Tabletop RPG Metathread: We Like To Party

[Sarachim]

Originally Posted By: Dantius

Holy crap you people are intense. Not building a specialist character is a moral failure on the part of the participant? Designing a generalist character is equivalent to an assault on your fellow players? Claiming that a character who stabs other players in the back is better for the party than one who happens to be bad at combat?

Wow, I'm starting to be glad I have no time to play anymore. AIMHack got craaaazy since I left.

You never bought into the idea that you had obligations toward your fellow players in the first place. That's why everyone stopped inviting you to their campaigns.

[Lilith]

Originally Posted By: Student of Trinity

Lilith has a point, but I think she's also ignoring the most important parts of tabletop RPGs.

Number one: There's a referee. If whether the party lived or died were determined by the iron law of some server farm, then letting the rest of the team down, Leroy Jenkins style, would indeed be pretty low. But a good gamemaster can simply tune the campaign's challenges so that incompetence is less deadly. I've done this in various ways. If memory serves, the best ways were the crudest and simplest. Boost the health of reckless characters. Give duller ones a magic charm of wisdom that is implemented as hints from the gamemaster. Climb down off the high horse of mimesis far enough to decree obvious punishments for the persistent pickers of party members' pockets, until they sheepishly fly more right. Just do whatever it takes to help awkward players pull their weight in spite of their handicaps. This is worth doing because ...

If you're going to tune fights and encounters so that they're equally dangerous regardless of the players' skill or tactics, haven't you made skill and tactics irrelevant? Why not skip the whole character-creation rigmarole, decide how lethal you want each fight to be, and resolve fights by rolling percentile dice over the course of one or more rounds to see how badly injured everyone gets?

That's not an attempt at a reductio of your claim about the role of the GM, by the way: it's a sincere question aimed at making you think about what you actually want out of RPGs. The system I described in the above paragraph might actually be exactly the right one for some groups, depending on what effect they're trying to produce.

Quote:

Number two: Players are friends. I understand that MMORPG guilds are normally recruited selectively for skill. If you're playing online with total strangers, you don't care about anything else besides how well they play. But tabletop games are normally played by friends whose relationships extend beyond their character sheets. I think this is true of AIMHack campaigns, for that matter.

If a friend of mine just likes playing inefficient builds, and doing crazy things in the game, then I'll live with that. I'll cut my friends some slack, in whatever we're doing, because they're my friends.

The fact that your fellow players are your friends certainly means that you have more reason to forgive them when they unintentionally let you down. But doesn't it also make it more important to try not to let them down in the first place?

RPGs are in this weird position where they're a fusion of a team sport and a collaborative story. The thing that brings those two aspects together is that the players make choices with meaningful consequences for their characters and the game world. Implicit in the existence of meaningful choices is the possibility of consequences that you don't want. The players, both individually and collectively, are responsible for the consequences that arise from their decisions. Whether you're more interested in challenge or art out of your gaming, attempting to disclaim responsibility for those consequences makes for bad challenge and bad art.

On a similar note to the above:

Originally Posted By: Aʀᴀɴ

I'm speaking as someone who hasn't been in AimHack in around two years (nor played more than three real-life sessions - 2* SR, 1* WH40K - in the past year), but I'd go further and say it's more fun if your party doesn't consist of optimized characters who play perfectly.
As you say, SoT, the gameplay is refereed by an intelligent arbiter. Obvious stupidity can be punished, but even spectacularly OOC-stupid actions may be brilliant and daring in-character. And even IC-stupid decisions may be made for good in-character reasons. There needs to be room for that. You play the game; it doesn't play you. It's not an MMO skinnerbox.

"Good in-character reasons" is not a justification for anything by itself. The character has no actual existence or motives; it is a fiction; its actions are determined by the player. If you think it'd be sufficiently compelling for your character to take an action that harms the party that you're willing to do it despite that, then you as a player ought to be prepared to defend that stance against anyone who objects.

[Slawbug]

Originally Posted By: Lilith

"Good in-character reasons" is not a justification for anything by itself. The character has no actual existence or motives; it is a fiction; its actions are determined by the player.

This one I object to.

It's true that the character of a PC is not set in stone. It normally develops over the course of play, and it can take an unexpected turn. But the same thing is true of the character of real life people, as seen from anyone else's perspective.

I also object on philosophical grounds. Surely we are simply characters in another story. We have a meatspace of our own that Frodo Baggins does not share, but neither do we share his; and in my mind I can imagine how he might act just as surely as I can imagine how you might. Your justification for requiring PCs to act in "moral" ways sounds similar to the justification used by civil and religious authorities, for centuries, to attempt to control the behavior of their constituent persons.

[Lilith]

Originally Posted By: HOUSE of S

This one I object to.

It's true that the character of a PC is not set in stone. It normally develops over the course of play, and it can take an unexpected turn. But the same thing is true of the character of real life people, as seen from anyone else's perspective.

I also object on philosophical grounds. Surely we are simply characters in another story. We have a meatspace of our own that Frodo Baggins does not share, but neither do we share his; and in my mind I can imagine how he might act just as surely as I can imagine how you might. Your justification for requiring PCs to act in "moral" ways sounds similar to the justification used by civil and religious authorities, for centuries, to attempt to control the behavior of their constituent persons.

I don't think it's inherently illegitimate for a group to maintain standards of prosocial behaviour, and as a forum moderator presumably neither do you.

You're also mischaracterising my position. I did not say, and do not believe, that it's never justifiable to have a character take actions that harm the party. I've repeatedly said just the opposite: that you ought to be able to justify it when you do so, which implies that justification is in principle possible.

When I said that you ought to be prepared to defend yourself as a player when you have your character do something antisocial toward the rest of the party, I meant just that: not that you should never do it, but that you ought to be able to justify it in terms of the effect on the players, not merely in terms of imagined cause and effect within the fiction (which is, after all, just whatever the players agree upon in the first place). Maintaining consistency with how I have established my character can be a perfectly good reason to have my character take an antisocial action; it's just not a reason that automatically overrides all other responsibilities, especially if there are multiple possible courses of action a character can take and still be consistent with prior characterisation, as is usually the case.

[Slawbug]

Ok, I suppose that's fair.

[Alorael at Large]

I think there's a conflation here. It's necessary for players to act in such a way that they're all having fun; doing otherwise is a violation of the gaming social contract. But fun is very subjective. Some players enjoy playing the dead-weight useless characters. If no one else minds, that's great; if the other players do, it's time to find a new group. Playing an incompetent combatant in D&D is far worse than doing the same in many World of Darkness games, and in something like Lady Blackbird it's really probably even less of an issue.

 

Good in-character reasons are an excuse, but they're not an explanation. No one makes a character act in a way they don't think is fun for them. But the social nature of the game means a good player had better also factor in how much fun everyone else thinks it is. In D&D, often, acting together is assumed and virtually necessary. In Burning Wheel, you can run a full and fulfilling game on players extensively working at cross purposes.

 

—Alorael, who ultimately thinks that for balance purposes you'd better pick a good game. If some people want to play skilled combatants and others don't, pick a game that will balance acceptably with that. Burning Wheel will do it decently, if you're running it as intended and not ramming endless combat into the scenario. D&D and its derivatives won't. mismatching game, group, and story is one of the primary errors leading to bad campaigns.

[Lilith]

For what it's worth I basically agree with Alorael's post in its entirety, and don't believe that anything in it contradicts what I've been trying to say: it's just a somewhat wider perspective on possible types of play than the relatively narrow, mostly D&D-inspired one that I've been taking.

[Student of Trinity]

It's inherently difficult to talk about tabletop RPGs, because they don't really exist as a topic. They're whatever the participants want them to be. Since a session usually lasts several hours, so even a single session can easily include tactical wargaming puzzles, role-played negotiations, head-scratching riddles, and heaven knows what all else.

 

With all that flexibility, there's an enormous range between enforcing strict rules like an online server, and tailoring and tuning so much that every outcome is pre-ordained. A gamemaster can arrange it to be very difficult for characters to die, but still offer all kinds of incentives for playing more cleverly. 'Challenge' is not a scalar quantity.

[Actaeon]

I've been considering the idea of a remote (AIMhack, Skype, or Roll20) campaign that takes advantage of different people's experience. It would be set in modern times, probably using conspiracy, action, mystery, or post-apocalyptic tropes, and the DM would rotate according to where you are (ie, you'd adventure in places the DM actually knew but you didn't).

 

Thoughts?

[Nioca]

Originally Posted By: Actaeon

I've been considering the idea of a remote (AIMhack, Skype, or Roll20) campaign that takes advantage of different people's experience. It would be set in modern times, probably using conspiracy, action, mystery, or post-apocalyptic tropes, and the DM would rotate according to where you are (ie, you'd adventure in places the DM actually knew but you didn't).

