Veterans fom old"Exile"

[Radzio]

How to compare old great(mmm...) "Exile" (or conversion for 1-3 avernum versions)to this... this something, in 4-6 avernum. How? I wont say that v.4-6 wos bad, it wos pretty nice to play, i also like geneforge series, i think its really nice, but...

Yes, something is not right here Playing Avernum v.4-6 i felt like someone have kicked me front into my face, any moment, when i entered city, meet old(really old ) character.

 

I'm asking you mighty old"Exile" Veterans, how you feel about it, about loosing this all freedom(we remembur ), loosing hundrets of spells(aff.. its hurts), loosing your great strange world for, for... This

[Harehunter]

I sympathize with you. The Crypt of Drath is just not possible in the current engine, and I truly miss Divine Thud and Null Magic Fields. The different party size between Exile and Avernum was not so big a deal to cope with.

 

I do like some of the new weapons, but where is my beloved Orb of Thralni?

 

And laying out the map for the two levels required a bit of redesigning my web pages.

 

There seems to be a rather heated discussion on the value of battle disciplines.

[Arch-Mage Solberg]

I miss the pure vastness of truly going anywhere that was in Exile 1: Escape From the Pit. The graphics weren't the best, there were WAY too many spells, but that all added to the mystique of what Exile was and still is.

 

All of that stuff kept you busy. All of the puzzles kept you guessing. And the storyline kept you coming back for more.

 

Although the more recent Avernum's have a few problems of their own, I feel that they are still really enjoyable to play. In fact, I've played and beaten all three Exiles and all six Avernums. I know I'm not the only one who's done this.

 

Post #579

[Randomizer]

i miss the puzzles. The game has gotten dumbed down since Exile when you had a choice between solving a puzzle or fighting your way through a place. Erika's Tower was always a challenge.

 

Now it's all smaller and almost always just hack and slash.

[Lilith]

Jeff's made it pretty clear that the puzzles aren't coming back: they lost him too many customers.

[Harehunter]

Quote:

In fact, I've played and beaten all three Exiles and all six Avernums. I know I'm not the only one who's done this.

Hardcore, Dedicated, Foolish. I resemble that remark.

And let us not forget the wealth of adventure to be discovered and re-discovered in the Blades of Exile scenarios.

Just to show my gluttony for punishment, I will attempt to complete the Avernum 5-6 Annotated maps. But I will always keep All versions of all the Exile games on my hard drive, and on my backup drive, and on my backup CD of my backup drive... (Paranoia is a healthy attribute for DataBase Administrators).

Now that I have the missing version 1 of Exile I, I am going to have to replay it just to experience the story in its most original form. ((Hardcore, Dedicated, Stupid...))
Just mumbling to myself.

[Arch-Mage Solberg]

Originally Posted By: Harehunter

Quote:

In fact, I've played and beaten all three Exiles and all six Avernums. I know I'm not the only one who's done this.

Hardcore, Dedicated, Foolish. I resemble that remark. And let us not forget the wealth of adventure to be discovered and re-discovered in the Blades of Exile scenarios. Just to show my gluttony for punishment, I will attempt to complete the Avernum 5-6 Annotated maps. But I will always keep All versions of all the Exile games on my hard drive, and on my backup drive, and on my backup CD of my backup drive... (Paranoia is a healthy attribute for DataBase Administrators). Now that I have the missing version 1 of Exile I, I am going to have to replay it just to experience the story in its most original form. ((Hardcore, Dedicated, Stupid...)) Just mumbling to myself.

I would also like to play the Exile games again, but for some reason they are not compatible with my new computer. Post #580

[Harehunter]

Have you tried Hare Krishna?

((Beware of muppets... mumble, mumble))

 

If you are using a 64-bit OS,

Tyranicus has proposed a potential solution.

 

I was going to try it out last weekend, but got tied up with DataBase Administrator duties.

((Hardcore, Dedicated, Why oh why did I volunteer for this job?))

[goblindolf]

Originally Posted By: Lilith

Jeff's made it pretty clear that the puzzles aren't coming back: they lost him too many customers.

I don't see the problem if the are optional.

[Lilith]

Considering how many people have made and still do make angry threads about the difficulty of optional boss fights, I'm not so sure about that.

[Harehunter]

Speaking for myself, the puzzles were part of the main attraction to the game. Jeff artfully wove in the elements of story, battles, and puzzles into a near perfect mixture to appeal to young and old alike. Being an oldster from the keypunch days and University of Texas Super Startrek, the user driven pace suited me perfectly.

