Kyshakk Koan MagusofStars Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 Spoilers I guess... I was replaying this recently and haven't quite been able to figure it out. In all the previous games, it was pretty easy to tell what the protagonist did from clues given in the following game (e.g. G2 made it pretty clear that the G1 Shaper stayed loyal, wrecked the Geneforge, handled Trajkov and then told the Council about it), but G4 either doesn't do this or I somehow missed it. Thus far, all I've been able to figure out is that the Shaper from G3 somehow doesn't seem particularly liked by *either* side. So what did happen at the end of G3 and where in G4 are the clues/text that I managed to miss? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Lilith Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 He probably took the rebel path (which is why the shapers don't want to talk about him) and then died (which is why Greta doesn't want to talk about him). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Randomizer Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 Alwan has his research notes and diary that he heavily excised to remove damaging information. The fact neither one wants to talk about it implies he did something that they didn't approve of his doing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Easygoing Eyebeast Goldengirl Posted October 20, 2008 Share Posted October 20, 2008 Canister mad Shaper...? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rotghroth Rhapsody Feo Takahari Posted October 21, 2008 Share Posted October 21, 2008 Greta left him because she didn't approve of what he was doing, though she did like him. As for the reason, a fellow in the rebel safehouse tells you that Lankan's rebels were completely slaughtered. The question is what he did after that--perhaps a change of heart led to a failed attempt to kill Rahul, and he died in the attempt? (By the way, I can't remember--is a gender ever specified for the G3 character? The illustrations in G3 showed an Agent.) Edit: by the way, there's actually a lot of argument over which G1 ending is canonical. I think what we concluded is that the G1 character killed both Trajkov and Goettsch, then returned home without destroying the Geneforge, but having never managed to beat Goettsch, I don't know whether that would contradict such odd tidbits as how Trajkov's entire expedition was never heard from again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnificent Ornk Dikiyoba Posted October 21, 2008 Share Posted October 21, 2008 Originally Posted By: feo takahari By the way, I can't remember--is a gender ever specified for the G3 character? The illustrations in G3 showed an Agent.) Both Greta's story and Alwan's journal just use "Shaper", so probably not. Quote: ...but having never managed to beat Goettsch, I don't know whether that would contradict such odd tidbits as how Trajkov's entire expedition was never heard from again. Dikiyoba thinks the "Goettsch dies but the Geneforge remains intact" ending resulted in several of the explorers sent to Sucia using the Geneforge and causing a massive war to break out. Dikiyoba is not sure what happened to the surviving Sholai in that ending, but no one in G2 used the Geneforge and there's no indication of wars happening elsewhere. If nothing else, the Awakened get a happy fate in that ending and they sure don't in G2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Well-Actually War Trall Acky Posted October 21, 2008 Share Posted October 21, 2008 Originally Posted By: Dikiyoba If nothing else, the Awakened get a happy fate I didn't get that impression from G2. It seemed that they where getting chased of the iland by the Shapers before Barzhl and Zakary offered them a way out. I think the most likely ending is one that dosen't exist. I beilive that jeff tweaked the ending to his own liking. If anything, it was the Rebal ending and your character was killed in between G3 and G4(perhaps at thortan ruins). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curious Artila Arori4 Posted October 21, 2008 Share Posted October 21, 2008 What I come to think is that this shaper is Shaper Monarch. If you go into Alwan's private quarters and read a book there, it says he crossed out the name of the shaper he traveled with in the Ashen Isles. Probably he's ashamed of what the shaper done. Also, this shaper traveled with both Alwan and Greta. They all fought alongside each other, taught each other, and listened to each other. When Greta joined the rebels and Alwan joined the shapers, I'm sure Shaper X (as what I call the shaper before he turned into the madman) could not choose which side to go on. So, he attacks both rebels and shapers alike, claims his own city, and becomes a big madman. If I remember correctly, Shaper Monarch utters his true name when he dies. That's my 2 cents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rotghroth Rhapsody Luca Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 While this is possible, it’s not very appealing. I had always hoped that G3 shaper would by like kyrhyk, except not a trakovite and not a woos. