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Celtic Minstrel Celtic Minstrel

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Posted 11 November 2016 - 09:16 AM #71 Exile Remaster

View PostThaluikhain, on 11 November 2016 - 05:04 AM, said:

Really?  There'd been discussion of that sort of thing in the past, and usually dismissed as too much work, though I think it was usually assumed to be a scratch built BoE scenario.
Well, I think his process is some kinda of automated E3 -> BoE conversion. It certainly wouldn't be perfect, and much touch-up would be needed. I don't know how much; at worst it might be as much as reimplementing every little special encounter. (I don't remember if they were hard-coded or if E3 already had a prototype of BoE's special node system.)

View PostThaluikhain, on 11 November 2016 - 05:04 AM, said:

In any case, even forgoing E3, it'd allow people to take E3 towns and put them in BoE scenarios.  Some towns from E3 got made into a BoE format, but not many IIRC.
I thought Ishad Nha already completed that, actually - a terrain-only conversion of the entire E3 game. If I recall correctly, he could have converted NPCs too but was asked not to.
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Posted 11 November 2016 - 07:26 PM #72 Exile Remaster

View PostCeltic Minstrel, on 11 November 2016 - 09:16 AM, said:

I thought Ishad Nha already completed that, actually - a terrain-only conversion of the entire E3 game. If I recall correctly, he could have converted NPCs too but was asked not to.

Really?  Didn't know about that.

In any case, one thing I'd be very interested in is the (presumably inevitable) variants of E3 that could get made.   There were 3 possibilities going for who was behind everything, could rewrite the ending to make it one of the other two and keep it a surprise, or even randomise it.

Bit ambitious, though, OTOH, replacing the slimes with another type of monster and putting them in new dungeons, say, shouldn't be that hard

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Posted 12 November 2016 - 04:00 AM #73 Exile Remaster

But I like slimes. :( I even made a red one which is included with OBoE to round out the set.
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Posted 12 November 2016 - 04:20 AM #74 Exile Remaster

Is it called "Red Slime"?

I mention the slimes in that they seem to be the plague with the least "presence" and would be easiest to replace.

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Posted 12 November 2016 - 05:30 AM #75 Exile Remaster

No, CRIMSON slime. I had to go with the naming theme of not using primary and secondary color names, but rather, shades. There's no default (blue shade) slime but the graphic is there, it's used for ice slimes and ice puddings.
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Posted 13 November 2016 - 06:21 AM #76 Exile Remaster

View PostThe Almighty Doer of Stuff, on 12 November 2016 - 05:30 AM, said:

No, CRIMSON slime. I had to go with the naming theme of not using primary and secondary color names, but rather, shades.

Was wondering about that, yeah.

As an aside, I always thought the best bit about the slimes was that room where slimes are trying to merge (The Thing style) with other creatures.  That was never really explained why or how that what happening, or what it would lead to.  But it had lots of potential.

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Posted 13 November 2016 - 09:18 AM #77 Exile Remaster

Yeah, I remember that room. They weren't just trying to merge; There was a slime trying to form the shape of a human but collapsing back into a puddle repeatedly, with no indication that it was "eating" anyone, IIRC. The slimes were always one of my favorite parts about Exile.
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Posted 13 November 2016 - 06:23 PM #78 Exile Remaster

IIRC, there was a room in which it looks like slimes are eating, a wolf, a goblin and a lizard, but on closer inspection they are trying to merge with them.  I wonder if they were supposed to do that, or having been left to their own devices they're moving beyond just running round dissolving things.

Out of interest, what is the Crimson Slime's special ability?

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Posted 14 November 2016 - 03:45 AM #79 Exile Remaster

Neither the Crimson Slime nor the Turquoise Slime exist in the Blades of Exile Base yet. Turqoise slime may get a new graphic if we decide to keep the Ice Slime graphic for just Ice Slimes and Ice Puddings, but I'm not sure right now. Poison Touch and Disease Touch are free as far as slime touches go, although Mauve Slime doesn't have a status touch, just minor spellcasting ability, so their abilities are still up for debate.
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Posted 14 November 2016 - 05:17 AM #80 Exile Remaster

I'd suggest a new graphic for Turquoise, I don't like monsters, especially with very different capabilities, having the same graphic, though the Ice ones do generate ice fields around them so they look different.

