Split off: Respecting and learning

[Cairo Jim]

One thing that gets me is people being referred to as asexual. It's not like I'm gonna have kids by mitosis or anything

[Slawbug]

"sexual" as a stem gets used for multiple meanings -- some about orientation, some about reproduction. so you have multiple meanings of "asexual" too.

[Dikiyoba]

One thing that gets me is people being referred to as asexual. It's not like I'm gonna have kids by mitosis or anything

Does this imply that you identify as the sexual orientation commonly known as "asexual?" If so, what term or label do you prefer instead of "asexual?"

 

Dikiyoba.

[Cairo Jim]

I've only known asexual as what I've mentioned. The only thing I can think of as it being implied otherwise would be referring to androgyny, or celibacy, or both.

[Lilith]

I've only known asexual as what I've mentioned. The only thing I can think of as it being implied otherwise would be referring to androgyny, or celibacy, or both.

 

well, "asexual" as a term of self-identification specifically implies someone who doesn't experience sexual attraction. someone who's celibate could still be attracted to people and choose not to act on it. i'm not sure what androgyny has to do with anything in this context

[Dikiyoba]

I've only known asexual as what I've mentioned. The only thing I can think of as it being implied otherwise would be referring to androgyny, or celibacy, or both.

Then take five minutes to educate yourself and don't whine about the terms marginalized groups use to describe themselves. It's a supremely jerk move.

 

Dikiyoba.

[Sudanna]

So's being snappy about reasonable misunderstandings, Diki.

[Dikiyoba]

Being snappy about reasonable misunderstandings is only a regular jerk move, and that wasn't a reasonable misunderstanding. Just because you have a high tolerance for language use and privileged ignorance doesn't mean we all have to feel that way.

 

Dikiyoba.

[Xaiya]

Not everyone is going to obsessively research every single term they see or use. You're expecting people to walk on legos when they've already had to walk on egg-shells. Just correct them and move on. Being angry about some odd ignorance doesn't help matters. Save the anger for if they're unwilling to learn despite being presented with the information.

[Dikiyoba]

You don't have to walk on eggshells or Legos. Just use some common sense and politeness. "Oh, someone has used a term I'm not familiar with. I guess I should look that up." It's not like it's hard to find the answer; it's the Internet. If you can't find it, then you make a post about it: "Hey, I've never seen asexual used in this context. What does it mean?" To do otherwise is to step on other people and expect them to be happy about it. "lol, asexuality is for amoebas, not people, lol, look at me blithely repeating a misconception any asexual person has had to hear and deal with ten thousand times before." *step, stomp*

 

Now get off Dikiyoba's back. Seriously. You're being just as sensitive and complaining over an issue that doesn't even affect you.

[Sudanna]

You don't have to walk on eggshells or Legos. Just use some common sense and politeness. "Oh, someone has used a term I'm not familiar with. I guess I should look that up." It's not like it's hard to find the answer; it's the Internet. If you can't find it, then you make a post about it: "Hey, I've never seen asexual used in this context. What does it mean?" To do otherwise is to step on other people and expect them to be happy about it. "lol, asexuality is for amoebas, not people, lol, look at me blithely repeating a misconception any asexual person has had to hear and deal with ten thousand times before." *step, stomp*

 

Now get off Dikiyoba's back. Seriously. You're being just as sensitive and complaining over an issue that doesn't even affect you.

 

That would be nice, but literally the only place I've ever heard the term asexual - actually heard in real life, and not in some of the queer-heavy places I frequent on the internet - is in biology classes, where it is indeed a technical term about reproduction. I wouldn't expect anyone to be familiar with its use in another context, or assume that the definition they've learned is wrong. That is an issue of "common sense and politeness", if anything is.