 

My library at home is filled with Heinlein, Asimov, Tolkien and the like. Exile had an intriguing story to tell that drew me in. Battle scenes were placed where they made sense, and puzzles challenged the mind.

 

This was no simple hack and slash Dungeons & Dragons. This was a virtual world into which one could escape the doldrums of real life.

 

By the way, I have a fairly large library of archived websites I have collected over the years. Is there any interest in seeing them re-hosted on my website? I have already done so with a couple of Avernum sites, one of which would have completely disappeared.

 

Please give me some feed back. I have a hankering to do it any way, just for personal satisfaction.

[Lilith]

Okay, on one hand Jeff has players like you who enjoy puzzles, but many of whom will still play the game if the puzzles are absent.

 

On the other, he has customers who get stuck on a puzzle, vow never to buy another of his games, and in at least one case send him death threats.

 

Squeaky wheels and all that, you know?

 

(I'm not entirely sure what the presence or absence of puzzles has to do with whether something is a "virtual world", either.)

[Harehunter]

What can I say? I like puzzles. Design and build a patio roof, and a deck. Tear apart a pickup engine and rebuild it.

Cross word puzzles, reverse engineering a BoE scenario editor. Picture puzzles.

 

MYST, Riven, Uru.

 

As a programmer my career is solving problems for people. Asking the right questions to get the specification, design the necessary database structures, writing/testing the software, presentation, modification, enhancement. One puzzle after another.

 

Nuff said?

 

As for people getting stuck on a puzzle and walking away, I'm confused. Jeff has always advocated using hint guides when necessary just to avoid the very situation you pointed out. And I never knew about the threats. I am truly beginning to miss the innocent days of my youth. To go to that extreme over a game is nothing less than insanity.

[Radzio]

I think that even avernum 4-6 might be much closer to puzzle series, but it would request much more work(word in "Exile" wos epic, epic great), i sometimes wos thinking how would this world looks like in 3D

But what we have in avernum looks like they would build one fort next to other(The Castle food depot is bigger than The castle), no space between them, and its looks like avernites are really dumb I were in shock when i first saw what happened to world size in avernum 4, that wos great disappointment.

I know how much work it would need to make huge(huuuuuge) free world(not a linear storyline, i really miss this), and somehow because of that i'm glad that this series has ended.

[ĐªгŦĦ Єяŋϊε]

he really got death threats?

[Necris Omega]

I'm about as veteran-y a Spiderweb Veteran as they come. Exile 2 (with the original graphics) was the first massive RPG of that type I'd ever played ever, way back when I was just a wee lad…

 

And… yeah. Honestly, going with the OP, I originally didn't care for the "new" Avernum trilogy.

 

Originally Posted By: Jeff Vogel – A5 Readme

And yet, a lot of the older fans really didn't like [Avernum 4]. They didn't like the story. They didn't like the graphics. They didn't like the interface.

 

That right there? That was me (and clearly at least one other person). I no longer have saved what I ultimately said in my final review of A4, but… I know for a fact it wasn't all smiles and sunshine. Had I recently played through the original Avernum trilogy before jumping into A4, it would have been a whole lot worse.

 

In retrospect, it's probably a very good thing I didn't.

 

Since then, I've come to accept the fact that I am and will always be steeped in nostalgia, and while I'll never agree with Jeff that new games are (necessarily) better than old games, I have since come to accept… at least the later 2/3 of the "new" trilogy. Avernum 5, which I just plowed through again, is a really good game. Avernum 6, which I'll tackle here again after I jazz up some of the graphics, is another great game, if only for bringing back that Exile feature I love so very very much, Dual Wielding.

 

Yeah, there'll always be things from the original Exile I'll miss, and curse simplification for getting rid of. I liked the banzai huge spell list of the original Exile (there's something so gleefully primal about a spell simply entitled "Kill"…), weapon poison, and diverse weaponry. Smite as a spear? Just… gah, that's not right! There are also a few things, which, honestly I don't think never even made it out of Exile 1 that I miss, like a few of the unsung draconic treasures like Scrioth and the Death Lance.

 

Puzzles, though… eh, I can see why Jeff axed them by far and large. I really see them as something you either love, or something you just hate, with no middle ground. Those who love them will be fine without them, but those who hate them will be better for it. Also, given the exile system's dialog mode and means of puzzles often amounting to "Riddles" one can often memorize and exploit far ahead of the plot.

