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A:EftP - general newb questions


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Hey, started with Avernum Escape From The Pit - loving the game, didn't even know anyone made games like this any more, and will surely now buy others in the series, haven't had this feeling since the first time I played Baldur's Gate or something.

 

That said, i'm having a few issues, my party are all about level 10, and it seems that nothing in my quest log is quite doable for me, tried clearing out the Aranea lair, one battle is so frustrating I just can't seem to get through it, same with everything else i've tried, giants near Formello, the Slith quest to get dispel barrier is still too hard, the Slith fortress still a bit too hard etc.

 

Is there a guide somewhere that would just give advice on sort of smooth progression through things? While I love the game tremendously it feels like i'm spending way too much failing, then finding something else to do until I gain a couple levels.

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There isn't a general guide because differences in playing difficulty and party makeup cause too much variation. The game is designed for starting in the Eastern Gallery, going north to clear around Formello, then south through Mertis and Tower of Magi, before heading west to the Great Cave,

 

The best thing you can do is skip places that are causing trouble and head to the Tower of Magi for better spells and the Great Cave to do delivery quests. Gain a few levels doing easy stuff and then return.

 

Welcome to Spiderweb Software. Please leave your sanity at the door. The beta testers did and because most of them are insane min/max power gamers you are having trouble.

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Originally Posted By: Randomizer
There isn't a general guide because differences in playing difficulty and party makeup cause too much variation. The game is designed for starting in the Eastern Gallery, going north to clear around Formello, then south through Mertis and Tower of Magi, before heading west to the Great Cave,

The best thing you can do is skip places that are causing trouble and head to the Tower of Magi for better spells and the Great Cave to do delivery quests. Gain a few levels doing easy stuff and then return.

Welcome to Spiderweb Software. Please leave your sanity at the door. The beta testers did and because most of them are insane min/max power gamers you are having trouble.


I've played these kinds of games for something like near on 20 years, from Ultima 6 on...it's fairly user friendly and intuitive so far even compared to early 90's commercial releases, I don't find it terribly hard, just somewhat..uneven I guess, where I can clear 90% of a dungeon, then two battles are impossible.

I'll take your advice and just head to the tower of Magi, and follow things geographically thanks!
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It does get better after mertis. I had a heck of a time fighting a major undead battle in mertis, but took a break and came back later with better results. One small thing i do know that has saved me more times was always at least casting war blessing before every battle i wasn't sure of. You'd think that protection or haste would help more, but when you don't hit anything, 10% hit chance makes a much bigger difference than some offensive and defensive perks.

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Originally Posted By: bumbumpanks
I think part of the issue is that I tend to be really anal about clearing out the quest log. Seems like you just can't really play avernum that way, correct?
The beauty of this game is that it's very open-ended, and you don't have to do everything in an area before moving on. If you find a quest is too hard, you can simply move on and return later.

I'm really anal about completing the quest list, too.
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Once you get aoe spells (lightning spray & mass heal from tower of magi) the game gets a lot easier. Don't do any undead missions without getting lightning spray first because they are immune to ice. Also, going to Cotra and places around that area have pretty easy quests.

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Part of "open-ended" means your quest log will usually be full of things you can't quite do and a few things you can. You do the ones you can, and then tackle the ones you couldn't but now can. It's progress!

 

—Alorael, who will start throwing out the prognostication that A2:CS will be better about this, since by the time the game really opens up you'll already have quite a few levels under your belt.

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Originally Posted By: off high horse, on fat pony
—Alorael, who will start throwing out the prognostication that A2:CS will be better about this, since by the time the game really opens up you'll already have quite a few levels under your belt.


And then when you return to the open ended world you find out how untrue that statement can be.
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I went and bought some spells, just the ice aoe and haste made a big difference.

 

Still the same thing though, running around, clear out part of a dungeon to find I can't complete it...so i'm doing like 4 dungeons simultaneously really.

 

Done most of the two of the Slith places, but can't quite manage the bosses, got past a difficult aranea battle though!

 

Wondering if I should just play on casual lol.

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Originally Posted By: Randomizer
The game was balanced based on insane min/max power gamers who mostly look at obstacles as something that might require some thought. Don't try it at home.


Incidentally, this is perhaps the suckiest thing about SW games, and at least part of the reason why I decided to help beta test; as somebody who plays on normal (and occasionally uses cheats to regain health/spell points), I figured I'd have something useful to offer JV.

I don't actually think A:EftP is all that bad though - I didn't have the problem most people have about not knowing what to do around level 10 for one. Sure, I had to leave some dungeons and return to finish them later (hello, Duvno Bats), but I felt I could mop up each area of the game (Eastern Gallery/Formello/Mertis and the ToM/etc.) pretty neatly before moving on.

