What do YOU want to see in G4?

[Student of Trinity]

I want to see some luxury Shaper accommodation. A place where there are comfy chairs, attentive servile waiters, and spawners that make fine wines and espresso. Some little corner of the map that says 'We Shapers don't just know how to shape life; we know how to live.'

[Learned Noremac]

What I'd like to see is more creations and spells. Now when I say more creations, I'm not looking for something stronger than what we have. I'm looking for more variety. I mean, add more creations that are equal in power to something like vlish and fyoras, etc. The same goes for spells. Also, the ability to create serviles should be implemented. As well, you should have the ability to buy equipment for joinable characters. You should be able to equip them with weapons and armour, etc. As well, when one of your party members leaves at the harmony docks, I thought it might have been cool if you ran into them later. Like for example, Greta could have joined the rebels, and then if you joined the shapers, and you saw her....well it'd be real awkward wouldn't it? lol seriously, maybe you could fight. That'd be awesome. Meh. But whatever. Jeff's games will always be top of my list anyway.

[I_am_a_Minotaur]

This is what I think should happen in G4...

 

Minotaurs come from the north and thraten to invade the shaper world if they don't let them live there. They land in the middle of a war. Drakons attack them trying to crush the shaper's new allies. The minotaurs drive of the attack. When the shapers call on the minotaurs to fight they refuse. Shapers attack the minotaurs and are driven back also. A few minotaur famlies join the shapers. youare one of their kihttp://www.ironycentral.com/cgi-bin/ubb/ubb/icons/icon14.gifds. You were let in as a shaper. They see great potential in you. Then your village that you are chosen to lead is destroyed in a drakon attack. You are the only survivor.

 

Then there would be 3 powerful factions then.

[Dolphin]

Aside form not being a Shaper again, it would also be nice to fight something besides Drakons and Ur-Drakons. I would like to see the final battle be with something completely new.

[Student of Trinity]

It turns out Ghaldring the ultimate Drakon is just a frontman for the real power behind the rebellion: the mighty Ur-Ornk Lord!

[Faizah]

Quote:

Originally written by Student of Trinity:
It turns out Ghaldring the ultimate Drakon is just a frontman for the real power behind the rebellion: the mighty Ur-Ornk Lord!

Now that I would love to see!

[tridash]

Being able to make clockwork creations would be nice, like the drakon in the clockwork maze in GF 2 . Perhaps mechanics + the shaping skill would be used.

 

Also, if it will be possible to make serviles, it should be necessary to pay to use a shaping vat or something like that.

[Contra]

More fractions, like maybe 5 or 6? Maybe a fraction consisting of humans that want to remove Shapers and Creations all alike?

 

I would prefer a game without a Geneforge, or if you have to have one..Let us use it this time? Like in G1.

[VCH]

Better yet let the player choose whether to use it at the games beginning. Then perhaps have harsh repercussions for doing so, to offset the power gain.

[Contra]

I wish for yu to be able to controll more then one PC..Maybe up to three?

[Student of Trinity]

I'd like to see Khyryk get his rear in gear, and revive the Awakened middle-of-the-road viewpoint. He seems like the kind of guy who might just pull it off: sane, self-disciplined enough to avoid canisters, averse to cruelty to serviles, also averse to mass terrorism, and evidently a brilliantly accomplished Shaper. You also get to know quite a bit about him in G3, so he's a living character. His obvious major weakness seems likely to be a reluctance to act aggressively when necessary; but this means that the PC is just what he needs.

 

I could see the post-G3 plotline assumed by G4 as having Khyryk take over Gull Island and sit there quietly for a few years, then land on Terrestia with a force and a plan. In fact, having the PC play a critical role in linking him up with some remnant of the Awakened would be a cool plot item.

[Stormlord Windspire]

The shaper in complex core in GF2 summoned a Demon...We should be able to do it too!or at least make ghosts/specters(sp?)

 

Maybe a something% chance for it to attack you.Decreseases with skill?

[TMH]

I want to see the "Schism" in GF4, some shaper on shaper action! and not just the odd encounter, I mean full on multiple shapers in combat with their creations/allies

 

Civil war where a large break away faction of more enlightened shapers actually want to craft a better world (instead of just being controlled by greedy drakons as in earlier GF), the UR-Drakons could be involved as they evolve into more ethical and enlightened beings. The fact that both sides would end up trampling most of that world into dust would be missed by their arrogant fervour/devotion to their respective ideals.