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Posted 14 November 2016 - 09:53 AM #81 Exile Remaster

View PostThaluikhain, on 14 November 2016 - 05:17 AM, said:

I'd suggest a new graphic for Turquoise, I don't like monsters, especially with very different capabilities, having the same graphic, though the Ice ones do generate ice fields around them so they look different.
There are already several monsters with the same graphic but different abilities, so I'm reluctant to accept that argument. (For example: Salamander and Fire Lizard. Cave Slime and Viscous Goo. Wraith and ... I think it was called Deva or something - the leader summoned by Summon Host.)
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Posted 14 November 2016 - 06:38 PM #82 Exile Remaster

Certainly (also, Shade and Spirit).  I personally find it annoying to run into a group of monsters, some that are relatively powerful magic using spirits, and some that are merely shades.  i can't really see a good reason for having multiple monsters using the same graphics, beyond having to create less graphics.

But, it's not like it breaks the game either way, just my personal preference.

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Posted 14 November 2016 - 07:09 PM #83 Exile Remaster

Ice Slime generates ice fields, but I think Ice Pudding, with the same graphic, has freezing touch.
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Posted 15 November 2016 - 04:17 AM #84 Exile Remaster

Just checked, and other way around, but yeah one of each so easy to distinguish.

Mind you, I have accidentally fireballed one of my own party, because the PC graphic with the armour and red and gold shield looks sorta kinda not really like the Troglodyte Defender with the armour and red and gold shield.  I think I did that more than once.

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Posted 08 January 2017 - 03:17 PM #85 Exile Remaster

Back at it after a while. Newest version of BoE doesn't load saved games from earlier versions (although parties made in current version are fine), and End Scenario still crashes the game.

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Posted 09 January 2017 - 03:39 PM #86 Exile Remaster

I did change the save format slightly, though it's not difficult to convert interim saves - you just need to strip off the first 10 bytes of the file. And this has nothing to do with ancient saves, which should still load.

I'm afraid it's been awhile since I looked at Blades of Exile, so I can't give an ETA on when these bugs will be fixed. Hopefully sooner rather than later though.
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Posted 09 January 2017 - 04:38 PM #87 Exile Remaster

It may be more sooner than later if people showed more interest. It would make the development feel less of a drag. I know there are more people out there who love BoE besides us four, but nobody else participates for very long.

I guess you can consider this a call to action. Maybe I should post a poll. "Would you: []work on code []playtest []pokeholesinthingsandseeiftheybreaktest []design during development []design when there's a release version []play scenarios for fun" etc. ? Maybe it would get some silent observers to speak up or something, I don't know.
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Posted 12 January 2017 - 09:10 AM #88 Exile Remaster

Okay, problem: Can't adjust skill levels in training windows except for HP/SP.

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Posted 12 January 2017 - 10:36 AM #89 Exile Remaster

I think some of your trouble comes from the fact that it takes some serious work to figure out what to download.  I would suggest making a single clean, clear, coherent page that briefly (i.e., in 1-2 sentences) explains what's going on with BoE and has a small number of easy downloads for Mac and PC.  Currently there is no such thing.  The BoE forum header has some decent info, however:

1. It's very hard to get there by google.  Google isn't just for reaching a new audience -- it is commonly used by people who know what they are looking for and just don't have the exact page handy.

2. There is a serious vocabulary problem.  The forum header says "Blades of Exile".  It has a link to CBoE but doesn't explain what the C is.  It also has a link to an experimental builds folder that is itself titled "oboe" but that is full of files labelled simply as "BoE".  It also discusses "original Blades of Exile" which appears to be different from OBoE.  That's at least five different uses of BoE.  I have heard all these terms before and this setup still confuses me; I imagine it will cause many people, who might remember BoE but not know what any of these terms are, to decide to walk away until there is just an obvious modern version to use.

