Hatchling Cockatrice Alorael at Large Posted March 10, 2009 Share Posted March 10, 2009 Combat isn't all that bugged in BoE. Unbalanced, maybe, except that designers who take that into account make scenarios that are balanced in ways that are surprising and unexpected to anyone unfamiliar with the engine's built-in oddities. Avernum and Exile are both absolutely standard in graphics and gameplay for their type, which is the same type. It's a type with room for more than one exact look and feel as standard. —Alorael, who doesn't mean that as any dismissal of the games. They're good! Defending them as nonstandard doesn't really help, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rotghroth Rhapsody The Lurker Posted March 11, 2009 Share Posted March 11, 2009 Originally Posted By: Sum Manus Nigrum Combat isn't all that bugged in BoE. Riiiight. There are very few fatal bugs, other than the blue screen of death that was recently mentioned, but seriously. There are many things that don't work as intended when fighting. -Blessing trick : Blessing enough makes you invulnerable to physical attacks. -Undead and Demons pierce through armor (or most of the armor, anyway). -"Stacking" exploding arrows : The last arrow will just blow up without doing any damage. -Invulnerable monsters : Are not immune to physical and Death Touch attacks. They are immune to most spells, but oddly enough, Ravage Spirit will still do 1 damage to invulnerable Demons. -End Combat Trick : Monsters act much more slowly in town mode, and they are also likely to move *without attacking* for no apparent reason. It is possible to have a monster act more than once per turn in town mode, but it would have to be very, very fast. Ending combat early tends to make monsters much less frightening. -Causes Fear weapons : Are ridiculously powerful. You can make the Nightmare Guardian in Revenge run away after a few hits, and it should be said that the Nightmare Guardian had a very high amount of courage. -Artificial Stupidity : As I mentioned in a Lyceum thread, monsters are *supposed* to go around things that block their way, but in quite a few cases, they don't. Sometimes it'll be possible to shoot at enemies that are behind a bunch or rocks or a table without having to worry about retaliation. There's more, but you get the idea. The blessing trick is especially annoying for designers, because it makes most melee monsters very weak unless you're willing to take out the player's blessing spells (as Thuryl did) or have the monsters use special curse spells (like Skirn and the Seraphim, if I remember correctly). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrulous Glaahk Neossokrass Posted March 22, 2009 Share Posted March 22, 2009 I enjoy all of the gamess quite a lot. Not one, in my opinion, desservess a failing mark. However, Avernum 2 ssticks out mosst profoundly in my mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curious Artila Gnaeus Pompeius Posted March 22, 2009 Share Posted March 22, 2009 Haha. Anybody else here find it humourously ironic that for all the A3 bashing in this thread, A3 is currently leading in both the categories specified? Not all irony is funny, but this is most amusing. And it does say something about the quality of the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrulous Glaahk Kyronea Posted March 22, 2009 Share Posted March 22, 2009 That's generally because A3 is bashed due to its plot mainly, and not the gameplay. As a game A3 is fantastic with allowing wonderful amounts of freedom without causing ease of gameplay as A1 could. As a plot, it doesn't have as much as it could. There are loads of ways it could have been refined. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Slawbug Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 That's not really true, at least not here. A3 is frequently bashed in the same breath as E3 is praised, so it's not about the plot. The most cited issue is atmosphere and presentation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrulous Glaahk Kyronea Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 Originally Posted By: The Not-So-Great Potato That's not really true, at least not here. A3 is frequently bashed in the same breath as E3 is praised, so it's not about the plot. The most cited issue is atmosphere and presentation. I'm not sure exactly how that differs between Avernum III and Exile III, unless you're talking about something like mountains versus sheer cliff walls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garrulous Glaahk Untamed Banana Slug Posted May 17, 2009 Share Posted May 17, 2009 Originally Posted By: Quite the Yahoo Golgolath, I think you stepped in a little deep here. You're addressing matters of preference as if your own opinion is going to be shared by everyone. You're forgetting that he was responding to another member's condemnation of Avernum 3's engine. And he makes some good points. Personally I prefer the Exile engine to the Avernum engine, but there are some advantages that Avernum offers over Exile, it's just a matter of priorities. One thing in particular which caught my eye was this: Quote: Furthermore, one of the greatest things about the Avernum engine is the ability to fight out of combat mode, which Exile sorely lacks. Sure, you can only use one character, and it leaves the other ones open, but the effect can't be overstated. It dramatically reduces the tedium of Combat Mode->Smack one mob->Normal mode, and makes what could be a chore into a treat instead. Thuryl passes the above off as a short attention span. I don't. Having to continually enter combat mode to fight enemies that were vastly inferior to you was a pain in the ass. It wasn't just a waste of time, it broke the flow of the game and added to the tedium. Giving the player the option to kill weak enemies in town mode is an obvious advantage of Avernum over Exile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Slawbug Posted May 17, 2009 Share Posted May 17, 2009 Originally Posted By: Untamed Banana Slug You're forgetting that he was responding to another member's condemnation of Avernum 3's engine. To be fair, the post he was responding to (by Thuryl) also stated preference as if it was fact. That doesn't change the fact that Golgoloth did as well. I would imagine I capped on Golgolath's post because it presented opinion as fact in a more extensive and less obvious way. However, I don't really remember, because you are replying to a post from a month and a half ago, and which has over a page of replies after it in the thread, which has itself been dormant for a month... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatchling Cockatrice Lilith Posted May 17, 2009 Share Posted May 17, 2009 Originally Posted By: Quite the Yahoo To be fair, the post he was responding to (by Thuryl) also stated preference as if it was fact. That doesn't change the fact that Golgoloth did as well. I would imagine I capped on Golgolath's post because it presented opinion as fact in a more extensive and less obvious way. Also, when I do it you know I'm doing it on purpose to get a rise out of people. It worked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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