 

I would also like to get past this "apprentice" label, surely if you sided with the traditional order of shapers you should be able to become a full shaper (possibly with some improved powers - I favour "command" a spell that allows shapers to strip control of a shaped creature from another shaper and/or rogue shapings - control stays for that area only). The renegades could develop counter powers at higher levels. This would allow very fluid shaper duels where wrestling control of the correct creatures at the right moment would be as important as shaping creatures.

 

A nice touch would be the reappearance of a strange powerful nemesis who would be a character that had completed GF 1,2 or 3 to oppose the player (would make for a much more equal final opponent)

 

Larger map with some timeline driven ebb and flow of territory gained lost to give a feeling of urgency but not panic.

 

The ability to produce serviles/intelligent serviles

 

Shapers should have more ability to control those immediately around them but be made to suffer the consequences of exerting too much control.

 

The schism could be over the ethics of creating intelligent self aware creatures and allowing them the rights to make deciscions and lead a life of their own.

 

GF 3 is too black and white and the rebels are insane, I honestly cannot see why anyone would side with them. It seems a little more tired than GF1 & 2 but I still like it.

 

Using the geneforge? It could end with the geneforge being used to remake the world or destroyed to maintain the status quo, either way there should be a few things to do after the geneforge (hunt down the nemesis afterwards would be nice).

[I_am_a_Minotaur]

Shaloi and minotars should be part of the war and there should be a faction with sense like maybe Khryk and Sharon should put together an awakened force (some drakons, serviles, sholai, minotaurs and shapers).

 

Factions:

 

Ghaldring: want to crush the shapers and shaper loyal people.

 

Shaloi: power-mad people like the barzites.

 

Minotaurs: want to conquer the world and purge it of magic.

 

Shapers: want to crush all factions.

 

Amakened: want peace without the shaper tyranny.

 

And we should start out being able to choose if you want to be...

 

Minotaur: one of the few minotaurs who wanted to be a shaper and was let in. Finished shaper training sent to help run a village but drakons attack and all except you, a shaper and a guardian (shaper and guardian just finished traing too) survived.

 

Shaolai: same as minotaur except Shaolai.

 

Drakon: Ditto

 

Servile: Ditto

 

Shaper: standerd choices

 

(I'm obsessed with minotaurs)

[Dolphin]

Okay, but where did these minotaurs come from? Shaping experiment gone wrong?

[Silver Shadow]

Who knows?

 

I'd kinda like to see people react to my creations. I mean, okay. So I play a loyalist to the Shapers in GF3. And yet I'm walking around with a Drayk. An illegal Drayk. So... shouldn't they get mad at me for that? Or at least suspicious? Shouldn't ordinary people become nervous when they see my mighty companions? Honestly, I could kick their butts without too much effort. So why no creation effects?

[I_am_a_Minotaur]

Origanally written by Dolphin: Okay, but where did the minotuars come from?

 

They were an empire overthrown by the shapers but then stayed in hiding until they were strong enough to over throw the shapers.(They were there before the shapers and will be after.)

 

They can live three times as long as the average shaper.

[Contra]

Hey, there is endless possibility here. Shapers don't controll the entire world (this we know for a fact), and just like the europeans during the middleages the shapers are proud, and if THEY can't cross that big ocean (G1) then NOONE can. This means that just like in the real world there can be two, three entire continents so far unsettled by the Shapers, where for all as we know Minotaurs can live there, propser, have an enlightened civilization with their own kind of magic.

[shell]

Quote:

Originally written by TMH:
the UR-Drakons could be involved as they evolve into more ethical and enlightened beings. The fact that both sides would end up trampling most of that world into dust would be missed by their arrogant fervour/devotion to their respective ideals.

Would not that contradict the theme of Geneforge? A constant theme of all three games is the corrupting influence of power. You see this in the way your PC grows more and more hot-headed and arrogant as he continues to use canisters. And again you can see the generally peaceful Drayks of GF1 become crazy and bent on futile revenge once they start shaping themselves, and the Barzites are the posterchild for the corrupt misuse of power. No, the Drakons care nothing about shaping themselves into more ethical, enlightened beings; rather they want to make themselves stronger at all cost. The idea of creating a "master race" that will set the world to right is doomed to failure, as a certain dictator from the last century could attest.

Although, one thing I would like to see is a new faction headed by a powerful Gazer, they seem smart and strong enough for the task, perhaps this faction can be a breakaway from the Takers that is not so much bent on revenge.

[Delicious Vlish]

"The Eye sees that power by any means is futile."