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnificent Ornk Dikiyoba Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 Originally Posted By: Ackrovan Originally Posted By: Dikiyoba If nothing else, the Awakened get a happy fate I didn't get that impression from G2. It seemed that they where getting chased of the iland by the Shapers before Barzhl and Zakary offered them a way out. *facepalm* Go back and reread the sentence you quoted. The entire sentence. Dikiyoba. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnificent Ornk nikki. Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 Originally Posted By: Dikiyoba Originally Posted By: Ackrovan Originally Posted By: Dikiyoba If nothing else, the Awakened get a happy fate I didn't get that impression from G2. It seemed that they where getting chased of the iland by the Shapers before Barzhl and Zakary offered them a way out. *facepalm* Go back and reread the sentence you quoted. The entire sentence. Dikiyoba. I don't see why you're getting so mad. Anyway, I wanted to ask: Shaper Monarch reveals his name? What does he say? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Well-Actually War Trall Acky Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 Originally Posted By: Dikiyoba Dikiyoba thinks the "Goettsch dies but the Geneforge remains intact" ending resulted in several of the explorers sent to Sucia using the Geneforge and causing a massive war to break out. Dikiyoba is not sure what happened to the surviving Sholai in that ending, but no one in G2 used the Geneforge and there's no indication of wars happening elsewhere. If nothing else, the Awakened get a happy fate in that ending and they sure don't in G2. Ummm, yeah. Your saying the serviles in the Awakened get a happy ending but they don't. There forced off the Iland because the shapers are exterminating them. Barzahl and Zakary go to them and, in exchange for their limited knowledge of the secreats of Sucia Iland, offer them to go with them in exchange for said knowledge. Am I not getting somthing here or have you fallen off the deep end Dikiyoba? If so, I'll get the party ready because its getting really lonely here Originally Posted By: Nikki Anyway, I wanted to ask: Shaper Monarch reveals his name? What does he say? I think he just mutters something that sounds like words. I'm 95 percent sure he dosen't say his name. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnificent Ornk Dikiyoba Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 Originally Posted By: Ackrovan Ummm, yeah. Your saying the serviles in the Awakened get a happy ending but they don't. 1. I said the Awakened didn't get a good ending in G2. That's what the whole "they sure don't in G2" was about. 2. Paragraphs and sentences are not the same thing. But, let me try again: In G1, you can leave Sucia Island without destroying the Geneforge. If you do that, the Awakened get a happy ending. Since the Awakened were in hiding in G2, we know that leaving the island with the Geneforge intact is not the canonical ending of G1. Dikiyoba. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrulous Glaahk Dark Neptune Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 If the G3 PC Shaper was Shaper Monarch in G4, then it may be possible Jeff may have Shaper Monarch living through the ending of G4 and to G5. (Before Monarch dies, you are given the option to let him go or kill him, although I am not sure how the Shapers will react of your action of releasing him.) Oddly, does anyone notices that when Litalia took away a key to where Monarch kept his most powerful creations, Monarch himself could not create more of them? (His strongest creations during the fight were Battle Alphas, and his "Pet Warped Creator". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Lilith Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 Originally Posted By: Dark Neptune If the G3 PC Shaper was Shaper Monarch in G4, then it may be possible Jeff may have Shaper Monarch living through the ending of G4 and to G5. (Before Monarch dies, you are given the option to let him go or kill him, although I am not sure how the Shapers will react of your action of releasing him.) You, quite wisely, don't tell them about the whole releasing-Monarch part when you report back to them. Quote: Oddly, does anyone notices that when Litalia took away a key to where Monarch kept his most powerful creations, Monarch himself could not create more of them? (His strongest creations during the fight were Battle Alphas, and his "Pet Warped Creator". He kept them there because they were too dangerous to be useful even by his standards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Well-Actually War Trall Acky Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 Well, making somthing like the Titan must take weeks of pure consentration and sheer power, so he couldn't exactly make that while he was fighting. And you should keep in mind that he was in almost a constant battle with his creations so as was identified by the text we got from him, he was beatin up a bit and definitly not at full power. He made all of his really powerfull creations while he was at full power. And also keep in mind that you fought him in the third chapter. You don't have acsess to 5 tier creations that were needed for the expert areas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Understated Ur-Drakon Sudanna Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 Originally Posted