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alhoon

Scripting and modding GF5

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Hmm. Actually, speaking of smaller creations, I actually found a way to buff them, sort of. In my head, t1-t2 creations aren't super big, at least when compared to later creations, such as Wingbolts, Battle Alphas/Betas/Gammas, Rotghroths, and Drakons. There was an interesting stat I found, called cr_nimbleness. Basically, from what I can gather, this stat increases the dodging chance for the creature that has it. So for example, if I set cr_nimbleness = 40; onto a creature in the script, that would increase its dodging chance by 40% (From what I've seen), essentially meaning that a 50% chance to hit becomes a 10% to hit. I noticed this stat on 'ghost' creatures, like specters, ghosts, and other things of the sort. I actually at one point made a joinable NPC have cr_nimbleness = 50; in its part of the script. Yeah... let's just say no enemy could hit her no matter how hard they tried. XD

 

This might actually be a good way to buff some of the smaller creations. Smaller creations can be more nimble, and thus, be harder to hit. Roamers and Fyora/Cryoas in particular. I know boosting dexterity or luck would probably achieve the same thing, but still, more useful scripting information to use. Bigger creations have massive health pools and other things to help them stay strong, while smaller creations would be better at dodging attacks outright, to make up for their lack of DPT and health pools. Just putting ideas out there. Going to experimenting more with this myself.

 

Oh, and increasing the levels of t1-t2 creations and their upgrades might make it a little easier to keep them alive to the end. Currently, the level discrepancy makes it extremely difficult to keep lower level creations alive and viable at the endgame. To take your example alhoon, if I were to boost the base Cryoa's level from 12 to 20 and set cr_abil_level 1; from 0 to 4 (The same levels as the NPC 'Savage Cryoa' players face at many parts of the game), you would have to work much less to bring that cryoa to the same level of a Cryodrayk, and it would not take a lot of extra effort to make that cryoa surpass a cryodrayk (Freshly made, not ones that you keep for a long time). That would encourage people to keep their creations around a little more. Having said that, it might make the earlier parts very easy, given that Savage Cryoas were no joke to fight against, and having the PC make them would be pretty strong. But then again, Cryoas aren't cheap in terms of essence cost for both creation at the start and stat boosts, so it might not be as bad as I think. Just my ideas. Also, more scripting ideas! :)

 

EDIT: And actually, speaking of Cryodrayks, I'm kinda curious why NPC cryodrayks have extra AP; they have as much extra AP as a Battle Gamma! Giving a strong ranged attack two attacks per turn? Really? Why? Just why?

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alhoon   

NPC Cryodrayks? For balance reasons I guess.

And while a savage Cryora could be useful till the end game... she would be a total annihilator at levels 8-9 or so... You get Cryoras VERY early.

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Oh yeah, let's just give an already powerful creation (Cryodrayks) the ability to move and still attack twice. That's totally balanced... XD I'm actually tempted to see how broken PC made Cryodrayks would be if the PC made ones had the +AP... XD (NPC Cryodrayks get +4 AP, btw)

 

Maybe not to the level of the Savage Cryoa, considering how strong it is, but it would be closer. Increase the level of PC made Cryoas (NPC ones are unchanged) from 12 to 16, and give them cr_nimbleness = 20; (Makes them harder to hit; in this case, 20% harder to hit. 30% -> 10%). I don't know, I'm just thinking of ways to make lower level creations viable.

 

Also, btw, I think I'll be dabbling in Artifact Swords, once I have the time. I think I'll be doing something a little bit different this time; this time, you need a 'unique' sword from the start, like the Captain's Shiv or the Stunning Blade, for example, instead of just taking a generic sword. You then put Purifying Elixir onto them, which will boost them, much like Artifact Batons. You can then put certain materials to really make them powerful, again, much like the Artifact Batons. These swords will have a set specialization based on the starting sword and the materials put in. I'll probably be changing things regarding the swords as I go, so feel free to give me suggestions. :)

 

EDIT: Also, I'm trying to think of what to replace the Pyroroamer with. The main problem is that the Pyroroamer is pretty bad as a creation, but it's really damn cheap in terms of essence costs. Putting a super strong roamer variant into that slot would create a lot of problems, simply because it's not difficult to get the Roamer's upgraded form early on, and as noted, it isn't terribly expensive to create them and increase their stats. Considering maybe buffing the regular roamers first, then make the cheaper upgrade more of a side-grade; essentially, the new roamer form would be very strong in terms of damage, but it would be a glass cannon; it wouldn't need too many hits to die. Alternatively, it could be the other way around; does less damage than a regular roamer, but it can debuff enemies and it has a lot of HP and resistances. There's probably more ideas around this forum, so ideas are welcomed. :)

 

EDIT 2: Also, considering the idea of merging the Artifact Baton mod with the later Artifact Swords mod, as well as some other weapon mods I have in mind (javelins, some other stuff), and then calling the new mod "Artifact Weapons" mod. Just putting it out there.

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alhoon   

No more useless javelins? That's heresy! Apostasy! Apostasy and heresy!

 

Roamers: I think glass cannon is better. Vlish Debuffs.

I like your idea of taking unique weapons, perfect them and then turn them to nice things.

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It wouldn't be hard, actually. Javelins actually have the same mechanics as batons; they use ammo to fire a projectile. Simply removing the ammo problem and giving the Javelins some perks would make them stronger, much like the artifact batons. Only problem is that I'm not sure how to ensure that artifact Javelins and artifact Batons are distinct from one another; considering that both are ranged weapons, I'm trying to think of ways to ensure that neither weapon would make the other redundant. Ideas welcomed. :)

 

Artifact swords will be something I will enjoy making. Melee has always been sorta dead after GF3, after the multiplier nerf. It wouldn't be hard to set it back; simply set for "Broadsword" type weapons ab_effect_per_level = 8; to unnerf sword attacks, but at the same time, why not go a step further? Take unique swords, put more materials, and make them into very powerful ones. I'll get to that when I have the chance. Though I have some ideas on what to do with the swords.

 

Not Vlish debuffs. More like "weakening" acid. The roamer I had in mind would use an acid based attack much like the regular searer, but it causes the 'weaken' status effect instead of poison. Though I'll be honest, most of the t1-t2 creations need buffs, with Roamers, Thahds, and Artilas being the worst offenders. Some upgrade variants as well; Plated Artilas aren't the greatest (I gave them 50% physical resistance in my experiments along with stronger existing resistances, and at one point, +2 AP. It helps them a bit.), and Pyroroamers straight up suck, which is why I'm considering these ideas. I'll be buffing and changing regular roamers first before I touch Pyroroamers (Btw, I'm making sure that NPC creations, friendly or not, don't get these buffs. These will be for PC made creations only; the enemy already gets a numerical advantage and other bullsh*t to throw at you, so it would be horrific if enemies were suddenly x20 stronger).