Basically, there are two (and only two) things that should be front and center: 1 version of BoE updated to run on modern systems but with no changes to game mechanics, graphics, etc.; and 1 version of the BoE that you are working on, that is the most stable and polished version available.  Make those easy to find, easy to download, easy to get started with.  THEN once people are into those, you might get more interest in helping with development.
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Posted 12 January 2017 - 03:07 PM #90 Exile Remaster

Part of the problem is the link for the latest Mac version goes to a suspended account.  The link with all the versions, has a buggy Mac version for the most recent date. There are problems with not being able to train before the first scenario and not being able to leave combat.
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Posted 12 January 2017 - 04:13 PM #91 Exile Remaster

Posted Image

Blades of Exile is a small software suite that allows you to design, share, and play adventures using the engine of the award-winning Exile Trilogy by Spiderweb Software, using a simple point-and-click, node-based system that involves no  scripting or coding. Over 300 adventures have been shared since Blades of Exile was released in 1997. It no longer works, so Spiderweb Software gave it to the community under GNU GPL 3.0.

Classic Blades of Exile (Classic BoE) runs reasonably well on modern computers. Very little user-end functionality is changed from the 1997 version. It is not being maintained but may allow you to play scenarios immediately.
+Classic BoE for Windows. Mac OS version currently unavailable.

Open Blades of Exile (OBoE) is a project to fix many bugs, add a few unobtrusive features, maintain compatibility with legacy scenarios and save files, and provide stable code going forward. It is under development and may have major bugs.
+OBoE for Windows and Mac OS (10.7 and later)
+IRC webchat for OBoE developers and users.

Blades of Exile Resources:
+At TrueSite4Blades you can download scenarios to play, read walkthroughs and tips, find graphics for your own scenarios, and more.
+Encyclopedia Ermariana is a repository of both canon and non-canon information about the world of Exile.
+Documentation for the game and the scenario editor
+Original Blades of Exile source code and resources
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Posted 12 January 2017 - 04:51 PM #92 Exile Remaster

That's definitely an improvement.  I am a little confused by the description of BoE.  The use of phrases like "software suite" and "award-winning" may be technically accurate, but it really serves to obscure what BoE is more than anything.  Meanwhile, the clear key word "RPG" does not appear, and scenarios are referred to as "adventures" for some reason, which makes it sound like a graphic IF engine or something.
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Posted 12 January 2017 - 05:12 PM #93 Exile Remaster

View PostBeyond the Mackerel, on 12 January 2017 - 10:36 AM, said:

There is a serious vocabulary problem.  The forum header says "Blades of Exile".  It has a link to CBoE but doesn't explain what the C is.  It also has a link to an experimental builds folder that is itself titled "oboe" but that is full of files labelled simply as "BoE".  It also discusses "original Blades of Exile" which appears to be different from OBoE.  That's at least five different uses of BoE.  I have heard all these terms before and this setup still confuses me; I imagine it will cause many people, who might remember BoE but not know what any of these terms are, to decide to walk away until there is just an obvious modern version to use.
Well, the C stands for "Classic", though I'm not 100% sure whether "Classic" is supposed to refer to an original untouched version or the updated version. For my part I've always used BoE or OBoE, where the O stands for "open". I guess "original Blades of Exile" would refer to the versions still downloadable on Spiderweb's site.

The only obvious modern versions to use are the various snapshots I've uploaded to my VPS, most of which are for Windows (which is only because I hadn't been getting any feedback from Mac users). None of those are entirely stable, though I think they're somewhat playable. I guess I should make another Mac build soon though; I think I might've fixed the skill training problem awhile back.

View PostBeyond the Mackerel, on 12 January 2017 - 10:36 AM, said:

Basically, there are two (and only two) things that should be front and center: 1 version of BoE updated to run on modern systems but with no changes to game mechanics, graphics, etc.; and 1 version of the BoE that you are working on, that is the most stable and polished version available.  Make those easy to find, easy to download, easy to get started with.  THEN once people are into those, you might get more interest in helping with development.
The first of those also may not exist anymore, though if Ormus's build still works, then I guess that would suffice for Windows users. (ADoS couldn't run it, but he was using WINE on Linux, so that might've been the problem.) The second of those isn't especially polished and stable.