Thoughts?

Hmm... I like the idea, but the catch would be if two or more players both knew the location.

Also, while GMing is easy, GMing well is a quite a bit trickier. It can take a while for a new GM to get their footing, as well.

(Also also, there's the question of what would happen to the GM's character every time the position of GM rotated, but that'd probably be easier to answer depending on the setting)

[Slawbug]

Not everyone likes every GM, and not every GM likes every player. Hence, a rotation system could cause problems if you aren't careful.

[Alorael at Large]

Originally Posted By: Student of Trinity

It's inherently difficult to talk about tabletop RPGs, because they don't really exist as a topic. They're whatever the participants want them to be. Since a session usually lasts several hours, so even a single session can easily include tactical wargaming puzzles, role-played negotiations, head-scratching riddles, and heaven knows what all else.

With all that flexibility, there's an enormous range between enforcing strict rules like an online server, and tailoring and tuning so much that every outcome is pre-ordained. A gamemaster can arrange it to be very difficult for characters to die, but still offer all kinds of incentives for playing more cleverly. 'Challenge' is not a scalar quantity.

And yet there are various form of roleplaying theory. I'm unaware of much in the way of peer review, and many are just sets of self-consistent claims that can fall apart in the wild. Still, there's some nebulous framework on which all this stuff is built, and it can be helpful for expressing what you like and don't like in games. If nothing else, it's starting ground for recognizing that there isn't a right way to roleplay but that there is a way you want to, and it's best to have a GM and a group on board with that.

—Alorael, who notes that even more exotic systems can make things even more complicated, especially when you remove the controlling influence of a GM. Or you can leave the GM but put pretty much all the teeth of consequences in the players' hands. Some people love it, and some people hate it, but knowing which you are is important for enjoying the games you play.

[Lilith]

Really, if the only thing theory ever did was to bring to light the fact that other people play in radically different ways than you'd ever thought possible and still somehow enjoy it, that alone would make it worthwhile.

[Actaeon]

Originally Posted By: HOUSE of S

Not everyone likes every GM, and not every GM likes every player. Hence, a rotation system could cause problems if you aren't careful.

I've done rotating DM before. It works pretty well in a episodic context (rather than a single epic storyline). Of course, you'd have to chose a group of decent DMs, or else a more rp-focused bunch which renders the DM all but obsolete.

[Nioca]

And here's what (I hope) makes the QuadHack variant tick. It's more complicated and wordy than I had hoped, and it really needs to be cleaned up a bit, but that's the basic idea. What I'm really hoping it'll accomplish is set a standard so that techniques and spells are consistent in difficulty and cost, rather than the GM having to pull numbers from his/her rump. Also, I'm hoping it also promotes creative thinking and tactics on an individual level when it comes to combat, and makes hybrid characters viable on-par with specialists (this is why I said earlier that I believe system favors two-stat builds).

 

Thoughts? Criticisms? Suggestions that my imaginary tabletop design license needs to be revoked?

[Triumph]

Ooh! I like it. Not sure if it works, but I like the idea and structure you've laid out.

[Lilith]

I like the idea of this, although I haven't yet done the numbers on some worked examples to see if they produce reasonable DC results. I'm also not clear on how attack spells will interact with defences in this system: do you have to roll once to see if the spell succeeds and roll again to beat the target's defence, or is it a single roll that must beat both the DC and the target's defence (i.e. whichever is higher)?

 

Also, the "multi-target" options as they're set up now are strictly better than the AoE options -- there's no reason to take a spell with a 2x2 area and instantaneous effect when you could take a spell that hits any 4 targets instead. You might want to reduce the maximum number of targets for multi-target abilities by about half to compensate for this.

[Nioca]

Originally Posted By: Lilith

I'm also not clear on how attack spells will interact with defences in this system: do you have to roll once to see if the spell succeeds and roll again to beat the target's defence?

Yeah, there's still some details I'm hammering out. Right now, the idea I've got in mind is that it's one roll, but it has to beat both the Technique DC and the enemy's AC. So if you fire a bolt of lightning (C1 D1 P2 S1 = 10 or 15DC) at a foe with 18 AC, your combined roll and bonuses has to be 19 or higher. If you fired it at a foe with 12 AC, the combined roll and bonuses have to be 16 or higher. The idea I'm running with now is that attack spells base off the same attribute that a similar mundane attack would (so a bolt of lightning would use perception). Attack spells that didn't fall under any of the three attributes would use the character's level instead.

Another idea I had regarding this is that, with certain techniques, if it hit one DC but not the other, different outcomes would occur. So if you used Shoot from the Shadows and only beat the Technique DC, you'd miss but enemies would be little the wiser. Likewise, if you used Blitz Barrage and only beat the enemy's AC, it'd just come off as a normal attack. That's hardly necessary, though.

One of the pros (AND cons) of this is that, with certain techniques, two different sets of bonuses come into play. Take Shoot from the Shadows. It'd function identically, but your roll and Stealth would have to beat the Technique DC, while your roll and either Dexterity (thrown) or Perception (missile) would have to beat the enemy's AC. The end result is that it's entirely possible to have the technique work, but wind up failing to do anything.

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Also, the "multi-target" options as they're set up now are strictly better than the AoE options -- there's no reason to take a spell with a 2x2 area and instantaneous effect when you could take a spell that hits any 4 targets instead. You might want to reduce the maximum number of targets for multi-target abilities by about half to compensate for this.

Not really. Note under complexity how tracking individual targets (multi-targeting, in other words) automatically bumps complexity up to 3. That means that AoEs are cheaper when it comes to stamina.

(This is probably my fault. I probably need to keep my wording and word choice a bit more consistent throughout the chart.)

[BJ Back From the Beyond]

*bump*

 

So, I've been doing a little thinking, specifically about Nioca's QuadHack. From what I understand, in QuadHack there is no Magic skill, unlike AIMHack and CreepingHack, and instead a player with a magic-using character just describes what they want to have happen, without needing a spell for it in advance, and that spell gets bonuses off of the Perception stat (if I'm wrong, please correct me). This is making me wonder though, what are the limiting factors on magic? In AIMHack, we've always divided magic into different schools, and which schools you could use were determined by which ones you had skill points invested in. With QuadHack, that is no longer the case, so what is keeping a mage from using any spell he wants? What would keep an evoker from, say, suddenly pulling out an illusion or a summon?

[Nioca]

Originally Posted By: B.J.Earles

*bump*

So, I've been doing a little thinking, specifically about Nioca's QuadHack. From what I understand, in QuadHack there is no Magic skill, unlike AIMHack and CreepingHack, and instead a player with a magic-using character just describes what they want to have happen, without needing a spell for it in advance, and that spell gets bonuses off of the Perception stat (if I'm wrong, please correct me). This is making me wonder though, what are the limiting factors on magic? In AIMHack, we've always divided magic into different schools, and which schools you could use were determined by which ones you had skill points invested in. With QuadHack, that is no longer the case, so what is keeping a mage from using any spell he wants? What would keep an evoker from, say, suddenly pulling out an illusion or a summon?

Not quite. In order to get magical abilities, you have to select magic adept feats which grant magic. So the circles still exist, it's just that there isn't a skill connected to them.

Additionally, magic isn't based solely off of Perception. Rather, it works like combat; melee attack spells are based off strength, "Cone" and AoE type attacks are based off Dexterity, and long-range spells (such as fireballs) are based off Perception. If it doesn't fit into any of the above, it's based on the character's level instead.

Finally, while magic is just as powerful as it was under previous systems, the catch is that it's also harder to become proficient in. A mundane combatant can become proficient with his chosen weapon right at level 1, and even if he isn't, he can still whack things with no penalty. A spellcaster, on the other hand, has to select a magic adept feat just to get the ability to use spells, then a second feat to grant proficiency. What's the big deal with that, you ask? Well, if you aren't proficient, performing techniques/casting spells is considerably harder. Reliably casting anything beyond simple spells and cantrips requires either proficiency or some freakishly good luck.

In short, magic under QuadHack is expensive, and is unreliable if you try to cut corners.

[Nioca]

Speaking of QuadHack, I've done some more work on it (along with some organization). More specifically, I've got Weapon and Armor rules up on the GM Core Rules. I also did a little work on the basic rules (and split the Take10/STMasNeeded/Assist rules into Tertiary).

 

I'm guessing people probably don't want to go through the whole thing to spot the smaller changes, so I'll list them here.

 

INCREASED MAX STAMINA AND REGEN:

Click to reveal.. (Stamina Max/Regen)

I don't have the Regen rules up on the GM page yet, but I did bump max stamina up to 15. The reason for this is that, with QuadScale Evaluation, stamina usage spiked. I dithered for a while on how to fix it, and I eventually realized that the stamina spike wasn't the problem.