 

I'm also considering replacing the type of Vlish that the PC can create at the start; Curse is good, but at the same time, looking at the variants of Vlish that can be seen, I want to give the PC a different Vlish type to make. There are so many to choose from, not mentioning the possibility of custom Vlish types. Just an idea. :)

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alhoon   

Javelins certainly need ammo though as far as logic is concerned. Batons that heal \ shape ammo is one thing. But Javelins duplicating themselves? Meh.

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Some variants of NPC Warrior Serviles use javelins, you know. By your logic, they should run out of ammo after a couple shots. XD Explain why the NPCs get infinite ammo then. XD XD XD

 

Same case with the bows in Avernum; why do they never run out of ammo even though they should, hypothetically? At least both sides have infinite ammo... XD

 

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alhoon   

Never played Avernum. And I don't see the NPC inventory, so I don't mind. Well, Serviles that kept throwing javelins would make me frown, but since I have barely noticed them, I would be OK.

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NPC inventory is pretty damn empty then, considering the amount of items that the PC drops if he/she is killed (everything in your inventory) versus the amount dropped by NPCs (very little in most cases). Makes sense, given that their stats and attacks are built in; they don't have to worry about finding ammo or getting a blade, unlike the PC. Lucky them. XD

 

I'm not joking, there are serviles in the game that can throw javelins, and believe me when I say they never run out; they just keep throwing... and throwing... and throwing... well you get the point. XD XD XD

 

Also, I'm starting work on the Artifact Blades. Using the same script for my Artifact Baton mod, mostly because I want to make it easier for myself. Also, I do want to release an artifact weapons mod someday, so that's just making my life easier. Already got a few of the artifact blade's stats and materials needed outlined; I have swords that require the Flaming Blade, Oozing Blade, and Frozen Blade as materials, along with some other materials (attack crystals, like the lightning infused crystal for example. Not using enchantment gems, since the player can use them on the artifact blades on top of everything else. Besides, artifact batons already use enchantment gems as it is). Will update my progress as I go. :)

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Alright, I've made 5 artifact blades that can be created by the PC. These blades are:

Energized Sword (Requires Flaming Sword, Purifying Elixir, Lightning Crystal, and Flaming Crystal)

+25% Energy Resistance

+25% Fire Resistance

+3 Spellcraft (Was +6)

+50% Energy Preservation

Attacks do pure fire damage (no physical), places the Searing Lightning status effect on enemies. Can be stacked with other enchantment gems.

 

Corroding Sword (Requires Oozing Sword, Purifying Elixir, and two Bile-Infused Crystals)

+25% Poison Resistance

+25% Acid Resistance

+50 Damage Shield

+15% Chance to Hit (NEW)

Attacks do physical damage, places acid status effect on enemies. Can be stacked with other enchantment gems. (I was considering having the blade do pure poison damage, with the acid status effect, but then I saw that certain high powered enemies were very resistant to both damage types, so I scrapped the idea for the moment.)

 

Hypothermic Blade (Requires Frozen Blade, Purifying Elixir, and two Ice-Infused Crystals)

+25% Cold Resistance

+3 Healing Craft

+50 Melee Damage Protection (Was +25)

+15% Chance to Hit (NEW)

Attacks do pure ice damage, places the slowed status effect on enemies. Can be stacked with other enchantment gems.

 

Paralyzing Blade (Requires Stunning Blade, Purifying Elixir, Radiant Crystal, and Ensnaring Fibers)

+25% Stun Resistance

+3 Mental Magic

+20% Chance to Hit

Attacks do physical damage, stun locks the enemy that is hit by the attack (Basically an enemy hit by this sword will lose all their turns. That's what it's supposed to do, anyway. If I find it doesn't, I'll buff its stunning ability further)

 

Melodious Sword (Requires Singing Rapier (Which requires you help the Trakovites with one of their quests to get the sword), Purifying Elixir, and two Radiant Crystals)

+3 Dexterity

+4 Quick Action

+4 Parry

+2 Action Points

Attacks do physical damage, apply the "cursing" effect onto enemies.

 

Bug that I couldn't fix: the Hypothermic Blade, Paralyzing Blade, and Melodious Sword have the wrong attack cursors. Basically, when you hover over an enemy you want to attack, the cursor will change depending on weapon. Ranged attacks have a Javelin cursor, Melee attacks have a fist cursor. The three weapons mentioned use the Javelin Cursor. I've tried to fix it, but nothing works (I think it has to do with the fact that the weapons are occupying the slots that used to be taken by the mine spore batons in GF4.). Swords are fully functional otherwise.

 

You will have to go to the smithy in Mera to get these weapons. And they do require a fee. 100 coins. I picked Mera because the PC will be passing through that area a lot while on their journey, more so if you're in Astoria's faction, so it's relatively convenient. That being said, the script for getting the items can be copy pasted to other smithies if you want.

 

Feedback on the swords are welcome. Also, I would like to hear ideas on how to make Javelins better. I've been trying to think of ways to make javelins better, but I'm running into problems because giving them infinite ammo would make them too similar to artifact batons (not to mention I don't really have a reasoning behind infinite javelins), and I have no idea on how to make javelins strong, while at the same time unique to the batons. Stat boosts are out of the question IMO, since the Javelins are going to be consumed really fast, meaning that the stat boosts won't last for very long.

 

EDIT: Blade stats have been changed a little bit, you can see which ones got the changes.

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alhoon   

Haven't found (or completely forgot) about half of those weapons...

Energized and Melodius seem overpowered. +6 spellcraft is huge IMO and would make a Guardian a competent spellcaster. Melodius gives too many bonuses along with a nice effect.

Hypothermic and corroding seem a bit underpowered (notice the "a bit" part). Those weapons are already good if I remember them well. How about a +10% to hit?