By: Arori4 What I come to think is that this shaper is Shaper Monarch. If you go into Alwan's private quarters and read a book there, it says he crossed out the name of the shaper he traveled with in the Ashen Isles. Probably he's ashamed of what the shaper done. Also, this shaper traveled with both Alwan and Greta. They all fought alongside each other, taught each other, and listened to each other. When Greta joined the rebels and Alwan joined the shapers, I'm sure Shaper X (as what I call the shaper before he turned into the madman) could not choose which side to go on. So, he attacks both rebels and shapers alike, claims his own city, and becomes a big madman. If I remember correctly, Shaper Monarch utters his true name when he dies. That's my 2 cents. For the record, this was Nalyd's idea first. So there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Easygoing Eyebeast The Mystic Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 Originally Posted By: Dikiyoba If nothing else, the Awakened get a happy fate in that ending and they sure don't in G2. I usually play pro-Shaper, but I feel kind of sad that the only way to give the Awakened a happy ending in G2 is to join them. They would've made good allies in G3/4, regardless of whose side you join. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rotghroth Rhapsody Luca Posted October 22, 2008 Share Posted October 22, 2008 Pro-shaper 'cept in G1&2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgeoning Battle Gamma Trakovite Mitchell Posted October 27, 2008 Share Posted October 27, 2008 Mitchell said "If this was true then something of the same befell to the characters of 1 and 2 (Possibly became part of the shaper consel or died or both but thats an other story) But I strongly agree with the fact the shaper is us since (Most of the facts have been stated) Monarch Shapes lvl 3 tier creations A shaper Knew Litalia Met Kyhhrik Insane You Met and helped Litalia Met Kyhhrik (This is proven by Ahkari Blaze being a MORE powerful Drakon then he was BEFORE using the geneforge) Shaped lvl 3 teir creations Traveled with Alwan (For a time) and Greta Started going mad/insane after canister use (Too much canisters) Thats basicully all I could find." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyshakk Koan Ghaldring Posted October 27, 2008 Share Posted October 27, 2008 If the PC sided with the Rebels in GF3, why is Khyrk still alive? You have to kill Khyrk in order to complete the game as a Rebel. On the otherhand, if the PC sided with the Shapers, how come the Geneforge on the Isle of Spears was completed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Slawbug Posted October 27, 2008 Share Posted October 27, 2008 Perhaps the canonical G3 PC was a min-maxing megalomanaical munchkin who tried to play both the Shapers and the Rebels for everything they had, and thus did not actually complete the game (hey, like me ). This would explain why both Khyryk and the Geneforge survived. Personally, I think the simplest explanation for the weird faces both Alwan and Greta make when that PC is brought up is that he was eaten by some creation in a particularly gruesome way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyshakk Koan Ghaldring Posted October 27, 2008 Share Posted October 27, 2008 Quote: Perhaps the canonical G3 PC was a min-maxing megalomanaical munchkin who tried to play both the Shapers and the Rebels for everything they had, and thus did not actually complete the game Akhari Blaze mentions in GF4 that the Geneforge on the Isle of Spears was complete, which implies that the PC from GF3 did finish the game as a Rebel. Which begs the question as to why Khyrk is alive. Slarty: Quote: Personally, I think the simplest explanation for the weird faces both Alwan and Greta make when that PC is brought up is that he was eaten by some creation in a particularly gruesome way. LOL! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrulous Glaahk pitchblack Posted October 27, 2008 Share Posted October 27, 2008 Ok, I've got it... The PC actually died in the school at the beginning of G3 and Alwan and Greta actually traveled with a different Shaper who eventually went mad and went to find the Sholai and spreas the 'enlightenment' of shaping among them, thus forging his own powerful army who are going to show up halfway through G5 and pound both the Rebels and the Shapers to smithereens and eventually become the new power of the land. So there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrulous Glaahk pitchblack Posted October 27, 2008 Share Posted October 27, 2008 In reality, though, I think the PC was originally helping the Shapers, up until Greta turned him over to the Rebels, RIGHT BEFORE going to the last island in the chain (I think you could do that... can't recall... I'm probaly wrong, though) and being accepted by the Rebels and completeing the Geneforge. (or maybe he just had mercy on Khyryk.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnificent Ornk Dikiyoba Posted October 27, 2008 Share Posted October 27, 2008 Originally Posted By: Ghaldring If the PC sided with the Rebels in GF3, why is Khyrk still alive? You have to kill Khyrk in order to complete the game as a Rebel. Khyryk cloned himself. Dikiyoba. