An Archonic Study of Magic Creations[G5]

[Acky]

(haha, I finally did it)

 

Magic Creations, as I have found, rival Battle Creations for the best creation branch in G5. The early types all have some sort of ancillary effect to them (Artila's, Vlish, and Glaahks) while the later variants have potent Magic blasts (Wingbolts and Gazers) that can rip apart anything that dares to challenge your might. The Artila may as well be looked over for the Thahd, and the Glaahk isn't hands down better then the Battle Alpha, but Vlish, Wingbolts, and Gazers are all superb. Enough of me blabbing, lets get to it!

 

The first creation is the Artila. Its a small, worm like thing that shots enemies with a magical bulb, and puts poison (yes, it says acid, but it doesn't, it shoots poison) on your enemies as an ancillary effect. Physically frail, you won't be putting this critter up front, but you can use it as range support. Unfortunately, unless you want to focus on Magic Creations, its more effective to use the Thahd. While having one wouldn't hurt your essence pool for any character type, Thahds are just a better investment. So sorry Artila; skip this guy and go for the good ol' thahd.

 

Plated Artila's are the upgrade of the Artila, after getting it to level 3. It spits acid, has more health then the Artila, and a slightly better melee attack. Unfortunately, its useless; you'll have better creations by the time you get the essence to make them, and their essence cost (40) isn't worth what you're getting. Its far, far more effective to get the Vlish, or another Clawbug. So ignore it.

 

The Vlish. Aside from having the more unique graphic in the series, its probably the best 2nd tier creation in G5, even taking into account the leveled Clawbugs. Its curse effect ramps up as it gains levels. Personally, I see it as one of the few creations to keep around through the end of the game, although that's more personal opinion rather then fact. Decent resistances, except its weak against physical damage, which is sadly the most common type of damage in the game. Still, if you want some mix in your hoard, go for the Vlish. I can think of ten times off the bat that my Vlish saved my Guardian tail in a tight pinch. So ya, before I rant on how great the Vlish is any longer, just shape the damn thing and go to the next creation.

 

Charged Vlish are worthless. Worthless, worthless, worthless. At a whooping 75 essence points (that's more then half of the 3rd tier creations!), its just a regular Vlish with a slowing effect, and even that isn't the best. So skip this loser. No really. Don't even waste your time finding out why I hate this creation.

 

The next monster is the Glaahk. While it doesn't have that much physical resistance, it does have decent hit points, the only melee creation that hits with Magic, and a stun attack, which while has been nerfed compared to previous games, is still worthwhile. At 60 essence points, its a little pricey, but I would recomend it. Bring in Drayks to tear up in range combat, you have yourself one feisty duo.

 

Ur-Glaahks are everything Glaahks are, but stronger, (although their stun may not be more powerful. Can anyone confirm this?). More hit points, more essence, more power. However, the only way to get it is to raid Gorash-Kel, which is nigh high impossible early one, and still rather difficult later in the game unless you know how to play the Unbound correctly. So this guys pretty much pointless; hell, it could not be in the game, and you wouldn't even notice the difference much.

 

Wingbolts were the greatest creation in G4, possessing the devils weapon on wings. However, its been nerfed, and is now hoovering just over average, but its not exactly the most impressive creation that it was. At the essence cost of 140, and a weaker range attack, its worth having around until you have the Gazer (although it's still better then the Kyshakk). Decent resistances, moderate health. There's not much left to be said.

 

Unstable Firebolts, I think, would be one of the most dangerous creation in the game if it not for the Shock Trall, which is only slightly more essence and just as much health/damage. Unlike what the name suggests, its attack has been switched with Lightning Aura, which damage is about the same level of Kyshakks. It does have 12 AP though, so its a terror on Drakons. Not too good, not too bad.

 

The Gazer is a very interesting creation. Its magic attack is hands down the most dangerous single attack in the game when blessed. Its got great resistances for everything, except physical. Physical is this epic creations downfall. After the third or fourth War Trall, get a Gazer if you want to switch it out for a more powerful creation for a more pricey cost. It'd be the best creation in the game if it weren't for that damn Trall.

 

The Eyebeast. Hands down, more powerful creation in the game. But its useless; by the time you get it, your creations are more then adequate. Oh well.

 

-- The Great Archon

[Dantius]

Does Eyebeast have stun in this game? I forget. I know it was removed in G4, but I haven't played as a anti-Ghaldring faction in a while...

[Acky]

No, it no longer has its stun power. Its still overpowered, though.

[nikki.]