[Dikiyoba]

That would be nice, but literally the only place I've ever heard the term asexual - actually heard in real life, and not in some of the queer-heavy places I frequent on the internet - is in biology classes, where it is indeed a technical term about reproduction. I wouldn't expect anyone to be familiar with its use in another context, or assume that the definition they've learned is wrong. That is an issue of "common sense and politeness", if anything is.

I don't expect anyone to be familiar with the term outside of biology either. But it's pretty clear in context that the word is being used to mean something else besides the biology definition. So a person can either choose to look it up and/or ask a question about what it means, they can choose to ignore it because it's none of their business and the context mostly makes sense without knowing every word means, or they can choose to complain about it being used to mean a new thing without knowing or caring what the new definition is. Only the third choice belittles people and is wrong, and only the third choice will get a snippy response from me. If you don't want me to post a frustrated response at you, make choices that don't harm other people.

 

Dikiyoba.

[Slawbug]

I'm going to temporarily lock this thread to avoid any more hurt feelings in the short term. Let's call it a cooldown period. Let me be explicit in recognizing that this is an important topic that should be discussed, and not brushed under the rug.

[Slawbug]

Okay. Let's establish a couple of things.

 

1. Everyone here should be treated in a friendly and respectful way. Period.

 

2. Talking about anyone's personal characteristics or beliefs in a flippant or belittling way is not friendly or respectful. In the cultures that many of us hail from, it's common for this to happen anyway — think about how often you've heard jokes or offhand comments made about different marginalized groups, in real life. Please: do not do that here. We want the forums to be a welcoming place for everyone.

 

3. If you feel someone has been disrespectful or otherwise offensive, that does not justify being snippy, combative, or anything else. It can be hard not to do this when you really feel that someone has been obnoxious. For example, I'll call myself out here: I was snippy in a recent thread when I commented "Classy" in a sarcastic way. We all have our strong reactions. Dikiyoba, as I think you know, you were uncharitably snippy in this thread, over multiple posts. If you are frustrated or offended, and it's not possible to discuss the matter constructively, PM a mod and let them know instead. The level of unfriendliness in this thread can and should be avoided.

 

—

 

This has been your friendly neighborhood warning. Now, I'm going to unlock and split this thread. I'm leaving this thread open for two reasons:

1. Mending of ways

2. Respectful discussion

 

Please remember that the some of the topics broached, touched some nerves; if you're going to post here, follow Plato's advice:

 

"Be kind; for everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle."

[Harehunter]

Slarty, Again I say, Well met.

 

Dikiyoba, This is just the sort of misunderstanding that I got crossways with before, and for which I was reprimanded, and therefore self-exiled. As I stated before, I had never intended to hurt anyone's feeling, but hurt they were. I am an old dog, and this gender of "Other" does not come to me naturally. I apologized, and do so again, for any slip that I may make. But due to the existence of this thread ( Thank You Slarty ) I begin to doubt that that is going to be enough.

 

Slarty, You are wise in splitting this off. Well Done.

[Dikiyoba]

You weren't involved in the argument in any way, so Dikiyoba doesn't know why you feel the need to apologize? Past Lilith's post, it's a continuation of an unresolved debate that occurred on CalRef (which is part of the reason it escalated so quickly).

[Sudanna]

That continually recurs on CalRef, more like. :|

[Harehunter]

Dikiyoba, I made a similar comment just before the whole thing blew up. I stayed out of it there after because I knew that if I had joined in at that time it would escalate. Apparently, my stepping out did not alter that course.

[Kelandon]

Harehunter: To be clear, you have not said anything offensive or inappropriate lately. You will be told — by name, directly — the next time you do. 'Til then, you're good. Don't worry about it.

 

And, as a gratuitous piece of advice, if you'd like to move past things from the past, stop bringing them up.

 

Also, to everyone, I'd like to quote myself (a favorite pastime of mine) from a similar topic a couple of years ago:

There are contexts when, among friends, people can make fun of each other in good humor for whatever traits they may possess. It's easy to imagine that this is one of those places, and sometimes it is. And some people think they're funny or not really serious when they don't come across that way in writing (lack of tone of voice, facial expressions, etc.).

