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A couple of questions about Avernum 2:CS


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I like Spiderweb games, although I'm not very fond of this saga (yeah, I know, I have terrible taste; I agree :D ).

 

Nonetheless, I'm considering purchasing and I have two doubts:

 

- Is there a hard level cap like in Avadon? If that's the case, do you hit that cap soon?

 

- I know, this is a naive question and I could try the demo, but anyway... is there music this time or only sfx?

 

Thanks ;)

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Avernum: Escape from the Pit was supposed to be hard capped at level 61. Believe me even as a dedicated player doing a singleton, I quit leveling up at 55 and finished the game.

 

Avernum: Crystal Souls has music for entering the town/dungeons and a few other places, but most of the game is sfx.

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- Is there a hard level cap like in Avadon? If that's the case, do you hit that cap soon?

 

As Hume mentioned about A1EFtP, with A2CS there is a soft cap at level 30 & then things slow way down.

 

After level 30 you continue to get your usual single attribute point per level (strength, dex, etc), but you only get 2 skill points every 5 levels rather than the 2 per level before that. Traits completely stop at L30. On my first playthrough (normal difficulty) I hit the L30 cap right about when I started to finish up the final quests needed for the victory conditions. So the cap came right about the time that it didn't matter much any longer (I think I finished with my guys at L32-33) On the other hand, my second playthrough (hard difficulty) had me trying to do most of the side quests & other little things as I came across them (the first was just a quick, get it done, race to the end). In this case I reached the cap at about the time when I'm started to get the final quests sorted out (about 75-80% through the game - they finished at about L35-36). Either way though the game is well balanced & by the time you get to where you hit the cap you're powerful/skilled enough that you really don't notice or need another point here or there.

 

However you get there though, enjoy the journey as it's a great game.

 

(I was one of the beta testers if you didn't figure that out...)

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I have a couple of additional questions to add to this. While I finished Avernum: Escape from the Pit on Torment, I can't really remember much of the mechanics anymore.

 

As you mentioned the level is soft capped. I guess there is a limited amount of xp?

If traits are stopped at 30 one has to think about whether or not Quick Learning and Great Wisdom are worth it.

 

Is there any advantage to swords/spears over the other? Or is it purely cosmetic?

Was a spear always 2h? Or can you combine it with a shield?

When dual wielding, I saw that the damage of abilities does not change. Does the toHit modifier of -35% apply to special strikes?

 

Is there any advantage to bow/razordisk over the other?

 

Do character races have any influence on story? Like additional dialogues or so?

The +Missile dmg seems to be a little too specific for my taste. With a tank, a mage and a priest, I'd rather use a second melee class to block away the enemies from the casters.

 

And a last one: Do summons "eat away" XP like in Geneforge? Or is the XP always shared within the 4 party members only?

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XP is not strictly limited - you can always find more outdoor encounters or a few respawning monsters in dungeons to get more xp.

 

Quick learning and great wisdom are pretty much definitely not worth it. Not only will you reach past level 30 by the end anyway, but the xp rounds down so most times you kill an enemy, you will not get any extra xp from these traits.

 

Dual swords were much superior to pole weapons in AEFTP, not sure if the balance has been changed at all for A2CS.

 

Poles are always 2h.

 

Razordisks have higher base damage, but there are a few rare bows that have stats that make them better to use. In almost all cases an archer is strictly inferior to having an extra mage or warrior though.

 

Not sure about the racial dialogues or summon XP.

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Thanks! One Question about the dual wield vs Pole though: If you completely specialize on damage on one character and play on hardest difficulty: Don't you have an advantage with pole weapons due to the better to hit chance and the higher damage on special abilities?

 

I see that "normal attacks" can be much better with Dual Wield, but I don't think I get the whole picture yet.

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As for A:EFTP, I would say no, because there are such OP weapons like Spectral Falchon (+5 to blademaster) or Flaming Sword (fire dmg).

Still, I picked Slith for main tank character in Avernum 2, becasue having only humans in party is kinda boring. (but still, i will probably go for it when playing torment game)

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I don't know/remember the specific benefits from having a different race along in your group but there was something such as an extra couple of points in pole wielding for sliths to start with (pulled out of my butt example, I'm not sure what the actual benefit is so don't hold me to it). Each race had something but it wasn't anything really spectacular iirc (I 'think' sliths got a couple extra points in pole weapons & nephs got a couple extra in bows at the start & humans got an extra 'trait' every for every 4th trait earned - so each race has something extra but it isn't enough to want to change the build of your party). There is a nice benefit to having a slith in the party once you get to Gnass but I'll leave that for you to discover (if it's worth it overall though is another discussion...).

 

Thanks! One Question about the dual wield vs Pole though: If you completely specialize on damage on one character and play on hardest difficulty: Don't you have an advantage with pole weapons due to the better to hit chance and the higher damage on special abilities?