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Hmm. Energized Sword's Spellcraft boost is pretty high, now that I look at it. My line of thinking was that +Spellcraft would make it more geared around a caster, since you would still need Battle/Mental/Blessing Magic stats to use any of the stronger spells. Guardians/Warriors/Shock Troopers have very expensive magic, so they would need to wait for the mid-late game artifacts that boost magic before they can utilize the +Spellcraft. That being said, I'll cut the +Spellcraft in half, so +3 Spellcraft. The attacks do pure fire damage, with an energy DOT on top, meaning enemies that are resistance to either one (Drakons, Drayks, other high powered enemies) won't be hurt too much by this sword. Keep that in mind. (I might change it later)

 

Melodious Sword was a sword that I did a lot to make strong. I will admit it would be pretty strong in terms of stat boosts, though at the same time, it does require the Singing Rapier (Pretty bad sword IMO; gives +2 Quick Action, +1 Parry, not so strong attack, you get it too late for it to be useful), which you can only get by doing a Trakovite quest. It's that quest you get from Caretaker Eloise, the quest where you have to go to the Storm Plains, find and talk to a certain NPC, and give them some money so they can return to the Trakovites. That takes time, and by then, you're in the Storm Plains already; the enemies you're facing are going to be much tougher than they were in the Mera-Tev. Quick Action and Parry from my experiences don't trigger too terribly often, so I didn't really hesitate to increase their stats, especially since Parry has been nerfed a lot from its previous incarnations (You would need a lot of parry to even have a chance to block attacks, so...). I don't think it's too bad, considering when you get access to it, but I might change it later.

 

Hypothermic and Corroding were due for some buffs, I will admit. +15% to hit is a good buff, I think. The Hypothermic Blade's +25 Melee Damage Protection was going to get an increase, to +50.

 

EDIT: Swords have been changed based on some of the feedback you gave me, alhoon.

 

EDIT 2: Also, this forum is really freaking empty most of the time. I know Geneforge as a series is really old, but still, you'd think there would be more people here...

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alhoon   

About the "Guardians need more to buy the magic" you forget something: There are other items. Before you make the artifacts in the late storm plains, you could get the Carnelians and a necklace boosting your combat and blessing magic a bit. Then you drop 4 XP to each to get them to a respectable 3-4. Then you get magic training from someone for a +2. I don't know if there are canisters that increase magic but even if not, with a 5-6 in magic and a theoretical +6 spellcraft you could do A LOT. OK, battle magic is not really useful once you have those beauties for weapons, I give you that. But there's something probably about mind magic. And with mind magic at 4-5 you can do a lot.

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Err, trainers can only train you in magic if you haven't already increased your magic skill already. Meaning that if you want to use the trainer to train up magic, you would have to not put any points into magic until you've gotten the +2 from the trainer. And the training isn't what I'd call cheap IMO. Carnelian Gloves give +1 Battle Magic, you're right. Don't know what necklace you're talking about that boosts magic; tribal fetish? But the Magic training has to be done first before you spend level ups on magic. And I've played through the same; there aren't any canisters that boost the magic stat early on. Heck, canisters that boost stats are pretty rare in general. But it doesn't matter, since I've already nerfed the +6 Spellcraft to +3 Spellcraft. Also added in the stuff you suggested for the Hypothermic and Corroding Blades.

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alhoon   

Yes, of course, I was talking academically.

And speaking academically... are you sure training has to be done before buying any points at all? Perhaps in Rawal's castle that is true but in Mera Tev? Perhaps Quixote (or how Astoria's Shaper is called) can train you even if you had put 1-2 points. Kinda defeats the point if you have to be useless to be trained everywhere.

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Lilith   

Yes, of course, I was talking academically.

And speaking academically... are you sure training has to be done before buying any points at all? Perhaps in Rawal's castle that is true but in Mera Tev? Perhaps Quixote (or how Astoria's Shaper is called) can train you even if you had put 1-2 points. Kinda defeats the point if you have to be useless to be trained everywhere.

 

100% sure. Whenever you invest skill points in a skill, trainers always and everywhere will be able to train you in one less level of that skill. It's a fundamental limitation of training in the later Geneforge games. Yes, this does mean the late-game trainers are no use to you unless you specifically plan around using them, starting right from the beginning of the game. There are even threads specifically devoted to optimizing your playthrough around getting to trainers early, if you want to look for them.

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^Precisely. Meaning that the moment a player uses skill points to raise a certain skill, skill trainers won't be able to train you in that skill (Ex: If you raise Battle Magic by 1 via skill points, you can only learn +1 Battle Magic from Quothe, not +2). Doesn't help that skill training is very expensive until you do quests for certain NPCs. To make a list:

 

- To make weapon training in Isenwood's Spire cheaper, you need to complete Rawal's 3rd task for you, which involves going to the Storm Plains and stealing something for him. Unless you have a ton of coins available to you to buy all of the skill training early on (Highly unlikely), then it's better to wait until you complete that quest. That's mid-late game already, meaning that the combat boosts are useless, since a player must've already increased their weapon skills at that point, especially if you're a Guardian/Warrior/Shock Trooper class. I honestly would've made it so that you either got the cheaper weapon training the moment you complete Rawal's 2nd quest, where you're still in the Mera-Tev, or simply made the skill training cheaper right from the start. It wouldn't be hard to change the scripts to do so, actually...

 

- Quothe's Magic skills training is relatively easy to make cheaper, since all you have to do for him is his first quest, which can be done with little problem if you know what you're doing. That being said, the skill training is still not that cheap even after you do his quest (I believe you needed like 800 coins to increase one of your magic skills by 1 point, Spellcraft training required ~1200). It is easier to get magic training from Quothe, though, since you have to do less to make it cheaper and you get it relatively early on (Mera-Tev).

 

- Shaping skill training (Fire, Battle, Magic, Healing Craft) is very difficult to get, since the only NPC in the game that will teach Shaping skill training to my knowledge is Sage Pavyl, who won't give you skill training unless you join Alwan's faction, which is problematic for players that don't like his faction either for thematic reasons (There are people on here who don't like Shapers, for reasons that I can understand; Alwan IMO is waaaaaaaaaay more level headed than the other Shapers, but he's still a Shaper, after all) or for gameplay reasons (Late game already; surely the player has to have already put points into Shaping skills already at this point, unless you knew this information beforehand and prepared for it. Have fun with weak creations until then though...). You could just simply take the skill training and run to another faction I guess, though that's not really my cup of tea (Something about betraying a faction makes me uncomfortable... I don't know why).

 

Because of how difficult access to skill training is, the fact that most of it aren't useful at the stage of the game you're in, coupled with the fact that they're all very expensive to get, skill training is something that I imagine most players would not bother with. Though I think there is a workaround, if you're willing to do scripting. Basically what you do is set the skill training to a flag, then once you pay the money to an NPC, the NPC will give you that skill training via alter_stat, which will raise the number on that flag, until the flag hits the point that you are unable to get training. For example, the flag starts at gf(1,1,0) at the start, before you get training. You pay the NPC, they train you and give you, let's say, +2 Spellcraft. It raises the flag from gf(1,1,0) to gf(1,1,1), which means that you cannot train in Spellcraft again. Rinse and repeat for all trainers. It does require more dialogue options to do so, however, which means that more lines have to be added into the script, so modders be careful, since the scripts do have a maximum limit on how much you can put in them. Not really something I'm focusing on at the moment (Artifact Blades is my current focus at the moment), but it is something for modders out there to keep in mind, since doing this would make skill training relevant regardless where you are in the game (You can use your skill points and still get the training, for a cost, of course).