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrulous Glaahk BlueRivets Posted October 27, 2008 Share Posted October 27, 2008 I would certainly clone Khyryk if given the chance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Randomizer Posted October 27, 2008 Share Posted October 27, 2008 After pointing out that a certain major NPC could die in an especially drawn out fight, Jeff now gives NPCs like Khyryk an out that players don't get because we are new to shaping. Remember how easy it was for Khyryk to leave Monarch when he wanted to? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyshakk Koan Ghaldring Posted October 27, 2008 Share Posted October 27, 2008 Originally Posted By: Dikiyoba Originally Posted By: Ghaldring If the PC sided with the Rebels in GF3, why is Khyrk still alive? You have to kill Khyrk in order to complete the game as a Rebel. Khyryk cloned himself. Dikiyoba. What is this, a Marvel comic book series? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgeoning Battle Gamma Trakovite Mitchell Posted October 27, 2008 Share Posted October 27, 2008 "If he cloned him self he would do it more then once. NO! He probley faked dieing and escaped thats the obvious thing anyone would do... ALMOST anyone."said Mitchell Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrulous Glaahk pitchblack Posted October 27, 2008 Share Posted October 27, 2008 Who wouldn't want to live? (Excepting of course diehard fanatics and people who have nothing to lose) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgeoning Battle Gamma Trakovite Mitchell Posted October 28, 2008 Share Posted October 28, 2008 "What about Exploding Romars pitch? They dont seem to value their lives." Said Mitchell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rotghroth Rhapsody Luca Posted October 28, 2008 Share Posted October 28, 2008 (")Exploding roamers and other suicidal creations were made to not have knowledge of life beyond their tasks, to not notice a value for their lives and were shaped to not have a fear of death,(") quoth the great Nebulan with his infinite wisdom, simultaneous pointing out Mitchell's straneitosity, next time he'll do pitch's sig which is absolutely ludicrous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnificent Ornk nikki. Posted October 28, 2008 Share Posted October 28, 2008 Originally Posted By: Nebulan Roamers and other suicidal creations were made to not have knowledge of life beyond their tasks. Neither were the serviles, if you want to take that view, and look where that went. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rotghroth Rhapsody Luca Posted October 28, 2008 Share Posted October 28, 2008 Serviles were ment to do tasks and have common sence. Exploding Roamers only know "run" "Die". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrulous Glaahk pitchblack Posted October 28, 2008 Share Posted October 28, 2008 And they do it so wonderfully, don't they? Oh, and Nebulan? My sig is SUPPOSED to be ludicrous. That's kinda the point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenderfoot Thahd Vrek Posted November 9, 2008 Share Posted November 9, 2008 Originally Posted By: Shaper Mitchell Mitchell said "If this was true then something of the same befell to the characters of 1 and 2 (Possibly became part of the shaper consel or died or both but thats an other story) But I strongly agree with the fact the shaper is us since (Most of the facts have been stated)Monarch Shapes lvl 3 tier creations A shaper Knew Litalia Met Kyhhrik InsaneYou Met and helped Litalia Met Kyhhrik (This is proven by Ahkari Blaze being a MORE powerful Drakon then he was BEFORE using the geneforge) Shaped lvl 3 teir creations Traveled with Alwan (For a time) and Greta Started going mad/insane after canister use (Too much canisters) Thats basicully all I could find." Don't forget, GF3 Shaper saw Litalia's sentient spawner, so he could have had that picture in his head, and recreated it when/if he became Monarch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnificent Ornk nikki. Posted November 9, 2008 Share Posted November 9, 2008 Or, when Litalia visited Monarch, she could have helped him make it. The game text says something about her trying to get him to work for the rebellion. Perhaps giving him instruction on how to make it was part of the deal? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyshakk Koan AnarhIztok2511 Posted November 9, 2008 Share Posted November 9, 2008 "Kyhhrik" - heh, that's a new one i guess "Monarch Shapes lvl 3 tier creations A shaper Knew Litalia Met Kyhhrik Insane You Met and helped Litalia Met Kyhhrik (This is proven by Ahkari Blaze being a MORE powerful Drakon then he was BEFORE using the geneforge) Shaped lvl 3 teir creations Traveled with Alwan (For a time) and Greta Started going mad/insane after canister use (Too much canisters) Thats basicully all I could find."" Well, that' could be true if greta didn't say (in g4) she went to litalia by herself and helped her! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Well-Actually War Trall Acky Posted November 9, 2008 Share Posted November 9, 2008 It actually said that she wandered the islands and eventually ended up on Spear Island. She then joined the rebels, not necessarily Litalia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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