 

There have been some arguments back in the day to either increase stamina or reduce the load on it. The general counterargument was that stamina was meant to be a valuable resource. And therein, I think, lies the problem. Right now, stamina is too rare and valuable for the amount of stuff that relies on it.

 

To give a list of what uses up or drains stamina, we have: Healing, Bleeding to death, Mid-to-High-end Spells/Techniques, certain athletic/acrobatic activities, general fatigue/lack of rest, lack of oxygen, certain spells and attacks which target STM instead of HP, and probably more that I'm forgetting.

 

To give a list of what recovers stamina, we have: Rest, and stamina potions. Neither of which provide large amounts.

 

The result is that, if a character winds up burning through a lot of stamina, or is playing a character that relies on stamina (Healers, Focused Wizards, and Sarelim come to mind), you can frequently wind up stuck with 2 or 3 stamina points for multiple sessions in a row, unable to climb out of stamina debt, if you will. Stamina's supposed to be a limited resource, but the slow regen rate can wind up acting as a bottleneck that hamstrings stamina-reliant builds.

 

So, as a response, I'm devaluing stamina. To address QuadHack's stamina-hungry nature when it comes to techniques, I've boosted the stamina maximum to 15. To address the bottleneck, my intention is to double stamina regen rates, with the additional provision that if a character is extremely low on stamina, they'll regenerate a little extra to help them recover faster. Stamina would still be a limited resource that you'd have to watch carefully, but getting stuck with no stamina and a long, slow crawl to get it back is now far less likely to happen.

 

TECHNIQUES AS MOVE ACTIONS:

Click to reveal.. (Move Action Techniques)

After some deliberation, I decided that any technique that was not an attack or a full-round action could be optionally performed as a move-action; doing so, however, boosts the DC of the technique by 5.

 

MAGICAL HEALING:

Click to reveal.. (Magical Healing)

I decided to change up magical healing a bit. For one thing, healing spells always have a minimum complexity of 3 now. Healing amounts are now listed under the mechanical effects of Power (1 Effect = 4 HP, basically).

 

WEAPONS:

Click to reveal.. (Weapons)

This is mostly just listing the ideas behind it and where it comes from; read the GM Core rules if you want to see the rules themselves.

 

Anyway, this currently works as sort of a mash-up between how Nibiru handles weapons and how ZombieHack handles weapons. Basically, each type of weapon is tied to a specific attribute (meaning that, no matter which attributes you select, there's still weapons that you can use). Each weapon also falls into a specific class, which determines damage, advantages, and disadvantages. Light weapons are concealable and easily wielded, while heavy weapons are bulky but do a lot of damage. There's also artillery classes, which are meant to handle siege weapons and artillery should the need arise. Damage is determined typically by a weapon's class.

 

The idea of the classes is that, no matter what you pick up, the GM can easily provide the appropriate stats and information, while still remaining fair and balanced. There are, of course, situations where common sense may have to prevail over the listed rules, but the system ought to work without too many exceptions.

 

PROTECTIVE GEAR:

Click to reveal.. (Armor)

My original idea for this was to have three separate types of Armor: Primary armor, which provided Damage Resistance, Secondary armor, which protected the character's limbs and extremities, and Shields, which provided AC boosts at the cost of additional encumbrance and not being able to use two-handed weapons. However, as I started to type it out, I realized that that was getting into too much detail, more than was needed; so I pared it down to Body Armor and Shields.

 

In its current implementation, it's actually surprisingly close to what Sarachim is using for armor in the Abyss campaign.

 

Body armor acts as a character's mainline defense against harm; heavier armor protects against heavier attacks, and is generally a tank's best friend. It's divided into three classes (Light, Medium, Heavy). The better the class, the better the protection; however, medium and heavy armors are also rather encumbering and reduce the character's movement speed as well, meaning that the defensive bonus comes at a trade-off with mobility.

 

Shields act to bolster a character's defense, and act as an excellent complement to a one-handed weapon. Again, there's three classes of shield, and the heavier ones also inflict an encumbrance penalty.

 

Encumbrance itself is pretty simple; Each piece of armor adds anywhere from 0.5 to 3.5 points of encumbrance. When the character performs athletic or acrobatic actions or techniques, the encumbrance value is rounded down to get a flat penalty against the action (in short, just take the 1s digit).

 

I'm hoping to have the rest of the rules worked out soon. Once the GM core rules are done, the system should be usable. I think I'll want to run some tests and one-shots to see how the system holds up and to spot any weak areas once I get that done.

[Triumph]

Sounds interesting. Your tweaks to the stamina system are particularly interesting. I'll look forward to seeing or hearing how the test runs go.

[nikki.]

To be fair, stamina regen is something that has been addressed to some extent in Sarachim's latest campaign; two characters now have abilities that allow them to recover stamina after battles, and one of those doesn't even suck, because it basically just feeds on corpses, risk-free.

 

I think I agree in theory that having a stamina debt is a bad thing - I'm feeling the pinch with Arabella (and did with my other healer character before her - this is why I dislike playing magic users), but at the same time I think it really adds a dramatic tension to things; healers are constantly (at the moment) torn between deciding to blow one of their precious stamina points healing a wounded ally, or deciding to try and kill the big bad before the party suffers any more damage.

 

I don't really get too involved with mechanics (and End of Days suffered as a result) but I think having lower-end abilities cost less is perhaps a better way of going about things. I'd rather be able to cast two or three low-end buffs (or debuffs) for free than have them eat out of a pool I'd use for healing or high-end spells. And, as a player, I really don't know how to "price" abilities, so I sometimes feel like I'm giving a spell or ability too high a cost in order to keep it fair. Usually, of course, this means a strict stamina penalty.

 

This is all just my rather tired two-pences worth; please feel free to ignore it. And seriously, sorry about the parentheses. But whilst lowered costs and a larger pool might work out the same in terms of mechanics, it doesn't feel like they do in practice.

[BJ Back From the Beyond]

Hm. Looks interesting, especially the new Stamina rules. I look forward to trying those out. I am a little concerned by the weapon rules though. They look a little complicated, which can make things difficult to figure for the DM during a session. Though that might just be my inexperience talking.

[Nioca]

Originally Posted By: The Boy With The Andra-b Strap

To be fair, stamina regen is something that has been addressed to some extent in Sarachim's latest campaign; two characters now have abilities that allow them to recover stamina after battles, and one of those doesn't even suck, because it basically just feeds on corpses, risk-free.

Yeah, but it's something I'd rather have codified in the rules. Recouping stamina losses shouldn't involve the player having to finagle in techniques just to keep their stamina from dipping into the red, especially since some GMs shoot stamina-boosting techniques down on sight.

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I think I agree in theory that having a stamina debt is a bad thing - I'm feeling the pinch with Arabella (and did with my other healer character before her - this is why I dislike playing magic users), but at the same time I think it really adds a dramatic tension to things; healers are constantly (at the moment) torn between deciding to blow one of their precious stamina points healing a wounded ally, or deciding to try and kill the big bad before the party suffers any more damage.

I don't want to kill the tension, and while I do think a test run is needed to be sure, I don't believe the stamina modification I outlined would actually do so. They'd still have to make decisions between using up stamina or trying to solve the issue another way, but if push comes to shove, having to use up stamina doesn't mean spending two or three in-game days (which can easily equal 6 or so sessions) skimping along and being rendered mostly useless.

Quote:

I don't really get too involved with mechanics (and End of Days suffered as a result) but I think having lower-end abilities cost less is perhaps a better way of going about things. I'd rather be able to cast two or three low-end buffs (or debuffs) for free than have them eat out of a pool I'd use for healing or high-end spells. And, as a player, I really don't know how to "price" abilities, so I sometimes feel like I'm giving a spell or ability too high a cost in order to keep it fair. Usually, of course, this means a strict stamina penalty.

On the pricing thing, I think that's why both Lilith and myself have been taking steps to nail down a concrete stamina pricing systems within our variants. Most spell/technique costs in AIMHack are based on the player and/or GM pulling numbers out of unmentionable places, and to add to the confusion, with several variants floating around, what might be perfectly balanced in one variant might be unreasonable in another.

Also, that's not to say that low-end spells/techniques cost a lot under QuadHack. It's just that, once you've actually got a foundation with which to base costs on, you notice that techniques start costing a bit more than you anticipated (and a few wind up costing less). If you stat out techniques in Nibiru, you'll notice that there's also a similar upward trend.

Quote:

But whilst lowered costs and a larger pool might work out the same in terms of mechanics, it doesn't feel like they do in practice.