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alhoon   

I think, not sure but think, I got Shaping training from Quothe. Could be wrong though. As for the "Easy" part, by the time I had reached Quothe and had the money to spend for training I was 15th lvl or so. Since I was playing Shaper, I didn't have spent anything on mind magic. I did buy quick action at some point though with my Shaper. And in GF4, I bought missile weapons from... outside the monarch's place in mid-late game. Frankly that was a waste of money. I believed it would help me with Crystals, but I have "outgrown" crystals by that time.

 

Yet, I'm reluctant to change the scripts to make training cheaper. Perhaps there's a reason I can't figure for the high prices.

 

And when you say "Quothe's first quest" is it the quest where he asks you to go check an Unbound? Easily leading you down the terrible vendetta with the abominable creatures? Since the first quest makes you cocky and the second, to kill an Unbound comes right around the corner?

Making you think "Perhaps there's a way to beat this... OMG Where are my creations!? Two dead in the first round?! RUUUN!" and then you return with a mischievous smile in your face and upgraded Clawbugs backed by Vlish saying "Now that's it, I may lose some but with 6 creaitions I ... Oh God! The aura alone! RUUUUUUUUN! RUN!" and then far later, you return with a couple of Drayks and the Battle Alpha you buy in Perikalia, along with even more powerful 2-tier creations and blessings saying "That's it. With all my essence spent I will use this spores to heal, bless and... WAIT! They're being chopped to pieces faster than I can heal them! The Drayks panic! The Alpha is toast! The Clawbugs miss! RUUUN!" - kind of quest ?

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I don't think you can get Shaping skill training from Quothe. You can learn how to make new creations for him, but I think he only offers Magic skill training with the skill training thing. I think the reason why skill training is so expensive is that you're getting stats using money instead of using level ups. You're essentially getting "free" stats as long as you have the money using skill training, saving you skill points that you can use elsewhere, whereas using your available skill points not only has an opportunity cost (If I put points into Shaping, I would have to consider what I'm not going to get at the moment. If you're a Shock Trooper, for example, you have to give up some of your combat abilities for better Shaping. Not the best example, but it fits), but you have to kill a lot of sh*t to get level ups.

 

Yeah, I'm talking about that quest line Quothe gives you. You get cheaper training from him after your first quest, though, so you could simply just do the first quest and ignore the rest of the quests until you're ready.

 

For the first quest, you just have to get to the entrance of Gorash-Kel; you don't have to go in super far or fight anything, just send a creation to the entrance, get the dialogue pop up saying about you stepping into the fort and some other stuff, then just leave. The first quest is not hard if you know what you're doing.

 

The second quest has you kill an Unbound that are wandering the Fens. Those aren't as dangerous as the ones in Gorash-Kel, since they only have their regular attacks; they don't have any crazy AoE aura attacks to use on you. Just charge in with a bunch of melee creations, force the Unbound into a corner, then have the melee creations wail on it. Unbound melee attacks sucks compared to their ranged attacks, so it shouldn't be hard to heal the damage being done to your creations.

 

The third quest... yeah, that one is definitely for later, since you have to clear Gorash-Kel, meaning kill all of the Unbound in the place. The Unbound in Gorash-Kel have AoE aura attacks that can wreck most of your party, and the area is littered with high powered creations (Patchworks, Podlings, and Cryodrayks that can attack twice) in large numbers. I was considering increasing the reward that Quothe gives you for this mission, since the reward he gives at the moment (Grounding Plate) is pretty lousy for what you had to do. Perhaps one of my upcoming artifact armor items + one of my artifact weapons will suffice... ;)

 

Also, speaking of armor, I'm also planning to add a few new Artifact Armor items as well. So that's artifact batons + artifact swords + artifact armor. I've noticed that you have artifact greaves, gloves, boots, and belts, but nothing for regular chest plate armor, cloaks, or shields (There is a recipe to make the Perfected Cloak, I think, which is a Shaped Fiber Cloak + Purifying Elixir, but there is no artifact cloaks to craft with it. Plate armor is great for protection, but the weight and decrease to Chance to hit makes it hard to use. Shields straight up suck; too heavy for what they give). I'm planning to add new items for the three types of armor I mentioned. Most of the shields and armor are pretty heavy, so I imagine more combat oriented classes, which already put stats into strength, would benefit more than say, a Shaping class. Could change though; we'll see what happens. :)

 

...also, I just realized that my "little" mod is not going to be so little when I'm done with everything I mentioned. This game's so much fun to mod, it literally sucks you in, and you think "Oh, I'll just add 1 more tiiiiinnnny thing", and then when you're done, you realize you've made something that's absolutely massive. XD XD XD

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alhoon   
"Oh, I'll just add 1 more tiiiiinnnny thing",

Tell me about it... ;)

 

About the Unbound quests, sure you can ignore it until you actually have a chance, but... I didn't. I didn't know that there's no trick or strategy. I thought I would be able to do it. Since I got Makar the Guardian down, I was sure I could take the Unbound. I was wrong...

The Unbound in the Fens have killed me and my creations like 20 times or so.

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Dealing with Unbound doesn't involve strategy. Strategy doesn't matter when you're dealing with creatures loaded with so much power to the point that they become mindless beings out to destroy everything in their paths. Do not think that just because you could deal with Guardian Makar that you can deal with the Unbound. Maker is meant to be a mid game boss that is prepping you to transition towards mid-late game (Storm Plains). He's not that tough, compared to other Shapers (Who are waaaaaaaaaaaaaay harder to kill than that old, arrogant idiot).

 

I will admit, fighting the Unbound in Gorash-Kel gets ugly fast, even if you have high powered creations. If the smaller creations roaming around the area don't kill you (I've died to the pack of Cryodrayks in the area, which is how I knew about the fact that NPC cryodrayks could attack twice... XD), the Unbound with their high powered attacks and AoE auras will kill you. Their melee attacks are far less threatening, fortunately. And I think Wingbolts, Gazers, and a few other creations are highly resistant to the Unbound's regular ranged attack, so you can probably tank their attacks with those. Simply use the Wingbolt/Gazer/etc to aggro the Unbound. Also, don't fight more than 1 Unbound at a time; I tried that, and got absolutely slaughtered.