Is this opinion, or do you have numbers to back up claims - whilst what you have is good, being able to say, and back up with numbers, that a drayk, say, consistently does more damage than a glaahk would be better.

[Dantius]

I object to the classification of Gazers as second rate due to low resistances.

 

I don't find the Gazers physical weakness to be any hindrance at all. It's not like the're fragile or anything- mine have well over 600 HP, in the 750's with a push, and with four or so, it is easy to steamroller over any opposition. Also, resistances are a double edged sword, lots of things that really crank out the physical damage are weak to magic(perfect example: Shock Tralls in the Wasteland took like 500 damage from my Agent, imagine what a Gazer could do), so the vice versa never really comes into effect if you can kill things quick enough, which I do.

[A less presumptuous name.]

When giving numbers such as life and damage, please state what difficulty you are playing on.

[Hypnotic]

I thought dificulty only changed the amount of Life opponents had and their damage. Does it change their resists?

[Dantius]

I think it changes your resists, at least it did in Avernum.

[Acky]

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When giving numbers such as life and damage, please state what difficulty you are playing on.

Torment. Obviously. I wouldn't be posting this otherwise.

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I don't find the Gazers physical weakness to be any hindrance at all. It's not like there fragile or anything- mine have well over 600 HP, in the 750's with a push, and with four or so, it is easy to steamroller over any opposition. Also, resistances are a double edged sword, lots of things that really crank out the physical damage are weak to magic(perfect example: Shock Tralls in the Wasteland took like 500 damage from my Agent, imagine what a Gazer could do), so the vice versa never really comes into effect if you can kill things quick enough, which I do.

500 damage? I'm sceptical you could exceed that. Making Gazers early, leveling them up, and casting blessing could result in something like that, but 500 is reaching the feasible max. The Agent can't get that high of a damage with Kill/Essence Blade while blessed with Essence Blade and/or War Blessing. I'm not even factoring in the fact that quite a few end-game enemies have Magic Resistance, particularly the Rebel endgame.

Originally Posted By: Nikki

Is this opinion, or do you have numbers to back up claims - whilst what you have is good, being able to say, and back up with numbers, that a drayk, say, consistently does more damage than a glaahk would be better.

Hardcore numbers? No, that's not what I'm good at. I ran numerous runs throughout the game, and tested things extensively before posting them.

(in answer to your Drayk, I'll argue that a Glaahk is better then the Drayk in Melee, and therefore the Drayk is not hands down superior to the Glaahk in every way. You'll need some sort of meat shields to play on harder difficulties.

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I thought difficulty only changed the amount of Life opponents had and their damage. Does it change their resists?

No, I don't believe so.

[Dantius]

500 damage from an agent with 12 spellcraft and 22 battle magic, with War Blessing and Essence blade? Completley feasible. This was on my glass cannon runthrough, though.

[The Ratt]

Still didn't mention your difficulty. It's okay if you don't play on torment. I don't either.

[Hypnotic]

The difficulyt shouldn't matter if we are talking about the PC and its creations as Damage output isn't effected by the difficulty.

 

I play on Normal always. I tried torment, its alright but I found its just too long.

[nikki.]

Originally Posted By: Master Ackrovan

(in answer to your Drayk, I'll argue that a Glaahk is better then the Drayk in Melee, and therefore the Drayk is not hands down superior to the Glaahk in every way. You'll need some sort of meat shields to play on harder difficulties.

You miss my point - I wasn't arguing that a drayk was better than a glaahk, I was suggesting that before you make comparisons such as that you should probably try to give at least some data as evidence.

[Lilith]

Originally Posted By: The Ratt

Still didn't mention your difficulty. It's okay if you don't play on torment. I don't either.

Originally Posted By: Master Ackrovan

Torment. Obviously. I wouldn't be posting this otherwise.

you're a bit slow, aren't you

[Lilith]

Originally Posted By: Karl Projektorinski

You miss my point - I wasn't arguing that a drayk was better than a glaahk, I was suggesting that before you make comparisons such as that you should probably try to give at least some data as evidence.

As a rule of thumb, ranged attacks will always do more damage than melee attacks, because nearly all melee attacks only have a d4 multiplier while ranged attacks start at d4 for Firebolt and steadily improve from there.

[Potato]

How is it nigh impossible to raid Gorash-Kel? I found it really easy; I defeated the podlings guarding the canister by constantly shaping Corrupted Thahds and sending them to kill em one at a time, going back to a city to recharge. After the podlings are dead, I sneaked inside of Gorash-Kel and raided it of everything I could, including the canister, and this was all very early. This was on torment, on my shock trooper run, and I had pumped battle shaping high (around ten I think).