...I'm honestly a little confused by this point, seeing as these rules haven't been practiced yet.

Originally Posted By: B.J.Earles

I am a little concerned by the weapon rules though. They look a little complicated, which can make things difficult to figure for the DM during a session. Though that might just be my inexperience talking.

Yeah, I'll probably need to look through that again and streamline it a bit. That said, the damage values are most of what you have to pay attention to; most of the rest is really just me stating common sense.

[Dintiradan]

Regarding stamina for healers: an alternative I mentioned earlier in this thread (or possibly one of the campaign threads) was allowing the healer and healee to decide who spends the stamina. Alternately, you can have the healers give up a spell slot so that they can choose whatever method is appropriate. Heck, if you wanted to spread healing to multiple schools, this could be the way to mechanically distinguish them.

 

On a side note, for whoever cares: the first round of testing for D&D 5E is open.

[Lilith]

Originally Posted By: Dintiradan

On a side note, for whoever cares: the first round of testing for D&D 5E is open.

i know some people who are involved in the playtest and it's not looking too promising so far, unfortunately

[BJ Back From the Beyond]

So, partially out of curiosity (and partially out of boredom) I decided to take the current QuadHack evaluation system and apply it to some of the more popular and/or basic spells from classic AIMHack. I'm wondering if these numbers seem right to everyone else:

(Note that on the DCs, the first number is for characters without proficiency and the second is for characters with proficiency. Also, all of these are what I see as being the minimum for each value. Any of them could be increased depending on the action.)

 

Click to reveal.. (QuadHack Spell Conversion)

Elemental Ward: Bestow resistance to a selected element upon a target. Stamina is required for multiple targets or elements.

 

Complexity: 2

Duration: 2

Power: 2

Scope: 1 (for a single target/element)

DC: 21/14

Stamina: 0

 

Brafdyk's Mystic Succor (1STM): Conjures up bandages and gauze around the target's wounds, healing damage.

 

Complexity: 3

Duration: 1

Power: 2 (required for healing, or is it possible for this to be 1?)

Scope: 1

DC: 21/14

Stamina: 1

 

Resconjure Minor: Summons a small-to-medium simple non-unique inert object, which lasts for ~1 hour before deteriorating into nothingness. Stamina can be spent to permify the object.

 

Complexity: 2 (maybe?)

Duration: 2 (border before stamina is needed)

Power: 2

Scope: 1

DC: 21/14

Stamina: 0

 

Location: Gives information on the location of an object or person. The more familiar the caster is with the target, the more accurate the intel.

 

Complexity: 2

Duration: 1

Power: 1

Scope: 1

DC: 15/10

Stamina: 0

 

Lehun's Messenger (1STM): Allows the caster to send a brief verbal message to someone they are personally acquainted with, even across great distances. The recipient may make a brief reply.

 

Complexity: 2

Duration: 1

Power: 1

Scope: 1

DC: 15/10

Stamina: 0 (this makes me suspect that Complexity should be 3, though it doesn't seem like it from the description)

 

Shrewd Disappearance: Turns the caster invisible and dampens all sound they make.

 

Complexity: 2

Duration: 3

Power: 2

Scope: 1

DC: 24/16

Stamina: 1 (seems appropriate for such a powerful ability)

 

Calm: Instills a sense of peace and relaxation in the target, making them less wary and alert. Hostile characters affected are more likely to negotiate, and suffer a penalty to attack.

 

Complexity: 3

Duration: 2

Power: 2

Scope: 1

DC: 24/16

Stamina: 1

 

Fireball (1STM): Fires a large fireball at the target that detonates on impact, doing damage to it and anything in a moderate AoE.

 

Complexity: 2

Duration: 1

Power: 2

Scope: 3

DC: 24/16

Stamina: 1

 

Cyclone: Creates fierce winds about the caster, pushing and knocking down anyone near and potentially stunning them.

 

Complexity: 2

Duration: 1

Power: 2

Scope: 2

DC: 21/14

Stamina: 0

 

Telekinesis: Magically pushes and/or pulls a targeted object. Larger and/or more complex tasks may require stamina.

 

Complexity: 1

Duration: 1

Power: 1

Scope: 1

DC: 12/8 (really not sure about this one)

Stamina: 0

 

Teleport: Instantly relocate something from one place to another place. Larger objects require stamina. Teleporting living matter or something to somewhere out of the caster's LoS greatly reduces the odds of success. The spell can only transport something in its entirety.

 

Complexity: 2

Duration: 1

Power: 3 (maybe?)

Scope: 2 (for range, if I'm understanding it correctly)

DC: 24/16

Stamina: 1

 

Detrimentum: Disrupts the molecular structure of a targeted object or creature, potentially disintegrating it.

 

Complexity: 2

Duration: 1

Power: 2 (assuming medium attack power)

Scope: 1

DC: 18/12

Stamina: 0

 

Curing: Purges the recipient of toxins. Note that, depending on the severity of the ailment, stamina may be required.

 

Complexity: 2

Duration: 1

Power: 2

Scope: 1

DC: 18/12

Stamina: 0

 

Drain Life: Drain life force from a creature, replenishing your own. May require stamina to effect larger targets.

 

Complexity: 2

Duration: 1

Power: 2

Scope: 1

DC: 18/12

Stamina: 0

[Nioca]

That looks pretty good. Just a few notes:

 

Click to reveal..

Elemental Ward: Scope is purely a measure of effect size (or, in the case of teleportation and other point-to-point spells, distance). So adding additional elements would not cause Scope to rise (but it WOULD cause Power to rise).

 

Brafdyk's Mystic Succor: To answer your question, I don't see why not. The better question, though, would be "does the character really want to spend 1STM to heal 1-2HP?" So yeah, a power of 2 would probably be the default.

 

Resconjure Minor: Duration would be at least 3, by a strict reading of the spell. However, spells are flexible under this system, and there's nothing stopping the character from summoning the item for a half a minute to do whatever they want before it disappears, reducing it to 2.

 

Lehun's Messenger: Personally, I never quite understood why the spell had a stamina cost in the first case. That said, this is a point-to-point, so keep in mind that Scope rises with distance.

 

Fireball: Someone (probably me) goofed when moving this spell to the wiki. The original spell cost 2STM, and iirc, the AoE was wider than the 4x4 described; So Scope should probably be 4.

 

Telekinesis: That DC would be accurate... if the caster was making a fly zip around. Telekinesis is one spell which has a rather fluid DC; Complexity, Duration, and Power can go up depending on various factors (Power for heavier objects, Duration for the length of time the spell is maintained, Complexity for unusual or advanced manipulations)

 

Teleportation: Keep in mind that Complexity can spike to 4 if the caster moves the target to something outside the caster's LoS.

 

Curing: Curing spells don't function quite the same as normal spells. Instead, they derive their DC from the Complexity, Duration, Power, and Scope of the toxin it's trying to cure.

 

It's good to see that it produced reasonable DCs in someone else's hands. How difficult or easy was the process to do, and would you say you'd be able to do it mid-session without too much trouble?

 

=====

 

In other news, I'm planning to stat up some of my own characters (with spells and techniques) to show what characters look like under the new system. That post's coming soon!

[BJ Back From the Beyond]

Originally Posted By: Nioca

It's good to see that it produced reasonable DCs in someone else's hands. How difficult or easy was the process to do, and would you say you'd be able to do it mid-session without too much trouble?

By the time I got half way through the list, I was doing most of them without looking at the chart. I think with a little practice I could do it without trouble.

Originally Posted By: Nioca

Curing: Curing spells don't function quite the same as normal spells. Instead, they derive their DC from the Complexity, Duration, Power, and Scope of the toxin it's trying to cure.

I didn't see that noted anywhere in the wiki, so that's something that needs to be added.

On Scope and AoEs: I don't understand why the sizes for the AoEs are even numbers. Usually, an AoE is centered around a single space and then covers every space within a certain radius, thus giving you odd numbered AoEs like 3x3, 5x5, 7x7, etc. So why are all of the AoEs listen under Scope even numbers?

[Nioca]

Originally Posted By: B.J.Earles

Originally Posted By: Nioca

Curing: Curing spells don't function quite the same as normal spells. Instead, they derive their DC from the Complexity, Duration, Power, and Scope of the toxin it's trying to cure.

I didn't see that noted anywhere in the wiki, so that's something that needs to be added.

It's under QuadHack Evaluation Subsystem: Use in Determining Other DCs in the GM Core Rules.

Quote:

On Scope and AoEs: I don't understand why the sizes for the AoEs are even numbers. Usually, an AoE is centered around a single space and then covers every space within a certain radius, thus giving you odd numbered AoEs like 3x3, 5x5, 7x7, etc. So why are all of the AoEs listen under Scope even numbers?