Edit: As far as helpful advice goes, don't be shy about fighting in the outdoors - heading west towards Fort Dranlon at the start is somewhat risky, but there are a couple of outdoor encounters there you should be able to win. West of Fort Duvno there's an Aranea dungeon you should be able to handle if you take it slowly (maybe popping outside to recharge your health/spell energey, as monsters will, on the whole, stay dead). If you haven't, make sure you clear the two dungeons for Fort Duvno, and the Nephil/Nepharim lair for the Cotra quest. There's plenty in the first main area to get you ready for the southern areas; it's just a matter of unturning every last stone.
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For the record, the fights aren't hard exactly..it just seems like with boss fights I am usually missing some crucial component in terms of spells etc. that the game has simply not "pointed" me to..inasmuch as the game points you to anything. Either that or I just need a level or two to do it.

 

So yeah i've cleared most of the little stuff in the beginning, i'm now working on the bigger Slith fort near cotra, the place across from fort Dranlon with Sliths for the Slith Arcana quest, and then sailing up to the Aranea dungeon..hopefully I can actually complete one without having to wander off somewhere else.

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Originally Posted By: bumbumpanks
For the record, the fights aren't hard exactly..it just seems like with boss fights I am usually missing some crucial component in terms of spells etc... or I just need a level or two to do it.


I was lvl34 the first time I attempted the Emperor on hard. The trash up to him was pretty rough for me and then the boss fight itself destroyed my party pretty quickly. However, he turned out to be an absolute joke for me on normal so I reverted to a save and changed directions from the Emperor to Groh-hoth. Good god, Groh-hoth was soooo much easier for me and in the process I hit lvl35. Afterwards I went back to the Emperor, on hard mode, and destroyed him with relative ease. I am a bit incredulous that the one level made that much of a difference but... it was really the only significant thing that changed between the two attempts.
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Originally Posted By: Randomizer
It's not only the extra level, but knowing what to expect.


Knowing what to expect definitely made clearing the hallway much MUCH easier. The boss fight though.... I must have attempted it 10+ times at lvl34. By the time I gave up I knew that fight as well as I was ever going to know it.
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I'm gonna feel dumb for the next few years after this but could someone please remind me where I can have potions made? I've done it before and I just spent the better part of an hour running aimlessly around the Eastern Gallery trying to find a place where I could make some potions >.<

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Originally Posted By: Shine On You Crazy Niemand
But, you weren't worn down by the trash mobs on the way to fight him. Or not as worn down, at any rate.

In fairness, it's probably a combination of both. tongue


Worn down? Doesn't everyone have way too many health/energy pots by this point in the game?

Nope, not worn down: full health, full energy for the boss fight.
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More than four in the game. My brain is blanking the names right now, but there's another in Formello. One in Kyass. One in Bargha. Also the pregnant woman in one of the early towns.

 

Sorry, brain not fully engaged, but there are lots of places to get various potions and elixirs. Just a question of which ingredients you have most of, and remember that Wisdom Crystals are possibly the most important things to be able to make.

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Originally Posted By: Kreador
More than four in the game. My brain is blanking the names right now, but there's another in Formello. One in Kyass. One in Bargha. Also the pregnant woman in one of the early towns.

Sorry, brain not fully engaged, but there are lots of places to get various potions and elixirs. Just a question of which ingredients you have most of, and remember that Wisdom Crystals are possibly the most important things to be able to make.


I was talking about the places where you could get potions made in exchange for herbs you collected. I don't have the game in front of me now to check, but I thought those other places you mentioned were just places that would sell you potions.
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What about Silverlocke? I imagine she'd make things for you (I'm assuming knowledge brews, since you could get them there in the original game).

 

Edit: Gah, second page. Does Silverlocke just sell potions then? I'm faintly embarrassed that I never bothered to check her out in my latest play through, and I don't recall from my first time last year.

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Really starting to develop a love/hate thing with this game, I think I either to nerd up a bit and do some reading, give up and play casual, or just give up.

 

I gained another level by going south, then tried returning to the slith places, I can almost beat both boss encounters..but only almost. So, just decided to yell at my monitor and call it good.

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Originally Posted By: Valdain the King
How do I solo this game if its at all possible on normal difficulty? Is it daze and dualwielding or does haste make up more of the repertoire with melee weapons?

Somewhere down the board you should find Randomizer's post and the followup comments for how he did solo on torment. It's certainly possible on Normal, as well, but you'll need to be very careful about character point assignment and so on.
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Originally Posted By: Kreador
Actually, you can get that one potion without having it brewed for you, but that is the quickest and easiest way.


true that since I have found 1 Graymold potion somewhere (prolly Kyas's fortress).

Originally Posted By: Lilith

Wisdom Crystals count the same as potions for that medal.


weird but nice to know since then I don't hsve to do 49 Health potions and recollect herbs twice-thrice a week to make Wisdom Crystals.
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