 

I see that "normal attacks" can be much better with Dual Wield, but I don't think I get the whole picture yet.

 

Not to insult you but you aren't supposed to get the whole picture yet. Jeff designed/nerfed the game so that anyone with little to no gaming experience could, on normal difficulty, grab a premade party & make it through the game without constantly getting everyone vaporized or not being able to do 'x' at the end because you didn't have THE perfect skill tree build. For those that have played & beaten Jeff's games before then 'hard' is probably a much better level to play at. It will be challenging but there too you won't destroy your party's chances by a not-optimal pick of a trait way back on level 3. I haven't tried it on torment yet but I can't imagine that things won't hold true there too.

 

My point is to not worry about the big picture/tiny detail things yet. All that you really need to know right now to have a great time is that the Empire invaded your cave systems & all of a sudden these strange magical barriers were closing off passages. Go enjoy the story & immerse yourself in this huge spelunking expedition for this run through as, even on the most difficult settings, the game has enough of a buffer built into it that it really won't matter if you can hit someone 62.2378% of the time doing 217 points of damage per hit or hit them 83.6754% of the time doing 145 points of damage. If in a couple of weeks, after you've played the game to the end, you're still wondering which is better (or frankly if it really matters) then we can hash it out.

 

For now though, go out & enjoy this huge & wonderful playground that Jeff has built for us

 

(for what it's worth my 1.5 fighters (1 pure melee & 1 fighter/mage combo) are human dual wielding. There are just too many good swords out there with extra abilities to use two hands to hold a spear (no spear is twice as good as a couple nice swords). Along the same lines, I've decided that the extra damage dealt out is worth more than the higher armor/different benefits from using a shield)

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Oh, I don't feel insulted. I just have a very different way to tackle games.

E.g. before I started with Might and Magic X I created this sheet to get an overview: https://docs.google....dENhcGNHUnRlNUE

Before I started Xulima I created this sheet to get an overview: https://docs.google....th5Kx18qZfRTpas

 

And normally the game mechanics itself are pretty clear. But it has been a long time since I played Avernum: Escape from the Pit.

I don't need to know what weapons can be found in the game and so on. But I'd like to know how mechanics work.

Example:

If a Pole Arm has a base damage which is 1.5X the dmg of a sword and a sword would not get any malus and you would do 2 x sword damage the sword is superior.

But if you use special strikes all the time which uses the 1.5Xdmg of the polearm and just mainhand dmg of the sword dual wielder than this would make the pole arm much stronger in this scenario.

 

About the bonus from the races: The Catguys get 10% on missile dmg and the lizard guys 10% on spear dmg. In addition both get 10% in one resitance. So if you do not use the catguy as a razordisc thrower/archer his racial ability is wasted and if you don't use the lizard guy as pure melee dmg dealer, his racial ability is wasted. And even if they have these roles, the human ability would probably still be better.

 

For me the game is about challenge. I play games on highest difficulty right away as I never play a game twice. And I also like to minmax my characters within certain borders (e.g. in MMX I took one of each race) because otherwise I just feel bad and think that I should start over. And while this isn't a big deal in small games, my playthrough of Avernum: Escape from the pit took more than 150 hours. And feeling gimped after 50 or 100 hours is not really what I look forward to. ^^

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There is one obvious place where a Slith in your party will let you get cheap priest spell training. Otherwise there are a few minor dialogue differences that don't change the game.

 

Dual wielding has a higher penalty so it takes longer before you gain the extra damage. So a pole arm with an extra chance of cleaving an adjacent foe becomes more useful on normal difficulty. Hard and torment difficulties still benefit from sword and shield with a shield's extra damage blockage and now giving increased parry.

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Thanks!

 

Got one other question: What influence does luck have? Is it just for combat or are there events which profit from luck?

 

If there is an event with a "luck check", do you have any benefit if not "maxing" it?

So, lets say if after 5 game hours there is an event, where you need 5 luck to get something, and after 10 hours there is an event where you need 10 luck to trigger it, there is no use of just putting a couple of points there.

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Got another small question which isn't really worth a whole new thread:

 

I gathered a lot of shattered crystals, perfect crystals, diamands and so on.

With all the crystal stuff going around I am not sure if this stuff can actually be used something or if it is just for sale as the tooltip indicates.

 

Currently carrying aroung stones worth a couple of thousand gold and would appreciate a hint whether I can sell them. ^^

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Got another small question which isn't really worth a whole new thread:

 

I gathered a lot of shattered crystals, perfect crystals, diamands and so on.

With all the crystal stuff going around I am not sure if this stuff can actually be used something or if it is just for sale as the tooltip indicates.

 

Currently carrying aroung stones worth a couple of thousand gold and would appreciate a hint whether I can sell them. ^^

 

This thread contains a list of items to keep for crafting or collection quests. If it's not on the list, you're probably okay to sell it. Most non-usable crystals and gemstones should just be sold, with the exception of focusing crystals.

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