 

I did have the temptation to make it possible for the PC to create Unbound, replacing the Ur-Drakon that the PC can create (It can be done, with some effort). I got rid of that idea later, mainly because:

1. It would be horribly game breaking. They're expensive (Since they're taking the Ur-Drakon's slot, they're going to cost a lot of essence) and difficult to get (You need very specific conditions to have access to Ur-Drakons, since no trainers teach you how to make them, and the canisters for the skill are extremely difficult to get) but you'd need only one of those monstrosities to win most engagements, and you can create more of them at will. High health, can attack twice, ridiculous attacks, etc.

 

2. Lore wise, the Unbound were completely uncontrollable, I think. The Drakons were able to keep them pacified until they reached Shaper lands, but they couldn't control them after that. I remember in GF4 where you and a few other NPCs (Won't spoil, but one of them is pretty damn important, and is seen in GF5) had to fight Unbound to "test their effectiveness"(Which in my head translates to "The Drakons are trying to kill me, again..."), and the Drakons were unable to get them to stop when you succeeded in proving the Unbound's strength. They had to send a kill command to the Unbound, killing them (Setting me against the Unbound so callously is why I absolutely refuse to join the rebels in GF5; they're even further off the deep end than in GF4!). So it would make little sense for a random lifecrafter to be able to control Unbound fully when the Drakons were completely unable to do so.

 

EDIT: P.S. The new artifact armors I'm planning are going to be taking a lot of script lines. I can only hope that there's enough space to put the new armors in. I'm putting in artifact shields, chest armor, and cloaks. I'm also planning to bring back a few old artifacts from past games, possibly with some buffs. I would hope I won't have to delete anything to add them in, but if I have to do it, so be it.

 

EDIT 2: I'm also thinking about adding artifact necklaces and rings, as well. Though I don't know if I'll go through with this one because you can craft some necklaces already (nothing for rings though), and there are some very strong necklaces and rings in the game already (Talisman of Might for example)

 

EDIT 3: I'm looking at how much the existing artifacts in GF5 can be sold for. Interestingly enough, it seems like all of them have the it_value set to 0, meaning that the artifact isn't worth anything. Perhaps Jeff thought people shouldn't be selling the artifacts for huge amounts of cash? Convenience?

 

EDIT 4: Removed certain spoilers. Really need to stop typing spoilers every time I post something. XD

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Wingbolts wreck unbound I've noticed in my current play through though I am on normal or hard difficulty not torment. The Unbound seem vulnerable to energy/magic damage and so while all my other creations dealt out measly amounts of damage and barely scratched it, the Wingbolt's bolts took much bigger chunks out of it and killed it in several turns. I also had my guardian PC wielding my modded Thirsting Knife (now called the Thirsting Kriss) that does energy damage and applies the weakening effect so between my main PC and my Wingbolt the Unbound proved manageable.

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Drakons, Ur-Drakons, and Unbound actually have no resistance to energy attacks. It means that any attack that does magical damage is going to hit them pretty damn hard. They've got lots of HP, but magic attacks will chew through that HP very quickly. It's why the Wingbolt's attack is so effective against them. Same with the Gazers.

 

EDIT: Quick question, does the Stealth stat do anything? I've noticed the Assassin Boots and some other items have a +x to Stealth, but I have no idea what it does exactly. If it does something cool, I'll consider putting it on one of the upcoming artifact armors that I'm making.

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Folks, please remember, when posting, that this is a family-friendly site -- them's the rules and we are all expected to follow them. Also, you probably weren't thinking about the impact it has, but tossing around trauma experiences (like rape) as crude and casual descriptors for game balance is, you know, maybe not the best idea.

 

This has been your friendly mod exhortation of the day. Thanks all.

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Oh, thanks for reminding us about the rules. Quick off topic question: why does your username change every time I see you in a thread? I don't even know what your original username is because of it... XD

 

Back on topic, does anyone know if the Stealth stat does anything? Or is it a useless stat to ignore?

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I just change it from time to time. Years ago it was a common habit here. There are still a few folks who indulge in it, most notably Alorael, who still manages a 1-2 day clock for his changes. I'm usually called Slarty, though I am also happy to be called "Slarties".

 

On topic: yes, Stealth does something. I believe it reduces the distance cutoff for when enemies are alerted to your presence due to walking near them. So it can be useful, or you can ignore it, depending on how you prefer to play.

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I seriously don't know why people change their username so frequently. I feel that just confuses people, who are probably like "Why the heck are these people changing their username so much?" XD Anyways...

 

Do you need a lot of the Stealth stat for it to be effective? Most items that grant stealth only give like +1-2 Stealth, which I doubt does a whole heck of a lot. Does the Stealth stat do anything regarding mines? Can you get closer to the mine triggers without making them go off? I heard that Stealth affected mines, but I'm not sure whether or not they really did. Even if it didn't do anything to mines, the fact that it makes it easier to sneak by enemies is pretty good already. Might just add it to a couple of the artifact items my mod will have (I'm actually bringing back a lot of the artifacts that were from older games, like GF3 and GF4, with some buffs and other modifications. There will be custom artifacts, but a lot of them are going to be a nostalgia trip for those that played those two games. Won't spoil what I'm putting in exactly, though).

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alhoon   

By the way, I have not found (or not been able to) mod a stealth skill check. No "If you have above X stealth this happens" in my mods so far. And it's not for lack of effort. So if someone could please direct me to the right stat, I would appreciate it.

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The stat for stealth is 215, I think. So that's the stat you're looking for if you want stealth to affect your options in the game. Also, you can only add onto the stealth stat via items in the game; you can't use alter_stat to change the stealth stat of your character; you'll get an error saying "procedural text error in line x" or something like that (I was planning to give Agents/Infiltrators a built in increase to their stealth stat via alter_stat. Wasn't pleased to find out that the Stealth stat can't be increased with alter_stat. On the other hand, you could just simply give the Agent and Infiltrator a charm (item that works as long as it's in your inventory) that increases the stealth stat). I also have no idea if it's possible for the game to check your Stealth stat, but then again, I've never tried it.

 

Though alhoon, I'm curious what you have in your mods that would make you use the Stealth stat as an indicator. Do you have something where if you don't have stealth, all enemies in the area are alerted and zerg rush you? XD

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alhoon   

Has anyone found a way to edit the finale texts? I really would like to add a couple of things based on the choices the player makes...

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Those are hardcoded and would require editing the application itself. Possibly doable with a patch, but would be extremely platform-dependent and likely not practical on all platforms due to checksums and the like.