 

Me? I find that the vast majority of puzzles all too often are very poorly implemented, puzzles for puzzles sake without any real rational reason behind them. They break up the flow of the game and I just generally don't enjoy them. Pit of the Soultaker? Meh…

 

Originally Posted By: Darth Ernie

he really got death threats?

 

Also, this. Seriously, this. What in the name of all that is sacred, this.

[-Jeran Korak-]

I've always disliked the presentation of Avernum 4-6. The graphical style of the previous games fitted so well, they were fluid and expressive while conveying a sense of awe and respect for your surroundings. Avernum just seemed so big. With A4-A6, everything got so damned small. In A4, cities were literally two and a half paces distance. It was unrealistic and immersion breaking. A1-3 had all the immersion.

 

Don't get me wrong, I still like and have completed the last three games, but they've changed so much that it just feels like a Geneforge prequel then a real Avernum game. If somebody remade Avernum 4-6 as scenarios for Blades of Avernum one day, I'd be the first in line to get them. Hell, I'd even pay double for the privilege.

 

I still play Exile 3 on occasion. The sounds, the feel, the graphics. The nostalge almost makes me cry at times. E3 was the first RPG I ever played, and it still looks fantastic.

[Harehunter]

Quote:

Shrink, I wanna kill. I mean, I wanna kill. Kill. Kill! KILL!

-- Arloe Guthrey.
The neatest thing about Kill was that it did not take many priest levels to be able to cast, it was completely irresistible, and even a heavily armored 'tank' could cast it.

Quote:

Also, given the exile system's dialog mode and means of puzzles often amounting to "Riddles" one can often memorize and exploit far ahead of the plot.

This is one of the greatest of the text-box dialogue. With the point and click interface in Av1-3, you always had to navigate through the dialog in order to get to the prompt you needed, and that path used Stuff Done flags in order to ensure you had done the proper things in the game before you got that prompt. And since Jeff published and sold hintbooks for Exile, a little bit of reading would allow you to completely miss a part of the story that was meaningful. That is like watching the entire Stars Wars saga in fast-forward mode. What's the point?

I invested a lot of time to flesh our my Avernum 4 Annotated Maps, and I feel that I must complete the same for Av5-6, if for no other reason than that I hate to see something half finished, such as Rache's Avernum 3 pages.

i am still flabbergasted that someone would go postal over a game. These times, they be a'changin'. We need to band together and form an Organization of People who are Offended by Offended People. (And NO, I emphatically refuse to reduce that to an acronym!)

But seriously folks, the only changes I would like to see be done to the Exile series are:
1) Port from a 16-bit library to a 32-bit which will run on our newer machines.
2) Allow for resizing the game for the higher resolutions so that I can read the text more easily and get a greater appreciation for the graphics.

That's all, folks.

P.S. Which graphics set do you prefer in Ex 1&2: V1-gray or V2-aqua? Having the option to toggle this would be a potential 3rd change.

[Lilith]

Originally Posted By: Harehunter

The neatest thing about Kill was that it did not take many priest levels to be able to cast, it was completely irresistible, and even a heavily armored 'tank' could cast it.

You're actually thinking of Wound, the level 2 priest spell. Kill is a level 6 mage spell, and does magical damage (which can be resisted).

[Harehunter]

Ack! I stand corrected. I was having one of my 'senior moments'. Thank you Lilith for bringing me to my senses.

 

Yes, Kill was a very good, high damage, spell. On the other hand, I really enjoyed Divine Thud. Not as deadly as Kill, but with area of effect and mostly irresistable.

[Necris Omega]

Plus the name. "Divine Thud"... It's so unique yet so provocative. What does that mean, anyways? Does a colossal holy book fall from the heavens to squish your enemies? Does Zeus suddenly trip and faceplant upon your foes? What IS a Divine Thud?

[Lilith]

I always kind of imagined a thunderbolt from the sky creating a wave of heat and pressure that knocked everyone around it flat.

[Slawbug]

thunderbull from the sky

 

Edit: Also, sky? What sky?

[Lilith]

Originally Posted By: CRISIS on INFINITE SLARTIES

thunderbull from the sky

Edit: Also, sky? What sky?

well the cave sky obviously

it couldn't be coming all the way from the real sky or you could one-shot Erika with it as long as it was daytime

[Dantius]

Originally Posted By: Yahtzee

There are two kinds of games in this putrid world of ours: those that are made mainly because the developers thought it would be a lovely thing for everyone to play, and those that are made because the developers thought it would be lovely to add another ballroom to their golden money palace

Of course, in Jeff's case it would be less of a "golden money palace" and more of a "silver money duplex". And he's maybe adding a rec room instead of a second ballroom. But still, it was definitely a game made primarily with the intent of making money- they were, essentially, the 7th, 8th, and 9th installment of the series, and even Star Wars managed to stop with the blatant cash-ins after four movies and one animated movie of blatant consumerism...

