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A Few Advance Notes On Geneforge 4


Spidweb

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quote:

 

Hi

 

Please don’t spend the majority of the time working on “prettier graphics”. The reason for your fan base is the unique and wonderful storytelling and the immense game play, the multiple outcomes and freedom you give the player are a rarity in most games. While a few graphic tweaks are always appreciated, without the story there would be no real reason to play your games.

 

....

 

but both are not necessarily mutually exclusive

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Really and truly. Loved those GF3 spinning particle effects. What I'd appreciate are people sitting down or lying down, when the game says they're doing so. It just looked a little weird when the sailors in Dhonal's Keep were standing at attention next to beds going "mmmm, just like that."

 

"Yummy shrooms."

-- Mushroom Cave servile

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I'd find the introduction of a 'third party' to the series quite interesting. I seriously doubt that the Sholai are powerful enough to be a threat to Shaper rule.

 

I think that 'Echoes of the Lost Song' by David Gemmel introduces an interesting concept. Perhaps another race from far across the seas who have no knowledge of Shaping or magic, but who are technologically superior to the Shapers (pistols, muskets, cannon, etc.) The Rebellion would then be forced to choose between two evils.

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The Sholai are too far away to be a significant threat to Shapers. Without a base of supply, a Sholai would have to pick sides.

 

Anyway, the real reason for my post; to resurrect an idea from earlier, I don't think a pack ornk is all that bad an idea. Going from island to island in Geneforge 3, I had to make several trips for my Shaper Equipment, crafting items, Infiltrator items, etc. etc. I'd just make it, use it, and absorb it when I got where I was going, but some way to easily transport all of my myriad forms of delayed gratification in one trip would be quite nice.

 

As far as weaknesses, I think the ornk has plenty built in--too many, to tell the truth. First off, it's a traveling buddy, so that knocks you down to six slots for the more deadly incarnations of my Shaper's wrath. Second, ornks aren't noted for their melee ability. Loaded down with six hundred pounds of crap, their already hideous melee ability would decrease further, if they could attack at all--what would be a good weight cap for an ornk? Third, after making a full battle group of seven war-ornks in Geneforge 1, I noticed their critical weakness: these suckers are slow. In combat, they get where they need to go just fine, but that's turn-based. Out of combat, if I'm dealing with patrolling roamers or worse, I need my characters to be exposed for as little time as possible. My PC had no trouble . . . until he had to run back and save the ornks.

 

There are plenty of ways to work around or through these various issues, but if the ornk can be made into less of a joke creation, I'd not at all mind slapping an inventory on it. Maybe, like with horses in Avernum 3, you could even ride your ornks and double your traveling time!

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Quote:
Originally written by Waylander:
I'd find the introduction of a 'third party' to the series quite interesting. I seriously doubt that the Sholai are powerful enough to be a threat to Shaper rule.

I think that 'Echoes of the Lost Song' by David Gemmel introduces an interesting concept. Perhaps another race from far across the seas who have no knowledge of Shaping or magic, but who are technologically superior to the Shapers (pistols, muskets, cannon, etc.) The Rebellion would then be forced to choose between two evils.
Yes, but then the Sholai might take advantage of the situation to attack the Shapers, or they might work together, and the war would just get more complicated.

Oh well, just gotta wait a lot longer.

- Archmagus Micael
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Quote:
Originally written by Sahdrani:
Well, I would suggest an Avernum 4 engine for a crossover (story-wise) of the Geneforge-Avernum universes. I would really like that. Oh, and make it so that you have 2 campaigns. and bring Erika back. (like, mabye a Geneforge-aiugmented person could Shape her again?) smile
NOOOOOOOO.

No offense, but that's an even worse idea than more evil vahahtai. Geneforge is Geneforge, and Avernum is Avernum. A4 only melded the engines, and look at the response it got.
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Quote:
Originally written by Sahdrani:
Well, I would suggest an Avernum 4 engine for a crossover (story-wise) of the Geneforge-Avernum universes. I would really like that. Oh, and make it so that you have 2 campaigns. and bring Erika back. (like, mabye a Geneforge-aiugmented person could Shape her again?) smile
People have joked about this happening as something to frighten people (like Homeland).

This actually happening would spell disaster for Jeff Vogel (form this community at least).

- Archmagus Micael
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We apologizes in advancement for the multiple quote-makingness.

