Death Knight

 

 

 

Well, if you think about how d and d did their mastery of generalized classes (3.0), jeff already probably has something thought of about making humans more viable. In d and d, humans got an extra feat at lvl 1, Jeff might be able to give humans the ability to choose from a few underdog feats that allow them to learn things to bump it more to their favor, making them equal to their other counterparts.

Hmm...thats interesting, does anyone know if anatomy applies to ranged weapons in the second trilogy? It obviously applies to the first.

I just read up on avernum 2 harehunter's site that anatomy actually does give bonus points to damage for bows and throwing weapons. This is interesting as even though it is .5 points, that matters quite a bit when you consider that it all adds up. Does anyone know if anatomy applying to ranged weapons only applies to a1 and a2, or if it is for avernum 3 and boa?

 

Thoukydides, you might want to look into that as it states a bit of stuff about dexterity as well. http://hasenjs.byethost33.com/Silverchat/Avernum/characters1.html

Im mainly looking for someone that is average at fighting, but amazing at healing/augmentation. If i remember correctly, augmentation is a lot of fun as it gives you extra health making you more hardy. i always thought that was pretty cool running around with a crazy amount of life as an agent in g1. Id play the shocktrooper missile style, but is it possible to do that without shaping? I tried doing the shaping this time with a melee shocktrooper and i couldnt get into it. Shaping was never fun for me in any of the geneforge games. Would that work if i got augment and some of the crazy good healing spells that heal anything+plus a bit of regular magic (bless, haste) and missiles. I'd still have a large essence pool, i just wouldnt be the best at regular magic. Has anyone tried the shocktrooper solo without creations?

Ok, this might not make sense but bear with me-Ive been thinking of the ranged possibilities in all the games and while thinking of the avernum series, I thought of g series. While avernum almost completely forces you to use bows, geneforge gives you many classes that sort of overlap each other.

 

You get a warrior. This class is excellent at missile weapons, meh at shaping and bad at magic

 

You get a servile. This class is just as the warrior, great at missile weapons, and ok at magic, shaping w/e.

 

You get an infiltrator, who is pretty good at missiles and excellent at magic, with no emphasis for shaping.

 

The question about all this rant is of the 3 (or 4) solo characters, which one is the best missile weapons/baton expert? I never sort of understood the real difference between a warrior and a servile only that the warrior is more defensive due to better healing and the servile is capable at magic. The infiltrator might pose a threat as well though as she is excellent at magic and not so bad at shaping. The only way i can see the warrior standing at all to this is if you went pretty gungho on augmentation through healing spells, thus making yourself a hardy sniper.

 

I would have included the shocktrooper but that makes no sense as any shocktrooper that doesnt use creations wouldnt work ever.

 

Has anyone ever decided who is the ultimate king of missile weapons in geneforge series.

Guangong eh? It seems like i am not the only rotk fan here

 

Whoever can get Jeff Vogel as a playable character in any of these games deserves a medal.

When you say that the damage is low, do you mean the multiplier. I always thought that the multiplier for all jeffs games was the bottom divided by the top. A bow or throwing weapon in a1, 2 is 2-20 or 2-24 damage. Thats 1-10 damage right? I never really knew what determined damage in the first trilogy as it only specified the multiplier in boa. I just figured it was 1-10 damage per dex and missile weapon. Is there a chart for this area?

What is a random generating store? Are you talking about wandering merchants.

Just for my knowledge, was there a refill on missile weapons in the first trilogy? I never stopped to notice if they restock. If they dont then you might be onto something.

You really think so? I remember the last time i played a4 and a5, the multiplier for most bows (other than heartstriker) was 1-2, with some 1-3. The multiplier is not only better in the 1st trilogy, but the need for sharpshooter isnt needed, at least imo. The only real thing you get that is worthwhile in the second trilogy for ranged investment, is chance to hit. Whats 1-2 damage going to do with regarding beating monsters?

You are right with a4 though. In a4, as much as the story wasnt as good as a5, charging in melee doesnt work as 5 ap rule. The thing i hated with a5 and onward was that you get 8 ap to do anything with just 1 to do it. That nerfs ranged and top that off with the battle disciplines. Battle disciplines is another avadon type thing that i never could get into. Avadon did that aspect right but had the battles play out much differently. The thing that could decide all this in the a1 remake is the fact that jeff is adding perks and reworking the BD system. I just hope jeff doesnt go linear with the remake.



Edit-There is however one other thing your view has that i might have overlooked, and that is the fact that the amount of missile weapons eventually run out or stop getting sold at the stores. If that is the case, then throwing weapons are indeed useless and bows close to the same.

I disagree. In both a4, a6 and a5-you are given 8 spaces that you can move to close in. Thats 4 spaces more than in the original trilogy. Once you close in, archers are no longer archers and melee is game time. The 2nd trilogy is almost too gungho on melee to the point where bows and throwing are pointless. Although bows give you infinite ammo in the 2nd trilogy. Even so though there is only a small amount of arrows and throwing weapons in the 1st series, you still can shoot at someone and still keep a distance. The 2nd trilogy makes things easier for melee, and in doing so make the game no fun for ranged. The main reason the first trilogy is so fun is that you can kite something the 2nd trilogy doesnt have. Geneforge 4 and 5 follow the same rules as what i just said as they give 8 spaces for everyone and it only takes 6-7 to reach your enemy. Ranged is pointless in the newer games.

i found that rogue type characters were always more useful with a bow/throwing. I tried the same idea that you are trying and it worked partially.