[Alorael at Large]

All of Jeff's games are made with the primary intent of making money. Being good is part of that: if they suck, you can tell from the demo, and if they suck, you probably won't pay for the sequel.

 

—Alorael, who can understand complaints about cashing in on a series when it starts to be terrible. So, yes, Radzio can think that. Most people here aren't fond of A4, but A5 and A6 are definitely well liked. If you don't like long series, you're dismissing Ultima, and true hardcore old-time gamers will let only let you pry Ultima VII from their cold, dead hands.

[ĐªгŦĦ Єяŋϊε]

maybe divine thud was an anvil falling from the sky.

i always enjoyed taking obscure spells and using them to when i was low on energy. i also enjoyed fire barrier as an attack

[Harehunter]

I always imagined Divine Thud to be more like a concussion grenade. Its greatest effect is at the center and diminishes the further out it goes.

 

Fire barriers as an offensive weapon is inspired. I preferred Wall of Blades. Sure it was low damage, but it persisted for several rounds inflicting damage each time. And if anyone tried to walk through it, friend or foe, they would incur damage each space they moved to that had the effect. A minefield is not intended to stop the enemy, just inflict enough damage to slow him down so you can bring your ranged attacks to bear and leave him weakened by the time he finally manages to pass through.

 

Alorael, it seems I misspoke on another thread as to the reason Jeff wrote these games. I said it was for people to enjoy. However, I clearly remember Jeff saying in one of his interviews that his motive was purely profit. The purpose of producing an enjoyable game was only a secondary goal, intended only to achieve the first one. Still, IMHO he succeeded handsomely on the secondary goal. I would guess that he also achieved his primary to the level of his expectations.

[Necris Omega]

Yet, at the same time, I recall Jeff also vociferously complaining about RPGs as you always an inevitably start out as a 2hp nobody wielding a bent sword killing rats. Nothing cool ever happens until you've ground out a bajillion XP points, and that bugged him.

 

I'unno. I'm personally of the mind that I wouldn't like working in the same field as Mr. Vogel. I think it would be like a magic enthusiast becoming an illusionist's assistant. The magic is lost when you learn the slight of hand. Likewise, I think if I had a front row seat to all the number crunching behind these sorts of games, I'd never be able to lose myself in one ever again. It'd be all about the math, and that is a very, very depressing thought indeed.

[Harehunter]

To Necris Omega

I resemble that remark. I work as a programmer, and I enjoy very much solving problems for my users. I have even taken some pleasure in writing a few games programs way back when. But unfortunately, playing a game you have written is not as nearly enjoyable. In fact it becomes quite boring. Playing games that other programmers have written is far, far more enjoyable.

[Randomizer]

Exile 1 was for fun, then Jeff found he could make money. After that is was all about the profit.

[Slawbug]

That's not true. Money was a motivating force with an influence that no doubt waxed and waned, but Jeff's publicly expressed attitude when he was writing Exile II (at least) was "my wife is making loads of money, so I'm just going to make this as cool as possible and maybe people will buy it!" This shifted gradually over time: gaining paid employees (first Mariann, then Linda) was no doubt a factor, as must have been the "disappointing" sales of Nethergate, which a truly dedicated amount of time went into making beautiful. The biggest factor, I'm guessing, was the birth of the children -- Jeff wrote books about that, after all, and the most common line now is that money from game sales "feeds his family."

 

In fact, you can even see some patterns in the family planning:

 

Games before Mariann: E1, E2

 

Games with Mariann: E3, BoE, N, A1, A2, G1

 

Games following Cordelia's birth: A3, BoA, G3, A4

 

Games following Miranda's birth: G4, N:R, A5, G5, A6, Av

 

I don't think it is a coincidence that the games immediately following the first child's birth are the ones that receive the most flack on these boards. I mean, cmon guys, Poo Bomb.

[Kyronea]

As someone who once posted a thread on why she wouldn't play Avernum 5 which even managed to get Jeff himself to comment on it...I have to admit my opinion has changed a little bit since then.