 

So if someone says something offensive or stupid or offensively stupid or stupidly offensive, it's generally best not to flip out. Explain why it's not okay to say that and move on.

 

I tend to think that we won't have moved past prejudice until the comments that are today offensive are tomorrow confusing or funny. Let's try and get there a little faster by not taking offense.

[Harehunter]

Kelandon, One thing I have learned, and which I teach to those who have sought my advise as a mentor, is that one should never leave the truth behind, no matter how ugly it may be. It must be picked up, accepted for what it is, chalk it up to experience as a lesson learned, and put in your pack to be remembered lest one should find oneself in a situation where that lesson applies.

 

I accept your advice, and this shall be the last I say of this topic, unless specifically asked. I just wanted to make it absolutely clear where I stand and why.

[VCH]

Dikiyoba is correct: just ask if you don't know. But also, it's prob better to respond in a more neutral way too.

[Dikiyoba]

As an aside, since the patterns thread has too many things going on in it already, the ability to "like" other people's posts certainly adds to the complexity and general weirdness to debates like this one.

 

Whether it's a good thing or not, Dikiyoba doesn't know. But it's definitely interesting.

[Marlenny]

Now I shall forever imagine Kelandon as keeping an organised computer file of everything he ever posts/says so that he's able to quote himself later on .

 

Also, I sincerely and deeply hate the ability to "like" other people's posts.

[Cairo Jim]

Well, by reading this, I realise I should of either thought through my original post a bit better or not at all seeing as this turned out a bit messy. That being said I was happy with Thuryl's explanation but Diki's reaction I found was confronting.

 

 

Does this imply that you identify as the sexual orientation commonly known as "asexual?" If so, what term or label do you prefer instead of "asexual?"

 

Dikiyoba.

 

Having read a bit of material, and a bit of thought, I'm starting to think it's actually possible. As for labels, well, I dunno. I don't always go for them.

[adc.]

I'm going to temporarily lock this thread to avoid any more hurt feelings in the short term. Let's call it a cooldown period. Let me be explicit in recognizing that this is an important topic that should be discussed, and not brushed under the rug.

 

All does not end well when we bust out our cage

[Kelandon]

Now I shall forever imagine Kelandon as keeping an organised computer file of everything he ever posts/says so that he's able to quote himself later on .

You know me well.

[Dikiyoba]

Hey Nightwatcher/M'ike the Liar, your posts are often so apparently irrelevant and cryptic they're spammy. Could you make them more relevant to and engaged in the conversation please?

 

---

 

Well, by reading this, I realise I should of either thought through my original post a bit better or not at all seeing as this turned out a bit messy. That being said I was happy with Thuryl's explanation but Diki's reaction I found was confronting.

Lilith. She's been Lilith for years now.

 

Dikiyoba has really got to stop hitting the like button instead of the quote button. Whoops.

[Randomizer]

You know me well.

Someday Kel wil have reached the point where all his posts will be from previous posts and no new content will be needed.

[Kelandon]

Someday Kel wil have reached the point where all his posts will be from previous posts and no new content will be needed.

As if that hasn't already happened.

[Alorael at Large]

The goal is to be able to post consistently and relevantly using only QFT. While quoting yourself.

 

—Alorael, who isn't there yet. Somehow his thousands of posts have yet to contain any meaningfully quotable material.

[Mistah Q]

The goal is to be able to post consistently and relevantly using only QFT. While quoting yourself.

 

—Alorael, who isn't there yet. Somehow his thousands of posts have yet to contain any meaningfully quotable material.

I once got banned from an NHL forum for "Quoted for quoting the quote that quoted the quote that quoted the truth." Apparently there is a line to cross, sooner or later.

[Triumph]

As if that hasn't already happened.

 

Look at me, I can't even be bothered to write my own message! I am truly the more optimal spammer!