 

Quote:
Originally written by MagmaDragoon:

An original question... Help someone, killing people without a purpose, stealing... Maybe these action can modify your person, like in Fable, Jade Empire or KOTOR. What do YOU think?

Oooh. I like that. If you have party members like Alwan or Greta I hope they judge you. I recall an old Zelda game ... "Shame on you! Leave that poor hen alone!"

 

I'd find the introduction of a 'third party' to the series quite interesting. I seriously doubt that the Sholai are powerful enough to be a threat to Shaper rule.

 

Quote:
Originally written by Waylander:

I'd find the introduction of a 'third party' to the series quite interesting. I seriously doubt that the Sholai are powerful enough to be a threat to Shaper rule.

 

I think that 'Echoes of the Lost Song' by David Gemmel introduces an interesting concept. Perhaps another race from far across the seas who have no knowledge of Shaping or magic, but who are technologically superior to the Shapers (pistols, muskets, cannon, etc.) The Rebellion would then be forced to choose between two evils.

The Sholai could be powerful. They seemed great in number, anyway. Your idea: brilliant. However, that could sort of bring the series abruptly to an end, much like the Aztec, Mayan, and Incan civilations decimated by the Spanish conquistadores ...

 

Quote:
Originally written by Tom:

Anyway, the real reason for my post; to resurrect an idea from earlier, I don't think a pack ornk is all that bad an idea. Going from island to island in Geneforge 3, I had to make several trips for my Shaper Equipment, crafting items, Infiltrator items, etc. etc. I'd just make it, use it, and absorb it when I got where I was going, but some way to easily transport all of my myriad forms of delayed gratification in one trip would be quite nice.

 

As far as weaknesses, I think the ornk has plenty built in--too many, to tell the truth. First off, it's a traveling buddy, so that knocks you down to six slots for the more deadly incarnations of my Shaper's wrath. Second, ornks aren't noted for their melee ability. Loaded down with six hundred pounds of crap, their already hideous melee ability would decrease further, if they could attack at all--what would be a good weight cap for an ornk? Third, after making a full battle group of seven war-ornks in Geneforge 1, I noticed their critical weakness: these suckers are slow. In combat, they get where they need to go just fine, but that's turn-based. Out of combat, if I'm dealing with patrolling roamers or worse, I need my characters to be exposed for as little time as possible. My PC had no trouble . . . until he had to run back and save the ornks.

 

There are plenty of ways to work around or through these various issues, but if the ornk can be made into less of a joke creation, I'd not at all mind slapping an inventory on it. Maybe, like with horses in Avernum 3, you could even ride your ornks and double your traveling time!

First: shouldn't "War Ornks" just be called "Wornks?"

Second: I can't remember who presented that idea, but I submit(ted(?)) that very thing in a hopeful and extensive email to Jeff Vogel about a week ago. I said that Ornks should not take a creation slot or get a turn in battle (they would just run away), and as opposed to getting the regular stats (Dexterity, Intelligence, Endurance, Strength) they would only get Strength, which would directly affect the amount they could carry (base 50 lbs, +10 lbs per Strength point).

 

Checking back, it was actually me who brought up the Ornks in that ludicrously long post.

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well u know what this game lacks is a bit of romance wink yea, something like the character developing different types of relationships throughout his/her journey that can help him or injure him depending on what he/she does.The character can have some sort of background story that could definately make the plot more interesting. Just a thought wink

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The Wornks have finally convinced me. There has been an Easter egg 'Create Ornk' canister in every Geneforge game. The next one should also give you Create Ornk, but once you have it, there should be possibilities (possibly activated by a cheat code) to upgrade this to Pack Ornk and War Ornk. And a War Ornk should be a joke creation that is far stronger than anything else in the game.

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Quote:
Originally written by Nick Ringer:
They would be powerful enough to tear down walls and melt enemies.
Whoa, destructible environments in Geneforge 4? That would be really cool.

Edit: Wait, how about the ability to make "fading creations" (see geneforge 3). You could make a fading creation during combat of any creation you could normally make outside combat mode. They only last a couple turns, though.
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I was looking at the original post again. I noticed that it said there will 3 new creations and 8 new spells. That probably means that there will be a new creation for each type of shaping, and the 4 types of spells will each get 2 new spells.

I also noticed the most important line in the post: All of this is subject to change.