Im not even sure what to make of where this topic is going...

 

Either way, if you cant play as the aliens thats not the biggest deal as we might get to play as jeff fogel With this new perk system, i think this game is going to rock.

Im having a bit of trouble with sticking with a class. I was going to give shaping/combat a try with a shocktrooper but i realized that i couldnt just go commando with 1 insanely buffed/leveled creation. I might just have to go with a warrior. Is it possible/viable to use a shocktrooper and just deck out all your points in a creation and stick with that guy+magic+combat. I know shocktroopers arent good in magic, but ive read their stats and they have good essence points. I dont have the patience to control an army of disposables and last guardian i used didnt turn out too well.

Im on to g4 right now. Unfortunately i never finished g2 with my guardian and g3 had problems with my os. So far the only geneforge that ive been able to beat was the 1st.

 

Does anyone think that jeff will ever do a remake for the first 3 g-series if he has success with avernum rewrites? I think it would work really well as there are a lot of things he could improve.

Im not worrying about jeff doing anything too out of the ordinary for the remakes. Avadon is avadon and A4-A6 and there is nothing that you can change about that. Its more linear and you either like it or you dont.

 

But besides that, like many others have said in the above posts, jeff will probably get quite a bit of recognition when this remake is made. A lot of people didnt like the original avernum's because of the graphics. I found the graphics to be cool as the retroness was unique. Aside from that, while i like the geneforge series the most, the original avernums 1-3 are probably my 2nd favorite series of party based games(with baldurs gate 1 and 2 as 1st).

 

I think that with the new skills, the graphics, the battle disciplines and this interesting new perks system, jeff is going to gain much more of a following than he already has.

I dont know if i could go that far. Avadon is not even in geneforge's league. Geneforge may be a very hard game (and it is), but at least it has a large amount of redeeming qualities.

I have to second it. Avadon was boring compared to the other games and i know what you mean. Avadon had one thing that avernum's first series didnt have (and they were hard). That thing that avadon had was that the battles took way too long and were hard. Compare that to avernum 1-3 plus boa, they were hard but at least you got killed in the first or second round. In avadon you could be in a battle that lasts half an hour to an hour, and lose, only to have to start all over. Ive played avernum 1, boa, they were a joke difficulty-wise compared to avadon.

I just put g3 and a4 onto my new laptop a day ago. I noticed that the animations on both those games were sloppy, slow and the game ran sluggish. To see if this was just those games, i downloaded g4, g5 and a5. All of them work fine with no slow. Are a4 and g3 part of the same engine. This must be because this laptop is windows 7.

I would say that anything that is a short-bladed weapon that cannot be regarded as a sword (due to length) and relies on finesse, is a dagger. Dirks, knives, etc.

 

The only one i have trouble calling a dagger is a kukri. Kukris are huge by dagger standards and difficult to use, or so i hear. Ive never used one before as i am still learning main gauche style.

Well that still doesnt mean its a bad idea, its probably too late anyway.

I was thinking about jeff expanding the series races that you get. I noticed that vahnatai are very prevalent in the games of the series. Can anyone confirm if jeff will ever add them to playable races. It would be cool as a4 had kravvit bok, who imo was pretty cool bad guy. Does anyone else think this is possible?

You are 100% right about all this. New games are all about action, but in a different way. People nowadays have no problem wasting 500+ hours on 1 game such as wow which has no ending, no purpose unless you are pvp. Everything is about graphics too, to the point where the actual game could suck so long as the graphics were good. Jeff is probably the only guy that actually makes games with a purpose. Even avadon (while lacking some of the luster of the previous games series) still had a great world and story. I can play one of his games, and actually finish it. Everything else nowadays is just claiming to be rpg, but its really action. The 3rd fallout was a good example. Fallout 3 was a disgrace that claimed to be rpg. Its a fps all the way. Such a sad state of affairs.

Im trying to become a rebel and i am on the 2nd mission. It says to place the box behind the marble statue in the city of z-whatever. I went to the city and searched it 8 times. I cant find a marble statue. Is the marble statue behind the area you cant enter unless you are with the empire? The area in the middle of the map.

I would probably prefer shorter in quests than in games, if that makes any sense. When you have quests that are average in length you can appreciate them. Once them become too long, they better have an awesome story, otherwise you wont enjoy all of it.

 

In bg2 there was a quest that some of you might remember called the unseeing eye quest. The quest was honestly epic and long and that was what kept me enthralled. The characters were real, the story was cool, and mostly it kept me busy trying to figure out what the real deal was. In short, keep the games however long they have to be. Keep the quests to the point and not too overdrawn.

 

Thats just my 2 cents.