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alhoon   

I don't recall if that has been answered before, but is there a command to change the essence a character has? Like with maximum health?

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Tried it; there's no applicable command to change the amount of essence a character has the same way you can change the max health of a character. Probably the same with the max energy of a character, though I haven't really tested the energy part.

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alhoon   

Bug NOT found:

Bug that I couldn't fix: the Hypothermic Blade, Paralyzing Blade, and Melodious Sword have the wrong attack cursors

Nope, I didn't have that bug. Cursor was OK.

 

Changed the Paralyzing blade. Actually removed it and replaced it with a "commander's sword". Stunlocking a boss would be, in my opinion, too powerful. Since in the warrior mod I have used a few bosses, I think that blade would make them boring.

 

Other thing: I cannot, for the life of me, find what should be changed mod-wise to make Rawal disgraced in the finale. I don't know which flags control it.

I would really like to add a couple of quests that would lead to Rawal being set aside instead of "You tried that thinking it would lower Rawal's influence. It didn't work"

 

For example, if you work for say Alwan. Respected Alwan that trusts you. I want an option to tell him "Rawal has a Geneforge! He also wanted the book to study how to make Canisters that you have!" and Alwan taking me seriously and that affecting Rawal's standing after the finale instead of a lame answer "I investigated your earlier accusations. Rawal the weasel blocked my efforts and I have to focus on the war."

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Oh really? The cursors were okay? Huh. It was probably a problem on my end if that's the case.

 

I will admit, the stun lock is pretty strong. Pretty much what IMO the Glaahk's melee attack should really be: a decently powerful stun lock melee attack (not as strong as the paralyzing blade, though).

 

I have no idea how to alter the finale text or the flags that control which text gets selected. Though I do wish it was possible to simply disgrace Rawal in general once you get rid of the control tool + you're working for a Shaper councilor that trusts you. You'd think that I could simply tell the Shaper councilor that he has a Geneforge, and then I get to execute Rawal for violating Shaper law so badly without any serious repercussions from the Shapers (Killing Rawal forces you into Ghaldring's faction, whether you like it or not). It seems like Rawal is untouchable, even to us modders. XD

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alhoon   

LOOOOOOOOL!

That Rascal!

 

There are ways that Rawal gets at least disgraced. I have read that somewhere that he may even lose his seat in the council. I want to make it happen since it's already there. It probably relies on some parameters of what you did in game.

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He only loses his seat in the council if you kill Greta in the final battle against the rebels. And the finale text for that will make it seem like Greta is dead. Rawal will lose his seat in the council, but the rebels will have a drakon as their diplomat instead of Greta, I believe. I have no freaking idea how killing Greta causes Rawal to lose his council seat in disgrace; the two events don't seem remotely related whatsoever.

 

I really wish it was possible to add new ending text, simply so I can think of a way to make sure that Greta doesn't have to die in order for Rawal to be disgraced by the Shapers. Rawal pisses me off; he alone almost convinced me to go Ghaldring's faction just so I can kill him (what stopped me was the fact that it would be the point of no return, meaning I can't leave Ghaldring's faction after I do so, and I was hesitant to kill the other councilors; Taygen is crazy, sure, and I would not hesitate cutting him down, but I've got little reason to kill Alwan (unless you're sympathetic to the rebels, then this is probably easier for you), and even less reason to kill Astoria (who is willing to negotiate with the rebellion. A Shaper councilor no less).

 

Doesn't help that the other councilors clearly hate Rawal, yet are unable to act against him because of the war and lack of known evidence to show that Rawal is breaking Shaper law really badly (Rawal's Geneforge and stealing the canister tome are both things that are secret to the rest of the Shapers; the other Shapers only know that he's using the Foundry Repository to blackmail them). I would've been more than happy to reveal Rawal's secrets to the rest of the Shapers and get him disgraced, but alas, my character is not given the option to do so whatsoever.

 

Also, thinking about it, if you made is possible to tell Alwan for example that you took his canister tome and gave it to Rawal, wouldn't Alwan a little angry at you for doing so? You did break Shaper law (literally) giving the book to Rawal, and Alwan probably won't appreciate that. Just saying.

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He only loses his seat in the council if you kill Greta in the final battle against the rebels.

I believe this also only happens in Astoria's ending.

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alhoon   

Of course if you tell Alwan you stole his things he would get angry. But NOT stealing the tome and telling Alwan "I was told to steal a tome on canisters that not even you remembered you have, but I didn't" will make him believe you that you were told so by Rawal. And destroy the tome. Then pointing out to that mage in Perikalia that -another- illegally shaped fellow is in the park (the Rawal servant with the magic by canisters) and having her arrest him or telling Alwan would give Alwan all the proof he needs to go to the council. That servant of Rawal was not a geneforged freak to start with. He placed a control tool and gave canisters to an outsider human, not "illegal creation" thus turning him to illegal creation. And he keeps canisters in the repository that Alwan, if he moves fast, may secure as proof before he points the finger.

 

 

Alwan is the guy that spends resources to track Trakovites that were mostly peaceful. Would he risk Rawal using the Shapers resources AND the Rebellions tools to overthrow the Shapers after the war? Cause that's would not be impossible with Rawal conserving his power and building canisters, geneforges etc.

OK, he doesn't do it in the ending, but would it be a hard leap to imagine?

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It can be done, you know. The part where you tell Alwan that he has an illegal canister tome in his library (which he probably doesn't even use, considering that he's propped up and attached to a machine 24/7) and get him to destroy the tome. Same with the part of telling Sage Pavyl that Trahan's a illegally shaped servant of Rawal (Though why her and not Alwan?). It wouldn't be hard to add some script to make it so that you can tell Alwan that he somehow has an illegal tome in his library.

 

The only problem is that continuing Rawal's quest line will be impossible at that point. I don't like Rawal, but he does give some pretty sweet rewards for doing stuff for him. You get a bunch of money, and the ability to use Major Heal and Shape Wingbolts by giving Rawal the tome. And the next quest you get after getting the tome gives you a permanent +1 Strength and +1 Dexterity, as well as an Essence Charm (+1 Intelligence, +3% Hostile Effect Resistance) for killing Platano. The only way I could see a player telling Alwan about the tome and telling Taygen that Rawal wanted to kill Platano respectively is if the rewards you get from the two are as good or better than what you get from Rawal. You'd also have to somehow make it possible to get Rawal's end reward even if you decide to disobey him and tell Alwan that he has the canister tome, which I imagine would lock you out from doing the "Kill Platano" quest.