Mostly because I'm rather attached to the whole "Order of Magnitude" thing I've got going, and if I switch it to odd numbers, I've either got to toss out the "OoM" entirely or the AoE sizes balloon drastically (and still wind up even). An AoE's center could still very easily be placed on the corner of a space for fine-tuning, and grid combat doesn't come up that often anyway, so I generally don't consider it a big issue.

=====

Oh, I promised characters, didn't I? Here's a bunch of my characters, statted out under QuadHack rules. I've included two versions here: The first is what the player would probably see and has a lot of the notes removed, and the second includes all the fun behind-the-scenes stuff. I didn't get into too much detail when it came to inventory and the like (and there's no backstories), but this should still give you guys an idea of what a finished character looks like.

Click to reveal.. (QuadHack Characters, Player Revision)

ETRIS TANNER The Flamekeeper Archmage (L5)
5 STR / 2 DEX / 5 PER
HP 16/16 | STM 15/15
DEF 12 / WIL 10 / REF 7
ARM: 1 / ENC: 0.5

Arcana - 6
Culture - 2
Deception - 3
Engineering - 2
Interrogation - 1

Traits: Human Racial Bonus (???)
Feats: Force & Deep Omnimagus, Force Magic Expertise, Casual Collateral

Inventory: Flamekeeper Light Combat Robes, 2x Shortsword, Tardrowse Powder

Familiar: Stygia the Winged Living Shortsword

FORCE MAGIC SPELLS
-Force Lance (DC10) - Fires a lance of force at the target, doing damage.
-Force Shield (DC14 1STM) - Creates a bubble of force around the target, deflecting objects and physical attack.
-Shockwave (DC16 1STM) - Creates a short-range shockwave that hits a small group of targets with bone-shattering force.
-Telekinesis (DC8) - Moves and manipulates an object through pressure and force.
-Illumine (DC12 1STM) - Creates a globe of light around the caster that illuminates his surroundings for 45 minutes.

DEEP MAGIC SPELLS
-Tanner's Hostile Divination (DC18) - Scans a target, picking up on its abilities and weakpoints. If the target has no notable weakpoints, the caster instead gets a +2 accuracy bonus versus the target.
-Elemancy (DC15) - Detects the presence of the elements, either in a specific target or within the presence of the caster. The wider the range, the harder the DC.
-Identify (DC21 1STM) - Tries to identify the purpose of a magical object or artifact.
-Lehun's Messenger (DC15) - Allows the caster to send a brief verbal message to an acquaintance. The recipient may make a brief reply.
-Detect Magic (DC12) - Detects magic, either on a target or around the caster.

=======================================================================================

AMADAN RAYTON The Alchemical Hunter (L9)
2 STR / 5 DEX / 9 PER
HP 10/10 | STM 15/15
DEF 15 / WIL 11 / REF 14
ARM: 1 / ENC: 1.0

Arcana - 4
Culture - 2
Engineering - 1
Forestry - 6
Stealth - 5
Custom: Alchemy - 4

Traits: Human Racial Bonus (???)
Feats: Liea's Divine Attention, Material Magic Adept, Missile Proficiency, Material Magic Expertise, Arcane Archery Magic Specialization

Inventory: Ricochet Bow w/ 20 Arrows, Leather Armor, Beetle-Carapace Shield, Athame, Prosthetic Gauntlet

ARCHERY TECHNIQUES
-Sniper's Garrote (DC18 2STM) - Takes careful aim and fires a shot at the target's throat. A successful hit will puncture the windpipe, preventing or strongly inhibiting the victim from casting spells, speaking, or using breath weapons until the arrow is removed and the wound healed.
-Truefire (DC16 FRAct 1STM) - Utilizes the character's skills, intuition, and perceptive abilities, enabling the character to lock onto and shoot a specified target even if the character (or player) can't tell where the target is located. The shot takes no concealment penalties.
-Arterial Break (DC16 1STM) - Attempts to strike and sever a major blood vessel within the target. If successful, the target will bleed, taking minor damage for several rounds or until the wound is healed
-Shooter's Stance (DC17 MAct) - The archer holds their current position and remains steady; so long as the character does not move from that spot, they gain a bonus to missile accuracy and can inflict additional damage on stronger rolls.

MATERIAL MAGIC
-Fire Arrow (DC17 MAct) - Transmutes an arrow into elemental flame, causing it to deal additional damage to a target and potentially cause it to ignite.
-Wavefracture (DC24 FRAct 3STM) This spell disintegrates EVERYTHING within a large cone of the caster. Any mundane material or objects caught in the fracture beam is completely vaporized; warded or magical objects hit have to make a save or also be disintegrated. Living (or necromantic) beings caught in the beam take heavy damage and, if killed, have their bodies and equipment reduced to component atoms.
-Ameliorate (DC12-DC14) - Repairs a damaged object. Note that it needs to have all the components of the object to repair it. It can also be used as a healing spell at a cost of 1STM.
-Basilisk's Gaze (DC16 1STM) - Turns a targeted object or creature to stone for a short time.

ALCHEMY
-Stamina Potion (DC18 2ING) - Recovers 4 STM.
-Aerolyzer (DC21A 2ING) - Renders a potion aerosol.
-Bloodlet Toxin (DC21 1ING) - Causes the victim to bleed from even minor wounds, resulting in additional damage from injuries.
-Kath Inhibitor (DC30 4ING) - Provides a strong boost to saves versus toxins and poisons for several hours, and reduces the effects of poisons present.

=======================================================================================

EVA ROE The Flamekeeper Mage (L7)
2 STR / 4 DEX / 8 PER
HP 10/10 | STM 15/15
DEF 14 / REF 12 / WIL 10

Arcana - 8
Citywise - 4
Culture - 5
Deception - 1

Traits: Elven Racial Bonus (???)
Feats: Force & Material Omnimagus, Force Magic Expertise, Material Magic Expertise, Magical Conservation

Inventory: Synergy Robes, Spellbooks

Familiar: Patches the Calico Cat

FORCE MAGIC
-Lightning Lance (DC10) - Fires a bolt of lightning at a target. [Normal Attack Spell]
-Ball Lightning Mk.VI (DC22 FRAct 2STM) - Fires a sphere of lightning at a targeted enemy or area; upon impact, the sphere fractures into lances of lightning, striking all hostiles within AoE. The spell is capable of telling friend from foe.
-Roe's Skydance (DC24L FRAct 2STM) - Enables the caster to fly for 30 minutes. Turbulent weather or a strong hit from a foe may require saves to avoid losing altitude or falling, and the caster is slowed down by excess weight.
-Prismatic Armor (DC17 MAct) - Creates a barrier around the recipient that protects against magical spells.

MATERIAL MAGIC
-Resconjure (DC10) - Summons a non-unique non-magical object, which disintegrates after some time has passed. The DC depends on the object.
-Restorative Cocoon (DC18 FRAct 1STM) - Creates a cocoon of bandages, gauze, and healing goo around the target's body, healing major damage.
-Energetic Panther (DC20 2STM) - Summons forth a large panther imbued with the power of a specific type of energy.
-Righteous Bulwark (DC14) - Creates a temporary bulwark, nearly weightless bulwark around the target, boosting their Armor score.

=======================================================================================

MAL TRAVERS The Hero (L11)
AP 15 / XP 26 / FT 6
9 STR / 8 DEX / 1 PER
HP 24/24 | STM 15/15
DEF 18+4 / REF 9 / WIL 10
ARM: 3 / ENC: 3.0

Arcana - 9
Engineering - 3
Forestry - 5
Interrogation - 2
Medicine - 5
Sleight - 2

Traits: Lacewing Racial Bonus (???), Misty Escape (FRAct 3STM; Turn into mist, becoming immune to physical damage and capable of slipping through cracks/tight spaces)
Feats: Melee Proficiency, Armor Proficiency, Heroic Valor, Go the Distance, Sword Weapon Specialization, Toughness

Inventory: Chain Mail, Arming Sword, Ignition Blade, Kite Shield, Grappling Hook, First Aid Kit (10 Charges), Healing Tonic

SWORD TECHNIQUES
-Wings of Fury (DC14) - Uses lacewing wings to fling oneself to new heights, hitting an airborne enemy or clearing obstacles.
-Blitz Barrage (DC14 1STM) - Strikes a flurry of blows, doing additional damage and potentially stunning the enemy.
-Crimson Confiscation (DC14 1STM) - Strikes a blow against an enemy that also tosses a targeted object to the wielder.
-Talon Defense (DC26 3STM FRAct) - Steps into a defensive stance, heavily boosting defense. Any melee attacks targeting the wielder that miss will riposte back on the attacker, and missile attacks that miss potentially hit someone else in their flightpath.
-Impregnable Barrier (DC17 MAct) - Sets the wielder's shield to block a specific target, providing a bonus to ARM against that target.