[MrRoivas]

What I'd like to see is more middle level creations, too add more variety. Also, more "specialzed" creations. For example, you could have a creature thast is meant to act as a walking wall, a damage dealer, and a harrasser/disrupter. Also, balancing the 3 classes. In G1, it was shapers all the way, no questions asked. G2, absolutly nothing could hit the guardian. Nothing. In G3, the agent rules with daze and uber spells. Restore the Gaurdian's ability for melee, give the shapers more creatures, and make sure the agents don't get crocked in the next game in a atempt to "balence." Also, more factions. More endings. In G1, it was amazing, the posibilitys. Leave the island as it is, and the shapers come in and try to crush everyone. Leave one bad guy alive (Gottesch or Trakjov), and all hell breaks lose. Become deranged, become deranged with company, the possiblitys are endless. In G2 and G3, the endings are predictible and faction based. Lets have more endings. And more angry ornks.

[I_am_a_Minotaur]

No one else likes my idea? *sniffs*

[Student of Trinity]

No, I'm afraid not. Sorry. Minotaurs just don't really make sense for the Geneforge universe. Sholai, sure. Maybe even a lost race of independent Drayk ancestors, who once learned to shape humans, but banned them into extinction because they were too willful and intelligent (*slaps self*). But minotaurs ... I mean, why minotaurs? Why not at least Ornk-lords?

[Slawbug]

I'm just impressed that we have yet to see GIFTS in the Geneforge universe. *shiver*

[Contra]

Haha, gawd, GIFTS. I am sure that now that you have mentioned it Jeff would be delighted to put them ins omehwere as an Easter Egg.

 

I support the idea of Minotaurs, or atleast the idea of other supernatural creations that have evolved outside of Shaper controll somewhere in a distant land, i also agree that Geneforge tells a tale of people wanting to create a better world, but lacks the power to do such. Shall they then take the power and lose their wisdom, or try and fight without the power even though ti is a doomed cause? Having the Darkons become "enlightened" is an oxymoron considering how many canisters it has taken to get them the power they now weild.

[Igor]

I would like to see more realistic reactions when you powergame. If you join and then betray three factions, why the hell would the fourth let you join?

[Slawbug]

Well, it's not like there's easy newsflow in any of the GF games. These kinds of questions are hard to address in open-ended, computer-based RPGs like Jeff's... the player will always find something unexpected to do. Dialogue pretty much has to be pre-scripted, and you can't predict everything.

[Contra]

No easy newsflow? There can be a threeway war, no merchants passing from city to city, all routes blocked, and still someone will know what i have said in Drypeak Warrens when i arrive in Riseing.

[Student of Trinity]

In the Shaper world, the walls really do have ears.

[Igor]

And that's another thing. Why does everybody know your opions and actions wherever you go? Do people have nothing better to do than gossip about you?

 

I think that now that the day counter has been implemented, it should take a while for news to spread.

[Slawbug]

I think this is a question of the plot outgrowing the basic game assumptions. On Sucia island, this made perfect sense, since your appearance on the island was a big deal and you were, inherently, one of the most powerful forces there. There were few settlements and each one had spies from the others! In GF3, it makes very little sense -- similarly Litalia's apparent obsession with you.

[MrRoivas]

You're special.

[Hawk King]

Quote:

Originally written by Slartucker:
Litalia's apparent obsession with you.

if you are a shaper or guardian she has a crush on you

but if you are an agent she just wants to be friends

same goes for female guardians and shapers

[VCH]

shaping serviles would be cool. Perhaps it could be a reward for loyalty to the shapers.

[Student of Trinity]

No, this is where G3 finally does make sense: you really are important. After all, you are going to be the one who kills either Akhari Blaze or Lord Rahul. You may start out as a mere apprentice, but you are an unusually brilliant one. You are the only surviving shaper on Greenwood, and on Harmony you are the only shaper other than Diwaniya, who is tied down in San Ru. Naturally you are a very important figure on those islands. By the time you get to Dhonal's isle, you are strong enough to have a major impact on the island, in a situation where everyone else is at an impasse. And so it goes.

 

G3 improves a lot on its predecessors in not having all its powerful NPCs sitting around with their thumbs in unnatural postures, while the PC dominates the world just by showing a little hustle. Hoge, Litalia, the various spies and infiltrators from both sides, and even General Greiner (in a sense) are all active agents, who do the kind of things the PC would try to do in their positions. All they really lack is the PC's high potential for increase in power, and your literally suicidal boldness (because you can always reload). And the game offers some plausible reasons why Akhari and Rahul stay home: Akhari is finishing the Geneforge (which he is able to do all by himself for a change), and Rahul is presumably exercising his ability to control large armies of creations from a vast distance.

 

The two conspicuously passive NPCs, Diwaniya and Khyryk, are given convincing motives for their passivity, and are explicitly criticized for it in the game.