 

I don't think Alwan even needs to secure the canisters from the repository. All you have to do is tell him about Rawal's secret Geneforge. You saw it, you were there, you have proof of its existence (Yourself, actually; since you use the Geneforge, you've been Shaped by it, which can be detected, I think. Probably more of Rawal's servants has been Shaped by that thing, possibly).

 

The Trakovites are attacked by both sides, mainly because they go against Shaping, something that both sides rely on the most. Go figure. XD Anyway, yeah, that's why I'm so bummed out that there's no way to get Rawal kicked out of the Shapers. There's no way to alter the ending text, so doing stuff like getting Rawal executed for his crimes will go against the text and break immersion, there's no option to straight up tell Astoria/Alwan/Taygen that Rawal has a f*cking Geneforge in his Foundry, no option to kill Rawal (unless you want to be forced into Ghaldring's faction).

 

Rawal legitimately scares me. Having Litalia leading the Trakovites is already dangerous on its own, considering that its Litalia, but Rawal somehow manages to come very very close to being just as bad as Litalia IMO, simply because, like you said, he's got Shaper resources and Rebel Shaping tools to simply roll over the other Shapers after the war (though if you go his "ending", it doesn't work out for him, strangely enough. You'd think with all of the powers he has, he'd be pretty capable of beating down the war weary rebels). It wouldn't be a hard leap to imagine, and that's why I'm trying to think of ways to script in a method to disgrace him, while also ensuring that you don't lose out on any rewards that you could've gotten from Rawal (Hell, I want the player to get bigger rewards for going against Rawal's wishes; not only is he a lying rat, he's undermining the Shaper war effort. The Shapers would probably be more than happy to generous reward someone that is going against a Shaper councilor undermining the war effort).

 

Like I said though, Rawal himself is proving to be untouchable, even though we modders are (in-universe) fourth wall omnipotent gods that can change the outcome with a few keystrokes. XD I'm starting to think that Rawal can see the fourth wall. XD XD XD

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alhoon   

Yes, I can add script codes for the player to tell Alwan many many bad things about Rawal. But they would amount to nothing, unless I can find what causes Rawal to fall from grace in the finale text. Yes, it would kick the player out of Rawal's path and the rewards it gives. But the player can always choose to not give Alwan the tons of incriminating evidence against Rawal and keep getting paid or go forth with it.

At the time, there is no option to betray Rawal.

 

I know I can't edit or change the ending text, so Rawal can't be expelled by the Shapers, killed or executed. But there is text of him being set aside with minimized influence. At the time we guess it is tied to whether Greta died (?!?) and whether Astoria wins.

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See Rawal doesn't worry me much because even though he hordes power, he doesn't seem inclined to lash out with it or actually use it much at all, he just kind of stockpiles it for "eventually" using it, his ambition isn't tempered by morals or compassion or anything particularly benevolent, but his ambition does seem to be tempered by caution to the point of being almost paralyzed by it. Astoria and I think some other characters talk about how all of the councilors have "broken" somehow, and the way Rawal has broken is to collapse inward and ignore the world and wait the war out and hope all the stuff he stockpiled will help him come out on top then, but he doesn't move to change the fate of the war himself. He has a very vague agenda and while he clearly seems to want to end up in charge of the shapers, he isn't an ideologue who would be willing to see the world burn just to advance his philosophy. he just sits and waits for a chance he tells himself will come. He's checked out of the plot almost, hiding in his mountains.

 

And in the endings, when that chance does come and he does wind up in power, he turns out to be a decent and pragmatic leader. he's actually a fairly moderate shaper to begin with too, he's no liberal like Astoria, but he's no Alwan or Taygen.

 

don't get me wrong, I really despise Rawal just the same. Largely because of how he treats the PC; I don't care what his redeeming features are when he sticks a control tool in my chest and lords it over me like that treating me like a slave. nah. he made it personal for me. I wanted to kill Rawal so badly that I almost joined Ghaldring on my first play through even though I sympathized most with Astoria and didn't particularly like Ghaldring. Now that Im doing a Rebel play through, I am eagerly looking forward to striking that pompous a-hole down for trying to use me as his puppet. I'm just waiting till I kill Platano and get that last reward.

 

but if I hadn't encountered him in that context and I'd just run into him without my whole dynamic of that relationship shaped from the beginning of the game the way it does, I think I'd just find him mildly contemptible and not have such a visceral loathing of him.

 

 

What I do wish is that there was a way to get into all of the Foundry Repository Vaults regardless of which faction you join. Make them really difficult to get if you're not aligned to the right faction, but don't have those rewards locked out completely. Maybe each councilor could drop their respective keys, or there could be some special boss (or bosses) somewhere else, or have it tied into other quest lines somehow. It might make sense to have it connected to Rawal since he oversees the repository, he could have some secret master key that he's not supposed to have stashed away somewhere.

 

Also there ought to be a way for Rebel Characters to get those third points in Gazer and Drakon so they can make Ur-Drakons and Eyebeasts, since currently as far as I know the canisters you'd need are only in Inner-Ghazaki-Uss where you have the final battle to kill Ghaldring. Even for Shaper Characters it'd make sense to have a way to get those creations somewhere else a little earlier because they're almost useless at that point, you're already in the middle of the final battle at that point, At best you only get to use them in one fight, and since you may well be locked in combat for the rest of the game at that point you might not get to make them at all. I feel like you should get them towards the end of the game still but earlier enough that if you go through the effort to get them you still have time to flex your newfound powers and revel in the glorious slaughter your Eyebeasts and Ur-Drakons are capable of, and already have them with you when you knock on Ghaldring's door, come prepared.

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alhoon   
I'm trying to think of ways to reflect that; maybe if you create a vlish, your creations get some stat buffs? (Only problem I'm seeing is how it can be scripted in; I don't really know any tricks to do so at the moment.)

A variation of the following for the zones you're interested at:

 

 

Go to zXXname.txt

 

 

variables;

sort num=9

 

 

//////// LATER AT THE INIT STATE, give the bonus based on a "do I have a PC made Vlish in the party? flag

beginstate INIT_STATE;

While (num<9) {

if (creature_type(num) == 90) {

sf(95,0,1); // Just a random unused flag.

}

num=num+1;

}

if (gf(95,0)==1) {

While (num<9) {

set_attack_bonus(num,1);

num=num+1;

}

}

 

//////// LATER AT THE EXIT STATE, revert to 0 bonuses

 

 

beginstate EXIT_STATE;

if (gf(95,0)==1) {

While (num<9) {

set_attack_bonus(num,0);

sf(95,0,0);

num=num+1;

}

}

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Someone should make a mod about that; checking that Litalia died and then being the talk in taverns in the random bubbles or random people, with big rewards from Shapers. And by big rewards I don't mean 600 gp, a gem, 2 crystals and a wand you don't need. I mean something really big. Rawal is Shaping-others-prone but the rest should offer LOTS of money at least.