 

My first Spiderweb game was Exile III. I found it on an old demo disk and got both myself and my little brother into it. Since then I've played and enjoyed all three of the first trilogy of Avernum games, am currently in a playthrough of Exile III again after some help from these forums in getting it to work(which I am very appreciative of) and am planning a run through of Exile II afterwards.

 

When I first encountered Avernum IV, I didn't like it that much, for many of the same reasons expounded upon by a LOT of people on these forums. My reasons for not playing Avernum V when it first came out could be summed up as "It has Geneforge graphics, therefore it changed and now it sucks" which is something I've since thought long and hard over and realized just how petty and stupid a comment it was. I'd disown my ownership of that thread in the past entirely but it exists so I can't.

 

Anyway, since then I've played through little bits of all three of the second trilogy of the Avernum games...and yet I still get bored and give up on them very quickly. Not because of the graphics or anything--the graphics are very beautiful--but because it just doesn't feel fun. The Exile games and the Avernum games based on them were fun because they were large, expansive, and you had complete freedom almost from the get go. Even Exile II unleashed you after a little bit of railroading, and Chapter Four of that game was approximately 80% of it. I mean my playthough in Exile III has so far taken me all the way up to Blackcrag even though I haven't even fully dealt with the troglodytes yet, let alone get to the giants or the golems.

 

In comparison in all three of the later Avernum games, you're seriously confined to whatever small area you're in at the time. You can't go around and around in the Abyss or up to Formello or whereever at the start of the game in Avernum VI, for instance, but have to go in a certain order.

 

More power to those of you who enjoy them. They are still good despite my lack of personal enjoyment, and I intend to continue to support Spiderweb Software and Jeff's games in the future anyway. But I just couldn't enjoy the later three Avernums, even after I got past my annoyance with the changes.

[Dantius]

Originally Posted By: CRISIS on INFINITE SLARTIES

Games following Cordelia's birth: A3, BoA, G3, A4

I don't think it is a coincidence that the games immediately following the first child's birth are the ones that receive the most flack on these boards. I mean, cmon guys, Poo Bomb.

I'd hardly say that A3 and BoA "receive the most flak" on these boards- BoA might not have sold very well, but it's still well-regarded and has a semi-active community a decade after it's release. And A3 manages to do quite well in "What was your favorite Avernum" polls- usually coming in second to 2. Two bad games at that time were outliers, nothing more.

[Enraged Slith]

I still like Geneforge 3, even if everyone else hated it.

 

The way I see it, I don't enjoy his new games now as much as I enjoyed the Exile series when I was a child, but I wouldn't keep playing his games if they didn't change. I haven't actually bought any of the new Avernums (save 5, but I regret it), but I'm still interested to see what he'll come out with next.

[La paix]

Originally Posted By: Harehunter

Speaking for myself, the puzzles were part of the main attraction to the game. Jeff artfully wove in the elements of story, battles, and puzzles into a near perfect mixture to appeal to young and old alike. Being an oldster from the keypunch days and University of Texas Super Startrek, the user driven pace suited me perfectly.

[...]

This was no simple hack and slash Dungeons & Dragons. This was a virtual world into which one could escape the doldrums of real life.

It's quite fascinating to read this when one remembers that he created Exile in high school. He must never have imagined that it would one day be lauded thus. Eerie.

[Alorael at Large]

Jeff didn't create Exile in high school! He started programming in high school, but Exile is a product of his disaffection with the life of a math graduate student.

 

—Alorael, who believes Jeff is 40 now. If he were in high school in 1994, he took his time getting through the grades. Or he took his time on programming Exile.

[Kyronea]

I was going to say...that certainly didn't sound right. I mean, I can't think of a single high school student who would have the patience to make a game a quarter of the size of Exile, let alone as huge as it is.

[Slawbug]

Originally Posted By: Dantius

I'd hardly say that A3 and BoA "receive the most flak" on these boards- BoA might not have sold very well, but it's still well-regarded and has a semi-active community a decade after it's release. And A3 manages to do quite well in "What was your favorite Avernum" polls- usually coming in second to 2. Two bad games at that time were outliers, nothing more.

When they came out, both games received a lot of flak (good catch) on these boards. BoA (which came out 7 years ago, not a decade ago) did receive a lot of praise, but it received pretty heavy criticism for the scenario editing functions being so much less accessible to the general public than they were in BoE. And importantly, unlike G3 and A4, BoA was not a commercial success. Avernum 3, while it certainly wasn't panned, got more negative reviews by forum users than any previous SW game.

So yes, after A4 and G3, which are clearly the flak winners whether or not they deserve that distinction, I think it's quite fair to say that BoA and A3 are next in line.