[Contra]

What i like about G3 is the presence of more Shapers, you really get the feeling that the Shapers actually have the power they try to flaunt. I had hoped that you would have more Shaper on Shaper or Dual-shaper against rouge action, like when killing the creator on Dhonald's.

[Slawbug]

Convicingly argued, SoT. I suppose if you are a loyalist, you -are- in a rather unique position. And as for the rebels, I guess Litalia and Hoge would have a harder time going undercover -- though considering that most of the other shapers have never heard of Litalia and don't know anything about Hoge's defection, I don't know that it would be that hard for them. True, they have OD'd on canisters, but you can do that and get things done just fine.

 

The really confusing thing, though, is WHY YOU? It is apparently not an accident that you were not killed in the attack on the school. Why no fuss over, say, Greta, who is clearly sympathetic, and seems to have had nearly as much training as you? (If the GF1 shaper who's "years away" from learning simple magic spells can master shaping, surely Greta can too.) And why save you, when no one seems to have any idea what you think of the conflict?

[Contra]

It somewhat annoyed me back in G1 that you had no choice but to use canisters to survive. In G2 and G3 you can go without even touching them, maybe useing a spellbook now and then, so why not a few spellbooks in G1? It WAS an advanced Shaper station.

[Delicious Vlish]

Go back and play G1 again.

 

You DO find spellbooks. Most of them have rotted away to nothing, or have had the pages ripped out by serviles or rogues. Or water came in and dripped on them.

 

I suspect that Hoge blabs about you to his masters. Litalia hints at this, as she seems familiar with you. You, being a prize pupil, are targeted by people pulling your strings the whole way. A Drakkon, I believe, hints at this, when you meet him, he implies that he left his mark in you, as you used canisters that were made for you. It's the way he says what he says... Meaning that this whole time, Hoge and company have marked you from the beginning so they can groom you for the rebels. They put you in your own private room down deep in the basement so you will survive the attack, make sure you have armor and weapons, and offer you the illusion of clever survival when in reality it is all cunningly planned. By using the canisters, they can track you and your progress. But you also put their mark in you, and the Drakkon can see this when he meets you for the first time. You are young, naive, and when in a desperate situation, you make a grab for any sort of power you can find. IE, the canisters. Hoge clearly leaves that first canister for you in the fort.

 

Hmmm.

[Contra]

You find a few, true, but no way enough for you to be able to survive without canisters. But i guess that the mood in G1 was more focused on the use of canisters, and that you could use allot more of them in G1 befoe you went crazy and detached.

[Lilith]

It's entirely possible to finish Geneforge 1 without using any canisters, especially if you're playing as a Guardian. It's more difficult, but that's the point, isn't it?

[VCH]

I'd like more places to train cheaply. The canisters are fine but there should be people who will increase your skills for less than 5,000 coins.

[Contra]

As a guardian, maybe, but since you learn even the simplest spell from a canistern then it becomes almost impossible for Agents and Shapers.

[I_am_a_Minotaur]

People who do not want to hear about minotaurs this is not about them.

 

In G2 there was the misfit gazer dude (i forget his name) who wasn't a part of any faction. You didn't have to kill him to kill him and being as powerful as he is why cuodn't he have escapedlike Isssss-ta and Amena blade. Coudn't he be a powerful Awakened leader leading a powerful faction? He would attract shapers like Greta serviles like Heust blade and those 4 drayks on Dhonal(3 in darkstone mine 1 guarding the door to the creator.

[I_am_a_Minotaur]

I wanna see some third Lv creations(especially Battle Gammas) to make the game more interesting.

[VCH]

Make the boats look like boats not some horrible magnified mess. Please don't use the Avernum boat again Jeff.

[I_am_a_Minotaur]

Someone write something interesting. This is my favorite topic.

[Marlenny]

I would like to see more reality in the characters. Something such as them getting tired or hungry; sure it would be anoying at times, but I would still like that. I also like the idea of playing a shaping servile kinda, though it would be unlikely given the story line. Having more characters would be way better too

[shell]

Get rid of the annoying three-creation limit. It limits the roleplaying options for no particularly good reason.

[Contra]

Three-creation limit? Don't you mean seven?

I would like the possibility to answer certain questions the way you feel, even though it is not the way of your road.

 

For example: You are asked by a servile keeper what you should do about the serviles too scared to work. One answer is force them, one answer is let them rest untill the monsters are gone..But what if i feel hat both are bad choices? What if i simply say "Have them escorted by guards"?

 

I know it is impossible to have the game understand written answers, but maybe expand those kind of dialogs by another few answers?