Contra

Who says you can make them? You can find one for free in Dhonald's Keep, and just making them for an extra +1 SC seems a bit cheap.

Don't got Artilla, though. Specialized on BattleShaping.

Then you're rather screwed.

I have a BM of 2. I don't use Searer, since I focus on MM. I don't want to use my Alphas as sheilds, I want them to live. Why else bother with creations eating your XP if they are going to die all the time?

No, not the ones guarding the neat stuff in the deep core. I can only shudder at the thought of those. I am speaking of the regular patrol golems.

These guys are kicking my rear. Torment, Shaper, 2 lvl26 Battle Alphas with pumped strenght, dex and endurance (2lvls of Int aswell, of course), blessed, Essence Shield, hasted, they still have a major problem to take down just one of these. Do you guys walk around them or try even harder? Any help would be appreciated.

Quote: Originally written by KMannKoopa: Aren't shapers supposed to be immune to Terror? Alwan likes to call himself that, but when it comes down to it he is the first in my party to get hit by mind-affecting spells (even with more points in intellegence than he by all rights needs). Very good point. Alwan even got more training than you, and should thus have this extra help. Another thing that does not add up, I guess.

So not only is this topic no longer about Going Rogue, but about pointless prejudice and stereotypes? O-key.

Perfected things are Shaped items OR Platinum rings OR Silver/gold necklaces combined with a perfection elixir on a forge. An elixir is made by combineing Mandrake Tinicture and Demon Bile on a forge.

The boat will be in Makers End docks.

To my great disappointment, a Thad Shade simply can't stick it up to a Batttle Alpha on Torment. It's just not worth the essence invested in it. Even with a Dex of 27 a Battle Alpha still has 55% chance of hitting, which is just too much. My shade can take out a single BA, but more than one will be trouble. Other creations and enemies still can't hit my Shade, but since Alphas are getting rather common I figure that I will have to upgrade my Thad Shade to a Battle Alpha.

New weapons will be needed, of course. New spells, new creations. All and all, this game needs a whole new set of things to combine and work with the old, not just a few tweaks to the allready existing objects. If we recieved like three new weapon types I would be delighted.

I think that the Talisman of Might should be counted as an artifact, no?

::Laughs:: You can heal Rouge by "Cure"? Would that not mean that you should, technically, be able to convert any creation you come across with Cure?

I posted once before about this, a Thad Shade that were more or less unstoppable on Harmony and Dhonalds because nothing could hit it. I got a few replies and the argument went that "Sure, it's good stuff, but only on normal and there won't be enough essence to support an entire army of them". This time, I did it on Torment. With an Int of 14 (P+1 for Skein, +1 for Students Belt) and a BS skill of 7, I pumped 240 essence into this once Thad on Torment, giving it max Dex, two points of endurance and close to max Strenght. Not only did it work, but even on Torment the Shade Pit was a walk in the park. Nothing could stop my Thad Shade. Since one shade is all that is needed, there is no point to support a larger army, especially since one shade even works on Torment. When I started ut on Harmony, the best & to hit my Shade came to 30%, and I had 4 from max Dex. A few levels later and max Dex, the highest hit % came up to 10, and that was only from one creation: Specters in the shade pit. The rest are arounds 0-5%. Nothing hits it. (Okey, another exception, the Battle Aplha guarding the canister in Dwyanna's basement. That thing is just out of controll. Probably ment to always hit on Torment) Even if something did hit the shade, as a Thad it has a rather heavy supply of hitpoints (260 hitpoints at Level 27, with 2 points into endurace.) As an added bonus, Poison has no effect whatsoever on the Shade, and Acid seems to have a really weakened effect, close to nothing but pointless. Level 27 might sound like allot, but with a BS skill of 7 and a Thad skill of 4 (1 Level from South End, 1 from Training Grounds, 2 from training by Dwyanna.) your Shade starts at somewhere around Level 22. So, you now have a creation nothing can touch, that can't be damaged by Poision and hardly by Acid (and oh, mental effects like Terror does not work either, because it's undead, duh), has allot of hitpoints and can hit back decent enough. It works on Torment and since it is only one creation it draws minimal XP from your Shaper. Love it? I shall come back on this topic after i tried the Thad Shade on Dhonald's. Maybe he will fail, but if such I will still have managed to take on an entire island with only one creation on Torment with minimal effort to keep it alive, giving more XP to main character.

Did you buy up their Int?

QUOTE]more intelligence = more essence ??????? I thought that essence came from every ennemy killed. What link with intelligence ?[/QB] ::Laughs:: Would you mind if I put this as my new Quote, Paulette? Edit: Speaking of quotes, mine seem to have gone awry.

I don't think Greta and Alwan can go "Rogue". They are not creations, per se.

Quote: Originally written by Vicheron: Well I did all the tests with a level 19 Shaper, 2 Vlishes, 2 Glaahks, and Alwan. Be sure to cast Augment, Essence Shield/Armor, and Steel Skin on everyone, then the Golems will rarely hit you and will do a lot less damage. Are you seriouse? That is like right after you leave Harmony. How did you get the Essence to have 4 creations and Augment/Essence Sheild them all on top of that? I can't recall Augment cost, but I will go with 20. So that is 40 per person, which are 5, meaning 200 Essence just on augment/essence armor. Creation cost will be atleast another 100. What is your int? I am guessing you don't have the Gruesom Charm or Girdle of Geniouse yet, ynless you just Exitzoned a few levels. All and all, it just seems highly unlikely. Sure, the Glaahks might stun the Golems, but since the Golems will be hard to hit and your Glaahks really low level compared to them they will just go down. Edit: And oh, another 40 essence for Alwan. I did not even take the Steel Skin into account, but that would be another huge blow of essence.

If Agent: Haste/Bless yourself. Hit him with "Kill" or "Searer" two times a round, heal when you need to heal. If Shaper: Use a swarm of your best creations, haste them all. I did it with a single creation that I pumped up allot. If Guardian: Never tried it, but with high dex and Missile Weapons you should do enough damage with a nice wand to bring him down. Seriously, how can you fail this on easy? I had more problems with the Golem in Darkstone Mine Core.

Or give you a bad rep?

11 points of strenght from start? And you did not use Guardian Claymore either? **** man, why go above base strenght of 4? Spend the other 35(!) skillpoints on Intelligence instead.

No, creatures with and over Int of 2 can go Rogue, this I got positive knowledge of from G2. As for other creatures dominating, well that is beyond the actuall point of this topic. But going Rogue in G3 seems to be very rare, something that is rather sad since it added another level of gameplay back in G1.

It seemed like there was a fair chance of creations going Rogue or running away in terror in G1. It happened pretty often if the health got low enough. In G2 the scale of rogue/terror tipped in the favor of terror, but I still recall creations going rogue on me. In G3? Never. Not even on torment have I ever seen a creation go rogue, no matter the health or how low Intelligence I buy for my creations (I never get more than 2 anyway). Has this rather intresting element in the game been wiped away completly, or is it just so that it is extremely rare/ only happens to creations that has less than Int 2 bought for them?

I would not be surprised if the Sholai appear in the next game as allies to your character or atleast appearing more like good guys (a' la Awakened) than the bad ones. This idea with the geneforge evolving to be a sentinent being is fun, too bad a few games have done things like that before.