Edited April 15, 2014 by Triumph
When I quoted Kel, Randomizer's quote disappeared. How do I work the fell magic of the quote-within-a-quote???

[adc.]

Hey Nightwatcher/M'ike the Liar, your posts are often so apparently irrelevant and cryptic they're spammy. Could you make them more relevant to and engaged in the conversation please?

 

Why of course! Anything for a moderator of... wait... Diki? Is that you?

 

Either I am telling the truth or my name spoke

 

Going back to Slarty's post...

 

I agree with him, as people have different opinions and choices. Our likes might be someone else's dislike etc. That's also the reason why I kinda hate posting my self-related opinions here as it is not guaranteed to be compatible with others'

 

Yeah and that, I also tried splitting up the thread with the Sunhallowed Elven Arrows, unfortunately, Trintan isn't online to help me spread the plague.

[Dikiyoba]

When I quoted Kel, Randomizer's quote disappeared. How do I work the fell magic of the quote-within-a-quote???

You have to add the quote back in manually, whether through copy-pasting or by quoting the original post as well as the reply.

 

---

 

Why of course! Anything for a moderator of... wait... Diki? Is that you?

In case it isn't clear, I am no longer a moderator and haven't been one for months. So my request was a personal quest, not an official request from the forum moderators, and was not an attempt to mini-mod. Feel free to ignore it if you want. I'm just pointing out that your posts come across as spammy or confusing to me and probably to other people as well.

 

Yeah and that, I also tried splitting up the thread with the Sunhallowed Elven Arrows, unfortunately, Trintan isn't online to help me spread the plague.

See, I don't know what that post was supposed to mean. Triumph obviously got the reference, but I didn't (by which I mean, I get that it's a reference to an Elder Scrolls game, but I don't know how it is supposed to relate to the thread). Maybe some additional explanation or context would make your posts less confusing, especially in a serious discussion or debate where tolerance for silliness is low (and people's patience are potentially already strained).

 

Dikiyoba.

[Triumph]

Triumph obviously got the reference...

 

Mwahahahaha, how cleverly I have fooled you! ...I actually had no idea what that comment in the other thread was about. I only "liked" it because I thought it was bizarre and irrelevant to such an extent that it became inadvertently humorous.

 

Disclaimer: this is NOT meant to be encouragement to spam threads with utter nonsense on the off chance someone might "like" your post.

 

Nightwatcher, I would encourage you think a bit more about some of your posts. As Diki said, they can come across as confusing and irrelevant, which A. tends to give no benefit to the readers, and B. can even seem disrespectful to others depending on the context of the thread/conversation. Just something to work on. Thanks!

[adc.]

In case it isn't clear, I am no longer a moderator and haven't been one for months. So my request was a personal quest, not an official request from the forum moderators, and was not an attempt to mini-mod. Feel free to ignore it if you want. I'm just pointing out that your posts come across as spammy or confusing to me and probably to other people as well.

 

 

See, I don't know what that post was supposed to mean. Triumph obviously got the reference, but I didn't (by which I mean, I get that it's a reference to an Elder Scrolls game, but I don't know how it is supposed to relate to the thread). Maybe some additional explanation or context would make your posts less confusing, especially in a serious discussion or debate where tolerance for silliness is low (and people's patience are potentially already strained).

 

Dikiyoba.

 

Not a mod? How did that happen Re-reading the quote saves you from humiliation :|

 

And as for the 2nd paragraph... noted.

[Callie]

As an aside, since the patterns thread has too many things going on in it already, the ability to "like" other people's posts certainly adds to the complexity and general weirdness to debates like this one.

 

Whether it's a good thing or not, Dikiyoba doesn't know. But it's definitely interesting.

This is definitely my main complaint about likes: it fuels group polarization (I think that's the correct term, correct me if I'm wrong).

 

Edit: I'm certainly guilty of that.