 

Glaahks are also very useful, as I can get them as soon as I reach Gorash-Kel, and mix them in with clawbugs to tear through Mera rather easily. Although I don't think I ever tried the Ur-Glaahk (I was using a rotghroth and drayks during the storm plains), I'd think that you could mix them into your party rather well, as if you sneak into Gorash-Kel, you can buy them as soon as you get to Perikalia (I think).

[A less presumptuous name.]

What podlings in Gorash-Kel. That's the unbound city, is it not?

[Hypnotic]

There is a group of Podlings guarding a canister there, at the North end of the Entrance.

[A less presumptuous name.]

Hmm, I don't remember that. I guess I'll have to go play through the game again!

[Dantius]

Originally Posted By: Thuryl

nearly all melee attacks only have a d4 multiplier

Incorrect. Only the daggers and the Bronze and Iron shortsword have a d4 die, pretty much everything else has a d5 multiplier. While Kill's d10 is the strongest attack in the game, physical resistances are rare, and resistances to the three types of spell damage are common and quite often very large (ice less so, but I digress). It's a tossup which is better, IMO.

[A less presumptuous name.]

It's not so much that physical resistances are rare, but more that they are mediocre. Especially later on, many creations have physical resistance, but it's fairly week. And it's more consistent, so your creations' damage doesn't vary as much between different enemies.

[Lilith]

Originally Posted By: Dantius

Originally Posted By: Thuryl

nearly all melee attacks only have a d4 multiplier

Incorrect. Only the daggers and the Bronze and Iron shortsword have a d4 die, pretty much everything else has a d5 multiplier. While Kill's d10 is the strongest attack in the game, physical resistances are rare, and resistances to the three types of spell damage are common and quite often very large (ice less so, but I digress). It's a tossup which is better, IMO.

Wait, yeah, I'm wrong and was thinking of Avernum. d5 is still bad, though.

Technically, reaper batons are the strongest attack at d12, but who puts that many skill points into missile weapons?

And physical resistances are actually very common, it's just high physical resistances, above 50% or so, that are rare. By comparison, many creatures have no magic resistance at all. Anyway, if you want to do lots of physical damage, you should be using war tralls.

[The Ratt]

I was addressing Dantius in my earlier post.

[Dantius]

That was on torment, yes.

[Vempele]

Originally Posted By: Hand Ackrovan

Charged Vlish are worthless. Worthless, worthless, worthless. At a whooping 75 essence points (that's more then half of the 3rd tier creations!), its just a regular Vlish with a slowing effect, and even that isn't the best. So skip this loser. No really. Don't even waste your time finding out why I hate this creation.

It does have a redeeming quality: 100 cold resistance (practically (but not theoretically) 100% since the game never throws enough Cryoas at you to overcome a regeneration aura). Meaning they're useful in about three places in the whole game, plus maybe Sammann's Isle.

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The Gazer is a very interesting creation. Its magic attack is hands down the most dangerous single attack in the game when blessed.

Ur-Drakons do a whopping 16.5 more damage at equal level, and a lot more if you count the lightning aura.

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The Eyebeast. Hands down, more powerful creation in the game. But its useless; by the time you get it, your creations are more then adequate. Oh well.

I disagree: you can get to Inner Gazaki-Uss at a fairly low level, and the Invincible Wingbolts make it easy to get the canister.

By the way, the Gazer's (and Eyebeast's) melee attack stuns a lot more than the Glaahk (ab_effect_per_level = 6 vs 1, ab_status_effect_per_level = 3 vs 1), so a mix of Shock Tralls and Gazers may be optimal for stunlocking.

[Brocktree]

Originally Posted By: "Vempele"

I disagree: you can get to Inner Gazaki-Uss at a fairly low level, and the Invincible Wingbolts make it easy to get the canister.

But by the time you have obtained 3 points of gazer, you've virtually finished the game.

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By the way, the Gazer's (and Eyebeast's) melee attack stuns a lot more than the Glaahk (ab_effect_per_level = 6 vs 1, ab_status_effect_per_level = 3 vs 1), so a mix of Shock Tralls and Gazers may be optimal for stunlocking.

Sounds good in theory. In practice, you'll never stunlock anything you need to stunlock.

Personally, I'd be tempted to haul along one gazer, if only to have a creation that can be a decoy for magical attacks. Unbound and Kyshakks brutalise war tralls.