[Lilith]

Most of the negative comments about Avernum 3 were from people who also disliked Exile 3, so I'm not sure its reception had anything to do with what was going on in Jeff's life at the time it was being made.

[Alorael at Large]

And again, while A3 was loudly rejected by some forum stalwarts, most people like it, and most people liked it quite quickly. Unlike G3 and A4, both of which picked up permanent bitterness, A3 does well in polls.

 

—Alorael, who in retrospect thinks one of the biggest flaws that A4 suffers from is new engine. All other new engines also came with new worlds, so the joy of exploration counteracts the lack of polish. A4 returned in an unpolished fashion to a beloved and highly polished world.

[Slawbug]

Most people also like G3 and A4. As you are fond of saying, they are good games that fail to live up to their predecessors in certain particulars. It's a question of relative appreciation. From what I've seen, A3 is less popular and was less well received than A2, A5, or A6. Do you guys feel I'm wrong about that?

[Randomizer]

A3 is liked as the last non-linear game. While some places are off limits until you do certain quests, this was the last game without barriers blocking travel to major regions. I started playing E3 and even before registering I could spend hours just exploring the world.

[Brocktree]

Originally Posted By: CRISIS on INFINITE SLARTIES

That's not true. Money was a motivating force with an influence that no doubt waxed and waned, but Jeff's publicly expressed attitude when he was writing Exile II (at least) was "my wife is making loads of money, so I'm just going to make this as cool as possible and maybe people will buy it!" This shifted gradually over time: gaining paid employees (first Mariann, then Linda) was no doubt a factor, as must have been the "disappointing" sales of Nethergate, which a truly dedicated amount of time went into making beautiful. The biggest factor, I'm guessing, was the birth of the children -- Jeff wrote books about that, after all, and the most common line now is that money from game sales "feeds his family."

In fact, you can even see some patterns in the family planning:

Games before Mariann: E1, E2

Games with Mariann: E3, BoE, N, A1, A2, G1

Games following Cordelia's birth: A3, BoA, G3, A4

Games following Miranda's birth: G4, N:R, A5, G5, A6, Av

I don't think it is a coincidence that the games immediately following the first child's birth are the ones that receive the most flack on these boards. I mean, cmon guys, Poo Bomb.

Nikola Tesla. "I do not think you can name many great inventions that have been made by married men." - Nikola Tesla

[Slawbug]

Unfortunately, that quote doesn't really apply to most of Jeff's games. With the possible exception of Exile III, I think he was married, engaged, or married for all of them.

[Necris Omega]

In the end, looking at how he even started with this madness, I think that kind of "magic" can never really happen again.

 

I do find it interesting, though, watching and seeing how the "mainstream" gaming trends influence Jeff in his design philosophies, for good or ill. No, the Avadon codex is NOT an original Jeff Vogel idea, but damn it, I liked it. At the same time, bestiaries that are umteen dozen variants of "[Adjective] Same Frickin' Thing!" across the whole game... It's a license for lazy design, really.

 

Eh, as anything evolves, some bad will always stowaway with the good.

 

It'll be particularly interesting to see what all this does to the original Avernum. We can't say to what extent he'll be revamping the game at this stage, but it does make for an interesting study, being able to take the same game (more or less) and see it redesigned time and time again over the years.

[Kyronea]

The thing that worries me about his redesigning Exile/Avernum I again is that if he's using the Avernum VI engine, there's a high possibility that some--if not a great deal--of the non-linearity will be lost, since so many of his games now include barriers of some sort or another to keep you from getting too far before you do certain things.

 

I'm probably worrying over nothing though.

[Slawbug]

Yeah, that's unlikely. The 2007 Nethergate remake did not add any barriers or linearity beyond the fairly tiny amount that existed in the original game.

[Dantius]

Originally Posted By: CRISIS on INFINITE SLARTIES

Yeah, that's unlikely. The 2007 Nethergate remake did not add any barriers or linearity beyond the fairly tiny amount that existed in the original game.

Isn't the only barrier in Nethergate forbidding you access to the central zone, anyways?

[Alorael at Large]

You can't go west of the Ruined Hall before you finish the Gate Contract section, and you can't easily get to Nethergate if you're Roman or south to the Shadow Valley Fort if you're Celts.

 

—Alorael, who thinks that Jeff's mention of outdoors implies that the games really will be as identical as possible in layout and plot. He wouldn't be shocked if either wall-bashing reappeared or a bunch of switches showed up right next to all the old secret passages.