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akindc

A6-Best party?

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So from reading the guides, it looks like archers are a wate of time. So what is the best party build?

2 dedicated tanks, a priest and a sorcerer, or switch out a rogue for one of the fighters?

Just curious as to what people have used.

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It depends upon playing difficulty level. There isn't just one best party. In general two fighters/tanks with dual wielding swords, a priest, and a sorcerer works well. It's more about your playing style since it's going to be a long game.

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I like to play archers, but Jeff seems to have something against them...they always seem WAY underpowered by the end of the games.

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That has been rectified to some extent in A:eftp , archers are pretty viable in that, some guys even prefer them to other builds.

Archers are actually very good in Avernum 4 as well - especially once you get the Heartstriker.

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Archers are actually very good in Avernum 4 as well - especially once you get the Heartstriker.

Yeah that one too, I wonder why Jeff diluted them again in A5 and A6 , A4 had a pretty good balance in all kind of weapons.

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That has been rectified to some extent in A:eftp , archers are pretty viable in that, some guys even prefer them to other builds.

 

Archers are aces in the early game, absolutely. Later on they fall far behind in terms of damage output, but are still playable.

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That has been rectified to some extent in A:eftp , archers are pretty viable in that, some guys even prefer them to other builds.

 

Archers are aces in the early game, absolutely. Later on they fall far behind in terms of damage output, but are still playable.

I would argue that they are still pretty good in the late game. Yes, their damage will fall behind other characters, but their high dexterity can make them an effective tank in many fights. They'll just need something to counter cold attacks (which dexterity does not help you evade). There are some items that give a cold resistance bonus, which helps mitigate this.

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One of the things that I never understood about Avernum 5 and the rest of the 2nd trilogy was getting parry. In Avernum Escape from the Pit, you could get by without use of parry so long as another fighter is tougher/has high health and you have some points into endurance. In the gamefaqs guide and the general guide on here, most say parry is needed. If I just want to focus on weapon skills, quick action, strength and endurance, will I have problems with getting 1 shotted later on in the game without having skills in parry?

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You can survive without parry. THe reason it is recommended is when facing a swarm of melee attackers, it's always better if you take no damage some of the time instead of trying to reduce damage with armor and have high health. You aren't likely to be one shotted, but several attacks in the same round can do you in.

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Two duel wielding tanks plus a dedicated mage and a dedicated priest works well most of the cases. I have passed the game with such a party on torment. Unfortunately, a few tough bosses harms the attacker when they are struck in melee, like charm or damage. At which time this party will be painful. The two tanks will have to resort to archery, which they are not good at in addition to weak in the first place. The priest will be busy healing, and the mage will be the only one doing decent damage. So another candidate best party is, one duel wield tank, plus two mage and a priest.

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Hey, I'm posting in this thread because it seems appropriate enough to not start another, but I peeked into A6 (although I'm not finished with Avadon yet) and holy cow! I was planning to have 2 humans (a fighter - probably the agile one - and a cleric), one Slith fighter (probably the heavy one), and a Nephil sorcerer, so I'd have at least two party members without XP penalties. Then I saw I could give THEM XP penalties to power them up!

 

I'm kind of blown away at all my choices; I don't know where to begin! How can I decide if the merits and flaws are worth the XP gain/loss? I'm not interested in being told "this is the best party"; I'd just like enough to at least make a decision on my own, because right now I'm a little overwhelmed!

 

Thanks!

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Well, if you want to process it all for yourself, http://spiderwebforums.ipbhost.com/index.php?/topic/12618-a6-trait-effects/ (also linked in the Strategy Central thread for A6, which is sticky-ed at the top of this forum) has quite a discussion of the effects of the different species and traits you can choose.

 

XP loss isn't really a huge deal, because as you level up, stuff gives you less experience. An XP penalty means you level more slowly, which means the amount of of XP stuff gives you doesn't decline as soon.

 

I hope that helps!

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In general traits always help you more than their exp. penalty, elite warrior is always very good for fighters while the mage and the priest can make very good use of natural mage and pure spirit traits, Divinely touched is very very powerful too, In fact it won't really be too bad an idea to give it to all of your party members, the rest of the traits are not as frequently used but you can see their descriptions and if you feel that that will be useful for the sort of character you are creating then always go for them, don't bother with the negative traits unless you are going for some role playing the xp bonus they give isn't really worth it, Also the non-human races can quickly access the powerful battle disciplines and are probably superior unless you are going for a pure magician.

Edit :- damn, sniped again, first lilith, now triumph, am i getting too old for this?

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So how much of an XP penalty is "too much," in your opinion? I'd love to get a general sense of how many advantages I can put on (especially on the non-humans) before it'll get to be too bad.

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Put as much as you want. For example, you can build an all-Nephil party, give them all Divinely Touched, and all either Fast on Feet (for fighters), or Pure Spirit or Natural Mage (for magic users), and you'll be totally fine. It won't be "too bad," it'll be totally worth it. The XP penalties involved are completely outweighed by the benefits those four traits can bestow (and those really are the best traits).

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The level difference is just under 2 for every 10% difference in experience (XP). But the skill point cost is much higher for the better traits than the extra skill points you get from levels. Also you get some of them much sooner.

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So how much of an XP penalty is "too much," in your opinion? I'd love to get a general sense of how many advantages I can put on (especially on the non-humans) before it'll get to be too bad.

The max. penalty you can have is a Divinely touched, Elite warrior slith and due to the way xp allocation works in avernum( you get less xp. as your level increases), even then you will barely lose about 6-8 levels, that's 30-40 skill points but you will be gaining skills worth 100's of skill points.

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So those skill points also balance out the 12-16 lost stat points (I assume here that you still get, to a certain point, one "free" stat point and one of your choice)?

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Oh dear, you're in for a shock. A6 isn't like that at all. There are no automatic stat increases. Stats are just like all the other skills in that you have to raise them (at increasing cost) from the same pool of skill points. This is why skill points actually decrease in value as you reach higher levels - the more you raise a skill or stat, the more it costs to raise it again.

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You know if you are totally new to such a system, you could try playing already set class of characters for a while, discover how the system works and what stats seem important to you, once you are done you could make a custom party and play with that.

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I'm not TOTALLY new (I played Avernum: Escape from the Pit); I just wanted to get some idea of what the new part of the system (the XP penalty thing) was like before I tried stuff.

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Aha. Well, I think I already know what stats are important to me (I'm a very defensively oriented type, so I tend to pump up ones that allows me to absorb and avoid damage), so I believe I at least have an idea of what I want to do.

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Yeah, especially since it seems clear that Divinely Touched and Elite Warrior/Natural Mage/Priest whatever is a fairly "safe" way to go. I just wanted to get a sense of how much it would encumber me if I did it. Since the answer is "it's hella worth it," that's all I really needed to know! :)

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Natural mage allows mage to wear armor and cast spells and other nice perks but there are robes for mage which give nice bonuses.

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