View PostBeyond the Mackerel, on 12 January 2017 - 04:51 PM, said:

That's definitely an improvement.  I am a little confused by the description of BoE.  The use of phrases like "software suite" and "award-winning" may be technically accurate, but it really serves to obscure what BoE is more than anything.  Meanwhile, the clear key word "RPG" does not appear, and scenarios are referred to as "adventures" for some reason, which makes it sound like a graphic IF engine or something.
While you may kinda have a point on the IF implications, "adventures" nevertheless seems like an accurate description of what a scenario is. I also agree that "software suite" is a bit of an odd choice of words.
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Posted 12 January 2017 - 05:19 PM #94 Exile Remaster

ADoS: That looks like an improvement, but I think some additional links would be good - the repository (https://github.com/calref/cboe) and possibly also the issue tracker (https://github.com/calref/cboe/issues). Unfortunately you need a github account to start new issues though. There are ways around that, but I haven't set them up yet.

EDIT: Also, should we maybe retain the link to the old Win16 / MacOS9 version on Spiderweb's site?
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"Dikiyoba just hopes no one ever blows up Saturn. Getting those rings back into their proper position would take hours."

"—Alorael, who spells phoenetically. No matter how much his orthography is a wreck, intelligibility rises from the ashes."

"I've never played a Spiderweb game. I didn't even know SW made games until I saw this thread." —Nikki

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Posted 12 January 2017 - 06:56 PM #95 Exile Remaster

Posted Image

Blades of Exile is free, open-source software that allows you to design, share, and play adventures using the engine of the award-winning Exile role-playing games, by Spiderweb Software. It uses a simple point-and-click, node-based system that involves no  scripting or coding. Over 300 scenarios have been shared since Blades of Exile was released in 1997. It no longer works, so Spiderweb Software gave it to the community under GNU GPL 3.0.

Classic Blades of Exile (Classic BoE) runs reasonably well on modern computers. Very little user-end functionality is changed from the 1997 version. It is not being maintained but may allow you to play scenarios immediately.
+Classic BoE for Windows. Mac OS version currently unavailable.

Open Blades of Exile (OBoE) is a project to fix many bugs, add a few unobtrusive features, maintain compatibility with legacy scenarios and save files, and provide stable code going forward. It is under development and may have major bugs.
+OBoE for Windows and Mac OS (10.7 and later)
+IRC webchat for OBoE developers and users.
+Github Repository: Files and resources for OBoE, for developers. You can also report problems at the Issue Tracker. (Note: Despite the web address, this is for OBoE now.)

Blades of Exile Resources:
+At TrueSite4Blades you can download scenarios to play, read walkthroughs and tips, find graphics for your own scenarios, and more.
+Encyclopedia Ermariana is a repository of both canon and non-canon information about the world of Exile.
+Documentation for the game and the scenario editor
+Original Blades of Exile source code and resources


---

Celtic Minstrel: I don't think we should clutter the forum header with useless software like the original 16bit BoE that nobody will use or care about. As for github and the issue tracker, they both say cboe in the URL so I didn't realize they were OBoE. I put them in with a note, but it's kinda awkward. It'd be good to fix that if possible.

But does Classic BoE actually work correctly? Since it's in the header I assumed it does, but I don't actually know.
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Posted 12 January 2017 - 06:59 PM #96 Exile Remaster

Again, the forum header is not particularly easy to reach, including by google.  And it has a lot of random clutter all over the page from stuff not in the header itself.