=======================================================================================

SARELIM SILVERWIND The Neophyte Shapeshifter (L4)
3 STR / 5 DEX / 3 PER
HP 12/12 | STM 15/15
DEF 15+2 / REF 8 / WIL 6

Arcana - 1
Citywise - 2
Deception - 2
Sleight - 2
Stealth - 5

Traits: Unnatural-Born Shapeshifter
Feats: Material Magic Adept, Material Magic Expertise

Inventory: Metallic Mantle, 10x Throwing Knives, Climbing Equipment

MELEE TECHNIQUES
-Disarm (DC15) - Disarms the enemy of their weapon. If the character is not wielding a weapon, the character will take it as their own.
-Cheap Shot (DC18) - Deliberately strikes at a painful spot on the target's body, stunning them for 1 round.

THROWN TECHNIQUES
-Shoot from the Shadows (DC18 Stealth 1STM) - Times an attack so that enemies cannot see where it came from, avoiding breaking concealment.
-Interrupting Shot (DC21) - Lands a strike that interrupts a target's ongoing action, inflicting a penalty on it.

SHAPESHIFTING SPELLS
-Canis Morph (DC18 FRAct 2STM) – Shapeshifts into the form of a domesticated black dog. While in this form, the caster gains powerful senses of hearing and smell, and gains a small bonus to speed. However, combat damage is penalized in this form, and his small size makes him more prone to damage. [+1Hearing/Scent Perception, +1SPD, -1WeapDmg, -1ARM]
-Feature Alteration (DC12) - Alters the caster's features. More advanced alterations have a higher DC.
-Morphspace (DC16 FRAct 1STM) - This spell enables the character to access Morphspace items at any time, and also to store new ones in morphspace even when not morphed.
-Biospout (DC20 3STM) - Creates a small biospout on a specified part of the body, which fills itself with either an incendiary or corrosive substance. As an Thrown attack, the caster can eject the substance at short ranges. Lasts for roughly 30 minutes.


=======================================================================================

VORIA GREY AMERESTAU The Starship Engineer (L1)
3 STR / 2 DEX / 3 PER
HP 12/12 | STM 15/15
DEF 12 / REF 5 / WIL 6
ARM: 1 / ENC: 0.5

Driving - 1
Electronics - 2
Engineering - 3

Feats: Gadgeteer Genius

Inventory: Laser Pistol, Engineer's Uniform, Engineering Equipment, Multi-Function Solar Watch

TECHNIQUES
-Head Shot (DC21 1STM) - Fires a shot at the target's head, dealing additional damage and bypassing armor.
-Arm Shot (DC18) - Fires a shot at the target's arm, reducing their ability to attack for a short time.
-Leg Shot (DC18) - Fires a shot at the target's leg, reducing their speed for a short time.
-Overcharge (DC21 Engineering) - Tinkers with an energy weapon and causes it to hold an increased charge, enabling it to do additional damage for a short time.

=======================================================================================

DEVIN MCCLOUD The Rookie Cop (L5)
4 STR / 2 DEX / 6 PER
HP 14/14 | STM 15/15
DEF 12 / REF 8 / WIL 10
ARM 1 / ENC 0.5

Citywise - 3
Culture - 1
Driving - 4
Engineering - 1
Interrogation - 2

Feats: Military Training, Heroic Valor, Parting Shot

Inventory: SIG P226, Submachine Gun, Kevlar Vest, Mirror Shades

TECHNIQUES
-Head Shot (DC14 1STM) - Fires a shot at the target's head, dealing additional damage and bypassing armor.
-Arm Shot (DC12) - Fires a shot at the target's arm, reducing their ability to attack for a short time.
-Leg Shot (DC12) - Fires a shot at the target's leg, reducing their speed for a short time.
-Spray and Pray (DC14 1STM) - Fires a spray of bullets, hitting everyone within a moderate AoE of the target.

Click to reveal.. (QuadHack Characters, GM Revision)

ETRIS TANNER The Flamekeeper Archmage (L5)
5 STR / 2 DEX / 5 PER
HP 16/16 | STM 15/15
DEF 12 / WIL 10 / REF 7
ARM: 1 / ENC: 0.5

Arcana - 6
Culture - 2
Deception - 3
Engineering - 2
Interrogation - 1

Traits: Human Racial Bonus (???)
Feats: Force & Deep Omnimagus (Adept in 2 circles with -2 penalty), Force Magic Expertise, Casual Collateral (Leftover damage transfers to next valid target)

Inventory: Flamekeeper Light Combat Robes (Light Armor), 2x Shortsword (Normal Medium Weapons 5Dmg), Tardrowse Powder (Light Thrown Weapon, 3Dmg STM)

Familiar: Stygia the Winged Living Shortsword (L2 4/2/1 14HP Special: Can be used as a shortsword with +1HIT)

FORCE MAGIC SPELLS
-Force Lance (C1 D1 P2 S1 x2 = DC10P 75%) - Fires a lance of force at the target, doing damage. [Normal Attack Spell]
-Force Shield (C1 D2 P3 S1 x2 = DC14L 1STM 55%) - Creates a bubble of force around the target, deflecting objects and physical attack. [+4DEF]
-Shockwave (C2 D1 P2 S3 x2 = DC16D 1STM 30%) - Creates a short-range shockwave that hits a small group of targets with bone-shattering force. [Normal Attack Spell, 16-square AoE]
-Telekinesis (C1 D1 P1 S1 x2 = DC8 85%) - Moves and manipulates an object through pressure and force.
-Illumine (C1 D3 P1 S1 x2 = DC12L 1STM 65%) - Creates a globe of light around the caster that illuminates his surroundings for 45 minutes.

DEEP MAGIC SPELLS
-Tanner's Hostile Divination (C2 D1 P2 S1 x3 = DC18L 35%) - Scans a target, picking up on its abilities and weakpoints. If the target has no notable weakpoints, the caster instead gets a +2 accuracy bonus versus the target.
-Elemancy (C2 D1 P1 S1 x3 = DC15L 50%) - Detects the presence of the elements, either in a specific target or within the presence of the caster. The wider the range, the harder the DC.
-Identify (C3 D1 P2 S1 x3 = DC21L 1STM 20%) - Tries to identify the purpose of a magical object or artifact.
-Lehun's Messenger (C2 D1 P1 S1 x3 = DC15L 50%) - Allows the caster to send a brief verbal message to an acquaintance. The recipient may make a brief reply.
-Detect Magic (C1 D1 P1 S1 x3 = DC12L 35%) - Detects magic, either on a target or around the caster.

=======================================================================================

AMADAN RAYTON The Alchemical Hunter (L9)
2 STR / 5 DEX / 9 PER
HP 10/10 | STM 15/15
DEF 15 / WIL 11 / REF 14
ARM: 1 / ENC: 1.0

Arcana - 4
Culture - 2
Engineering - 1
Forestry - 6
Stealth - 5
Custom: Alchemy - 4

Traits: Human Racial Bonus (???)
Feats: Liea's Divine Attention (1PD call on Liea's Assistance), Material Magic Adept, Missile Proficiency, Material Magic Expertise, Arcane Archery Magic Specialization (+4 Spellcasting, +1 Effect)

Inventory: Ricochet Bow w/ 20 Arrows (Medium Missile Weapon, +1 Accuracy), Leather Armor (Light Armor), Beetle-Carapace Shield (Light Shield, +1DEF/REF versus Magical Attack), Athame (Light Weapon), Prosthetic Gauntlet

ARCHERY TECHNIQUES
-Sniper's Garrote (C3 D2 P3 S1 x2 = DC18P 2STM 55%) - Takes careful aim and fires a shot at the target's throat. A successful hit will puncture the windpipe, preventing or strongly inhibiting the victim from casting spells, speaking, or using breath weapons until the arrow is removed and the wound healed.
-Truefire (C4 D1 P2 S1 x2 = DC16P FRAct 1STM 45%) - Utilizes the character's skills, intuition, and perceptive abilities, enabling the character to lock onto and shoot a specified target even if the character (or player) can't tell where the target is located. The shot takes no concealment penalties.
-Arterial Break (C2 D2 P3 S1 x2 = DC16P 1STM 45%) - Attempts to strike and sever a major blood vessel within the target. If successful, the target will bleed, taking minor damage for several rounds or until the wound is healed
-Shooter's Stance (C1 D2 P2 S1 x2 +5MAct = DC17L MAct 40%) - The archer holds their current position and remains steady; so long as the character does not move from that spot, they gain a bonus to missile accuracy and can inflict additional damage on stronger rolls.