Not just a ton of money. But also some Shaper training as a reward, which increases some of your stats. Shapers don't necessarily have to Shape you to give you new skills, they can simply give you some training lessons, which in-game have the same effect as using canisters or being Shaped. You can also get cheaper training, or some other rewards for your service to the Shapers. Perhaps you can even be given a position at one of the Storm Plains forts that are holding the rebels back, to push the envelope a little bit (Fort Rockfall, specifically. The Shapers would probably be more than happy to have you be at the front lines fighting the rebels, as well as helping to fortify Rockfall. They say one Shaper is an army, after all. Not mentioning that the commander there is absolutely miserable; he'd probably be more than happy to have someone else take his position).*

 

However, killing Litalia will probably make it very hard to convince the rebels that you're friendly to them. I'm thinking though that it will make it impossible for you to get into Ghaldring's faction (perhaps simply make Gazaki-Uss attack you on sight if you kill Litalia, essentially locking you out of the rebels. I'm assuming you're in the late game and you've already done being Alwan's envoy, since I find it unlikely that someone would kill Litalia early to mid game), but it won't greatly affect your chances of getting into Astoria's faction (remember, Astoria requires you be more sympathetic to the rebels. At the same time though, I doubt either Astoria or Greta will mind seeing Litalia die, considering that she's insane, and in GF5, is pretty much outright evil considering her actions).

 

It wouldn't be hard to do, really; there's already a set_flag in the script that is triggered when Litalia dies (sf(101,9,1) ;). It wouldn't be hard to simply make it so that when the flag is set, you are given the option to tell one of the Shaper councilors that you killed Litalia. After getting your reward, set the flag higher (sf(101,9,2) ;), which will enable cheaper Shaper training and (possibly) the option to take command of Fort Rockfall, along with some other stuff I'll think of later.

 

I'll see if I can do this in my spare time. I don't really have a lot of time these days, so...

 

*It would essentially be your warrior mod, Alhoon. Where you get to control a fort and the soldiers in it, giving them upgrades, bringing them with you, etc. Only difference is that you're doing it on the side of the Shapers, whereas your mod sounds like you gain control over a rebel fortification instead. If I implemented such a thing, I'd probably use the Zone Simulator to add more creatures to the zone, maybe some unique soldiers that have their own entry in the Gf5itemsandchars script and have their own unique attacks and capabilities as well.

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alhoon   

They say one Shaper is an army, after all. Not mentioning that the commander there is absolutely miserable; he'd probably be more than happy to have someone else take his position

 

That's not how military operates BUT, I can could see it happening as Alwan gets to trust you more and more. However, give a fort to an illegal abomination? That's getting it too far even for a bend-the-law approach of Alwan.

What could be more realistic is the character becoming the leader-behind-the-throne in Rockfall. An attached mercenary\councilor that is calling the shots without alerting the whole Shaper Empire that Alwan gave part of the Line to geneforged individuals that worked(?) for Rawal.

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alhoon   

Searing lighting does insane amounts of damage... With my warrior I can kill a wartrall after clearing part of Mera-Tev (level 20). I removed it from one of the batons the player can find early on.

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However, killing Litalia will probably make it very hard to convince the rebels that you're friendly to them. I'm thinking though that it will make it impossible for you to get into Ghaldring's faction (perhaps simply make Gazaki-Uss attack you on sight if you kill Litalia, essentially locking you out of the rebels.

 

Killing Litalia resulting in you being locked out of Ghaldring's faction doesn't make ANY sense. For one thing, one of the quests FROM HIS FACTION is specifically to Kill Litalia, the Drakon Researcher in the lab gives you that quest. Sure, Litalia cofounded the Rebellion and perhaps to some of the rebel humans and serviles she's still a war hero, but to Ghaldring, she's a Traitor and a dangerous Enemy. She turned on him, and is now directly working against him, so both his pride and strategic prudence dictate that he wants her dead. I'm surprised he doesn't give you the kill-quest personally. I can't imagine him overlooking that kind of betrayal, he probably wants her severed head on a silver platter as much or more than any of the Shapers, a traitor is usually viewed worse than someone who was a foe all along, and the closer and dearer that person was before they turned traitor, the deeper that betrayal wounds and the more hatred and vengeful rage it inspires.

 

The point of this post isn't that ideologically I am pro or anti Litalia/Ghaldring, or to cast judgement on her decision to leave the rebellion to lead the Trakovites, but to point out the dynamic that the relationship between Litalia and Ghaldring likely would have taken on given what she did and his seeming general attitude. Greta might feel bad about Litalia getting killed, but Ghaldring almost certainly WANTS her dead.

 

beyond that personal vendetta on Ghaldring's part for her betrayal, there's also the fact that even though the Trakovites count as a "Rebel-Ish" faction, they are not only separate from but opposed to the main Rebellion. The Trakovites think that the Rebels are just as bad as the Shapers if not worse, and the Rebels seem as viciously opposed to the Trakovites as the shapers are. Slaughtering the Trakovites and killing their Leader ought to help put you in the Rebels' good graces, not lock you out of joining the Rebellion.

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alhoon   

There are a few mistakes in that post.

 

but to Ghaldring, she's a Traitor and a dangerous Enemy

 

Ghaldring almost certainly WANTS her dead

Not at all. For many Drakons yes, but Ghaldring aggressively stops any talk of killing Litalia, hence the Drakon researcher asks you to do it in secret because even hinting at it makes Ghaldring angry. It is in his dialogue for the quest. From what I got from her dialogue, Litalia has connections to Ghaldring's part of the Rebellion more than Astoria's but that is not as clearly stated as the part that Ghaldring threatens everyone hinting to take action against Litalia.

 

Probably Ghaldring thinks he can get her back. Also, the Trakovites don't act against the Rebels till suddenly Litalia goes Berserk and sends her agents to kill Ghaldring, that trusted and protected her and shielded her from the wrath of his underlings.

 

 

The Trakovites think that the Rebels are just as bad as the Shapers if not worse, and the Rebels seem as viciously opposed to the Trakovites as the shapers are.

Not any more. Litalia was the Rebel leader that was as opposed to the Trakovites as the Shapers. Not the rest of the Rebels. They don't like them very much, but they tolerate them and give them refuge according to the dialogue in the game.

And I was let to believe the majority of the Rebels didn't know that Litalia (that was spending energy in GF4 to hunt Trakovite Drayks as the rebellion was close to collapse) leads the Trakovites.

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