, which was the first series Spiderweb produced. Because of this, Avernum is somewhat of the flagship series for Spiderweb, so it gets more attention (from my perspective, that is) than Geneforge. In fact, I don't believe that Geneforge was ever meant to be a series, and instead meant to be a single game, like Nethergate.

 

Also, that Scorpia seems to be a hack. Half of that information is wrong about the Geneforge. I wouldn't take anything he says that seriously.

 

Anyway, give the other Geneforges a try. They are all absoulutly amazing smile.

 

The Last Archon

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Originally Posted By: Xelgion
Most people are too stupid to play to Geneforge, thats why. Having to make diplomatic choices choices? Oh noes!

People enjoy Fallout just fine, and that also gives you (some) factional choices and a karma meter.

—Alorael, who thinks Geneforge would be immensely popular for being different and interesting if it had a larger budget, pretty graphics, and good advertising. Without those, it's just a niche RPG that's trying out a slightly different niche.
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  • 2 weeks later...

I haven't yet made it through all the games of each series, but from what i've seen i like Avernum better than Geneforge for nitpicky reasons of mechanics:

 

#1) It is a PITA to have to make multiple trips to properly loot an area, because only one character can carry stuff. Why can't Shapers make some sort of pack mule type creation?

 

#2) Geneforge does not tell you the value of an item until *after* you have hauled it to the store. Avernum lets you know before you pick it up.

 

#3) I intensely dislike the artificial limitations on how much money the stores have to trade for your loot. Once the store has given you their alloted sum of money, it never ever gets any more. On top of that, whichever faction you've joined is stamped on your forehead. Thus even if they have money you may not get it.

 

#4) If i keep getting smacked down by a certain enemy, i appreciate the option of temporarily giving myself a boost in the editor. Here again, the Avernum games stand head and shoulders above the Geneforge games. Not only is the Avernum editor built in as opposed to a third party hack, but it covers much more than just character stats.

 

#5) I would have to say it appears that Mr. Vogel himself likes Avernum better than Geneforge. Why else is it that in Avernum you can get a full selection of avatars [choice of gender and race] for each character class, but in Geneforge your avatar is fixed for each class?

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Geneforge 3 onwards fixes your complaint about number 3. (Number 2 gets fixed somewhere along the line as well, as Ackrovan pointed out. I'm not sure which game. Probably in G3 as well.)

 

Dikiyoba totally agrees with you on point one. Between encumbrance (older games) and the prevalence of charms (newer games), one person just can't carry much.

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Actually number one is fixed in 4 and 5....... sort of....

 

But then, you must remember that many RPGs DO have the limitation on carrying capacity. Even the father Dungeons and Dragons. It's just people tend to treat backpacks as being somehow able to carry three full sets of armor and four weapons while still being under the unmoving encumberance level. Although I will admit, being able to carry my hoard off 25 Living Tools and god-only-knows how many potions that I save for when I never use them without having to worry about the weight they make IS really handy.

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Originally Posted By: Chessrook44
But then, you must remember that many RPGs DO have the limitation on carrying capacity.


I should have been more clear. I don't object to the concept of encumbrance. What i'm objecting to is that in Geneforge my party only carries about a quarter of what my party in Avernum does.

Originally Posted By: Chessrook44
Although I will admit, being able to carry my hoard off 25 Living Tools and god-only-knows how many potions that I save for when I never use them without having to worry about the weight they make IS really handy.


?!? Is this another thing that changed in G3 or later? As of G2 i DO get penalized in AP for carrying too much. That's why when i traded up from the Shielding Knife to the Shaped Blade i had store most of my Living Tools back in the house. I also sell off some food items if i accumulate a bunch.
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Right, but "low" is relative and not synonymous with "worst" in any event.

 

And A4 was unpopular with a certain subset of forum users. It wasn't actually unpopular by a particularly gross margin here -- though the preference for A5 does seem to be nearly universal -- and we are a pretty self-selected subset of his customer base as well.

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