MATERIAL MAGIC
-Fire Arrow (C2 D1 P2 S1 x2 +5MAct = DC17P MAct 70%) - Transmutes an arrow into elemental flame, causing it to deal additional damage to a target and potentially cause it to ignite.
-Wavefracture (C2 D1 P5 S4 x2 = DC24D FRAct 3STM 5%) This spell disintegrates EVERYTHING within a large cone of the caster. Any mundane material or objects caught in the fracture beam is completely vaporized; warded or magical objects hit have to make a save or also be disintegrated. Living (or necromantic) beings caught in the beam take heavy damage and, if killed, have their bodies and equipment reduced to component atoms. [Light Artillery Attack]
-Ameliorate (C2 D1 P2 S1 x2 = DC12L 85% | C3 D1 P2 S1 x2 = DC14L 1STM 75%) - Repairs a damaged object. Note that it needs to have all the components of the object to repair it. It can also be used as a healing spell at a cost of 1STM. [+4 Heal]
-Basilisk's Gaze (C2 D2 P3 S1 x2 = DC16P 1STM 45%) - Turns a targeted object or creature to stone for a short time.

ALCHEMY
-Stamina Potion (C1 D1 P3 S1 x3 = DC18A 2ING 30%) - Recovers 4 STM.
-Aerolyzer (C2 D1 P1 S3 x3 = DC21A 2ING 15%) - Renders a potion aerosol.
-Bloodlet Toxin (C2 D2 P2 S1 x3 = DC21A 1ING 15%) - Causes the victim to bleed from even minor wounds, resulting in additional damage from injuries.
-Kath Inhibitor (C3 D3 P3 S1 x3 = DC30A 4ING) - Provides a strong boost to saves versus toxins and poisons for several hours, and reduces the effects of poisons present.

=======================================================================================

EVA ROE The Flamekeeper Mage (L7)
2 STR / 4 DEX / 8 PER
HP 10/10 | STM 15/15
DEF 14 / REF 12 / WIL 10

Arcana - 8
Citywise - 4
Culture - 5
Deception - 1

Traits: Elven Racial Bonus (???)
Feats: Force & Material Omnimagus (Adept in 2 circles with -2 penalty), Force Magic Expertise, Material Magic Expertise, Magical Conservation (-1STMCost)

Inventory: Synergy Robes (+1 Positive Spell Effects on Caster, -1 Negative Spell Effects on Caster), Spellbooks

Familiar: Patches the Calico Cat (L3 1/3/4 8HP)

FORCE MAGIC
-Lightning Lance (C1 D1 P2 S1 x2 = DC10P 90%) - Fires a bolt of lightning at a target. [Normal Attack Spell]
-Ball Lightning Mk.VI (C4 D1 P3 S3 x2 = DC22P FRAct 2STM 30%) - Fires a sphere of lightning at a targeted enemy or area; upon impact, the sphere fractures into lances of lightning, striking all hostiles within AoE. The spell is capable of telling friend from foe. [Heavy Attack Spell; 4x4 AoE; Selective Targeting]
-Roe's Skydance (C4 D3 P4 S1 x2 = DC24L FRAct 2STM 15%) - Enables the caster to fly for 30 minutes. Turbulent weather or a strong hit from a foe may require saves to avoid losing altitude or falling, and the caster is slowed down by excess weight.
-Prismatic Armor (C1 D2 P2 S1 x2 = DC17L MAct 50%) - Creates a barrier around the recipient that protects against magical spells. [+2DEF vs. Magic]

MATERIAL MAGIC
-Resconjure (C1 D1 P2 S1 x2 = DC10L 85%) - Summons a non-unique non-magical object, which disintegrates after some time has passed. The DC depends on the object.
-Restorative Cocoon (C3 D1 P4 S1 x2 = DC18L FRAct 1STM 45%) - Creates a cocoon of bandages, gauze, and healing goo around the target's body, healing major damage. [Heal 16]
-Energetic Panther (C3 D3 P3 S1 x2 = DC20L 2STM 35%) - Summons forth a large panther imbued with the power of a specific type of energy.
-Righteous Bulwark (C2 D2 P2 S1 x2 = DC14L 65%) - Creates a temporary bulwark, nearly weightless bulwark around the target, boosting their Armor score. [+1ARM]

=======================================================================================

MAL TRAVERS The Hero (L11)
AP 15 / XP 26 / FT 6
9 STR / 8 DEX / 1 PER
HP 24/24 | STM 15/15
DEF 18+4 / REF 9 / WIL 10
ARM: 3 / ENC: 3.0

Arcana - 9
Engineering - 3
Forestry - 5
Interrogation - 2
Medicine - 5
Sleight - 2

Traits: Lacewing Racial Bonus (???), Misty Escape (FRAct 3STM; Turn into mist, becoming immune to physical damage and capable of slipping through cracks/tight spaces)
Feats: Melee Proficiency, Armor Proficiency (-1.5ENCUM, -1SPDPenalty), Heroic Valor (+2 Bonus to saving Sophonts, +4 when saving Innocents), Go the Distance (2STM to stabilize when dying, 2STM to recover at 1HP when disabled), Sword Weapon Specialization (+1Dmg, +2HIT), Toughness (+1ARM)

Inventory: Chain Mail (Medium Armor), Arming Sword (Medium Melee Weapon 5+1Dmg), Ignition Blade (Heavy Melee Weapon 6+1Dmg, deals 2 fire damage to target and wielder when active), Kite Shield (Heavy Shield), Grappling Hook (Medium Improvised Thrown Weapon 3Dmg), First Aid Kit (10 Charges), Healing Tonic (+6HP)

SWORD TECHNIQUES
-Wings of Fury (C2 D1 P2 S2 x2 = DC14S 75%) - Uses lacewing wings to fling oneself to new heights, hitting an airborne enemy or clearing obstacles.
-Blitz Barrage (C1 D2 P3 S1 x2 = DC14 1STM 75%) - Strikes a flurry of blows, doing additional damage and potentially stunning the enemy. [+1Dmg, Stun]
-Crimson Confiscation (C3 D1 P2 S1 x2 = DC14 1STM 75%) - Strikes a blow against an enemy that also tosses a targeted object to the wielder.
-Talon Defense (C4 D2 P4 S3 x2 = DC26 3STM FRAct 15%) - Steps into a defensive stance, heavily boosting defense. Any melee attacks targeting the wielder that miss will riposte back on the attacker, and missile attacks that miss potentially hit someone else in their flightpath. [+4DEF, RiposteMisses]
-Impregnable Barrier (C1 D2 P2 S1 x2 +5MAct = DC17 MAct 60%) - Sets the wielder's shield to block a specific target, providing a bonus to ARM against that target. [+1ARM]

=======================================================================================

SARELIM SILVERWIND The Neophyte Shapeshifter (L4)
3 STR / 5 DEX / 3 PER
HP 12/12 | STM 15/15
DEF 15+2 / REF 8 / WIL 6

Arcana - 1
Citywise - 2
Deception - 2
Sleight - 2
Stealth - 5

Traits: Unnatural-Born Shapeshifter (Sustainable morphs automatically permanent, Revert as Free, Can only take Shapeshifting spells)
Feats: Material Magic Adept, Material Magic Expertise

Inventory: Metallic Mantle (+2AC, -2DRvsLightning), 10x Throwing Knives (Light Thrown Weapon 3Dmg), Climbing Equipment

MELEE TECHNIQUES
-Disarm (C1 D1 P2 S1 x3 = DC15S 40%) - Disarms the enemy of their weapon. If the character is not wielding a weapon, the character will take it as their own.
-Cheap Shot (C1 D2 P2 S1 x3 = DC18S 25%) - Deliberately strikes at a painful spot on the target's body, stunning them for 1 round.

THROWN TECHNIQUES
-Shoot from the Shadows (C3 D1 P1 S1 x3 = DC18 Stealth 1STM 35%) - Times an attack so that enemies cannot see where it came from, avoiding breaking concealment.
-Interrupting Shot (C2 D2 P2 S1 x3 = DC21D 20%) - Lands a strike that interrupts a target's ongoing action, inflicting a penalty on it.

SHAPESHIFTING SPELLS
-Canis Morph (C4 D1 P3 S1 x2 = DC18L FRAct 2STM 30%) – Shapeshifts into the form of a domesticated black dog. While in this form, the caster gains powerful senses of hearing and smell, and gains a small bonus to speed. However, combat damage is penalized in this form, and his small size makes him more prone to damage. [+1Hearing/Scent Perception, +1SPD, -1WeapDmg, -1ARM]
-Feature Alteration (C2 D1 P2 S1 x2 = DC12L 60%) - Alters the caster's features. More advanced alterations have a higher DC.
-Morphspace (C4 D1 P2 S1 x2 = DC16L FRAct 1STM 40%) - This spell enables the character to access Morphspace items at any time, and also to store new ones in morphspace even when not morphed.
-Biospout (C3 D3 P3 S1 x2 = DC20L 3STM 30%) - Creates a small biospout on a specified part of the body, which fills itself with either an incendiary or corrosive substance. As an Thrown attack, the caster can eject the substance at short ranges. Lasts for roughly 30 minutes.