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I have a lot of ideas (mainly because i walk a lot and as i walk i turn off and think a hell of a lot...)

 

Anyway Ive always wanted to use the geneforge and turn into a drakon, (i like the prospect of being huge and walking into a town and anialating it).

 

I also think it would be cool if you can shape serviles and them acting exactly like you, therefor half obeying you but also carrying items.

 

You could also have the ability to be able to create an army instead of only 7 creations to help you in the war.

 

If you can only be servile and human, not a shaper by origin, i think you should be able to shape yourself but not straight away you need instructions found in books that you read a and learn how to change yourself to have thicker skin, would reduce damage, and it appears in inventory ,like an image of a scroll and you use it and get more endurance.

 

I also like the idea of weather affecting spells and stuff but i also think night and day would be good, you could have a helmet that lets you see in the dark but if you haven't got the helmet you need to use a spell to see better, like light, but this could also attract enemy and the helmet does not, you would need a slot for helmets in the inventory.

 

Also useing night to sneak around would reduce some creations ability to see as far as in the day letting you travel around safer at night providing you have the helmet on.

 

Wow my imagination is huge...

 

I also may have an idea for one of the creations but i don't know whether its that good... Anyway it could be like a telepathic creation useing dominate as an attack to take over the enemy and use it to fight, then kill them when they are not needed anymore...

Well thats just a bit of my thoughts i need to take a walk now and I'll be back with more later.

 

P.S. I'm dyslexic so don't complain about my punctuation like student of trinity (lol i'm gonna keep pointing it out till you apologize).

 

Ok I've had a walk/bath and thought it would be good if you could swim in geneforge 4, and instead of only allowed to wear 1 ring be able to wear like 2 on each hand.

 

I also think that you could make a creation that can actually fly you places (it would be quicker to get places).

 

I also think health and essence should slowly regenerate.

 

Also mabey for the last creation you could have as a human which you give a sword and armor and he uses that to fight therefor his weapon depends on his max damage. Thats all i have so far.

 

P.S. As a small point to student of trinity i've checked my punctuation now.

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sorry about not reading your long block of words you typed it fast and im busy. if you want people to read your words youll have to make the extra effort to include capitals punctuation and paragraph breaks otherwise they wont bother reading because it will be too much trouble for them and they are not getting paid to do this after all.

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hay read my P.S. im dislexic (if thats how you spell it) i have a problem with my english i dont know the right places to put puntuation in ok. Im not stupid im acctually quite clever i just cant write long things with puntuation, it would take me way to long. and if you dont know what dislexia is well i'll tell you (btw im quite annoyed and offended by that because i planely stated it) dislexia is like a permanent mental block of 1 subject (with me its english) and it kinda makes it harder for me to read write and spell words i can thinck of a story line pritty quickly i just cant get it down to paper. so next time read a post before replying to it!

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That's not actually what dyslexia is (nor how to spell it), and even if you are dyslexic, you can learn to read and write as well as anyone else, if given the proper teaching.

 

Being dyslexic has absolutely nothing to do with being able to punctuate, and while none of us mind a comma or two misplaced, your posts need periods separating the sentences in order to be comprehensible.

 

If you make a good-faith effort to write properly, then others will make a good-faith effort to read your writing. If not, they won't.

 

I'm under the impression that I dislike the GF4 ideas in your post above, but it's rather more effort to read than I'd like, so I won't try to reply to them here.

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Quote:
Originally written by sharx:
oh yeh its not word i use its open office
Any "office" program has a text editor with a spell-checker in it. And there is nothing embarrassing about using it. I use it myself whenever I want to make sure that my post is completely correct. (Like this one. smile ) In fact, it just found a typo for me. (I've originally typed "emberrassing", instead of "embarrassing".)

As for the ideas in your original post, some of them you can try in some games already: If you use the Genefoge in Geneforge I, you don't turn into a Drakon, but still become powerful enough to destroy almost anything. Also, there are some places in Geneforge 3 where you get to command parts of Shaper army. It's not much of a command, but still gets a bunch of soldiers to follow your orders.