Make a simple web page somewhere, anywhere, specifically dedicated to the BoE project.
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Posted 12 January 2017 - 07:17 PM #97 Exile Remaster

I could include this in the header of the directory listing for /oboe/. Making a page separate from the directory listing is also a possibility, of course. I'm not sure if that'll make it easily googlable though...
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Posted 13 January 2017 - 05:14 AM #98 Exile Remaster

I have a Blades of Exile section on my personal site, but the URL is "AlmightyWebsite" and the site also includes things like my "The Idiot" comics and a game where you hit space aliens with potatoes. I'll go register a new domain just for BoE, there's a great one available. Stay tuned!

EDIT: openboe.com is now registered to me via JustHost! I'll figure out what to do with it later I guess.
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Posted 13 January 2017 - 06:48 AM #99 Exile Remaster

You could point it to my VPS if you want (23.226.229.74)... though if we expect high traffic I'd want to tweak some apache settings...

Alternatively, you could put up a website via your own hosting service.
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"Man, I know how you feel. I once spent an hour playing WordPad before realising that it was a text editor." – Thuryl

"Dikiyoba just hopes no one ever blows up Saturn. Getting those rings back into their proper position would take hours."

"—Alorael, who spells phoenetically. No matter how much his orthography is a wreck, intelligibility rises from the ashes."

"I've never played a Spiderweb game. I didn't even know SW made games until I saw this thread." —Nikki

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Posted 13 January 2017 - 10:27 PM #100 Exile Remaster

Linky. Because, as said on the page, redundancy doesn't hurt.

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Posted 17 January 2017 - 12:03 PM #101 Exile Remaster

Well when getting onto the page, I just downloaded whichever version is the most recent.

Anyway, another problem, with the scenario editor: If you write text in a "display message" node, it won't save automatically (you have to preselect a text node to place it in). Additionally, sometimes, when programming a "Display Dialog" node, going into the text boxes somehow causes all the town text to erase, and it's unrecoverable. I've been backing up text in my own text file, but the Text Dump feature doesn't work either.

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Posted 17 January 2017 - 12:40 PM #102 Exile Remaster

View PostBainIhrno, on 17 January 2017 - 12:03 PM, said:

I've been backing up text in my own text file, but the Text Dump feature doesn't work either.
Are you sure the Text Dump feature doesn't work? They're saved in the same directory as the scenario file, not in the executable directory (as they used to be, if I recall correctly).
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"Man, I know how you feel. I once spent an hour playing WordPad before realising that it was a text editor." – Thuryl

"Dikiyoba just hopes no one ever blows up Saturn. Getting those rings back into their proper position would take hours."

"—Alorael, who spells phoenetically. No matter how much his orthography is a wreck, intelligibility rises from the ashes."

"I've never played a Spiderweb game. I didn't even know SW made games until I saw this thread." —Nikki

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Posted 20 January 2017 - 03:38 PM #103 Exile Remaster

Some bugs in the latest build you posted:

- Deleting specials in the town editor causes a crash
- Using Create/Edit with text messages from the specials page generally causes a crash

(Windows 10 64-bit OS)

Also, why is this program so hard to compile? I'm currently getting linker errors for several unresolved references from a single file and I don't understand hy. (gzstream fyi).

Celtic Minstrel Celtic Minstrel

Eye of Avadon

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Posted 20 January 2017 - 04:01 PM #104 Exile Remaster

Did you install zlib? That file is the only one that directly references zlib, so if you were missing zlib I would definitely expect errors in that file. I'd have to see the specific unresolved references to know for sure whether or not it's zlib, though.

I've reproduced the second of those errors and am guessing it shouldn't be too difficult to fix. Hopefully I'll be able to reproduce the first one too.
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Ir the Great Ir the Great

Citizen

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Posted 20 January 2017 - 04:25 PM #105 Exile Remaster

"unresolved external symbol _gzclose referenced in function "public class gzstreambuf * __thiscall gzstreambuf::close(void)"

3 other symbols too were unresolved from the same file. VS Community 2015. I have triple-checked my library paths.

Edit: Another bug you may or may not be aware of -- Apparently, some of the options in the "scenario" menu of the scenario editor are off by two (ex: Edit Item Placement Shortcuts brought up the dialog box for dumping the data to text file. The one before that option actually calls delete last town.)




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