=======================================================================================

VORIA GREY AMERESTAU The Starship Engineer (L1)
3 STR / 2 DEX / 3 PER
HP 12/12 | STM 15/15
DEF 12 / REF 5 / WIL 6
ARM: 1 / ENC: 0.5

Driving - 1
Electronics - 2
Engineering - 3

Feats: Gadgeteer Genius (+4 when Creating/Repairing/Modifying Gadgets)

Inventory: Laser Pistol (Light Missile Weapon 3Dmg), Engineer's Uniform (Light Armor, +1vsHeat), Engineering Equipment, Multi-Function Solar Watch

TECHNIQUES
-Head Shot (C2 D1 P3 S1 x3 = DC21P 1STM 10%) - Fires a shot at the target's head, dealing additional damage and bypassing armor.
-Arm Shot (C1 D2 P2 S1 x3 = DC18P 25%) - Fires a shot at the target's arm, reducing their ability to attack for a short time.
-Leg Shot (C1 D2 P2 S1 x3 = DC18P 25%) - Fires a shot at the target's leg, reducing their speed for a short time.
-Overcharge (C2 D2 P2 S1 x3 = DC21 Engineering 10%) - Tinkers with an energy weapon and causes it to hold an increased charge, enabling it to do additional damage for a short time.

=======================================================================================

DEVIN MCCLOUD The Rookie Cop (L5)
4 STR / 2 DEX / 6 PER
HP 14/14 | STM 15/15
DEF 12 / REF 8 / WIL 10
ARM 1 / ENC 0.5

Citywise - 3
Culture - 1
Driving - 4
Engineering - 1
Interrogation - 2

Feats: Military Training (-3XP, Proficiency in Light/Medium/Heavy Weapons), Heroic Valor (+2 Bonus to saving Sophonts, +4 when saving Innocents), Parting Shot (One AoO vs. Foe when dropped to/below 0)

Inventory: SIG P226 (Light Missile Weapon 3Dmg), Submachine Gun (Medium Missile Weapon 4Dmg), Kevlar Vest (Light Armor), Mirror Shades

TECHNIQUES
-Head Shot (C2 D1 P3 S1 x2 = DC14P 1STM 60%) - Fires a shot at the target's head, dealing additional damage and bypassing armor.
-Arm Shot (C1 D2 P2 S1 x2 = DC12P 70%) - Fires a shot at the target's arm, reducing their ability to attack for a short time.
-Leg Shot (C1 D2 P2 S1 x2 = DC12P 70%) - Fires a shot at the target's leg, reducing their speed for a short time.
-Spray and Pray (C2 D1 P1 S3 x2 = DC14P 1STM 60%) - Fires a spray of bullets, hitting everyone within a moderate AoE of the target.

[Nioca]

Oh, also (and in a separate post, because the board software was having a lesser conniption with the size of the last one), I've added a bit of stuff on Saves to the QuadHack GM Core. Also, in case it's passed unnoticed, there's a list of feats up as well, though the listed feats are subject to further change. If you've got an idea for a feat, by all means, let me know.

 

EDIT: But wait! There's more! Out of boredom, I also decided to do Epic Spells in QuadHack. These are the results:

Click to reveal.. (Epic Spells)

MARIONA'S GRACE (ABJU/LIFE/SPIRIT) - A powerful spell rumored to have been used during the battles with Chamulsep, this spell gives a single target a powerful protective aura that renders one completely immune to the effects of hostile life magic or undead corruption for 12 hours.

(C3 D4 P5 S1 = DC26-39 4STM FRAct)

[Necrotic Immunity, 12 Hours]

 

XIAN BOMBARDMENT (CONJ/MATERI) - Bombards target with large anvil. All conjured anvils can be dispelled afterward.

(C2 D3 P5 S1 = DC22-33 3STM FRAct)

[Light Artillery Attack Spell, Anvil Remains 12 hours]

 

IKAT'IKA'S FRIEND IN NEED (CONJ/MATERI) - Summons a rare and powerful creature trained to fight for the caster. The creature fights for several rounds of combat before disappearing.

(C3 D2 P5 S1 = DC22-33 3STM FRAct)

[Massive Summon]

 

EKHART'S PERFECT PREDICTIONS (DIV/DEEP) - Causes the caster to see all outcomes of given actions for a short while, providing a +6 to all rolls, defenses, and saves.

(C5 D3 P5 S1 = DC28-42 5STM FRAct)

[+6 All Rolls, 30 Minutes]

 

IMMACULATE SHIFT OF DREAMS (ENCH/DEEP/SPIRIT) - Casts any number of attacking creatures into a shadowy nightmare. They remain physically present, but cower in terror helplessly unless they can save against the spell. This spell affects a 30-foot line on the battlefield, and any creatures that cross it are affected by the spell. The line itself persists for 2 rounds.

(C4 D2 P4 S2 = DC24-36 2STM FRAct)

 

THE AGENCY OF MOLTEN LINES (EVOC/FORCE) - Strands of elemental fire are cast about the battlefield at random. Any creature that passes through the fire is ensnared, and the line constricts in to attack it.

(C3 D2 P3 S3 = DC22-33 3STM)

[Normal Attack Spell, Grapples Enemies]

 

SUDDEN WINTER (EVO/FORCE) - Creates a tempest of snow and ice covering a large AoE. Anyone inside takes damage from the cold and will be tossed about by the wind. Particularly strong castings may freeze objects and slow down enemies.

(C3 D2 P3 S4 = DC24-36 3STM FRAct)

[Normal Attack w/ Slowing]

 

ILIANDIB'S SINEWY ASCENT (TRAN/MATERI) - All targets gain sprout a pair of feathered wings (this does not conflict with armor, as the wings are not physical), and gain the ability to fly for 12 hours.

(Cast on Single: C1 D4 P4 S1 = DC20-30 2STM FRAct)

(Cast on Four: C3 D4 P4 S2 = DC26-39 3STM FRAct)

(Cast on Party/Nine: C3 D4 P4 S3 = DC28-42 4STM FRAct)

[Flight on targets, 12 hours]

 

EGUES-TOL'S DESPICABLE PALL (VITA/LIFE/SPIRIT) - A dark fog forms on the battlefield, giving Perception checks a -5 penalty. All attack rolls also suffer a -2 penalty within the cloud. Creatures who spend a turn in the fog lose 1 stamina. The caster is unaffected.

(C4 D2 P4 S5 = DC30-45 4STM FRAct)

[-5 Perception, -2 Attacks, 1STMDmgOngoing, 6 Rounds, 16x16 AoE]

 

LA-YIM'S LIFEBLOOD (VITA/LIFE/SPIRIT) - Heals all injuries, and automatically saves against all conditions currently effecting the target.

(C4 D1 P6 S1 = DC36 3STM)

[Full Heal, Full Cure]

 

BREATH OF LIFE (VITA/LIFE/SPIRIT) - Brings a recently-deceased character back to life at 1HP. The body must be relatively intact for this spell to function.

(C5 D1 P5 S1 = DC24-36 4STM)

[Resurrect at 1HP]

 

LEHUN'S INSTANT SERVITOR (VITA/LIFE/SPIRIT): This spell turns a newly-dead creature as an undead servant. This servant will obey all commands, and the caster will be able to see and hear whatever it sees/hears. If the servant was intelligent in life, it will retain whatever skills and knowledge it had. The same creature cannot be animated twice. The caster must remain awake to maintain the servant, so it will return to death when he rests. DC depends on the strength of the target.

(C3 D4 P3 S1 = MinDC22-33 3STM)

[Rowen]

I haven't seen this in another thread, but it reminded me of aimhack. Tabletop Forge

[Lilith]

On the topic of tabletop RPG kickstarters, Dungeon World is doing very well indeed. It's already met its main funding goal, but you can still donate to further support the project and receive backer rewards. For a contribution of only $5 you can get the full rules in PDF form when they're released, plus exclusive supplements available only to backers. I've looked at pre-release versions of the rules and they definitely put a new spin on the D&D-style party-based fantasy RPG, with a well-written set of GM guidelines that codify what the GM is supposed to do while providing the freedom to do it.

 

Alternatively, if fighting giant insects in powered armour sounds more like your thing, Last Stand is offering a rules PDF to backers for $10.