Serene Tempest

Try the trainer in Fort Vengeance.

I remember the straight rebel ending saying that the rebels gained a lot of ground, and then the Shapers responded in kind with more dangerous creations (remember the bugs in the Pacification fields that Mehkan said were to eat the rebel's crops?), bringing the war to a bloody stalemate. The Rebel-Trakovite ending results in the Rebels having enough Unbound to secure their land, but not enough to seriously threaten the shapers, resulting in a less bloody stalemente. So I think we're dealing with the straight-rebel ending. There's also the fact that Miranda dies, Alwan is left for dead, and Alkhari Blaze is still around.

As much as I love Geneforge, I hope he doesn't. I personally find little more disheartening than a great thing dragged out past its prime until it becomes a dim parody of what it used to be. And I think GF 5 was a good capstone to the series.

Not all of them ended that bad. In fact, if I remember correctly, one of the easiest-to-find rebel endings ended up with the PC being a rebel hero and the whole continent spiraling into the gruesome stalemate you find it in when GF 5 starts up. Also, if you help the shapers shut down the rebellion right then and there, and you have a strong enough pro-shaper reputation so they don't completely distrust you, they just strip you of all your powers and let you live out the rest of your life in obscurity. In fact, the only endings where I remember dying are the Trakovite ending and taking the Shaper ending without a solidly pro-shaper reputation. If it makes a difference, though, I was pretty sparing with the canisters.

And possibly a species change... Also, since shaping seems to slightly modify someone's apperance (waxy skin and glowing eyes, etc.), maybe if you were subjected to a ridiculous enough level of it you wouldn't be easy to recognize anymore.

So the hidden ending where Ellhrah wakes up and realizes that the the whole thing was a long dream about the shapers was someone pulling my leg? Because I didn't see it in there.

Originally Posted By: Delicious Vlish I thought about naming my Sorceress Erika. I'm starting a game that's going to end up allying with Alwan, so just for the hell of it' I'm playing an Agent named Miranda.

I'd be more curious to know what gets the Rebels to essentially adopt the portions of Shaper law dealing with restrictions of power after they have their own half of Terrestria to run.

Actually, I had the impression that the Ghladring ending was much worse for the Shapers than the Astoria ending, and not really much better for the rebels except that when all the smoke cleared they had significantly more land under their control.

I think I found a minor bug. Learned Koblar (I don't think I spelled it right) will tell me where I can find a boat off the island before I've done anything to help the Awakened (or used the leadership-enabled dialogue option). I hadn't even left the town yet, and the only reputation answer I gave should have hurt my standing with them.

I think the idea was that Ghaldring had always been that crazy, or at least had been for a very long time (ie before GF 4). He was just incredibly cunning, and only showed his true colors when his rage and desperation at realizing that he might not win that battle finally shattered his calm and calculating charade.

Originally Posted By: A**ra*l Having a middling reputation doesn't really help you. All factions are either rebel or Shaper, and having an extreme reputation doesn't hurt you. You can stay in between for a while, but it just makes neither side particularly happy about you. It could be useful if you want to see the alternate endings without having to start all over again; just keep a saved game before having committed to any of the factions.

There's a way for mechanics-savvy characters to insta-kill the bride ghost, and for diplomatic characters to make the next fight easier. But the one after that is the toughest, and if there's a way around it I didn't find one. I'm also not sure that Warrior was the best choice for a singleton. I think you want to be playing an Agent or a Servile for that.

Maybe all the shapers on the island had shaped all sanity out of themselves and had been plotting to return to the island behind the other shaper's backs?

Nope. That's uncontested rebel territory, and since you basically start out the game in the Shaper's camp, I think the idea is that crossing that line would be suicidal. No matter how big the pile of dead rebels around you ended up being.

As far as your character knows, those two provinces could be elaborate Shaper conspiracies to make themselves look grander and more powerful than they actually are.

Originally Posted By: madrigan Thanks. Where the heck is Tholoss, by the way? I have been looking for days. I finally figured out where Ghaldring's tunnel is, anyway. http://www.ironycentral.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=119407#Post119407 As far as finding the crypt, follow your nose.

So the destroyers should all commit suicide for the greater good when their work is complete?

I actually did it with an Infiltrator and a pair of Drakys, so slightly more durable than a Sorceress or Lifecrafter. Maybe a ceramic gatling gun? Now that I think about it, a baton-focused Servile might work well for this too.

It sounds like you're trying to play a Sorcerer as if you were playing a Servile or a Guardian. I'd say that life would go much easier on you if you had a nice meatshield or two. I hear Rots are pretty sweet, but I was playing a character (a Sorceress, incidentally) who followed Shaper law on my first run through, so I wouldn't know. Plated Crawbugs or Battle Betas work nicely, and with Regeneration Aura to free you up from constantly healing them, you should be able to play to your class's strengths better, rather than having to carry around a flaming sword that your class can use the least effectively of anyone (well, tied with Shapers/Lifecrafters). Another viable strategy (at least in GF 4, and I assume it would still work in GF 5) is to play a sort of sniper/guerrilla warrior, playing a strong-magic character and running a small number of missile based creations, to sneak up on enemies and either kill or cripple them with a single surprise barrage, and use daze/dominate/charm/mass madness for crowd control if you get in trouble. Of course, if your party was built up for that, this fight would be rather painful, as you're facing three enemies with very high hit points who are perfectly content trading missile attacks with you. Unless you can charm one of his Kyssaks.

What if we made the creations axis based on what the characters/factions see creations as: Dangerous, suspect things to be stringently controlled or destroyed. Taygen. Useful tools, to be controlled by whatever means are most effective. Rawul, Brazites, Trajkov, some Loyalists. Living beings to be cared for, but not deserving or capable of independence. Obeyers, most Loyalists, Astoria (Maybe). Living things with dignity, and deserving freedom if capable of independence and humane treatment if not. Awakened, Trakovites, Astoria (maybe), Greta. Superior to humans in the same way that humans are superior to animals, and any inferior beings claiming dominion over them deserve to be exterminated. Extensively shaped humans may be elevated to their level. Ghladring, GF3 Litalia.

I agree. Especially the loading pictures of the Unbound (I assume that's what's walking across the field of burning crops, as the look different from every other Drakon in the loading pics).

I actually found plated bugs to be much more durable than Battle Betas. But it's unfortunate that so many enemies who logically should be dealing poison damage are dealing acid damage instead - otherwise, the bugs could really clean house. I also made them as soon as I got to Mera-Kev, after slipping through the Shaper trials for the third level of Crawbug, so by the time I could make Battle Betas there wasn't much of a level difference.

I noticed that the Drakons lost their wings. Except they still have them in the beginning/ending pictures.

I've been scouring the barrier zone between the three shaper forts and the Drakon stronghold looking for Tholosss, but I haven't been able to find him anywhere. The only thing I found is this back room in a crypt that a large creature may have been dragged into, but it needs a key that I can't find either. Anyone know where I can find this character?