PS And thank you for trying to make your posts easier to read. smile

RE-EDIT: Thanks, now your post is far more readable than before.
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Quote:
Originally written by sharx:
...
and as a post to zeviz yeh ive done them (played all geneforge versions a number of times thrugh more than 10 times each but still cant remember much of the specifics) but i like the graphics of the drakon. laugh
There is some way to change your character's graphic to whatever you want. (I don't remember how to do it, but some people have done it.) It's not very easy, but if you really want it, you could try. I think you have to overwrite the character picture with the picture of Drakon, but somebody who knows will have to give you the details.
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Extremely so.

 

Nice that we could convert someone to be forum-savvy by his tenth post! And just the next thread over I was whining about him. Sorry, sharx.

 

Frankly love the idea of moving with aid of creations. Flying would be pretty, well, revolutionary for the Shaper world. "Sea Drayks" were introduced briefly in GF1.

 

I would like to see more flying creations, though. A bird of some kind or huge wasps, maybe?

 

prouches4ua.png

I dub thee, "Prouch."

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Thanks for the effort on that one post. Keep it up and you'll find these are fun and friendly boards. It's just that we use basic writing skills as a kind of spam filter: experience amply shows that people who can't or won't write clearly very rarely have any worthwhile ideas to contribute. So we mock them or ignore them.

 

Shouldn't we instead bend over backwards to decipher the postings of dyslexic newbies who won't take a few seconds to punctuate or spellcheck?

 

Maybe, but we don't. It's a harsh, cruel world out here on the internet. If the pedophiles don't get you, the grammar cops may. Sink or swim.

 

(Okay, that's my noob patrol duty done for the month. Tag, whoever's up next.)

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Keeping my new found gramma cheaking in mind hears more ideas.

 

The enchanted forge:

1) Well i think there could be more items to be made with it and maby be able to make all the item enchantments instead of just a few.

 

2) Mabey you could add a new skill for the enchanted forge so it restricts what you can make until you improve it.

 

3) Mabey you could be able to use normal anvils useing metal and a hammer.

 

The posibility of mini-games:

1) Well as i offered earlyer the possability of flying there could be a mini game like a space invader game but useing the creation and enemys.

 

2) I understand this would be hard to build into it and some peeps may not like it but its a suggestion.

 

Running:

1) I suggested swimming before but now i've thought of running.

 

2) There should be a staminer bar and this goes up with strength mabey.

 

3) It would be faster to get around and you may be able to avoid some enemys.

 

Thats some more ideas from sharx! smile

 

EDIT:

One more idea:

Maby lanken could have masterd his powers and shaped you?

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I'm personally just flat out confused on how we got switched off the topic of Geneforge 4 to something about some guys punctuation and grammar...

 

confused

 

Also about the storyline for Geneforge 4, I feel it'd be really cool to have multiple endings for each character and for their actions(at least 3 each.

 

As for the idea about "stealth"...I think there should be a range to your sight that can be improved by leveling up or even making it a skill to put points into.

 

p.s. I think Nick Ringer has a great idea with introducing Creations that have the ability to Fly(maybe using just ranged attacks).

 

That's all i've really got to say. :p

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Well, there's Firebolt. But I sort of like the reloading. Actually, I like the way reloading in G1 and G2 is a separate action, instead of automatic as in G3. I hate the fact that you can only reload by trying to shoot someone with an empty baton, which is silly. But having to count your shots and create tactical opportunities to reload is fun. There's the pucker factor of seeing a fresh wave of rogues approach just as your baton goes X, the anxiety of getting to cover after burning 5 AP in that reloading 'scritch', then the joy of stepping back out with a fresh 6 rounds to blow those rogues away.

 

Which is to say that I'm currently replaying G1 with a missile Guardian on Torment. I never tried this combination before, never used batons much before in fact, and it's fun. Tricky enough to be rewarding, but not so much as to be frustrating.

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Quote:
Originally written by sharx:
nice graphics you drew them?
Yep. I don't use my free time very wisely. Not according to my family, anyway.

I think serviles should wield double-barreled bazookas ...

"What are you doing out of the mines? Get back to work, Servile!"
*cha-click*
"... never mind."

Or, maybe my ideas regarding flight were better ...

walkers6xx.png

Assorted ground-based creations. I will now spontaneously think of names for them: the muscular one can be a Flaahk (a tailless Glaahk?). The two-legged thing with a tail on its head is a Flitch. And the freak on the bottom is a Vone.

EDIT: the on with the tail on its head has four legs. Mercy, me. The next post, by the way, will be #200.
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